Australia Australia - William Tyrrell, 3, Kendall, Nsw, 12 Sept 2014 - #61

[The gavel]

"What is unforgivable is the incompetence and unprofessionalism of the police involved in not actively trying to corroborate Spedding's alibis, and other evidence that was there for the grabbing if they could be bothered to follow thorough."


OK, To be fair, I think they did try to corroborate the alibis. We followed here in real time----I remember clearly reading and hearing about the proof that BS and his wife were putting forth.

The wife had a receipt from the coffee shop across the road from the school, where they were going to see their grandson accept an award. BS said he met his wife there for coffee before they walked to the school award show.

The receipt was timestamped and dated and was for 2 coffees, paid for by wife's bank card. The problem was, it did not prove that she bought them for herself and her husband.

And LE interviewed the Employees, and they could not say for sure that BS was there that morning, although they did recognise him as being there before. And there was no cctv.

The same thing happened with the witnesses to his visit to the school awards. His grandsons said he was there, and there was another friend of theirs who claimed to see him that morning. And BS was able to describe what he saw in the award show, like the children's choir singing a certain song, etc.

But other witnesses said they didnt remember seeing him, including someone he said he saw there nearby. ...so LE was not accepting it all as 100% verified alibi. I do think they tried to corroborate but it is hard if there is no cctv and it is just a large crowd meandering, to find witnesses who can swear they saw someone.

IIRC, there was also a picture that was taken with BS and his grandson and it was on school grounds, but it was at the very end of the award show, and people concluded that BS could have gone to Benaroon and grabbed the child, and then rushed to the school as an alibi.

So I don't want to bash LE and say they didn't try to corroborate BS's story because it seems that they did. And BS came with a lot of baggage, and it made sense that he would need to be investigated. He had been in FGM's home right before the children arrived and had plans to return to the home that same morning. It made sense at the time, that maybe he had driven to the home, and saw the boy in the driveway and sped off with him.

When they did begin investigating him, they found out that he had previously lived with his brotherinlaw, who was in prison for rapiung a 10 yr old girl and killing her father. And they found records of historic accusations of child abuse of a sexual nature against 2 of his relatives, years earlier. So how could they ignore all that?

They didn't try to corroborate them properly. BS had to produce his own receipt from the cafe, and also a video of him at a club function.

<modsnip>

 

[The gavel]

She can give all these details of what she thought when WT was quiet, she could recite this car nosing into the driveway of house next door that was driving with a purpose, but doesnt know the name of the street near her mothers house????? Unbelievable...

Maybe she hadn't rehearsed that part of the call ? Moo

 

[Tigerlily75]

Well that is very interesting! Reminds me of Baden Clay and his ‘head injury’ after crashing his car…

Or the scratches on his face he got “shaving”.

 

[Jaded325594]

Just stumbled across these Nowhere Child bonus episodes. Haven't listened yet, but thought worth sharing.

Nowhere Child Bonus Episodes

Nowhere Child Bonus Episodes
William Tyrrell was a three year old boy who disappeared from the village of Kendall, on the mid-north-coast of New South Wales. Key facts were kept from the public, from day one. A lot of what was reported, especially early on, was false. In the new podcast, Nowhere Child, The Australian’s Caroline Overington delves into a case where notions of class and privilege; opportunity and poverty came crashing together, to create a nightmare for William Tyrrell.

 

[Estelle]

It definitely seems to be factual, as it is noted in the book that it happened more than once.

Page 64 William Missing Book:

“…and she [FM] repeated [to the FACS worker Ben Atwood] an offer she had made earlier: she would be happy to occasionally take care of William's little brother, Francis, when his mum had the new baby, and maybe need a break?”

Page 65 - William Missing book

Also, someone asked how many days William was at childcare, the answer is also in the book.

“Mr Atwood said he would pass that on, as well as a request to enrol William in preschool for an extra day, so he would have two days in childcare and two days in preschool.”

So she did not have WT around her skirt tails for four days a week???

 

[EllaN1]

This area is apparently remote. But is there a possibility there is CCTV in the area, that wasn't there 7 years ago?

It's always surprised me to read of murderers moving a body, sometimes multiple times. Or criminals returning again and again to the scene of the crime. It puzzles me that they do this and that it's not that uncommon.

CCTV, dash cam footage, phone pings, recordings are all "intelligence" and specific too. As opposed to the accepted unreliability of human witnesses.

Yep, my thoughts exactly. They were under surveillance and visited that particular area several times or someone spotted FP's car in the area.

 

[SleepyJoe]

This bit doesn't seem very fair.
"At the inquest, the birth grandmother and her son were forced to enter the NSW Coroner’s Court at Lidcombe in Sydney’s west via the front door and in the media spotlight.

This was in contrast to William’s foster family, who were allowed in through a side door. When a cameraman tried to film them, a formal complaint and warning was made in court."
William Tyrrell’s birth family felt under suspicion for five years

They (bio parents) really haven't been treated very well, have they? And despite their failings, I honestly believe that they loved William, wanted him but just couldn't make it work and, since he has been missing, have been genuinely distressed and grieving.

 

[Edgar70]

Im worried that the foster family were directing the narrative, the theory of "abduction", the theory of "paedophile" could this be to explain anything that they might discover if the body was actually found back then,

The BS theory, could the foster family hav found out by Facebook that the real grandmother was friends with a woman who is friends with BS's family, were they hoping the narrative would follow that direction

I wonder what ever happened to the washing machine did the foster family blame him from the start and got another washing machine repair man

Missing toddler William Tyrrell: 'We hope he is still alive'

"The mother of missing toddler William Tyrrell says she has a vision in her head that somebody "reached over and ... has gone 'clump' on his shoulders, picked him up and moved him on ... because ... that's the only way ... to explain for him not to be there"."

There are probably "hundreds" of alternate ways to explain for William not to be there IMO with many discussions here.

"I had a vision in my head.
I don't know why, but I have a vision in my head, somebody, I'd, I can't explain it..." and then goes on to explain it?

Also noteworthy is the change from past tense "HAD" to present tense "HAVE".

Alternating between tenses raises a Red Flag for me.

Present tense may be indicative of storytelling. IMO.

 

[SLouTh]

I am still wanting to know when / day / time BS was called. Very fair question

9.03am: Foster mother rings washing machine repairman for 38 seconds, the call going to messages.

William Tyrrell: Missing boy’s doomed life before ‘handpicked’ for care | news.com.au — Australia’s leading news site

 

[Green beans]

I’m curious as what is being held in the right hand here, to me (IMO) it looks like a white tissue, from FM fall she mentioned ?

also FM mentioned “Moore” is “Moore” a street, or a road off bater creek? I’ve had a quick look on google maps cannot find. Not sure if I heard wrong

William Tyrrell's foster parents give evidence

 

[missepic]

Agreed. I have felt very sorry for him. All because the FGM had a broken washing machine....

I remember when one of the news stations showed a picture of his work van (which had "Speddo's" on it) which they doctored to make it look like it said "Peddo's"! What he was put through was disgraceful.

I recall this too.

9.03am: Foster mother rings washing machine repairman for 38 seconds, the call going to messages.

William Tyrrell: Missing boy’s doomed life before ‘handpicked’ for care | news.com.au — Australia’s leading news site

fascinating

 

[BGirl88]

Hey guys, I haven't posted in years but I am always lurking.

I am watching the FP interview with Michael Usher and I just wanted to say that when FM is talking about WT and his 'little Tara' doll around the beginning of the interview (around the 4.20 mark) she starts crying but it seems so fake and forced to me.

Anyone else have any thoughts on this?

Interesting thought.

yes I wondered this too - I did some research earlier today to see if I could find out how long a car’s computer kept GPS records. I didn’t find much, except that it can be saved for a number of years.

 

[canarybird]

I watched the 60 Minutes piece and was quite alarmed at that looming high balcony dominating the background of so many of the shots. It was almost screaming to be noticed! And the fact that it can be accessed from the backyard -easily for an active three-year-old- is quite alarming. I kept wanting to shout at the reporter like I was watching a pantomime: 'BEHIND YOU!'

I've also been relistening to the 10Speaks podcast and what struck me is how often the FP say that he absolutely, definitively would not have wandered off. I don't think you can make such a definite claim about ANY preschooler. They are unpredictable!

 

[Trmtrm2]

.

 

[Podcast Tragic]

I am just wondering under what legal circumstances the Foster Parents will be named and identified. It seems to me the fact they can't be identified is a huge disadvantage to the investigation. Always has been . Did I read in an earlier thread the FM made sure this protection was in place before details of William's disappearance was announced to the media? I am sure I read that somewhere????

 

[Awakening]

There's A LOT of info in this article including timelines, the foster care system, inquest, police investigation etc. BBM.


"Missing boy William Tyrrell had been “handpicked” to be shuffled off for adoption and had a doomed life even before he was abducted, a child welfare advocate claims.

William, who would just have turned eight years old if he is still alive, was “earmarked” for fostering and eventual adoption, child protection activist Allanna Smith said.

Ms Smith is responsible for William’s status as a foster child being revealed, after the state government tried to restrain her disclosure on social media that William was a ward of the state when he vanished.

The children’s advocate, who successfully took his case to the NSW Supreme Court, said authorities “certainly had William earmarked”.

“The removal was systematically calculated. The plans to adopt without consent or knowledge ... was by all means heading down the path of a forced adoption,” Ms Smith told news.com.au.

William’s biological mother has already told his inquest how she was alarmed when she later found out her son was then being adopted out without her knowledge.

Under NSW law, a child can remain in short term care for up to 12 months, when they can be returned to their natural parents or moved into long term care, which requires a court order.

Also legally represented is the NSW Police, who have been riven with dispute over their investigation of missing William.

Allegations have been made of a bungled police investigation and a focus on individual suspects.

Potential persons of interest were not formally interviewed early on, the disappearance was treated as a missing person search rather than a potential case of foul play.


William Tyrrell’s doomed life

 

[Cbk]

Police are working on the theory the three-year-old’s body was “placed” rather than buried in bush close to the Kendall home he vanished from, and that his remains should be near the surface of their dig.

. . .

The police source said very specific intelligence led them to a one-square-kilometre area of bush less than 900m from the Benaroon Dr home where the Tyrrell family was staying with the foster grandmother. --
November 21, 2021 - 6:00 AM The Sunday Telegraph

"very specific intelligence" ... That, if true, rules out police hunches.

Police are working on the theory the three-year-old’s body was “placed” rather than buried in bush close to the Kendall home he vanished from, and that his remains should be near the surface of their dig.

. . .

The police source said very specific intelligence led them to a one-square-kilometre area of bush less than 900m from the Benaroon Dr home where the Tyrrell family was staying with the foster grandmother. --
November 21, 2021 - 6:00 AM The Sunday Telegraph

"very specific intelligence" ... That, if true, rules out police hunches.

After the success of the CS case in WA, wonder if investigators engaged the AFP and their sophisticated toolset. For example, historical satellite imagery.

AFP have been referenced as being involved more recently. Perhaps they were able to identify the vehicle or place the FCM in the vicinity.

 

[Milisi]

Wow! Interesting pick up. I wonder if that’s connected to the current charges?

So do
I…..?

 

[SleepyJoe]

Professor Jon Olley, who found Daniel Morcombes body, is there, among other top specialists. They’ve brought in the big guns. Everything points to their surety he’s there somewhere. For reference, it took two months to find Daniel and it was a smaller area.

Body-finder who solved murder mystery breaks silence in Tyrrell case

That is so interesting that it took 2 months to find DM. I didn't realise that as the search for his remains was not as public. So, I will relax a bit about waiting for an outcome and give it some time!

 

[The gavel]

So she did not have WT around her skirt tails for four days a week???

Wasn't with him 4 days a week.
Didn't sleep in same room with him
FF mentioned that William was His world and vice versa
FF did all of the feeding and nappy changing early on
FM talked about giving up on William
FM talks about William as being full of beans and boisterous, rather than quiet and compliant like the FD?

Maybe she didn't like him that much but couldn't give him back because then they would probably want to take the FD too.

Looks like motive to me.

JMO