CANADA Canada - Barry, 75, & Honey Sherman, 70, found dead, Toronto, 15 Dec 2017 #16

[MistyWaters]

It’s interesting how the tragic Glen Davis murder in 2007, also a philanthropist, happened to be mentioned by Idsibga in passing.. Even if he didn’t mention “similarities” clearly financial gain (ie greed) was involved in the Davis murder in the godson’s (a cousin’s child) motive of mistakingly believing he was named in the will. I wonder, were Barry and Honey godparents to anyone?

WARMINGTON: 'Window was left open' as Sherman home painted | Toronto Sun
“The most important thing Idsinga has done is utilize his experience and skills to bridge the relationship with the family and police, which had soured since day one when it was announced there was no risk to neighbours and it was looking like a murder-suicide.

Six weeks later, police changed their minds but it has taken two years for the trust to rebuild with the four Sherman children.

“Idsinga made that happen — as he did with the gay community in the originally troubled investigation into the McArthur serial murder case.

Idsinga turned that around and made an arrest.

He’s hoping for a repeat, and referenced how the Glen Davis murder took four years to solve as an example to show that two years is nothing to fear.

Wealthy philanthropist Davis was murdered by a hitman hired by godson Marshall Ross.

Idsinga didn’t suggest similarities other than it shows homicide won’t quit until they made their collar……”

10 years after the murder of philanthropist Glen Davis divided a family, his widow recalls a man of adventure and legacy
With no children of their own, the couple had dinners and spent time during the holidays with Davis’s extended family, including first cousin Marsha……

…..Marsha and her husband, Murray Ross, had two children, including a son, Marshal (Ross). Davis and Mary Alice were the boy’s godparents and doted on him as he grew up in Lawrence Park. He called them uncle and aunt.

In March 2009, after a 21-month investigation, police arrested (Marshall) Ross and three other men and charged them with first-degree murder.

Police alleged Ross hired Dmitri Kossyrine and Jesse Smith whom he knew through his home renovation business and they turned to Ivgeny Vorobiov as their gun for hire……

……In October 2011, a week before his trial was to begin, Marshall Ross pleaded guilty to first-degree murder.

“I cannot do anything to change the terrible thing that I have done,” he said in a statement read out in court by his lawyer. Ross was having financial difficulties and wrongly thought he might be in Davis’s will. He also admitted resenting that Davis, who was adopted, was giving away the family fortune….”

Court dismisses appeal by man who shot dead philanthropist Glen Davis
“Davis’s godson, Marshall Ross, is serving a life sentence after pleading guilty to first-degree murder in 2011. Fuelled by greed and resentment, Ross admitted orchestrating the murder so he wouldn’t have to pay back the $2 million loan Davis gave him for his home renovation business. He also mistakenly believed he would be named a beneficiary in Davis’s will….”

 

[deugirtni]

It’s interesting how the tragic Glen Davis murder in 2007, also a philanthropist, happened to be mentioned by Idsibga in passing.. Even if he didn’t mention “similarities” clearly financial gain (ie greed) was involved in the Davis murder in the godson’s (a cousin’s child) motive of mistakingly believing he was named in the will. I wonder, were Barry and Honey godparents to anyone?

WARMINGTON: 'Window was left open' as Sherman home painted | Toronto Sun
“The most important thing Idsinga has done is utilize his experience and skills to bridge the relationship with the family and police, which had soured since day one when it was announced there was no risk to neighbours and it was looking like a murder-suicide.

Six weeks later, police changed their minds but it has taken two years for the trust to rebuild with the four Sherman children.

“Idsinga made that happen — as he did with the gay community in the originally troubled investigation into the McArthur serial murder case.

Idsinga turned that around and made an arrest.

He’s hoping for a repeat, and referenced how the Glen Davis murder took four years to solve as an example to show that two years is nothing to fear.

Wealthy philanthropist Davis was murdered by a hitman hired by godson Marshall Ross.

Idsinga didn’t suggest similarities other than it shows homicide won’t quit until they made their collar……”

10 years after the murder of philanthropist Glen Davis divided a family, his widow recalls a man of adventure and legacy
With no children of their own, the couple had dinners and spent time during the holidays with Davis’s extended family, including first cousin Marsha……

…..Marsha and her husband, Murray Ross, had two children, including a son, Marshal (Ross). Davis and Mary Alice were the boy’s godparents and doted on him as he grew up in Lawrence Park. He called them uncle and aunt.

In March 2009, after a 21-month investigation, police arrested (Marshall) Ross and three other men and charged them with first-degree murder.

Police alleged Ross hired Dmitri Kossyrine and Jesse Smith whom he knew through his home renovation business and they turned to Ivgeny Vorobiov as their gun for hire……

……In October 2011, a week before his trial was to begin, Marshall Ross pleaded guilty to first-degree murder.

“I cannot do anything to change the terrible thing that I have done,” he said in a statement read out in court by his lawyer. Ross was having financial difficulties and wrongly thought he might be in Davis’s will. He also admitted resenting that Davis, who was adopted, was giving away the family fortune….”

Court dismisses appeal by man who shot dead philanthropist Glen Davis
“Davis’s godson, Marshall Ross, is serving a life sentence after pleading guilty to first-degree murder in 2011. Fuelled by greed and resentment, Ross admitted orchestrating the murder so he wouldn’t have to pay back the $2 million loan Davis gave him for his home renovation business. He also mistakenly believed he would be named a beneficiary in Davis’s will….”

Thanks, I'd forgotten about that.

 

[casesensitive]

Yes, I remember the WS discussion after Idsinga gave that presser and mentioned how the Davis case took four years to solve. He actually referenced a family murder based on greed. I think it was a Freudian slip for him to mention the Davis case as an example of how long a case may remain unsolved when he was addressing the Sherman murders. Certainly facts learned since then, and speculation of a family member's greed have made his comparison more relevant.

Sorry Misty, I had to copy this excerpt that has been the belief of all media globally from the start and has never changed. I know you don't agree, and you know I don't agree with you.

“The most important thing Idsinga has done is utilize his experience and skills to bridge the relationship with the family and police, which had soured since day one when it was announced there was no risk to neighbours and it was looking like a murder-suicide.

Six weeks later, police changed their minds but it has taken two years for the trust to rebuild with the four Sherman children."

 

[MistyWaters]

Yes, I remember the WS discussion after Idsinga gave that presser and mentioned how the Davis case took four years to solve. He actually referenced a family murder based on greed. I think it was a Freudian slip for him to mention the Davis case as an example of how long a case may remain unsolved when he was addressing the Sherman murders. Certainly facts learned since then, and speculation of a family member's greed have made his comparison more relevant.

Sorry Misty, I had to copy this excerpt that has been the belief of all media globally from the start and has never changed. I know you don't agree, and you know I don't agree with you.

“The most important thing Idsinga has done is utilize his experience and skills to bridge the relationship with the family and police, which had soured since day one when it was announced there was no risk to neighbours and it was looking like a murder-suicide.

Six weeks later, police changed their minds but it has taken two years for the trust to rebuild with the four Sherman children."

I’ve never doubted the crime scene was staged in such a way to initially appear as if a murder/suicide had occurred. Why not, horrible enough to murder two innocent, then toss in an added diabolical touch of making one of the deceased victim appear as guilty perpetrator as well. No homicide investigation would’ve occurred, can’t convict dead people nor can they defend themselves. So not only is Barry murdered but his reputation and legacy is tarnished forever, I suppose an attempted double accomplishment by whoever is responsible. But I do know police aren’t in a position to immediately and accurately determine what occurred and they certainly don’t touch the bodies let alone conduct an on-site autopsy. When arriving on the scene of “suspicious deaths” the coroner is called while police only secure the crime scene. So how can police have reliably known how the victims died in those first few hours even before the autopsy was completed? If they had coats over their arms any markings indicating bound wrists might’ve been covered up.

However regardless of how the crime scene was staged, I just don’t believe TPS held onto that belief of m/s for a full six weeks. However it must’ve proved an advantageous strategy during those early days of interviewing people known to the Shermans.

 

[Tobiano8th]

The Davis case potentially dovetails this case really nicely.. Lots of similarities and in the end maybe very similar.... Davis wasn't as rich or famous as HE but his father was way back when

BS, rightly or wrongly, had bad reputation... I didn't sense much closeness to his kids in KD book.. Got along great with other's kids cause it didn't require regular, predictable time commitment

 

[Tobiano8th]

Sorry I should added some disclaimers to my BS comment... IMO, 2ND hand info, etc etc .

 

[dotr]

Honey's friend has retired her seat..

Twitter
https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/linda-frum-leaving-senate-1.6132082
Aug 06, 2021
''After 12 years in the upper house of Parliament, Sen. Linda Frum is set to retire from her seat on August 27.''

"It has been my profound honour to represent the people of Ontario in the Senate of Canada since my appointment by Prime Minister Stephen Harper in 2009," Frum said in a statement.

"As a Senator I have done my utmost to champion important causes including protecting the integrity of Canadian elections from the threat of foreign influence, denouncing human rights abuses by the malign regime in Iran, and combatting the surge of antisemitism at home and abroad."

 

[ldlager]

I’ve never doubted the crime scene was staged in such a way to initially appear as if a murder/suicide had occurred. Why not, horrible enough to murder two innocent, then toss in an added diabolical touch of making one of the deceased victim appear as guilty perpetrator as well. No homicide investigation would’ve occurred, can’t convict dead people nor can they defend themselves. So not only is Barry murdered but his reputation and legacy is tarnished forever, I suppose an attempted double accomplishment by whoever is responsible. But I do know police aren’t in a position to immediately and accurately determine what occurred and they certainly don’t touch the bodies let alone conduct an on-site autopsy. When arriving on the scene of “suspicious deaths” the coroner is called while police only secure the crime scene. So how can police have reliably known how the victims died in those first few hours even before the autopsy was completed? If they had coats over their arms any markings indicating bound wrists might’ve been covered up.

However regardless of how the crime scene was staged, I just don’t believe TPS held onto that belief of m/s for a full six weeks. However it must’ve proved an advantageous strategy during those early days of interviewing people known to the Shermans.

Do we know whether TPS interviewed anyone of significance in the first 4-6 weeks of the investigation? For example, we know that it took them 7 weeks to interview KW, someone with an obvious motive and significant dislike (ok hatred) for the deceased. It took them the same length of time to interview FD, and some other people with obvious knowledge of the crime scene (like the realtor with his clients) weren't interviewed for many months thereafter. The neighbors even had to chase TPS to come and pick up their video of the Shermans house.

I don't doubt TPS interviewed some people early in the investigation (apparently they claim to have interviewed 126 people before they interviewed FD, but who?) , but there seems to have been no rhyme or reason or urgency as to when they interviewed people who could have important facts surrounding the case. I don't subscribe to the argument that maybe they were being strategic in holding off interviews of key individuals in the case for months in some specific cases so that the killer(s) might be lulled into a false sense of complacency. Just my opinion.

 

[Bobbi Pearl]

Do we know whether TPS interviewed anyone of significance in the first 4-6 weeks of the investigation? For example, we know that it took them 7 weeks to interview KW, someone with an obvious motive and significant dislike (ok hatred) for the deceased. It took them the same length of time to interview FD, and some other people with obvious knowledge of the crime scene (like the realtor with his clients) weren't interviewed for many months thereafter. The neighbors even had to chase TPS to come and pick up their video of the Shermans house.

I don't doubt TPS interviewed some people early in the investigation (apparently they claim to have interviewed 126 people before they interviewed FD, but who?) , but there seems to have been no rhyme or reason or urgency as to when they interviewed people who could have important facts surrounding the case. I don't subscribe to the argument that maybe they were being strategic in holding off interviews of key individuals in the case for months in some specific cases so that the killer(s) might be lulled into a false sense of complacency. Just my opinion.

Maybe some of them lawyered up and it took that long for an "interview" to be arranged? In a roundabout way, the family did when they hired their personal team and started a parallel / their own investigation.

Possibly many contacts were away this was just before Christmas and NewYears.

I also assume that the detectives were deep into the investigation of BM and Toronto serial killings, logically implies that with a current threat to the public and the city compared to a "targeted" and no threat to the public investigation of suspicious death(s) and thus they did not have a full team to start the Sherman case immediately.

PS.
I do not subscribe to that either, it was far too early in the investigation and before any detectives had a chance to consume the details of the crime. I believe the scene was staged to appear as if it was domestic in nature and a murder-suicide or possibly a double suicide. But I still lean toward staging the bodies as an afterthought. I am still not sure that death was the intended crime, possibly they were tied up too tightly and asphyxiated in error. I wonder if the mastermind of this crime was not on-site and had communication with the "enforcer(s)" that was in the home following instructions.

Bobbi Pearl

 

[Sphinx]

The Davis case potentially dovetails this case really nicely.. Lots of similarities and in the end maybe very similar.... Davis wasn't as rich or famous as HE but his father was way back when

BS, rightly or wrongly, had bad reputation... I didn't sense much closeness to his kids in KD book.. Got along great with other's kids cause it didn't require regular, predictable time commitment

Were Honey and Barry God Parents to anyone ?

 

[nuff]

Were Honey and Barry God Parents to anyone ?

Unlikely, given that godparents are not a part of the Jewish tradition, but possible in an honorary role only, I guess.

 

[ldlager]

Unlikely, given that godparents are not a part of the Jewish tradition, but possible in an honorary role only, I guess.

am I mistaken or was Barry a godfather to his friend Joel ulsters son?

 

[Warwick1991]

am I mistaken or was Barry a godfather to his friend Joel ulsters son?

As @nuff noted, the Jewish tradition does not have godparents. I seem to recall that there was a close relationship with Ulster and Barry mentored his son.

 

[dotr]

As @nuff noted, the Jewish tradition does not have godparents. I seem to recall that there was a close relationship with Ulster and Barry mentored his son.

Have just been re-reading snippets of KD's book at this link..
The Billionaire Murders

The bit in the book about JU and his son MU, went completely over my head on first reading.
Could someone have felt resentful and jealous that BS helped MU with advice and generosity to start a business?
Coincidentally, JU and his son were supposed to treat the Shermans to a thank you dinner that weekend. imo, speculation.
The Billionaire Murders

ETA..
Maybe they don't have godparents in the atheist tradition either, lol!
Barry Sherman wrote frankly about atheist convictions in unfinished memoir

 

[WINDSOR]

"Coincidentally, JU and his son were supposed to treat the Shermans to a thank you dinner that weekend."
Is that correct? It would be an interesting coincidence.

Maybe meaningless, but maybe not, especially if jealousy was a partial motive.

 

[dotr]

"Coincidentally, JU and his son were supposed to treat the Shermans to a thank you dinner that weekend."
Is that correct? It would be an interesting coincidence.

Maybe meaningless, but maybe not, especially if jealousy was a partial motive.

Quick re-read atm, page 273 of KD's book, regarding dinner plans.
If i got all the initialed names correct, this more or less is what happened regarding the dinner at the Riz, which was not to be..

JU and MH were enroute to Toronto, for Sunday night dinner at Riz restaurant to celebrate JU's foray into podcast ads.
Mark U whom BS had assisted financially a few years prior, would also be present at the dinner with his wife.
JU and his wife had extended the invitation to the Shemans but HS apparently took over booking her fave restaurant The Riz and sending out emails to make sure all invited would be on time.
The Shermans would have Hanukkah brunch first at KS's fiance's parent's home, then go to the dinner at the Riz.

 

[Lexiintoronto]

"Coincidentally, JU and his son were supposed to treat the Shermans to a thank you dinner that weekend."
Is that correct? It would be an interesting coincidence.

Maybe meaningless, but maybe not, especially if jealousy was a partial motive.

Quick re-read atm, page 273 of KD's book, regarding dinner plans.
If i got all the initialed names correct, this more or less is what happened regarding the dinner at the Riz, which was not to be..

JU and MH were enroute to Toronto, for Sunday night dinner at Riz restaurant to celebrate JU's foray into podcast ads.
Mark U whom BS had assisted financially a few years prior, would also be present at the dinner with his wife.
JU and his wife had extended the invitation to the Shemans but HS apparently took over booking her fave restaurant The Riz and sending out emails to make sure all invited would be on time.
The Shermans would have Hanukkah brunch first at KS's fiance's parent's home, then go to the dinner at the Riz.

That didn’t occur to me, but if that is part of the motive that may also explain the timing of the murders.

One person I suspect wasn’t succeeding despite Barry’s financial support, IMO, and I think Barry knew that. He’s Mark’s peer. Mark U not only succeeded with Barry’s investment in him, but Mark U was grateful.

Few people in this saga are grateful for Barry’s generosity. Some are completely furious.

 

[ldlager]

Quick re-read atm, page 273 of KD's book, regarding dinner plans.
If i got all the initialed names correct, this more or less is what happened regarding the dinner at the Riz, which was not to be..

JU and MH were enroute to Toronto, for Sunday night dinner at Riz restaurant to celebrate JU's foray into podcast ads.
Mark U whom BS had assisted financially a few years prior, would also be present at the dinner with his wife.
JU and his wife had extended the invitation to the Shemans but HS apparently took over booking her fave restaurant The Riz and sending out emails to make sure all invited would be on time.
The Shermans would have Hanukkah brunch first at KS's fiance's parent's home, then go to the dinner at the Riz.

Dotr are you sure of this quote? JU does not have a wife, but instead a male partner. IIRC.

 

[ldlager]

As @nuff noted, the Jewish tradition does not have godparents. I seem to recall that there was a close relationship with Ulster and Barry mentored his son.

Yes but neither JU or BS are/were particularly observant.

 

[dotr]

Dotr are you sure of this quote? JU does not have a wife, but instead a male partner. IIRC.

Sorry for the confusion, i should have clarified that a father and son have the same initials, JU, the former does have a male partner and the latter, Jeff- has a wife, imo.