CA CA - Lydia "Dia" Abrams, 65, Idyllwild, 6 Jun 2020

[KALIMOUSE]

Thanks for the links. Wow, it could help. It sounds like a fairly new study. Is it costly? Are you suggesting LE use this fascinating technology to find Dia's remains? Perhaps Dia's loved ones could arrange to have this done. Only problem is I'm not sure any of those mentioned care enough to look further. Plus, Dia may not be on the property. Did you see the drone search done in Arizona? You're right that the main priority now is to find her so we can figure out who is responsible for harming her. Who will search for Dia?

It has been very costly in the past , 30k + for just the lidar, another 10k+ for the heavy lift drone capable of carrying it. This is why LE doesn't utilize this method to search.

Just recently a company released a $100 lidar that can fit on smaller drones. Velodyne Lidar Introduces Velabit™ | Velodyne Lidar

With the Velabit lidar, it places this method in reach of regular search teams.
Dia may not be on the property means that there is a possibility that she could be. Eliminating the possibilities will leave the probabilities of other locations.

 

[adot0902]

Read the new court docs. For the second time this case I'm having issues with the attorney and how he goes about things. I am very familiar with both Trust Documents and POA documents. You do not accidentally mess those up, yes frequently they are completed together for the ease of estate planning, but that's not a mistake a lawyer makes nor would I allow a POA who did that to not be looked at, I would 100% make a report because as a POA you have to do what is in the best interest of your principal, that's not in the best interest.

 

[coastal]

It has been very costly in the past , 30k + for just the lidar, another 10k+ for the heavy lift drone capable of carrying it. This is why LE doesn't utilize this method to search.

Just recently a company released a $100 lidar that can fit on smaller drones. Velodyne Lidar Introduces Velabit™ | Velodyne Lidar

With the Velabit lidar, it places this method in reach of regular search teams.
Dia may not be on the property means that there is a possibility that she could be. Eliminating the possibilities will leave the probabilities of other locations.

I would happily donate funds for this. Do you know anyone who could do it, KALIMOUSE?

 

[KALIMOUSE]

I know a few people and will forward this case to them to see if they are interested. I am personally busy working on this FINDING MISSING PEOPLE BY LOCATING KEYS- NEED HELP FINDING CASES

 

[KALIMOUSE]

Can someone pm me the address that needs to be searched. Thank you

 

[coastal]

Can someone pm me the address that needs to be searched. Thank you

Check your mail.

 

[Curious Me]

I know a few people and will forward this case to them to see if they are interested.

You might want to share this with them.

the address that needs to be searched.

Here are some posts from the very 1st page of this thread. @SoHelpMeGod researched and supplied a great deal of useful info on the properties that we all appreciated. It's a lot of land

This is where the address for the ranch estate is located:
خرائط ‪Google
Here's the ranch estate web site - acreage is stated as 116:
Bonitavistaranchestate.com

I found the above link for the ranch web site on this site:
Bonita Vista Ranch Estate - The Knot

Here's an interesting Air BNB listing for the ranch:
Bonita Vista Ranch Bed and Breakfast (3 rooms) - Bed and breakfasts for Rent in Mountain Center, California, United States

Here's an interesting real estate listing for a 2 bedroom, 2.5 bath property at the same address, with the ranch estate photos, that sold on June 18,2020
58111 Bonita Vista Rd, Mountain Center, CA 92561 - realtor.com®

Here's another real estate listing:
58111 Bonita Vista Rd, Mountain Center, CA - 2 beds/2.5 baths

Here's a description of the property as 'Agricultural Land with Single Family Residential', the acreage is listed as 35.13:
https://www.propertyshark.com/mason...111-Bonita-Vista-Rd-Mountain-Center-CA-92561/

The address and much more info on the properties are within this post and several others in the beginning of this thread.

For those who are interested:
Clem's Candlelight Project
So much work appears to have gone into this over the years. I don't know when it will break ground....

Just to take note of other property of interest. This is other property that the children have holdings in. It was the father Clem's last big dream project.

Here's a first-person account of the search for Dia by Riverside Mountain Rescue Unit on June 9th (along with some photos). www.rmru.org/2020/06/09/2020-030/

I thought this was interesting: We were met there by Sheriff’s deputies, search dog team and Swat teams due to the high incidence of marijuana growing nearby in some of the draws that had water.

They searched for two full days. RMRU does great work. They've popped up in a number of cases I've followed.

^^^ This is about the entire search of the vast property done by RMSU. It is a huge undertaking and this will give you an idea of what needs to be searched. BBM = Bolded by Me

 

[KALIMOUSE]

Okay just looked at the address and the first thing that I have to ask is, has anyone searched the pond? Also, does anyone know what kind of drone searches have been conducted on this property? My initial thoughts are, there are places that someone could get injured in this area. Just from what I have read so far, I can see that there are opinions that she was murdered. I like to be opened minded and rule out the possibility this could have been a accident first by 3d mapping the area and scanning for the color of her clothes with LOC8.

I am working a lot of missing person cases at the moment and this location is 2+ hours from me . So I will try to get to it in the coming weeks if I can and will post my findings here.

 

[KALIMOUSE]

I just finished reading the first few pages on this post and I wanted to share something that stuck out to me.

she NEVER left her house or went anywhere without her dog, even to go check the mail he was always by her side. The dog was still at her home/ranch when she couldn’t be located. This is a big red flag to me and could possibly be a clue that she left the property against her will. Her dog was a ranch dog and appeared to be some type of heeler/herding dog. I think you can see him walking in the shots of her ranch that were shown in the video of her fiancé speaking.

I lived on a ranch with herding dogs and when I read this statement, it made me really think . If she never went anywhere without her dog, how was the dog found initially? Most responsible dog owner I know, that lives near a mountainous area, takes there dog everywhere they go, and cares about their dogs safety, would protect their dog.
Depending on what kind of dog owner she was, If she was going to leave without her dog, she would either leave the dog in the house, kennel or within a gated area. From what I seen, she had a border collie, so the question would be how was the dog found? From looking at the property on google earth, there is a fence. What I cannot see is if there is a fence in the front of the house leading to the trail behind the property. If the dog was found outside the fenced area, in the driveway outside of a protected area but still on the property, then that could narrow it down a bit. If the dog was inside the house , kennel, or inside of the protected area, that means she could have left the property. Her phone, purse and keys were left. Living on a ranch, most of the time you wouldn't have those things on you.

Now if she went on a hike, obviously the dog would stay with her or wait for her to come back to the last known area. Under what circumstances would the dog leave? If someone called out searching for Dia, and would go to the person calling. Border collies are smart but they are not lassie smart. The person searching for Dia could have brought the dog back into the protected area and not realized how important that was, they would have been preoccupied with just finding her.

This would all depend on the type of dog owner she was and how she trusted the dog on the property. I hope what I am saying makes sense, I am speaking from experience as a ranch dog owner that took my dog everywhere.

I know how LE conducts searches and how at times it can be ineffective. A perfect example is the Matthew Weaver case. They didn't use flir and the dogs didn't detect on the items that were later found by the family. Some agencies don't have drones or the latest tech in finding missing people. It was 86 degrees the day she went missing, if something happened to her on a hike, she would not have been laying out in the open for them to see from a helicopter.

The positive thing is that she was wearing jeans, and the colors yellow and teal. This would all stand out when searching low altitudes with a drone, the LOC8 software searches for colors by pixels in images.

 

[Niner]

@KALIMOUSE - I recognize you from Matthew's case! So nice of you to take on this case! Thanks!

 

[sleuther007]

https://interactive.cbs8.com/pdfs/motion-to-dismiss-PROPER-1.pdf

Greetings,

Newbie here, but this case which I started following a couple of days ago has niggled me – and eventually brought me to this discussion. I've read through as much elsewhere online as I could find, and literally spent a good chunk of today going through this 42-page (!!) thread to see if my question had already been answered – but it has not. So I've now signed up and am looking forward to furthering the discussion

So here it is –

Dia's Trust Agreement of 2016 (Exhibit A of link) has (on pg 5/27) the "predeceased child's Trust share" (now, effectively, the entirety of the Trust, assuming the deletion of her daughter on 12/12/18 is upheld) pass to "Victor". That person was also designated to receive $5,000 (along with Isidro, the now dismissed farm hand).

While the general background of every other person of interest (eg KH, DF, Isidro, children, lawyer, notary) appears to be familiar to those interested in this case, I have not been able to find ANY reference whatsoever to a "Victor" being associated with either Dia or any of her ranches. I looked over past reviews of the Air B&B and Wedding rentals and saw no reference to a "Victor".

Am I missing something? Does anyone know who this guy is?

 

[Sun Spot]

Fiancé of missing woman takes over as trustee of ranch near Idyllwild | cbs8.com

MOO, Strictly my opinion only.
MOO. Reporter David Gotfredson did a very good interview with Isidro Garcia at the time. I wonder if Isidro is available for another interview at this time. I believe he may possibly know a few things that can further and answer question we have. I think hee can shed more light on the situation.
MOO. FROM reading the texts and listening to this interview. PLUS reading the petitions that have been filed in the courts.
THANK YOU

 

[coastal]

https://interactive.cbs8.com/pdfs/motion-to-dismiss-PROPER-1.pdf

Greetings,

Newbie here, but this case which I started following a couple of days ago has niggled me – and eventually brought me to this discussion. I've read through as much elsewhere online as I could find, and literally spent a good chunk of today going through this 42-page (!!) thread to see if my question had already been answered – but it has not. So I've now signed up and am looking forward to furthering the discussion

So here it is –

Dia's Trust Agreement of 2016 (Exhibit A of link) has (on pg 5/27) the "predeceased child's Trust share" (now, effectively, the entirety of the Trust, assuming the deletion of her daughter on 12/12/18 is upheld) pass to "Victor". That person was also designated to receive $5,000 (along with Isidro, the now dismissed farm hand).

While the general background of every other person of interest (eg KH, DF, Isidro, children, lawyer, notary) appears to be familiar to those interested in this case, I have not been able to find ANY reference whatsoever to a "Victor" being associated with either Dia or any of her ranches. I looked over past reviews of the Air B&B and Wedding rentals and saw no reference to a "Victor".

Am I missing something? Does anyone know who this guy is?

Welcome to Websleuths, sleuther007!

I have not seen any reference to "Victor", but yours is an interesting question!

 

[Curious Me]

Okay just looked at the address and the first thing that I have to ask is, has anyone searched the pond? Also, does anyone know what kind of drone searches have been conducted on this property? My initial thoughts are, there are places that someone could get injured in this area...

Welcome @KALIMOUSE! Fresh eyes on this case are needed. I'm not sure I'd believe Dia was wearing certain clothes or colors though. For a long time we weren't even sure when she actually went missing. Not many facts about her disappearance have been confirmed by LE.

You sound able to search in unique ways and are familiar with the use of drones. It'd be wonderful to have your technical skills here, and your knowledge about actual searches. It was discussed that the pond should be searched, but I can't remember if it was searched.

I started following this case when there were six people missing from Idyllwild. Some were found alive, and one woman Rosario was found seven months later. I don't know if you're familiar with the organization that helped find her.
Four people now confirmed missing in area, two found • Idyllwild Town Crier

Rosario Garcia located after seven months • Idyllwild Town Crier

“We have been in the Idyllwild area for some time searching for David O’Sullivan. Because of that, we noticed the articles in the Town Crier,” Tarr said. “When we saw the Garcia story still in the news after a couple of trips up there, we thought it would be the perfect opportunity to bring in some of our resources to try to help locate her.”

One of those resources was WSAS. The team of four pilots came down from Utah and flew four drones from Jan. 22 to 24 taking thousands of images — 4,000 to be exact. The images were handed over to FOF.

Tarr said, “By the evening of Jan. 24 we had images, and on a couple of images, with no doubt we could see it was Ms. Garcia. She was about 500 feet from her car down a steep embankment with her purse and identification inside of it.”

I don't think Dia's property was searched using drones.

Here's a first-person account of the search for Dia by Riverside Mountain Rescue Unit on June 9th (along with some photos). www.rmru.org/2020/06/09/2020-030/

I thought this was interesting: We were met there by Sheriff’s deputies, search dog team and Swat teams due to the high incidence of marijuana growing nearby in some of the draws that had water.

They searched for two full days. RMRU does great work. They've popped up in a number of cases I've followed.

The RMRU did two full days of searching. IIRC, that after others had searched on horseback and with dogs that Sunday she was noted missing.

...I have not been able to find ANY reference whatsoever to a "Victor" being associated with either Dia or any of her ranches. I looked over past reviews of the Air B&B and Wedding rentals and saw no reference to a "Victor".

Am I missing something? Does anyone know who this guy is?

Welcome @sleuther007! Glad you made a first post here. You did a lot of reading to catch up. I vaguely remember seeing a person named Victor would receive $5,000. Good question-- Who is Victor? It must've included his last name. (I'm too lazy to go look.) I doubt he'd be a relative? I would guess he also worked on the ranch at one time. I doubt it was someone she knew from La Jolla. MOO, it's not an substantial amount of money, but enough that she remembered to include Victor. We need your fresh eyes and sharp mind here.

 

[Curious Me]

Ah... Valentino.

 

[Sun Spot]

https://interactive.cbs8.com/pdfs/motion-to-dismiss-PROPER-1.pdf

Greetings,

Newbie here, but this case which I started following a couple of days ago has niggled me – and eventually brought me to this discussion. I've read through as much elsewhere online as I could find, and literally spent a good chunk of today going through this 42-page (!!) thread to see if my question had already been answered – but it has not. So I've now signed up and am looking forward to furthering the discussion

So here it is –

Dia's Trust Agreement of 2016 (Exhibit A of link) has (on pg 5/27) the "predeceased child's Trust share" (now, effectively, the entirety of the Trust, assuming the deletion of her daughter on 12/12/18 is upheld) pass to "Victor". That person was also designated to receive $5,000 (along with Isidro, the now dismissed farm hand).

While the general background of every other person of interest (eg KH, DF, Isidro, children, lawyer, notary) appears to be familiar to those interested in this case, I have not been able to find ANY reference whatsoever to a "Victor" being associated with either Dia or any of her ranches. I looked over past reviews of the Air B&B and Wedding rentals and saw no reference to a "Victor".

Am I missing something? Does anyone know who this guy is?

MOO, What was the name of the gentleman that acted as general contractor when Dia built the ranch?

 

[sleuther007]

[snip]

Welcome @sleuther007! Glad you made a first post here. You did a lot of reading to catch up. I vaguely remember seeing a person named Victor would receive $5,000. Good question-- Who is Victor? It must've included his last name. (I'm too lazy to go look.) I doubt he'd be a relative? I would guess he also worked on the ranch at one time. I doubt it was someone she knew from La Jolla. MOO, it's not an substantial amount of money, but enough that she remembered to include Victor. We need your fresh eyes and sharp mind here.

Thanks for the welcome!

Last name was Valentino (I was being a bit coy as I wanted to be fully rule compliant – learning as I go. I'll just put down VV from now on). He is listed with IG to receive $5000, which might make folks think he is also a ranch hand, but I think that is misleading as he is also listed as the receiver of the entire Trust should the daughter not be in the picture at the time. Remember that this goes back to 2016 – 2 years before Clem's death. MOO That makes him a much larger player, and likely well placed as to his understanding of the family circumstances. I'm simply confused why his name is entirely absent in the past year's reporting, given the normal route of investigation is to "follow the money" (as I'm sure they have been doing with KH).

MOO MOO and more MOO - Dia set about protecting herself in 2016. That aligns with the timeframe wherein KH asserts Dia felt her son had drugged her during his very brief and only visit to the hospital during her recovery from her lower back surgery – which immediately proceeds an inexplicable 4-day coma. Two years later (2018), the day Clem dies, Dia appears to have written the daughter out of the trust. VV becomes the sole beneficiary (beyond IG's $5k). NB: The son had always been written out of the trust. Two years later (2020) she designates KH as 1st Alternate and DF as 2nd Alternate, also naming them as Trust residue beneficiaries. I am unclear if VV remains involved with the Trust at this time as his name does not appear in the 22 May 2020 amendment. The name JULIE STANFORD is now added as a $5k beneficiary. Both children are now specifically excluded from any benefits of the Trust or the Trustor's WILL.

MOO - VV was trusted from 2016-2020, and likely quite aware of the family conflicts spurring these changes along. He needs to be questioned.

 

[KALIMOUSE]

I must say that my interest in very much peaked. The more I learn about the case, the more I am starting to feel that she may have went on a hike and was the victim of a accident. I was able to look at the case file and there was nothing that struck me out of place to point directly at a homicide.

I checked out the RMRU members postings about the search. The first things that stands out, the search was called off "detectives called the physical search off and they took over the investigation" after the second day. There was no mention of air units being deployed with flir, which is what troubles me.

Let me explain why:
Imagine you have one square mile to search. Using a grid search, you have to decide how many searchers to put in
the search area. From the post by RMRU,

RMRU Members Involved: Cameron Dickinson, Blake Douglas, James Eckhardt, Glenn Henderson, Eric Holden, Beth Jeffery, and Vinay Rao. Met there by Sheriff’s deputies, search dog team and Swat teams. Normally, the Swat team is on standby for incident response not active participants of the search.

I estimate the number of 14 active searchers from the limit info I have been able to gather for the two search days.
Assume you assigned all 14 people to search that one square mile. Now, you have to decide on spacing. If you space out the searchers with 20 feet between them, this "line" will need to make 33 parallel passes through the area to cover it all and will take a total of 148 hours! That’s 2,772 MAN HOURS and 148 actual search hours, if the searchers are moving at a slow, deliberate pace as they are trained to do.

If they searched for 8 hours for two days, 16 hours in total, they covered a small fraction of the area. This environment is located on the side of a mountain with 100 of places to fall and sustain a incapacitating injury. Without air support, it would be shear luck to see someone that fell over the side unless they were standing up with a unobstructed view.

This "DATELINE" type case, since money is involved, people go directly to the spouse or significant other. Which I think is the reason why the " detectives" called off the search and not the SAR's team. As everything stands right now the investigation has yielded zero actual evidence pointing to homicide. If it did, then they would have arrested someone or implied a person of interest.

The dog, purse, car, keys, the gate being locked, and the backyard hiking trail and the lack of searching the area. It leads me to believe she may be still on the property. Taken against her will? I dont see it, She was armed and the gate was locked. Shot or stabbed ? The detectives have searched the whole house for evidence and the only blood they have found was on a napkin and bandaid. Strangled? She would have fought for her life and there should be signs.

We put our faith in LE when they say that they have searched a area for someone, that they are professionals and do this for a living. Most SAR's teams are volunteers and follow a chain of command when searching. If they are told to search a area, they search it. If they are told to suspend searching, they believe that whoever gave them the orders know something that they do not. At the time, I am sure the detectives had felt that the boyfriend did it and wanted to only focus on that.

Now I am not saying that it is not possible that this isn't a homicide. NO! I am saying that at this point did everything to find evidence of a homicide and found nothing substantial. If you eliminate the "drama" surrounding this case , the lack of evidence of a homicide, the basic circumstances of her disappearance. Sherlock said it best "when you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth?"

 

[Sun Spot]

[snip]


Thanks for the welcome!

Last name was Valentino (I was being a bit coy as I wanted to be fully rule compliant – learning as I go. I'll just put down VV from now on). He is listed with IG to receive $5000, which might make folks think he is also a ranch hand, but I think that is misleading as he is also listed as the receiver of the entire Trust should the daughter not be in the picture at the time. Remember that this goes back to 2016 – 2 years before Clem's death. MOO That makes him a much larger player, and likely well placed as to his understanding of the family circumstances. I'm simply confused why his name is entirely absent in the past year's reporting, given the normal route of investigation is to "follow the money" (as I'm sure they have been doing with KH).

MOO MOO and more MOO - Dia set about protecting herself in 2016. That aligns with the timeframe wherein KH asserts Dia felt her son had drugged her during his very brief and only visit to the hospital during her recovery from her lower back surgery – which immediately proceeds an inexplicable 4-day coma. Two years later (2018), the day Clem dies, Dia appears to have written the daughter out of the trust. VV becomes the sole beneficiary (beyond IG's $5k). NB: The son had always been written out of the trust. Two years later (2020) she designates KH as 1st Alternate and DF as 2nd Alternate, also naming them as Trust residue beneficiaries. I am unclear if VV remains involved with the Trust at this time as his name does not appear in the 22 May 2020 amendment. The name JULIE STANFORD is now added as a $5k beneficiary. Both children are now specifically excluded from any benefits of the Trust or the Trustor's WILL.

MOO - VV was trusted from 2016-2020, and likely quite aware of the family conflicts spurring these changes along. He needs to be questioned.

MOO, was he Dia's PT?

 

[Curious Me]

...As everything stands right now the investigation has yielded zero actual evidence pointing to homicide. If it did, then they would have arrested someone or implied a person of interest.

Gee, with all due respect, I don't agree with most of what you said. I hope you don't take offense by my stating what I think. Why would Dia go out for a walk maybe armed, and not take her purse, phone, dog? As far as there not being evidence or a POI, it's very common here on WS to wait because many cases stall, and suddenly there's a break in the case and you find out there was evidence and LE was onto a suspect. Stick around on WS and you'll see it happen again and again.

There actually hasn't been that much "dateline" drama and media attention to this case as yet. More attention would be great. It went silent too fast actually. It's only thanks to DG & News8 that we learned pertinent info, otherwise this case was just lumped together with the other missing people from the area. It went quiet, nobody was sharing, not even LE, that there was something to investigate. Hey, KH himself was the one that seemed to want to get on camera and get media's attention. The odd thing is I hardly think LE would've been as suspicious of him if he hadn't left in his RV before they even got there. Not to concentrate only on the fiancé, there's still plenty of reason to be suspicious of foul play in this case.

MOO, more investigation is desperately needed because IMO there's plenty of reason to suspect a monetary or property motive, and a homicide. After all, sometimes there isn't a body found, but it still ends up being a homicide. LE doesn't share everything in most cases, and needs a lot more conclusive, solid evidence to name a POI or make an arrest, but that doesn't mean Dia got hurt taking a walk. This is just my own opinion though. If Dia did go out for a walk and got hurt, then hopefully and eventually her remains will be discovered on the ranch or in the nearby vicinity. However, if she was my loved one, I'd want the searches continued and her disappearance investigated, not forgotten.