Australia Australia - William Tyrrell, 3, Kendall, NSW, 12 Sep 2014 - #72

[SouthAussie]

A 2 year CSO is actually quite significant. I'm currently working with someone who has just been put on a 12 month CSO for assault. IMO.

It will be interesting to see what happens during the next court case, likely with a different judge.

Well, there you go then. Not so 'normalising the behaviour', I suppose. If that is a significant penalty.

 

[JLZ]

We don't see what the magistrates see, bear. The hundreds of cases af alleged assault against children.

Sadly, I imagine there is turbulence in many families. So, yes, it may be 'normal' behaviour (to the magistrates). Alleged corporal punishment for bad behaviour.

He seemed to think the alleged wooden spoon incident was minor, and that the alleged kicking incident was more serious. The wooden spoon presumably being a 'measured' punishment, the alleged kicking being a reactive and angry action.

Still only worthy of 2 years community service, in his opinion.

imo

It was the kicking that caused pain and bruising. Also, the kicking was part of an extended incident, where the child had reason to scream with pain, then was forced to sit on the floor for an extended time, then was kicked. It sounds like the 15-minute tirade was part of the same episode too.

Police will allege that when the child screamed out in pain, SD 'then forced the child to sit on the floor for an extended period of time before kicking the (alleged) victim and causing her pain and bruising. The (alleged) victim is reported to have tried to get up a number of times but (SD) forced her to sit down.'

The report states police will allege the child was 'pleading' with SD to stop while the two defendants allegedly subjected her to a 15-minute 'tirade of verbal abuse'.

same link . . .

William Tyrrell's foster mum in court over allegations she hit girl

William Tyrrell's foster mum has been refused an application to have charges she allegedly hit, kicked and intimidated a ten-year-old girl to be heard on mental health grounds.

www.dailymail.co.uk

I did argue that conflict with an older child had no bearing on what might have happened to William, but having heard the details I'll retract that. Along with the rest of it, the intention of 'breaking' a foster child (and this one who has lost a brother) horrifies me.

 

[Marg944]

Extracted from your post Marg944: "Interesting how the truth has come out in Court today, with proof being audio surveillance in their home."

JMO - Now it has been revealed, that audio surveillance will have FFC and MFC wondering??

So true Couldbe! The LE have shown their hand now, and can be sure they will no longer hear anything untoward in the fosters house, car, etc. The only place the fosters will be able to speak freely now will be in an open field.
It does make me wonder why the LE took so long to lay charges, if the offences took place in July 2021, and they did not lay charges until October 2021? Sounds like a dangerous waiting game when there are children involved. IMO

 

[SouthAussie]

How can we believe a word that has come out of either FFC or FMC's mouth - they lied with ease to both Police and Crime Commission. MOO

In relation to William's disappearance, it doesn't seem that the police have proved that either one of them have lied.

In relation to the alleged assault charges, as someone said earlier, the motivator for that would be shame.

imo

 

[JLZ]

In relation to William's disappearance, it doesn't seem that the police have proved that either one of them have lied.

In relation to the alleged assault charges, as someone said earlier, the motivator for that would be shame.

imo

She wasn't ashamed when she stated her intention to a friend.

 

[Sillybilly]

i wonder if the other six year old child also gave evidence? how frightening to be little and witness this alleged assault!
do we still need to refer to this assault as alleged if it has been reported from a police listening device, and do we still have to refer to the fosters as fcs or can we now use the initials used in msm?

Status quo re the thread parameters.

No, real initials may not be used, and ... a crime is "alleged" until a verdict is rendered by either a judge or jury.

 

[seekingjustice**]

In relation to William's disappearance, it doesn't seem that the police have proved that either one of them have lied.

In relation to the alleged assault charges, as someone said earlier, the motivator for that would be shame.

imo

I would actually think the motivating factor re: assault charges, is for justice.

 

[k-mac]

A child never deserves corporal punishment obviously.

But the two together, the parent or guardian having mental health issues, and the child playing up can happen both at the same time.

If the older girl had some idea of what kind of things they might do to the younger new girl (like "patterns of ongoing abuse" regardless of mental ill health), she may have instinctively been more in the centre of any negative attention to protect a younger child. imo

the defence is using the mental health issues as long standing and the reasoning for the abuse.
At the same time blaming the child for her lack of personal composure.
Can't be both in this circumstance. IMO.

How did she get custody of another child.

 

[SouthAussie]

She wasn't ashamed when she stated her intention to a friend.

Excuse me for trying to understand the situation without becoming over emotional. That's how I roll. Though I do understand the emotional reactions.

There is nothing that can be done by any of us. They have been separated for 7 months now. I hope they are all getting help.

There is a well known term about breaking the behaviour (as opposed to breaking the person).

I don't think this is related to William's disappearance.

Though I do think it could be a result of William's disappearance.

imo

 

[k-mac]

but he also normalised the behaviour as happening in families? yes i hope she get some help too

I noticed that too

 

[Couldbe]

She wasn't ashamed when she stated her intention to a friend.

JMO - It is very fortunate that the young girl told her teacher about what had been happening. Who knows where this behaviour by the FFC and the MFC could have led to ..... next time, either of them may not have been able to stop themselves! As Foster Carers, are they meant to be dishing out such discipline?

 

[seekingjustice**]

I wonder what other punishments the FFC was planning on using to 'break her'. We know about the 'alleged' kicking, hitting and verbal abuse, so how far was she willing to go to break the child?! Thank god for the audio surveillance.

The court heard that the foster mother at one point called a friend and allegedly said 'I need to break her', with police having a strong case for the charges because of audio surveillance in the home at the time.

Prosecutors told the court the intimidation was 'part of an ongoing pattern of violence' in the home. bbm

William Tyrrell's foster mum in court over allegations she hit girl

William Tyrrell's foster mum has been refused an application to have charges she allegedly hit, kicked and intimidated a ten-year-old girl to be heard on mental health grounds.

www.dailymail.co.uk

 

[JLZ]

JMO - It is very fortunate that the young girl told her teacher about what had been happening. Who knows where this behaviour by the FFC and the MFC could have led to ..... next time, either of them may not have been able to stop themselves! As Foster Carers, are they meant to be dishing out such discipline?

Nor as parents either.

 

[k-mac]

Though I do think it could be a result of William's disappearance.

imo

sff
It has been admitted she has long standing mental health issues that she clearly has beaten the system very recently to get custody of another child.

How do you know when she developed mental health issues?
How does anyone know she didn't beat the system before?
Just proven she can do it.

For all you/I know she may have had control/depressive issues all her life.
Not being able to have her own children....most women in her shoes will tell you how difficult that is emotionally.

When a child has vanished off the face of the earth..on her watch.......
I don't believe for a second that her issues started the day he disappeared.

moo

edited to snip post correctly

 

[Tessi V]

Does anyone know if any of this can be used for the WT investigation case, at all? Is this why the NSWCC are now involved? Are they responsible for the surveillance on the FP?
Particularly the "patterns of ongoing abuse" possibly to prove repeat offending and then obviously whether it can be applied to assess their credibility.

Some of the content is very distressing to read and quite the shock, so apologies if my comments are against WS regulations.

 

[luceat lux vestra]

I’m a bit confused about the allegations.
Is it alleged that FFC hit and kicked the elder foster child or the 6 year old?

 

[seekingjustice**]

but he also normalised the behaviour as happening in families? yes i hope she get some help too

I find it disturbing that Magistrate Feather seems to think this abuse is what normally goes on in households.

 

[JLZ]

I’m a bit confused about the allegations.
Is it alleged that FFC hit and kicked the elder foster child or the 6 year old?

William Tyrrell's foster mother has been refused an application to have charges she allegedly hit, kicked and intimidated a ten-year-old girl to be heard on mental health grounds.

William Tyrrell's foster mum in court over allegations she hit girl

William Tyrrell's foster mum has been refused an application to have charges she allegedly hit, kicked and intimidated a ten-year-old girl to be heard on mental health grounds.

www.dailymail.co.uk

BBM

 

[luceat lux vestra]

William Tyrrell's foster mother has been refused an application to have charges she allegedly hit, kicked and intimidated a ten-year-old girl to be heard on mental health grounds.

William Tyrrell's foster mum in court over allegations she hit girl

William Tyrrell's foster mum has been refused an application to have charges she allegedly hit, kicked and intimidated a ten-year-old girl to be heard on mental health grounds.

www.dailymail.co.uk

BBM

Thank you!

 

[Marg944]

ABC News allege that the FFFC hit the child on the head with a wooden spoon!

"William Tyrrell's foster mother allegedly used a wooden spoon to hit a young child in the head as part of a "pattern of ongoing violence", a Sydney court has heard."

William Tyrrell's foster mother used wooden spoon to hit young girl, court hears

A Sydney court hears William Tyrrell's foster mother allegedly used a wooden spoon to hit a young child in the head as part of a "pattern of ongoing violence". The child is not William Tyrrell.

www.abc.net.au