Australia Australia - William Tyrrell, 3, Kendall, NSW, 12 Sep 2014 - #72

[bearbear]

the ffc ankle bruise photo is in this article published feb 2022 so probably not relevant to this current charge, unless the child still resided there which i dont think

William Tyrrell's foster mother hit with fresh charge

The woman and her husband were represented in Hornsby Local Court on Tuesday regarding the allegations. The assault is alleged to have occurred at a home on Sydney 's upper north shore in 2021.

www.dailymail.co.uk

 

[JBowie]

The children were in daily childcare ..... / cat went into Cattery when they were away overnight!
I thought FFC must have gone out to work.

IIRC, she works from home.

 

[SouthAussie]

IIRC, she works from home.

I don't know if she always worked from home, but she was working from home on the day they left to go to Kendall.

She may have also been working at home due to the pandemic, as many people were/are.
The Sydney area was locked down and/or restricted for quite a while.


The foster mother was working from home on the day before William vanished, her husband out having meetings with clients or colleagues, when they made a snap decision to get their cats boarded for the night, grab William and head up to Kendall a day early.

Privileged life of William Tyrrell's foster mum haunted by final photo

William's foster mother is a wealthy professional from Sydney's north shore worth several million dollars who always longed to have children.

www.dailymail.co.uk

 

[deugirtni]

Am surprised on learning the fosters had gained another child and after being named a POI in the disappearance of her foster son that new placed child wasn't removed immediately.

Only AFTER they WERE CHARGED WITH assaulting the older girl was she removed. SMH.

They started fostering the second girl (6 year old) in July of 2020, according to this article, and that was prior to FM being named the sole POI in W's case.

That kinda doesn't make sense though, since articles are saying the alleged assaults took place in March 2021, which is well before July 2021 when this new foster child is said to have joined their family, but yet the victim's problematic behaviour was said to have been a result of jealousy over the new addition to the family?

The woman, whom the Herald is prohibited from identifying except by the pseudonym [FFC], was charged with two counts of intimidation and two of common assault in October last year, in relation to several alleged incidents in March 2021.
....
In July last year, the couple had a six-year-old female foster child placed into their care.

William Tyrrell’s foster mother accused of hitting child with wooden spoon, court hears

Mr Feather said the girl began “misbehaving” around another six-year-old child.

He said reading between the lines, there seemed to be a level of “jealousy” between the children.

A prosecutor opposed the “misbehaving” claims, telling the court the child’s “past and current” school teachers provided an “opposing opinion”.

“The intimidation relates to an ongoing pattern of violence,” the prosecutor said.

https://www.news.com.au/national/ns...l/news-story/e75f6b918434d5bb109163d9fd257191

 

[FromGermany1]

i wonder if that msm article with the photo of ffc with what looks like a big bruise on her ankle coincides with the alleged assault?

KICKING the child (which I find the worst and most humiliating) would make a bruising on FFC's ankle easily, IMO. But I can't classify the timing. Maybe, it doesn't fit.
ETA: "FFC's" included instead of "her". To me it was without question, that I meant FFC (not the girl).

 

[deugirtni]

KICKING the child (which I find the worst and most humiliating) would make a bruising on her ankle easily, IMO. But I can't classify the timing. Maybe, it doesn't fit.

It was FM who appeared to have the ankle bruising in one of the photos, not the foster daughter. But wondering if perhaps if there was some type of scuffle or something when FM was alleged to have kicked the girl, where the girl may have kicked back? imo.

 

[deugirtni]

The ABC article was already edited when I found it 25 minutes after it was originally posted. I think they're being pretty careful to be accurate and follow all these suppression orders. Someone must have seen an innacuracy nearly straight away.

I am still seeing the same wording even now when I click on that same link?

It's alleged the woman hit a 10-year-old girl in the head with a wooden spoon, kicked her in the thigh and threatened to "break" her.

William Tyrrell's foster mother used wooden spoon to hit young girl, court hears

A Sydney court hears William Tyrrell's foster mother allegedly used a wooden spoon to hit a young child in the head as part of a "pattern of ongoing violence". The child is not William Tyrrell.

www.abc.net.au

 

[deugirtni]

They started fostering the second girl (6 year old) in July of 2020, according to this article, and that was prior to FM being named the sole POI in W's case.

That kinda doesn't make sense though, since articles are saying the alleged assaults took place in March 2021, which is well before July 2021 when this new foster child is said to have joined their family, but yet the victim's problematic behaviour was said to have been a result of jealousy over the new addition to the family?

The woman, whom the Herald is prohibited from identifying except by the pseudonym [FFC], was charged with two counts of intimidation and two of common assault in October last year, in relation to several alleged incidents in March 2021.
....
In July last year, the couple had a six-year-old female foster child placed into their care.

William Tyrrell’s foster mother accused of hitting child with wooden spoon, court hears

Mr Feather said the girl began “misbehaving” around another six-year-old child.

He said reading between the lines, there seemed to be a level of “jealousy” between the children.

A prosecutor opposed the “misbehaving” claims, telling the court the child’s “past and current” school teachers provided an “opposing opinion”.

“The intimidation relates to an ongoing pattern of violence,” the prosecutor said.

https://www.news.com.au/national/ns...l/news-story/e75f6b918434d5bb109163d9fd257191

sorry, correcting my post, but too late to edit... first sentence supposed to read 'July of 2021'.. my own error.

Also, the DT is also saying the abuse occurred early in 2021 (but yet the other child wasn't in the home until July according to MSM):

"The incidents allegedly occurred in the family home early last year but the woman was not charged until November."

No Cookies | Daily Telegraph

No Cookies

www.dailytelegraph.com.au

 

[Megnut]

I just had a thought. In light of the newest details...

If William had the dice in his mouth, and the female caregiver followed him, caught him, scooped him up and dug into his mouth to retrieve the dice (good parent), if Wm bit her, she may have reacted instinctively, and her recoil may have pushed Wm back -- above waist height right over the rail (bad parent). He may well have uttered a final roar, borne of surprise, fear. There might have been nothing sustainable about a fall like that, not from that height.

Question: the high veranda, does it have a second access/recess point (opposite the low, ground level end)?

Would the female caregiver, in my scenario, have had to return to the low end, coming back to the patio or could she have entered the home unseen?

Pure speculation:

She witnessed the terrible fall. She enters the house and exits on lower level, unseen by the two on the patio. She hides Wm in the boot. Possibly returns to the patio with fresh tea, to keep foster grandma occupied, sits a minute before remarking how quiet Wm is, goes around the corner for the second time, and leaves in the car --

JMO

 

[FromGermany1]

dbm

 

[Couldbe]

I just had a thought. In light of the newest details...

If William had the dice in his mouth, and the female caregiver followed him, caught him, scooped him up and dug into his mouth to retrieve the dice (good parent), if Wm bit her, she may have reacted instinctively, and her recoil may have pushed Wm back -- above waist height right over the rail (bad parent). He may well have uttered a final roar, borne of surprise, fear. There might have been nothing sustainable about a fall like that, not from that height.

Question: the high veranda, does it have a second access/recess point (opposite the low, ground level end)?

Would the female caregiver, in my scenario, have had to return to the low end, coming back to the patio or could she have entered the home unseen?

Pure speculation:

She witnessed the terrible fall. She enters the house and exits on lower level, unseen by the two on the patio. She hides Wm in the boot. Possibly returns to the patio with fresh tea, to keep foster grandma occupied, sits a minute before remarking how quiet Wm is, goes around the corner for the second time, and leaves in the car --

JMO

JMO - In her effort to have the perfect children, if FFC had become used to successfully being able to hide her harsh disciplining methods of William and his sister, this may have escalated to (Extracted from your post Megnut):

"She witnessed the terrible fall. She enters the house and exits on lower level, unseen by the two on the patio. She hides Wm in the boot. Possibly returns to the patio with fresh tea, to keep foster grandma occupied, sits a minute before remarking how quiet Wm is, goes around the corner for the second time, and leaves in the car --"

 

[deugirtni]

I just had a thought. In light of the newest details...

If William had the dice in his mouth, and the female caregiver followed him, caught him, scooped him up and dug into his mouth to retrieve the dice (good parent), if Wm bit her, she may have reacted instinctively, and her recoil may have pushed Wm back -- above waist height right over the rail (bad parent). He may well have uttered a final roar, borne of surprise, fear. There might have been nothing sustainable about a fall like that, not from that height.

Question: the high veranda, does it have a second access/recess point (opposite the low, ground level end)?

Would the female caregiver, in my scenario, have had to return to the low end, coming back to the patio or could she have entered the home unseen?

Pure speculation:

She witnessed the terrible fall. She enters the house and exits on lower level, unseen by the two on the patio. She hides Wm in the boot. Possibly returns to the patio with fresh tea, to keep foster grandma occupied, sits a minute before remarking how quiet Wm is, goes around the corner for the second time, and leaves in the car --

JMO

It appears there are 2 sets of sliding doors which access the upper balcony: one in each of the master bedroom and the 'long room'; pics can be seen at this link: (master bedroom is pic #3 of 14, the long room is pic #7 of 14), and also attached to this post:

https://www.realestateview.com.au/property-360/property/48-benaroon-drive-kendall-nsw-2439/

---


I don't see how he could've fallen from that height without anyone hearing a noise/scream(?), and one would hope that with all the forensic work undertaken in November 2021, LE would've found DNA traces of W's blood if he had fallen from that height? Also, if W had bitten FM's hand, hopefully LE would have been observant enough to have noticed that, and if so, it would've been a big red flag? jmo.

Also attaching a floorplan created by our WS member richieswan from an earlier post linked below:

Australia - Australia - William Tyrrell, 3, Kendall, NSW, 12 Sept 2014 - #18

It would have been very easy for somebody to hide underneath the side balcony. It looks as though bushes/grass obscure the view underneath, so even the children running past several times may not have noticed anyone hiding there. The layout of the house (that we are now privy to) shows that...

www.websleuths.com

 

[Couldbe]

JMO - FFGM's memory of the activities where she describes (in her walkthrough) what William had been doing on the back deck, appears very good. She seems to say that the photographing occurred before the last activity ("...we said “roar, I’m a tiger” and he just disappeared around the corner of the house."

Inside house where William Tyrrell spent his FINAL hours and bedroom he slept in before vanishing

“She said William drew pictures with crayons, ‘got fed up’, and while he was doing so was photographed by his foster mother, ‘that photo of him in the Spider-Man suit, that was taken here’.

‘Then (the foster mother) had him throwing the dice, and he was THROWING the dice and she had to teach him that you don’t, just let it roll out of your hand.

The foster grandmother tells detectives ‘He was sort of taking over everything and we said “roar, I’m a tiger” and he just disappeared around the corner of the house. And that’s the last I saw of him’”.

 

[SLouTh]

don't see how he could've fallen from that height without anyone hearing a noise/scream(?),

BBM

The no scream is one of the most puzzling aspects of this case……

Was the “last Roar” that we have heard about so many times actually a “scream” ???? That has been “verbally disguised“ as a “roar” for the sake of the “story” ??????

Just a thought … imo

 

[Megnut]

BBM

The no scream is one of the most puzzling aspects of this case……

Was the “last Roar” that we have heard about so many times actually a “scream” ???? That has been “verbally disguised“ as a “roar” for the sake of the “story” ??????

Just a thought … imo

I think exactly that.

IMO we all accepted the Mommy Monster, Daddy Tiger (do I have that right?) story at face value, including that that's what's captured in the proof of life photos, as if he was photographed roaring, got up, ran around the corner, roared again and mere moments later, no one could find him.

I do think Wm uttered a final sound. But it wasn't for any game.

JMO

 

[SLouTh]

She witnessed the terrible fall. She enters the house and exits on lower level, unseen by the two on the patio. She hides Wm in the boot. Possibly returns to the patio with fresh tea, to keep foster grandma occupied, sits a minute before remarking how quiet Wm is, goes around the corner for the second time, and leaves in the car --"

Definitely a plausible scenarios CB ….. and would fit the current timeline …

However it would take nerves of steel to pull off making cups of tea after something like that imo ….

I am starting to think that Anything is Possible …. In this case…It seems to have done a complete 360 degree turn..

Maybe the “tea” gave FM time to think about the destination of where she would take the drive to????

SPECULATION and IMO

 

[JLZ]

JMO - FFGM's memory of the activities where she describes (in her walkthrough) what William had been doing on the back deck, appears very good. She seems to say that the photographing occurred before the last activity ("...we said “roar, I’m a tiger” and he just disappeared around the corner of the house."

Inside house where William Tyrrell spent his FINAL hours and bedroom he slept in before vanishing

“She said William drew pictures with crayons, ‘got fed up’, and while he was doing so was photographed by his foster mother, ‘that photo of him in the Spider-Man suit, that was taken here’.

‘Then (the foster mother) had him throwing the dice, and he was THROWING the dice and she had to teach him that you don’t, just let it roll out of your hand.

The foster grandmother tells detectives ‘He was sort of taking over everything and we said “roar, I’m a tiger” and he just disappeared around the corner of the house. And that’s the last I saw of him’”.

It was also my impression from what FGM said, that she remembered the photographs and the roar-around-the-corner as close together. Whereas FFC's first accounts put the roar at least three quarters of an hour later.

 

[k-mac]

BBM

The no scream is one of the most puzzling aspects of this case……

Was the “last Roar” that we have heard about so many times actually a “scream” ???? That has been “verbally disguised“ as a “roar” for the sake of the “story” ??????

Just a thought … imo

yes it is strange. Definitely food for thought.

FFGM said zoomed off round the corner full of life....jumping out of his skull.


verbal leakage.

 

[bearbear]

if, as reported, ffc had a difficult relationship with her mother, there could have been a lot of tension that morning between the two, with old issues and behaviour patterns possibly resurfacing?

William Tyrrell’s foster mother denied mental health application over alleged assault of young girl​

ffc was diagnosed with major depressive disorder and PTSD, and some of her mental ill-health relates to the “difficult relationship she had with her mother and the loss of her mother in most recent years … in fairly difficult circumstances,” he said.

William Tyrrell’s foster mother denied mental health application over alleged assault of young girl

Magistrate dismisses application for woman’s charges of assault and intimidation to be dealt with under Mental Health Act

www.theguardian.com

 

[Megnut]

Perhaps Wm fell onto something. Random. Like a yard tarp. Something he was then wrapped up in and disappeared with. No trace below.

Just a thought