Australia Australia - William Tyrrell, 3, Kendall, Nsw, 12 Sept 2014 - #63

[JWSleuth]

Yeah right, not sure how long since you’ve been but the duty free there now is high quality , maybe cheaper too ? Not sure.

For me it’s been a while.., and it’s also been along time for the family, I think generally speaking though your not buying a camera at the other end?

 

[Cleaver Greene]

Me either.
If police took an avo out, pressed charges and removed a child from care, that’s serious. She is a victim. If another child in a hearing last week had even more serious assault does this mean FD’s alleged abuse isn’t serious now and not worthy of looking at?

I think the comment was probably in the context of the Magistrate not doing anything different with this case than she would with the dozens and dozens of cases she hears every day.
The fact that the FM is a POI in a missing child case is irrelevant to her decision making process today.

 

[drsleuth]

To the people saying that they doubt LE will find anything because all of the previous searches have not, please let me remind you that this new evidence, new search, new POI, and new charges are being done by a different team of investigators.

<modsnip>

Detective chief inspector David Laidlaw

Since he took over in January 2019, Laidlaw has steered the investigation through inquest hearings and the controversies left in the wake of his predecessor.

It appeared to be Jubelin, who was stood down for illegally recording a former suspect and has since left the police force, that NSW Police Commissioner Mick Fuller referenced when he described the case as an 'inherited mess'.

And it was clearly Laidlaw that Fuller was referring to when he said, 'I'm confident that the team who has the investigation at the moment can solve it'.

Under the guidance of Laidlaw, a former investigations coordinator for the NSW Homicide Squad, outwardly it had appeared the Tyrrell probe was treading water.

Behind the scenes, nothing could be further than the truth.

Recognised in the 2017 Australia Day Honours with the Australian Police Medal, DCI Laidlaw has been a police officer since 1977.

He became a detective in 1988, and in 1994 was promoted to the rank of detective sergeant.

He worked in the Major Crime Squad and in 2000 he was promoted to detective inspector at the Drug and Organised Crime Strike Force Program.

Since then he has served at the Crime Agencies Drug Trafficking Squad and the State Crime Command Homicide Squad.

He has dedicated the majority of his 40 years of policing to criminal investigation. At the Drug Trafficking Squad, Laidlaw led Strike Force Buffier which investigated an Italian organised crime cannabis syndicate and seized drugs worth up to $200m.

In 2007, he led the Coronial Investigation Team which developed closer working relationships between police and the NSW State Coroner’s Office.

He is a member of the SIDS Advisory Committee with the State Coroner’s Office and NSW Health, advising on children who die from Sudden Infant Death Syndrome.

Source: William Tyrrell investigation led by detective David Laidlaw in Kendall | Daily Mail Online

From photos I've seen of the searches etc, they all look like the same detectives to me ...........

 

[imstilla.grandma]

Cases that remain open for such a significant period of time almost never result in concrete answers being uncovered, crime scene reconstruction expert Scott Roder told news.com.au.

Even if investigators found half of William’s remains, the odds were stacked against them determining when and how he was killed, said Mr Roder, who hosts the Crime Scene Time Machinepodcast.

Even if they find the bones, and identify them as this child, there’s a very low percentage chance of them being able to determine his manner of death,” he said.

“They’re certainly not at this point in time going to be able to do any sort of toxicology or skin tissue exam or anything like that. There’s going to be no trace evidence.”

“Unless there’s something on the bones that is found that can be

interpreted as a specific cause of death, the chance of being able to determine the manner of death, or even compile evidence, is pretty slim.”

“Trying to find physical evidence after seven years is very hard.”

“If you took a marble and broke that into seven pieces, you could be looking for something that small,” he said.

Given William was just three when he went missing, his skull at the time was still in four pieces and relatively “flexible and pliable”, meaning they would have more easily detached and spread.

The chin bone and the hip and femur bones might be slightly easier to locate, Mr Roder said.

“Because it’s dense bushland, you can’t really dig too deep because of all the roots,” he said

“Maybe there’s evidence that he was dragged off into that bushland.”
Tyrrell question that will ‘never be answered’

 

[Ytho]

For me it’s been a while.., and it’s also been along time for the family, I think generally speaking though your not buying a camera at the other end?

Bali Airport Duty Free Shopping – Bali Airport Guide

I was there 4 years ago I was too keen for the holiday ahead to stop and be buying duty free cameras but I’m guessing wealthy people can afford to buy on impulse ? To each their own. I don’t see it as a red flag but if you do I’m all good with that x

interesting question though! I wonder if LE requested proof of purchase ? Surely they asked and not just took their word they purchased it in Bali, being a major part of the timeline investigation.

 

[JoeDetective]

It’s a pretty expensive strategy if this search is simply to ramp up the pressure to see if FFC will crack IMO. However, with all the media around reporting on the search in such detail I sometimes wonder. I keep reminding myself that this search was ordered by the Coroner on new information.

I don't see any supporting evidence to this conspiracy theory that this is some sort of tactic to make someone(specifically FFC the primary POI) that is allegedly capable of doing what they have allegedly done cracking. I feel like this is a narrative some people are lifting from a bad episode of Law & Order.
I do think the police want to make a public show of competent investigational methods for a multitude of reasons, namely public faith in the NSW police force in light of the tunnel vision of prior investigators that will continue to cost the NSW taxpayer for many years to come and especially in light of the CS investigation.

I would be gobsmacked if FFC does not protest her innocence to the grave, if she is involved it would be completely inconsistent with all her previous actions and statements to acknowledge any guilt at any stage. If she was involved you don't simply live with it for this long and suddenly crack because of some news reports or journalists outside your house, anyone involved in this that has covered it up would in all likelihood need to have a particular personality that allows for you to sleep at night with the knowledge innocent people are having their lives destroyed because of your lies.

This operation is dedicating a significant amount of police resources and tax-payer dollars on the off chance it might make someone crack? There are far cheaper ways of doing that believe me.

 

[sniffsniffcough]

What puzzles me about the whole photo thing is that if what beimg said is correct, FF went to all the effort to update the time on the camera for a holiday, but then didn't bother to change it back once home. Which seems odd to me, if you where THST concerned about it being right for the holiday, wouldn't you want it back for when your at home too

I don't think the Bali holiday od purchase if the camera in Bali has anything to do with it. Northern male foster carer. More likely whoever at FACS or NSWPOL who downloaded the photos onto police computer network had made the error when they applied the manual correction and not taking into account daylight saving.

New Article in The Australian paraphrased:

From a criminologist regarding what Police are looking for in the current search:

• Criminologist Terry Goldsworthy said police were searching for items such as bone fragments or the teeth of a young child.

• Dr Goldsworthy stated “There is material there. We have seen the material released by the police and they have an electronic sifter that makes (processing) it faster.

• Dr Goldsworthy also stated “It would be very draining to be constantly vigilant to ensure you don't miss a crucial bit of evidence that may be contained in the material (soil etc). It will be a very slow and thorough (process) to move through all that.”

From the Police Minister.

• The Police Minister David Elliot hinted at new evidence, during a morning show interview.

• He stated that detectives wouldn’t be searching there unless they thought there were new and fresh leads.

• Police have additional help like a forensic archaeologist and a hydrologist but it will still take a lot of time.

William Tyrrell latest: What police are looking for as search enters second week (theaustralian.com.au)

All these wonderful committed people (and cadaver dogs) giving of their timeless dedication in such atrocious conditions to hopefully discover the smallest key items that will support the successful prosecution of whoever was involved with the tragedy that occurred with adorable William. Justice may still take an excrutiangly long time but Justice will be served to its fullest extent IMO.

 

[JoeDetective]

Bali Airport Duty Free Shopping – Bali Airport Guide

I was there 4 years ago I was too keen for the holiday ahead to stop and be buying duty free cameras but I’m guessing wealthy people can afford to buy on impulse ? To each their own. I don’t see it as a red flag but if you do I’m all good with that x

interesting question though! I wonder if LE requested proof of purchase ? Surely they asked and not just took their word they purchased it in Bali, being a major part of the timeline investigation.

If they still have the camera it can possibly be traced through initial distribution batches, though the likelihood if it was actually a bali purchased camera, which I have my doubts, it would be a dead giveaway as the charger at the grandmother's house would almost certainly have had a big adapter in it.

 

[SLouTh]

All these wonderful committed people (and cadaver dogs) giving of their timeless dedication in such atrocious conditions to hopefully discover the smallest key items that will support the successful prosecution of whoever was involved with the tragedy that occurred with adorable William. Justice may still take an excrutiangly long time but Justice will be served to its fullest extent IMO.

Totally Agree!!! There needs to be Justice for William, no matter how long that takes..... and I just pray that William can be found soon.
IMO

 

[JoeDetective]

Hi everyone, there is so much coming through these threads, apologies if this has already been mentioned and responded to. The location where the FFC was alleged to “throw something from the window”, is that thought to be the corner of Batar Creek Road and Cobb and Co Road?

Further, the location where the creek is being drained - is that the same site? Just wondering if previous media had it wrong and Police are looking for remains at this site, not something thrown from a car window.

This is the alledged current search area. As provided by CH10 Australia as per the watermark.

 

[Milisi]

“There is material there.BBM. We have seen the material released by the police and they have an electronic sifter that makes (processing) it faster,” Dr Goldsworthy said.

 

[sniffsniffcough]

I don't see any supporting evidence to this conspiracy theory that this is some sort of tactic to make someone(specifically FFC the primary POI) that is allegedly capable of doing what they have allegedly done cracking. I feel like this is a narrative some people are lifting from a bad episode of Law & Order.
I do think the police want to make a public show of competent investigational methods for a multitude of reasons, namely public faith in the NSW police force in light of the tunnel vision of prior investigators that will continue to cost the NSW taxpayer for many years to come and especially in light of the CS investigation.

I would be gobsmacked if FFC does not protest her innocence to the grave, if she is involved it would be completely inconsistent with all her previous actions and statements to acknowledge any guilt at any stage. If she was involved you don't simply live with it for this long and suddenly crack because of some news reports or journalists outside your house, anyone involved in this that has covered it up would in all likelihood need to have a particular personality that allows for you to sleep at night with the knowledge innocent people are having their lives destroyed because of your lies.

This operation is dedicating a significant amount of police resources and tax-payer dollars on the off chance it might make someone crack? There are far cheaper ways of doing that believe me.

I agree with you and I would like to add that I personally appreciate viewing the media footage of search sites as it really reveals to me personally something that could never be felt by viewing still photographs.

The heartbreaking reality that this location may have been chosen by someone that described gorgeous William as 'my son' is unfathomable and totally and utterly gut wrenching and extremely difficult to comprehend at all levels.

It must also be a terribly harrowing experience for media representatives reporting from search areas.

 

[Jaded325594]

I don't see any supporting evidence to this conspiracy theory that this is some sort of tactic to make someone(specifically FFC the primary POI) that is allegedly capable of doing what they have allegedly done cracking. I feel like this is a narrative some people are lifting from a bad episode of Law & Order.
I do think the police want to make a public show of competent investigational methods for a multitude of reasons, namely public faith in the NSW police force in light of the tunnel vision of prior investigators that will continue to cost the NSW taxpayer for many years to come and especially in light of the CS investigation.

I would be gobsmacked if FFC does not protest her innocence to the grave, if she is involved it would be completely inconsistent with all her previous actions and statements to acknowledge any guilt at any stage. If she was involved you don't simply live with it for this long and suddenly crack because of some news reports or journalists outside your house, anyone involved in this that has covered it up would in all likelihood need to have a particular personality that allows for you to sleep at night with the knowledge innocent people are having their lives destroyed because of your lies.

This operation is dedicating a significant amount of police resources and tax-payer dollars on the off chance it might make someone crack? There are far cheaper ways of doing that believe me.

I've encountered some sly detectives before but this theory is next level. Completely unethical, someone could be seriously hurt by it (self harm?). Unless the foster carers were "in on it" but that doesn't really fit with the AVO.

 

[Seabreeze1]

I believe someone has given specific info to LE, to be searching where they are and to be so certain that an item was thrown from a car window to me doesn't seem like something the coroner could come up with.

 

[sniffsniffcough]

I believe someone has given specific info to LE, to be searching where they are and to be so certain that an item was thrown from a car window to me doesn't seem like something the coroner could come up with.

Maybe locals in that particular area recalled a certain 'odor' in the area at a certain time. Odors emitted by decomposing human remains are quite different than odors emitted by decomposing animals. Maybe the odor was quite different than that which is normally experienced.

Counsel Assisting the Coroner did release a direct formerly non publicized landline telephone number to the Coroners' Office for the public to make contact in the early stages of the Inquest. I cannot locate a link and I am positive this happened because I recall how shocked I was to read the article. Never heard of that happening before. IMO

 

[sniffsniffcough]

No worries. I’d like to think I’m across these things too, as I’ve worked as a journalist reporting on courts before.

Thankyou for revealing your connection. My understanding is that there is some sort of registration process media reps must go through to identify their actual media connection. I don't mind being corrected if that's not the case.

 

[SLouTh]

Maybe locals in that particular area recalled a certain 'odor' in the area at a certain time. Odors emitted by decomposing human remains are quite different than odors emitted by decomposing animals. Maybe the odor was quite different than that which is normally experienced.

Counsel Assisting the Coroner did release a direct formerly non publicized landline telephone number to the Coroners' Office for the public to make contact in the early stages of the Inquest. I cannot locate a link and I am positive this happened because I recall how shocked I was to read the article. Never heard of that happening before. IMO

Here is the link : William Tyrrell hotline direct to coroner (theaustralian.com.au)

Police investigating the disappearance of three-year-old William Tyrrell are so convinced that “someone knows something” they have taken the unusual step of releasing a phone number for the solicitors working directly for the NSW Coroner, so that information can be passed directly to the court.

 

[sniffsniffcough]

Is anyone experiencing WS site freezing tonight and subsequent double posts?

 

[Edgar70]

For what it's worth IMO I don't thing the following is of concern
. FP stopped 3 times other way to FGM. I make the same journey w kids to my mothers and it's annoying, but not suspicious
. FP slept w the kids in separate rooms, Whether bio or not, families are so familiar with eachother that this is not sinister IMO
. FD was cranky in the morning. I think everyy working parent know how difficult it is to focus on work with noisy kids in the background
. The time on the camera. If they can show it was purchased in Bali, the anomaly makes sense.
. The inversion of the time on pics.. even though the digits are reversed the difference between the time and correct time is the same in each image. IMO it was corrected by LE
. The supposed awkward pose FM must have been in to take pictures 5. The amount of strange pics I have taken of my kids, I don't think this is an issue.
. the bruised face black eye of WT. kid's get hurt all the time. And WT was a very hyper child.
. The confusion between Laurieton and Lakewood. These 2 locations are very close and Lakewood is kind of the nickname for the Woolies for locals. Driving from Kendall to Lakewood you follow the signs to Laurieton.

What I do find suspicious IMHO.
. The omission of driving during the 000 call.
. The memory of 2 cars (IMO FM filled in her memory gap with 'evidence that fit her mindset)
. The lack of concern re the high balcony. I would be on tender hooks visiting a place posing such as risk
. The inclusion of the description of WT 'deliberately crashing his bike into the garden'. This IMO feels like an embellishment (maybe anticipating potential evidence)
. The angry response on the WT official SM pages to new evidence.
. The mention of the description of her head out the window further passing truck. Again IMO this seems to be an anticipatory explanation that seems unnecessary IMO.

I also note FM's statement you discuss:
"deliberately crashing his bike into the garden"

FM also states in the following link:
"he didn’t want to wear a singlet"

William Tyrrell’s grandmother has lost all hope of her grandson being found

These can viewed in the context of subtle blaming of a victim, a Red Flag for me. IMHO.

I feel there is just no need for these types of comments when a loved and cherished little boy is missing IMHO.

 

[Milisi]

New article in The Telegraph paraphrased:

• William Tyrrell's FP today did not enter any plea on charges of assaulting a child.

• Magistrate Robyn Denes ruled a suppression order was extended on any other details, at Hornsby Local Court.

• FF's solicitor is Justeen Dormer,

• FM's solicitor is Sharon Ramsden,

• Both solicitors said they had only received the “mini” brief of evidence from the police yesterday.

• FF and FM were granted a two-week adjournment before entering pleas.

• “The allegations are not the most serious that the courts see by any stretch,” Magistrate Dene said.

• Solicitor Marlia Saunders, appearing for news organisations including News Corp — publisher of The Daily Telegraph — said it was a matter of public interest and the media sought to report the allegations without identifying anyone involved.

• Neither FF or FM were required to appear before the court.

• The magistrate said that if there was going to be a trial in this case, it was unlikely to be heard before August or September next year, such were the delays in the local courts.

• She adjourned the case to December 3 at 9am.

William Tyrrell’s foster parents did not enter a plea in court today | Daily Telegraph

Why would a couple have different solicitors? Can anyone explain the legal process or reason. Wouldn’t it be cheaper 2for 1!