ID - 4 University of Idaho Students Murdered - Moscow # 16

[webraccoon2234]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1597797504317550592

This is…a mess. The back pedaling is frustrating. I feel it’ll be a cold case, unfortunately. Small town LE for you.

 

[CrownCowboy1]

There really is no telling how much information LE is sitting on at the moment. I'd suspect that they know a lot more than we think and certainly a lot more than they are letting on.

With a crime scene that messy and with one of the victims having defensive wounds, it certainly is very possible that foreign DNA was left behind. I'd imagine that they have also found evidence outside as well whether the killer left some sort of trail or anything else. LE is controlling the narrative and I think that this case is not as cold as we think it is at this stage of the investigation.

 

[syrian rose]

It's so crazy that a relatively inexpensive Ring device (less than $100) on the wall next to the sliding doors at the back and the killer would most probably be caught by now. Or even just a basic security camera that you can review the footage placed at the back of the house. JMO but i think in these times things like this is basic safety now.

 

[layer]

I wrote this whole novel and realized I don’t even know the name of the dog so brb while I Google it. You get a cookie if you read this far.

I believe the dog's name is Murphy. Where's my cookie?

 

[jcamh]

Idaho murders: Law enforcement should not dismiss 'incel' angle, experts say

Authorities have not identified a suspect in the murders of four college students, but some experts say detectives shouldn't discount the killer potentially being an "incel."

www.foxnews.com

Forensic psychologist Kris Mohandie thinks the killer is an incel. The way the person killed the victims indicates extreme anger and envy.

I think the killer is likely an injustice collector or grudge hoarder. More like Elliot Rodger, Adam Lanza, Eric Harris, Nikolas Cruz, Stephen Paddock, Jodi Arias, or Lori Drew.

What does Intel. mean?

 

[Friday Fan]

So, what will happen to the house now, since I doubt they will be able to rent it out again. Does it get destroyed? Does it get gutted and completely redone? Is there some provision or addendum to rental property insurance that allows a place to be destroyed and the owner reimbursed for full value in the event of a heinous crime committed there? Just wondering if there might be a benefit to someone to not have it exist anymore who might have a vendetta against the owner or management company. I don't know if this type of comment is allowed, but it's MOO, my own random thought.

The Jon Benet Ramsey house is still there in Boulder.
I saw it myself on December 28th, 2019.

The Clutter farm house was used in a movie about their murder. The new owner loaned the house to the studio for the 1967 movie, In Cold Blood.

 

[drmrgrl]

I hope that in escaping through the dark back yard, the perpetrator stepped into a pile of Murphy's waste and it worked its way thoroughly into the treads of his shoes and the sides of them, and from there onto the floor mats of his car, and everywhere he stepped early that morning. And that even still - for as careful as he may have been in planning and executing his plan to leave little of himself behind - he cannot fully rid himself of what he took away with him so it is like a smelly telltale heart reminder every moment of what he did and how much closer LE is to discovering that it was he who did it. And I hope someone around him remembers that he came in early that morning with dog waste on his shoes and that - given he has no dog - they think that strange enough to call that tip in.

I know. Petty. I don't care. I'm for any path to his discovery that will get LE there. And I would love for him to be known as the murderer who was found because he had KG's sweet little dog's waste all over his shoes.

Amen!

 

[Bliss_Perth]

So, what will happen to the house now, since I doubt they will be able to rent it out again. Does it get destroyed? Does it get gutted and completely redone? Is there some provision or addendum to rental property insurance that allows a place to be destroyed and the owner reimbursed for full value in the event of a heinous crime committed there? Just wondering if there might be a benefit to someone to not have it exist anymore who might have a vendetta against the owner or management company. I don't know if this type of comment is allowed, but it's MOO, my own random thought.

Maybe keep the house as it is so they jury can walk through the crime scene, then demolish it.

 

[Trouble1321075]

I hope that in escaping through the dark back yard, the perpetrator stepped into a pile of Murphy's waste and it worked its way thoroughly into the treads of his shoes and the sides of them, and from there onto the floor mats of his car, and everywhere he stepped early that morning. And that even still - for as careful as he may have been in planning and executing his plan to leave little of himself behind - he cannot fully rid himself of what he took away with him so it is like a smelly telltale heart reminder every moment of what he did and how much closer LE is to discovering that it was he who did it. And I hope someone around him remembers that he came in early that morning with dog waste on his shoes and that - given he has no dog - they think that strange enough to call that tip in.

I know. Petty. I don't care. I'm for any path to his discovery that will get LE there. And I would love for him to be known as the murderer who was found because he had KG's sweet little dog's waste all over his shoes.

I think it's plausible that the killer left behind significant pieces of evidence but the police don't have enough to put- together to point at a specific person. I think if they did a search warrant would have been executed that names a POI. It's one thing to have a foot print but another to know who it belongs to.

 

[webraccoon2234]

What does Intel. mean?

Incel is a shortened form of involuntary celibate. They are a form of men for lack of a better word. Whom hate women because they for some form or another have never been able to date one or are just not approached by women. So they take their hatred out on women. Elliot Rodger for example.

 

[Bliss_Perth]

What I don‘t get is why LE indicated right away it was targeted crime. What made them think that? Granted the university might have had some influence but I don’t think they would put the community at risk needlessly.
There must have been something ie. a reason for saying it was targeted. LE are holding back lots…

Evidence but what evidence???

 

[Emerald15]

I think he used 2 knives Simultaneously.

 

[acutename]

Here’s what bothers me the most about this case: Where was the dog during the murders if no roommates or neighbors heard any barking?

But before I get to that, I want to explain why this case is so stuck in my mind. When I was their age I lived in a campus house with five girls. We had six rooms but one was always empty. I am curious how their living arrangement was set up, if they paid for their housing with student loans it’s possible the house is owned by the University. Otherwise, they probably rent it from a local landlord. My house was owned by the University, our roommates were assigned, and was basically a huge piece of crap with bad street lighting etc. Especially because the house is so close to the frat house, it wouldn’t surprise me if it was university-owned.

I lived on the second floor of a split-level college house. My floor had a sliding door entry that faced the road and was easy to see into. We kept it unlocked most of the time because that’s how friends of those of us who shared that floor would come and go. Though we did generally lock it at night, I’m sure there were nights someone forgot. Not smart, I know. But I grew up in a rural area and remember being confused about having to lock doors when I moved to a city. It’s not engrained in everyone’s head as you may assume. Especially out there.

You had to learn to sleep through everything in that house. My roommate directly above me always had people over and her rabbit thumping around. It was not unusual to come home drunk, lay down, realize there were strange voices coming from above me, fall asleep. And because we had three entries to our various living areas it was easy not to see or talk to your other roommates that often. I definitely couldn’t tell you how many random people came and went that I didn’t realize were ever even there. I even woke up to someone trying to get into my room thinking it was a bathroom more than once.

This is part of the reason that being that age is such a high risk factor for being victimized. It’s a very vulnerable time and you don’t always (or even normally) make the most rational choices— not locking doors, posting your entire night on snap chat with location on, drinking too much without a secure way home, etc. All things that make a good target for a perp. I still sometimes look back and wonder how I survived those years. But that’s the thing, not everyone does survive it, and it’s a tragic reminder how fragile youth is.

So back to the dog. Either the dog was barking and no roommates or neighbors heard him or the dog really didn’t bark. I can’t puzzle out how the dog wouldn’t have barked unless it was in a crate or in a room completely separate from the rest of the house, maybe in the extra room. If it were in another room then maybe it was desensitized enough to noise of people coming and going in the house. I don’t think he would have been outside at that time either, it was cold. Even less likely if we consider LE has suggested they were sleeping already.

When I think about my roommate who had a dog, the crate was always in her room. Especially because strangers do come and go in college houses. I really don’t think she would have gone to sleep without her dog in her room. I just can’t see that. This dog would be a source of comfort for her. I shared a dog my Senior year of college with a boyfriend and I loved that dog, he always slept in the bed or in his crate.
I think we can logically rule out the dog being loose in the room (or anywhere in the house for that matter) Otherwise the dog likely would have barked, possibly attacked the perp, or at the very least stained all of his fur with blood. Looking at recent pictures, it’s very white and it doesn’t appear to have been stained. I also think if the dog were loose this perp wouldn’t have a hard time killing anything in their way (unless the crime was committed related to the ownership of the dog, which has crossed my mind).

So let’s assume the dog was in her room in a crate. I can’t figure out how the dog wouldn’t bark upon a stranger coming into the room. The perp could have been known to the dog, but wouldn’t a dog bark even if they know, or even trust, the person attacking it’s owner? Or, they could have fed the dog to distract him. I just can’t see how someone could get in without waking the girls, get lucky that the dog doesn’t bark, and then give it some food which might make the dog whine and make noises that wake the girls anyway. But let’s just assume the distraction works and the perp is gone before the dog realizes what happens, they can still smell death almost immediately. I really can’t imagine that her dog wouldn’t have barked through the night/morning after realizing something was off.

So even though I strongly believe that she would have kept her dog in her room, I can’t think of a reasonable scenario in which the dog was in the room at the time of the murders and also did not bark. Which means I have to consider the possibility that the dog really was in another room and didn’t bark, in which case I lean towards the extra room being used as sort of a “dog room” for while she is out of the house. My poor roommate’s dog had to be in her room all day when she was at class. It’s common courtesy in a shared house to keep your pet contained while not around.

So…. Where was the freaking dog?

I’ve outlined the possibilities of if the dog really didn’t bark, in that case he was likely in the spare bedroom.

The the alternative is that the dog was actually barking and the roommates and neighbors just didn’t hear him. A dog in distress can be loud, but the layout of the house is strange and maybe dogs in the neighborhood bark a lot and people don’t think twice about it and don’t remember hearing the barking. In that case I feel he was in a crate in her room and was barking, and may even be part of what made the roommates think someone was unconscious.

Some other possibilities, could the dog have been drugged? Could the dog have been muzzled? Could the dog have been locked somewhere by the perp? This would certainly add to the degree of premeditation involved in the crimes.

I wrote this whole novel and realized I don’t even know the name of the dog so brb while I Google it. You get a cookie if you read this far. Please let me know what you think about where the dog was. Was he in a crate? Was he loose? Which room was he in? Did he bark? Did he not bark? I feel like there is something there that we can logically deduce but I just can’t put my finger on it.

people say who cares about this, however young dogs have very acute senses- sharp ears- and dogs' noses are about 10,000 x more sensitive than humans, so I do not understand where the dog was.

 

[avalonisland]

Here’s what bothers me the most about this case: Where was the dog during the murders if no roommates or neighbors heard any barking?

But before I get to that, I want to explain why this case is so stuck in my mind. When I was their age I lived in a campus house with five girls. We had six rooms but one was always empty. I am curious how their living arrangement was set up, if they paid for their housing with student loans it’s possible the house is owned by the University. Otherwise, they probably rent it from a local landlord. My house was owned by the University, our roommates were assigned, and was basically a huge piece of crap with bad street lighting etc. Especially because the house is so close to the frat house, it wouldn’t surprise me if it was university-owned.

I lived on the second floor of a split-level college house. My floor had a sliding door entry that faced the road and was easy to see into. We kept it unlocked most of the time because that’s how friends of those of us who shared that floor would come and go. Though we did generally lock it at night, I’m sure there were nights someone forgot. Not smart, I know. But I grew up in a rural area and remember being confused about having to lock doors when I moved to a city. It’s not engrained in everyone’s head as you may assume. Especially out there.

You had to learn to sleep through everything in that house. My roommate directly above me always had people over and her rabbit thumping around. It was not unusual to come home drunk, lay down, realize there were strange voices coming from above me, fall asleep. And because we had three entries to our various living areas it was easy not to see or talk to your other roommates that often. I definitely couldn’t tell you how many random people came and went that I didn’t realize were ever even there. I even woke up to someone trying to get into my room thinking it was a bathroom more than once.

This is part of the reason that being that age is such a high risk factor for being victimized. It’s a very vulnerable time and you don’t always (or even normally) make the most rational choices— not locking doors, posting your entire night on snap chat with location on, drinking too much without a secure way home, etc. All things that make a good target for a perp. I still sometimes look back and wonder how I survived those years. But that’s the thing, not everyone does survive it, and it’s a tragic reminder how fragile youth is.

So back to the dog. Either the dog was barking and no roommates or neighbors heard him or the dog really didn’t bark. I can’t puzzle out how the dog wouldn’t have barked unless it was in a crate or in a room completely separate from the rest of the house, maybe in the extra room. If it were in another room then maybe it was desensitized enough to noise of people coming and going in the house. I don’t think he would have been outside at that time either, it was cold. Even less likely if we consider LE has suggested they were sleeping already.

When I think about my roommate who had a dog, the crate was always in her room. Especially because strangers do come and go in college houses. I really don’t think she would have gone to sleep without her dog in her room. I just can’t see that. This dog would be a source of comfort for her. I shared a dog my Senior year of college with a boyfriend and I loved that dog, he always slept in the bed or in his crate.
I think we can logically rule out the dog being loose in the room (or anywhere in the house for that matter) Otherwise the dog likely would have barked, possibly attacked the perp, or at the very least stained all of his fur with blood. Looking at recent pictures, it’s very white and it doesn’t appear to have been stained. I also think if the dog were loose this perp wouldn’t have a hard time killing anything in their way (unless the crime was committed related to the ownership of the dog, which has crossed my mind).

So let’s assume the dog was in her room in a crate. I can’t figure out how the dog wouldn’t bark upon a stranger coming into the room. The perp could have been known to the dog, but wouldn’t a dog bark even if they know, or even trust, the person attacking it’s owner? Or, they could have fed the dog to distract him. I just can’t see how someone could get in without waking the girls, get lucky that the dog doesn’t bark, and then give it some food which might make the dog whine and make noises that wake the girls anyway. But let’s just assume the distraction works and the perp is gone before the dog realizes what happens, they can still smell death almost immediately. I really can’t imagine that her dog wouldn’t have barked through the night/morning after realizing something was off.

So even though I strongly believe that she would have kept her dog in her room, I can’t think of a reasonable scenario in which the dog was in the room at the time of the murders and also did not bark. Which means I have to consider the possibility that the dog really was in another room and didn’t bark, in which case I lean towards the extra room being used as sort of a “dog room” for while she is out of the house. My poor roommate’s dog had to be in her room all day when she was at class. It’s common courtesy in a shared house to keep your pet contained while not around.

So…. Where was the freaking dog?

I’ve outlined the possibilities of if the dog really didn’t bark, in that case he was likely in the spare bedroom.

The the alternative is that the dog was actually barking and the roommates and neighbors just didn’t hear him. A dog in distress can be loud, but the layout of the house is strange and maybe dogs in the neighborhood bark a lot and people don’t think twice about it and don’t remember hearing the barking. In that case I feel he was in a crate in her room and was barking, and may even be part of what made the roommates think someone was unconscious.

Some other possibilities, could the dog have been drugged? Could the dog have been muzzled? Could the dog have been locked somewhere by the perp? This would certainly add to the degree of premeditation involved in the crimes.

I wrote this whole novel and realized I don’t even know the name of the dog so brb while I Google it. You get a cookie if you read this far. Please let me know what you think about where the dog was. Was he in a crate? Was he loose? Which room was he in? Did he bark? Did he not bark? I feel like there is something there that we can logically deduce but I just can’t put my finger on it.

I have 2 small dogs that bark when neighbors pass my house out on walks or when guests visit. However, my dogs never bark at night where they sleep on their doggy beds which is in master bathroom. If there was a spare bedroom in the house, perhaps that was where the dog slept and that the dog was so used to hearing the noise of guests that he did not bark. Or maybe the dog slept in a crate at night? Or, maybe the dog was at co-owners but dropped off sometime on 11/13. I don't know why LE seems to not give much info about the dog.

 

[jcamh]

So, what will happen to the house now, since I doubt they will be able to rent it out again. Does it get destroyed? Does it get gutted and completely redone? Is there some provision or addendum to rental property insurance that allows a place to be destroyed and the owner reimbursed for full value in the event of a heinous crime committed there? Just wondering if there might be a benefit to someone to not have it exist anymore who might have a vendetta against the owner or management company. I don't know if this type of comment is allowed, but it's MOO, my own random thought.

I think there are people who will rent it as it will be "famous". I can't see girls renting it, perhaps guys. I know from personal experience that if there was a murder in the house, you have to legally disclose that on a home that you put up for sale. I think it will be hard to rent or sell initially, but if the owners/sellers want to rent it or sell it, all they have to do is lower the price.

<modsnip>

 

[Trouble1321075]

They do lie to spare family feelings in my experience. When one of my relatives were killed in a wreck, all of the official people who dealt with us reassured us it was very quick and painless. But per people who were there and the actual reports, that's not what happened. I've not disabused the rest of my family of the notion, and I don't resent the authorities for trying to be kind. But because of that, I am inclined to suspect that all of the family members in this case saying it was quick and painless may not have been told the full truth to spare them the reality. MOO


My inclination is to believe them when they say they don't have a person of interest. They are under tremendous pressure to solve this case from the community. It would be much easier for them to try to be somewhat reassuring with vague mentions of people of interest. That's not to say that I don't think they still have lines of inquiry to pursue, but I am guessing they are being honest about not having any specific person to focus in on.

They will only name a POI if they have a need to. Like obtaining a warrant to search their vehicle. Otherwise it's not in the investigations interest to name who they are looking at.

There's also a safety element for the POI. Imagine a vigilante killing an innocent POI. The police would get shredded for needlessly naming that person if they were not ready to make an arrest.

 

[Colorado303]

I don't think they should release the 911 call at this point, or possibly ever. IMO the suv behind the red jeep belonged to one of E's siblings (Washington plates and I've seen pictures of the vehicle on social media but can't link). That 911 call likely includes the horrific screaming and crying of 2 very traumatized roommates and 2/3 triplets. No one's morbid curiosity is more important than the privacy of the VICTIMS left in the wake of this tragedy. MOO - that 911 call is horrific and the people there will possibly never recover from what they witnessed/called in - but they sure as hell don't need the public hearing and weighing in on the absolute worst few minutes of their lives. I feel like it's kind of gross to even continue to beat on the issue. The police and FBI have it - let the families grieve in peace without having their trauma played on repeat for the sake of people on the internet - regardless of how well intentioned. JMO

Amen!

 

[Windsorite]

Sadly...I think "It can't happen here" was part of this.

But it can happen anywhere.

Some long-term residents have short-term memories then. I believe they still have an unsolved case
on the books from 1969 (Janice Foiles)

 

[ArmChairDet]

people say who cares about this, however young dogs have very acute senses- sharp ears- and dogs' noses are about 10,000 x more sensitive than humans, so I do not understand where the dog was.

Dog looks like a labradoodle, I have one. It views everybody as a friend. Barks a lot, however, if it is a party house and people come and go, it may not get excited.

If you look at the neighborhood, it is basically student housing. A dog bark would go unnoticed.

 

[DizzyB]

During the live showing on Banfield and also in the video Brian Entin posted prior to the start of the show (around the 5:21 mark in video below), he mentions a big parking lot right behind the house. I'm not sure if that was mentioned anywhere before because I haven't read through all the threads. But this could also mean the person escaped by car out back. MOO

https://twitter.com/i/broadcasts/1BdGYyDjgvZGX

I watched a video the other night that showed that parking lot, and I wondered about cameras-evidently no cameras there. It seemed like a logical place to park and walk in.

I listened to someone on Banfield-last name Main, I know he has been mentioned, he is well known. He stated that if one person were more brutally attacked, that would not necessarily indicate that they were the “target”. It could just mean that they were the first attacked, when the killer was most strong, that first burst of adrenaline. As they continued, they could tire and lose the rush that they had. Just food for thought. I’m thinking that the word targeted was misused prematurely. We are hanging onto it like a dog with a bone, and LE isn’t letting go. Like they’re trying to spin it now.

I also feel like LE isn’t being cagey and withholding. I think like they are just trying to figure out wth happened. Seems like a pretty honest straightforward group. Except Snell lol. And I live in a state where only cops and criminals carry guns. I was unsettled when I watched the neighbor say he is now toting a gun, especially when the town is on edge and people are accusing him of being the guy.