ID - 4 University of Idaho Students Murdered - Moscow # 21

[T4Tide]

I agree. There is a picture of blood running down the outside wall of E and X bedroom. The amount of blood that was lost in that house that night makes me think there is no way this person just left and walked away. Someone knows something. There is bloody clothes somewhere and a knife and possible a car that was detailed.

I have, since the beginning, thought that carotids/jugulars were sliced/stabbed on the sleeping victims. I’m assuming this suspect is an avid hunter and knows how to deal a devastating, deathly blow without a lot of fanfare. I think he knows how to kill a deer, elk, or other large animal with minimal blood/bodily fluids getting on him or his clothes. I think we will discover that the wounds on the victims are similar in nature and location… not just haphazard stabbing in various locations. According to the floor plan, I think the head of Zanas bed was against the wall with the bloody exterior bc those two victims bled out in the same location. I think one victim had defense wounds woke up, one was the overkill target, and two were just gotten out of the way. I do not believe any of them got out of bed to go check on anything or discovered anything. This guy has some pent up rage and he’s used to killing… just not humans.

I think this person is not a student. I think he is in the victims’ OUTER circle but not inner circle. I think this person met the group at previous times at bars, other party locations. I’d bet he even has exchanged phone numbers/social media with at least one victim but never had the courage to actually contact them. Lives with his mother or grandmother or alone and his alibi would be that he was hunting, which absolutely would not be abnormal to be gone that early in the morning from his home. He had all day to clean up and even if he had blood on his camo clothing, it would not be suspicious. I live in Deep South hunting land and it wouldn’t be suspicious at all for me to see a guy dressed in camo with mud or blood on him. I would just assume he’d been hunting. I would never assume a murder. He’s hidden the knife somewhere on the land/property that he hunts on. There are hundreds of places to hide such a thing.

The only thing about my profile that sticks out is that this same type of person usually loves their truck. It will have after market tires, a lift, maybe a wench… other things that make it unique. Maybe a 4wheeler or side by side loaded in the bed. He parked and walked. If they could just locate this type of vehicle on cameras and connect it with someone, I believe they would have a suspect.

This is allllllll my opinion and completely hypothetical and speculation.

 

[Aquarian]

If according to Kaylee's dad, his daughter was the alleged target of the killer, I can't help but wonder why the killer would plan the brutal attack on Sat evening, the most likely day that E (strong, male guest) would be present, knowing that he could attack any other day without the threat of encountering a big guy like E. This doesn't follow...

Instead, it definitely makes me ask whether or not E was the target of the psycho-killer. Logic indicates it is better to attack E in a house with three (or possibly five) petite women than his own frat house full of young men.

And if E was the target of the killer, I can also see the killer taking out the three women (collateral damage) that in the mind of the deranged killer -- could even be intended to publicly shame big E who by all accounts was a prince of a guy.

IMO, I think the killer is feeling very proud of himself and will not be able to resist bragging about his conquest.

There really is nobody better at this sort of profiling than the FBI and I don't doubt they are all over the sites they believe the killer is likely to visit.

Funny, my 23yo son thinks the target was Ethan. He was in college, lived on campus and off. Feels similar to what you said, tho gets irritated when I probe him further-lol. Idk, jury still out for me due to lack of verified info .

 

[captnchuck67]

I will say this about MPD,unlike a lot of small town PD ,when this occurred they realized this situation was out of their league.
They got outside help right away

 

[samanthadaniels1995]

Unless someone is using deduction and trying to describe how they concluded that the third floor victims were the targets.

If a rando came in just to kill and then killed, there was no reason for them to take more risk by going upstairs (according to inference into the rando's mind). SG is considering the perp to be a rational person, I believe (which is debatable). So he thinks that there was no logical necessity for the killer to go upstairs. The fact that he went upstairs is, to SG, evidence that he wanted something specific on the third floor.

I believe he clarified his statement this morning to show that's what he meant.

No one has said that any one of the housemates was a perceived target, btw. Instead, LE seems to have confirmed that the target may have been the house. IOW, SG is saying that since the killer DID go to the third floor, he must have been targeting that floor. I think he's using the word "need" in a specific way. If the house was the main target (and not an individual or individuals), then there was no logical or practical necessity to go upstairs. Since the perp went to the third floor, SG is arguing, then the people on the third floor must be the target (same thing you're saying). He didn't say "have to go," IIRC, he said "need" to go. Minor difference, but it makes me think about what we're taught about wanting vs needing.

I suppose targeting the four may be for the reason they are seen together as a group. "Want to go" may also be applied in your analysis.

The kind of evidence available, not reported, is the amount of blood leading into each room and the blood prints on the entry side door handle. If this is observed, then the significance of which floor was attacked first can lead to a conclusion of which victim is most targeted.

Since the locks are digital on each door and we assume the doors were closed, I would hope an opening time record would be preserved on them even if a combination was not activated.

The offender(s) would seem to need to act quickly and leave quickly. They would need to be familiar, confident, and resolute in what they were attempting to accomplish. They would have to have motivation and familiarity with the situation they would enter.

If not, this type of assault may lean more like an assault performed by more than one person with a motive and resolute mission among them.

 

[layer]

I'm afraid that isn't true--always. Bundy was much admired, even thought of as future political leader. BTK was church elder or deacon. Many have "normal" family lives.

Gary Ridgway

 

[TeaTime]

The parents are all heartbroken, angry and want the killer caught NOW. It is normal as they feel if they know who, then they will have one less thing on their minds.

But, to think that such a case would be solved in 3 weeks is unrealistic.

LE is doing their best to solve this, investigations take time.

Misplaced anger.

 

[XtremeScorpio]

So, after this interview, to me, it's clear the family DOESNT think their daughter was targeted. Sounds like they don't think anyone in the house was targeted. More confusion, and THAT is why LE needs to be allowed the space to do their jobs.

Not sure when that interview was done but I read, and posted with my opinion this a.m, that the dad thinks one of the girls on the 3rd floor was the target. Of course, this would include his K (this dad's daughter).

 

[stattlich1]

SG: “He doesn’t have to go up the steps! Let’s stop playing games! Guys! I need somebody to step up and be an alpha, be somebody to be a leader! Don’t make me do it! I don’t wanna do it! He doesn’t have to go up those steps. They’re mad. Their, their points of damage don’t match. I’m just gonna say it... Wasn’t leaked to me, I earned that. I payed for that funeral. I paid for that. It’s my right! You ain’t takin’ that from me!

Mom: “Calm down.”

SG: “If you don’t wanna say nothing, that’s your bed... But don’t say I’m leakin’ anything, I paid that bill! I sent my daughter to college to get an education, she came back in a box, and I can speak on that.”

Kaylee Goncalves' parents hunt for answers 3 weeks after college student slayings | Fox News Video

Steve and Kristi Goncalves speak with Fox News' Lawrence Jones to discuss the ongoing investigation from Moscow, Idaho.

www.foxnews.com

 

[Jealoushe]

I got the vibe from the News Nation special yesterday that the parents of the victims aren't getting along. Anyone else get that vibe?

 

[Cryptic]

Something like this represents a disturbing pattern of behavior, and one that would have been noticed and wouldn't have blended well socially. Not a frat brother. Not a sorority sister. Not a bar fly. Probably not even a fellow student.

I'm afraid that isn't true--always. Bundy was much admired, even thought of as future political leader. BTK was church elder or deacon. Many have "normal" family lives.

I am thinking that it could come down to.... well.... relativity.

As Hopewell, mentioned, the capacity to murder four people could well indicate a disturbing personality that would be noticed. Yet, as Shane13 noted, sometimes the outward signs of the disturbed personality can be effectively muted.

Perhaps sociopathic murderers can be divided into two groups outward personality wise. Say...

Category A: Disturbed personality is very evident. Manifests itself though abuse of animals, constant impulsive, but not homicidal violence towards peers. Narcissistic behavior is grandiose. Individual is shallow to the extent they do not have meaningful relationships with others.

Category B: Disturbed personality is muted. No impulsive violence. Outwardly, the individual comes across as a standard and typical low to moderate level jerk. Individual is shallow and self centered, but not to the extent that they are grandiose or incapable of meaningful relationships. Other partners must be willing to accept their "rougher edges".

Of course, we have all known low to mid level jerks in our lives. A very significant majority never kill anybody.

 

[layer]

Is there a source you have for much of the DNA results returning? I know a ton of progress has been made since I was in the field, but there is no way ‘much’ of the DNA results have returned. But please let me know if you have a source on this because I’d love to see!

I’ll pull some data charts for you on cold cases in the meantime.

While you're looking things up, look up how long it took to get the DNA in the Eliza Fletcher case.

 

[whirrledpeas]

Do we know which house had the ring camera that caught M & K arriving home?

I’m not sure if the camera that caught them was from the house across the street or from a vehicle (some people have speculated that the vehicle that dropped them off had a camera but not verified), but the house that did have a camera is pictured below.

Internet sleuths share theories on the Idaho murder case

Internet sleuths continue to share their theories on the Idaho murder case that left four university students brutally stabbed - as police are yet to make arrests.

www.dailymail.co.uk

 

[everybodhi]

How did we find out SG (the family I guess) has both K & M's urns? I'm having trouble searching the short word "urn". I'd like to know if that's correct and why. JMO

When my friend died she had small glass bottles with her ashes in a basket at her memorial for her friends to take if they wanted, she had a large social circle.
They make all kinds of choices like this now to divide ashes between friends and family members, even including jewelry.
KG’s dad said their ashes were side by side at his house but that doesn’t necessarily mean he has an urn with all of her best friend’s ashes.

 

[Blue_Painting]

While you're looking things up, look up how long it took to get the DNA in the Eliza Fletcher case.

Perhaps the difference there is that his dna was in the system, and they quickly knew who her killer was. I think they have had some results for a while, but it doesn't yet point to anyone. imo.

 

[Kittycat40]

The original night stalker Deangelo was found when they linked his dna to someone in his family that put their dna on some genealogy website like ancestry.com, 23 and me etc…


DeAngelo became the first public arrest obtained through genetic genealogy, a new technique that takes the DNA of an unknown suspect left behind at a crime scene and identifies him or her by tracing a family tree through his or her family members, who voluntarily submit their DNA to public genealogy databases.

 

[CSIDreamer]

You never slept in the same bed with your friends at this age? This is so normal for girls this age. My girlfriends and i slept in the same bed all of the time. This is a far fetched theory in my opinion!

This has came up before in the threads. So, obviously not everyone is in the know and understands. At least they're asking for clarification. If "we" on WS don't always interpret things properly, it stands to reason people "out there" may not always interpret things correctly either. Food for thought. JMO

 

[XtremeScorpio]

<modsnip - quoted post was removed for speculation not based on known facts of the case>
My thoughts are that:
1. The killer did enter in through the kitchen slider on the 2nd level
2. Kaylee was targeted
3. The motive had something to do with an obsession with K
4. E heard a noise and was attacked as he got up to investigate (killer possibly saw him in the laundry room or near the kitchen, then chased him back to X's bedroom, and attacked him there
5. The above (#4) is what woke X up. She couldn't run but was able to defend herself.
6. Killer then went upstairs to attack his target (K), which would have also made M collateral damage, as she was likely killed because she was a witness.

Again, all of the above is of my opinion based on what I've read on this case. Pure speculation, on my part.

 

[layer]

I’m not sure if the camera that caught them was from the house across the street or from the vehicle, but the house that did have a camera is pictured below.

Internet sleuths share theories on the Idaho murder case

Internet sleuths continue to share their theories on the Idaho murder case that left four university students brutally stabbed - as police are yet to make arrests.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Wasn't it K's sister that located the camera which showed the private driver dropping off K&M?

 

[Blue_Painting]

There also may not be much dna. Eliza Fletcher was raped even though they didn't report it. MOO.
We don't know that this killer bled and maybe he was masked, gloved etc. They did say it was a messy crime scene, however, so hoping he did.

 

[DizzyB]

How do they sort out all of the DNA in this so-called “party house”? Do they decide which DNA is the killer’s, based on things and locations of that DNA at the scene, in the absence of blood that belonged to the killer? Do they then review where else in the house that same DNA was found, to trace movements that night, or a past visit there? Say, if the killer’s DNA was found in the spare bedroom or a first floor bathroom as well as on one of the victims, that could change up a scenario. Between this and digital data, and interviews, it’s a heck of a lot to sift through.