CA - Jonathan Gerrish, Ellen Chung, daughter, 1 & dog, suspicious death hiking area, Aug 2021 #5

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Agreed. I don't think this family *chose* to die anywhere that day - or planned to on any other given day for that matter. But I also don't believe that there was any complicated devious scheme at hand where some dastardly mastermind forced them out there against their will where some newly concocted weaponized untraceable aerosol toxin could be used against them. Possible? Sure. Probably? No. And I'm guessing that I'm not the only one that feels that way but who doesn't feel like debating every single post that's made here supporting such a theory. So I'm just saying that there may be many people still following this thread that are simply waiting to hear what further results LE eventually comes out. I won't assume that I'm correct on that though either. ...but I believe it's possible. (At least as possible as some of the other theories I've been reading here on these last few pages.)

Sorry for the interruption. I'll go back to lurker mode now and await the autopsy results & more info from LE. As you were.
I keep coming back to this post of your @WillieMac and am joining you in lurker mode. I can come up with no scenario starting with the premise that the family would absolutely not intend to take the hike that doesn’t lead me to discount or suspend the facts we do have and superimpose an alternative scenario for which there is currently no support. Reductio ad absurdum.
Eta: Moo
 
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There was no timing to make this hike safe. At daybreak (6:15 am) the relative humidity is high making the temperatures seem hotter. Leaving later pushed them up against the afternoon highs by the time they reached SLT. Three miles long, a narrow rocky trail where you need to watch your step, hot and dry with no shade if needed, hiking up when the temperatures had exceeded 100° was probably the tipping point toward HS. As they climbed the air temperature was getting lower due to elevation change however apparently their bodies had already overheated and couldn’t cool down. As we’ve said before you really have to stop activity and get into the shade. If you’ve reached an internal temperature of 104° to 105° even rest won’t help. At that point you need extreme cooling measures.
A little more information from the CDC.
Heat stroke is the most serious heat-related illness. It occurs when the body becomes unable to control its temperature: the body's temperature rises rapidly, the sweating mechanism fails, and the body is unable to cool down. Heat Stress Related Illness | NIOSH | CDC
Things were just as hot during July, the hottest month of their summer. Temperatures had been no better in August although the temperatures cooled somewhat the 18th through the 23rd before increasing again. There were several weeks of hot weather to warn them this hike was unadvisable. The SLT was avoided during this heat so there was no help, there was no cell service and HS ensued. I’m afraid that is the tragic reality.

MOO
 
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But do they do all these risky things with their 1-yr old child? That's what I can't wrap my head around. It makes no sense.
I believe they would since both parents were avid hikers. In most other cases of adventurers, only one of the couple (usually the man, sometimes the woman) is into extreme sports and does it alone or with buddies. In this case both the man and the woman were equally avid hikers/adventurers and they probably wanted to acclimatize their child early on and instill that love for hiking in her. Add to that the fact that they probably didn’t think this hike was even truly dangerous to begin with and I can totally see them taking the baby and dog on it. MOO
 
Sure. Snipping if you hit a paywall.

“My thought initially was perhaps the car veered off the trail,” said Mr. Jeffe, who cut short a trip to Croatia when he learned that the bodies had been found. “People were going to go out and look.”
Family’s Death in Sierra National Forest Is Shrouded in Mystery

Sunday’s outing with the family dog, who was also found dead at the site, was supposed to be a day hike, Jeffe said.
https://www.fresnobee.com/news/local/article253572954.html
https://www.fresnobee.com/news/local/article253572954.html
Thanks! If trucks fit down HC or could drive down the SL switchbacks, I assume LE would have used them to remove the bodies rather than a helicopter. MOO.
 
I believe they would since both parents were avid hikers. In most other cases of adventurers, only one of the couple (usually the man, sometimes the woman) is into extreme sports and does it alone or with buddies. In this case both the man and the woman were equally avid hikers/adventurers and they probably wanted to acclimatize their child early on and instill that love for hiking in her. Add to that the fact that they probably didn’t think this hike was even truly dangerous to begin with and I can totally see them taking the baby and dog on it. MOO
And, in fact they did, they were all found on the SL trail.
 
i haven't seen quite a few pictures of them hiking with their baby girl. if they routinely did so, does anyone know what hikes they took the baby on prior to this one?
I saw a few in The Daily Mail, including in the winter. MOO.
 
But do they do all these risky things with their 1-yr old child? That's what I can't wrap my head around. It makes no sense.
I mentioned on another post that on my most recent desert hike my companion and I passed two couples with babies in backpack carriers. This was on a very hot day One of the babies already appeared to be very sunburned.

My point is that it’s not uncommon for parents to take babies on strenuous hikes, even in very hot weather.
 
I keep coming back to this post of your @WillieMac and am joining you in lurker mode. I can come up with no scenario starting with the premise that the family would absolutely not intend to take the hike that doesn’t lead me to discount or suspend the facts we do have and superimpose an alternative scenario for which there is currently no support. Reductio ad absurdum.
Eta: Moo
Heartily agree, MOO. They intended to hike, they were dressed for hiking, they were found on a hiking trail, with hiking gear. They intended to go on a nice outing together, and as sometimes things tragically do, it went sideways. With suicide off the table in the latest update from LE, it leaves intending to hike, maybe see some mines, spend the day together. MOO.
 
I mentioned on another post that on my most recent desert hike my companion and I passed two couples with babies in backpack carriers. This was on a very hot day One of the babies already appeared to be very sunburned.

My point is that it’s not uncommon for parents to take babies on strenuous hikes, even in very hot weather.

My personal hope is that pediatricians, vets and outdoor gear stores become sources of public education re: the dangers of heat, particularly for the young, the elderly and canines. I hope that the policy of announcing trail closures in extreme heat continues and spreads, not 100% effective but will help move the needle on educating that there is some weather (heat, air quality, fire risk) that people should not hike in. Phrases like "risk of brain damage" need to be used and charges of neglect and cruelty to animals need to be more widely publicized. People don't know the risks or discount them and they need to better understand and to face consequences. That may help people think twice. MOO.
 
I keep coming back to this post of your @WillieMac and am joining you in lurker mode. I can come up with no scenario starting with the premise that the family would absolutely not intend to take the hike that doesn’t lead me to discount or suspend the facts we do have and superimpose an alternative scenario for which there is currently no support. Reductio ad absurdum.
Eta: Moo
San Francisco Chronicle
@sfchronicle

·
20 Aug

“They probably went to just venture out, so it wouldn’t have been like an extreme hike of any sort,” a family friend said. “It was probably just kind of, since they lived near the trailhead, ‘Let’s take a look at these things.’”
https://t.co/zheoeEqbKc?amp=1
 
Heartily agree, MOO. They intended to hike, they were dressed for hiking, they were found on a hiking trail, with hiking gear. They intended to go on a nice outing together, and as sometimes things tragically do, it went sideways. With suicide off the table in the latest update from LE, it leaves intending to hike, maybe see some mines, spend the day together. MOO.
San Francisco Chronicle
@sfchronicle

·
20 Aug

“They probably went to just venture out, so it wouldn’t have been like an extreme hike of any sort,” a family friend said. “It was probably just kind of, since they lived near the trailhead, ‘Let’s take a look at these things.’”
https://t.co/zheoeEqbKc?amp=1
 
I mentioned on another post that on my most recent desert hike my companion and I passed two couples with babies in backpack carriers. This was on a very hot day One of the babies already appeared to be very sunburned.

My point is that it’s not uncommon for parents to take babies on strenuous hikes, even in very hot weather.
Im sure it’s not uncommon for some people to do this. When I was younger I might even have done it myself - but not when I was 45 with my first (and only) 12 month old baby. We are assuming they were avid hikers on the one hand, but inexperienced on the other. If we are saying the were experienced then it stands to reason they would have taken every precaution to safeguard, not only themselves, but also Miju and Oski. Looking at the ALLtrails account Jon didn’t really appear to hike in areas as remote and unforgiving as the SL trail.
If we assume they actually made it to Hite Cove and managed to enjoy some fun and frolics in the river, surely as experienced hikers (or even just intelligent human beings) they would realise that returning to their vehicle would be madness in the heat of the day? They could have made the decision to follow the traditional route of the HC trail along the river and reach the main highway much more easily than heading for the SL trail. On reaching the HW they could have used their cellphone to call for someone to pick them up.
I can’t figure why they would choose the most difficult option. MOO
 
I saw a few in The Daily Mail, including in the winter. MOO.

I've only seen two, not quite a few, photos of JG and EC And their baby in "hiking" mode.

I believe it was news-reported that Rosanna Heaslett said they hiked weekends. It appears she did some housekeeping of Gerrish-Chung homes and, Moo, wasn't a close girlfriend of EC. Moo, I don't believe any close girlfriends or Chung family members have commented at all on this tragedy.

Also, the news reported that Steven Jeffe said they had planned to hike that weekend? I wonder how close of a relationship he has with the JG and EC.

Have either Heaslett or Jeffe made statements about where JG and EC had hiked With their baby on the weekends prior to this fateful one?

Moo. All Moo.



Moo. All Moo.
 
Im sure it’s not uncommon for some people to do this. When I was younger I might even have done it myself - but not when I was 45 with my first (and only) 12 month old baby. We are assuming they were avid hikers on the one hand, but inexperienced on the other. If we are saying the were experienced then it stands to reason they would have taken every precaution to safeguard, not only themselves, but also Miju and Oski. Looking at the ALLtrails account Jon didn’t really appear to hike in areas as remote and unforgiving as the SL trail.
If we assume they actually made it to Hite Cove and managed to enjoy some fun and frolics in the river, surely as experienced hikers (or even just intelligent human beings) they would realise that returning to their vehicle would be madness in the heat of the day? They could have made the decision to follow the traditional route of the HC trail along the river and reach the main highway much more easily than heading for the SL trail. On reaching the HW they could have used their cellphone to call for someone to pick them up.
I can’t figure why they would choose the most difficult option. MOO
I'd like to see map of this option. How far and which highway? TIA
MOO
 
I'd like to see map of this option. How far and which highway? TIA
MOO[/QUOTE

I have tried to upload a pic of Google earth showing the trail from the highway but the file is too big. If you look at Hite Cove on Google earth then click on the street view icon you will see dots highlighting areas on the trail towards the main road. Granted the trail is narrow but it looks a better option than the ravaged and very steep SL imo
It leads to central Yosemite highway 140
 
This is a brilliant explanation and totally plausible except - this was not a popular place at this time of year. We don’t know if there were any people frolicking in the river - and if there were people there they could probably attest they’d seen Jon, Ellen, Miju and Oski doing the same. As far as I’m aware there wasn’t anyone who saw them anywhere on that hike. MOO
Um- I said people were frolicking in the river DOWNSTREAM from JC-EC. Highway 140 runs along the Merced River, you can drive right to it and frolic to your heart's content, very popular activity on a Sunday. No, they wouldn't see the JG-EC family doing the same because you couldn't drive to the river where they were, and hiking down to it is not a good idea in summer. Here's a screen shot from Google Maps of the confluence of the Merced River and South Fork Merced River. The green marker at right labels the north end of the Hites Cove Trail. You can see highway 140 along the south side and my, look at all that frolic-friendly river.
 

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