4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered - Bryan Kohberger Arrested - Moscow # 75

[kae27]

I find it really interesting, too, especially after reviewing the details of all Block/Square does. imo jmo the fact that it was for the 4 victims and 3 additional parties makes it even more interesting because LE had to have probable cause so jmo imo interesting. This is one of the issues I find most compelling.

https://coi.isc.idaho.gov/docs/case/CR29-22-2805/022823%20Order%20to%20Seal%20and%20Redact%20-%20Block.pdf

Block, Inc. - Wikipedia

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Deleting.

 

[Twistinginthewind]

Your post made me recall Idaho Fish and Game mentioned in the States response to request for discovery. Page 2

In addition, deputies and officers from the Latah County Sheriffs Office, Idaho State Police, Moscow Police Department, Idaho Fish and Game and other law enforcement agencies may record their law enforcement contacts via an audio recorder or audio/video recorder. Any audio and video recordings related to this matter are available for review and duplication on request, subject to the provisions of I.C.R. 16(b )(9).

https://coi.isc.idaho.gov/docs/case/CR29-22-2805/012323%20States%20Response%20to%20Request%20for%20Discovery.pdf

Good point, Nila Aella, that "communications" with officers from Idaho Fish and Game were included and could be recorded and would be available on request in the State's response to request for discovery.

I had always thought the route BK took south after the time of the murders based on the map that was labelled "This is a possible route based off cellular device location" in the PCA was proximate with the actual roadway from Moscow on 95 South and then North on 195 to Pullman.

Dunno if this is helpful or not to others, but it was helpful for me to see different maps focused on different features side by side, IMO.

Looking at (from left to right) Google Maps of those roadways (95S/195N) next to the "possible route" from the PCA and the Idaho Fish and Game Fishing and Boating (Public) Access Locations map, it looks like to me that BK's route may have "swung out" to the southeast and then maybe a bit to the southwest more than the roadway does, although it is probably splitting hairs since the "cellular device location" could have inaccuracies introduced in the "possible route". Just mullin'. All MOO.

 

[Sister Golden Hair]

Your post made me recall Idaho Fish and Game mentioned in the States response to request for discovery. Page 2

In addition, deputies and officers from the Latah County Sheriffs Office, Idaho State Police, Moscow Police Department, Idaho Fish and Game and other law enforcement agencies may record their law enforcement contacts via an audio recorder or audio/video recorder. Any audio and video recordings related to this matter are available for review and duplication on request, subject to the provisions of I.C.R. 16(b )(9).

https://coi.isc.idaho.gov/docs/case/CR29-22-2805/012323%20States%20Response%20to%20Request%20for%20Discovery.pdf

This is really interesting. I'd put a dollar on any conversations with LE about this case being withheld for the reasons allowed for public records exemptions but ICBW so pls let us know if you find it!

 

[kae27]

DBM. Apologies.

 

[Sister Golden Hair]

Thanks. I've been an attorney for 31 years. I think you misunderstood my point, which is probably an error in my writing rather than your interpretation, so no worries.

Edit: I didn't realize this had already been covered, so I've deleted my post. Sorry, folks!

or my reading comprehension skills today are failing. I probably interpreted that way based on previous questions. I deleted my response, and I see what you were saying (I think) that maybe grub hub or others were on the list, but I think the September date would rule that out, esp early in the investigation (11.19). I think we'll find out it was far more than that imo jmo ime icbw

 

[10ofRods]

Some aberrant people have very low emotional arousal. Be careful not to judge criminals based on the psychologica and emotional makeup of relatively normal people.

Indeed and BK speaks of this issue in his teen writings on TapATalk (see Media Thread). Derealization and depersonalization result in flat affect (in ability to experience any strong emotion). It's rather the opposite of, say, Bipolar or Histrionic PD (just as examples). It is a state that non-criminal people experience as well but there are some brain researchers who have written about their own experience of it, and it can be detected upon MRI or SPECT analysis (failure to rouse the limbic system). That's why there's the phrase "cold-blooded killer."

Many such people go into careers that others could not handle, that involve high EE (emotional expression) on the part of the population served (so, it's not uncommon for trauma surgeons to be relatively detached). My personal opinion is that many academics fall into this category, as well.

It's associated with BK's syndrome (VSS) and I agree with the authors of the below paper that it is a neurobiological condition in most cases.

Depersonalization: neurobiological perspectives

Depersonalization remains a fascinating and obscure clinical phenomenon. In addition to earlier Jacksonian neurobiological adumbrations, and conventio…

www.sciencedirect.com

IMO.

 

[ktm44]

@ktm44, I think you might have accidentally attributed to me the post you are replying to? I didn't write the post, don't know much about how folk carry big knives around!

Sorry about that. I'm not sure how I messed up but I do apologive for messing up.

 

[kae27]

or my reading comprehension skills today are failing. I probably interpreted that way based on previous questions. I deleted my response, and I see what you were saying (I think) that maybe grub hub or others were on the list, but I think the September date would rule that out, esp early in the investigation (11.19). I think we'll find out it was far more than that imo jmo ime icbw

Sorry for all the confusion! Thanks for all your information in here.

 

[jepop]

Sorry about that. I'm not sure how I messed up but I do apologive for messing up.

No worries and no apology needed, I can see how it could happen when faffing around with the reply boxes.

 

[10ofRods]

You do impart interesting angles on details. TY

Of course, we don't know if BK purchased Vans while living in Idaho. However, I did find two locations in Moscow that sells Vans. None were found in Pullman.

Zumiez
1850 Pullman Rd
Moscow, ID, 83843
Zumiez in Moscow, ID, 83843

Famous Footwear
2010 W Pullman Road
Moscow, ID, 83843
Famous Footwear in Moscow, ID, 83843

That's really interesting. According to my students, Vans are for people older than them (the average age in the class I asked is 19). They regard Vans-wearing as something that 30 year olds do to pretend to be skaters, a category of people who are regarded as fun-loving and non-serious. Of course, this is California, so I have no idea what shoes mean in Idaho. But I'm guessing the marketing of Vans is pretty much the same all over.

So the shopping may be better in Moscow, for real. Zumiez is a chain that exists in my own local mall, it is oriented towards skaters and surfers and my kids stopped shopping there right around high school graduation time, but they are girls and I think the store is still frequented by a slightly older group.

Vans are known for being "non-slip" (on a skateboard), for being able to abruptly stop one's feet in case of emergency, etc. They are also easy to put on and take off, etc.

On the topic of clothing, someone yesterday pointed out that Carrhardt coveralls (sp?) do not have long pockets (the way my new raincoat does). The knife users in my family believe BK put the sheath in his pocket, but that it fell out and he didn't realize it until he got to the car to bag his stuff and hide it in the trunk.

Most of the above is speculation or opinion (except for the part about what my students said and what one WSer said about the coveralls).

The devil is in the details. IMO.

 

[Montecore1]

You do impart interesting angles on details. TY

Of course, we don't know if BK purchased Vans while living in Idaho. However, I did find two locations in Moscow that sells Vans. None were found in Pullman.

Zumiez
1850 Pullman Rd
Moscow, ID, 83843
Zumiez in Moscow, ID, 83843

Famous Footwear
2010 W Pullman Road
Moscow, ID, 83843
Famous Footwear in Moscow, ID, 83843

Target market and most Vans "wearers" 12-21 year olds, so certainly college kids

Off the Wall: Vans Target Market & A History of the Popular Skate Shoes

Vans took over the west coast skate scene in the 70s and now teenage boys and girls love these classic skate shoes.

www.qualitylogoproducts.com

 

[Sister Golden Hair]

Sorry for all the confusion! Thanks for all your information in here.

it's usually my job to cause confusion and be the bad influence

I wish LE would throw us a few more redacted warrants and sealed affidavits. It's like they're not even considering how difficult this is for all of us waiting for information. (<< joking)

 

[U.N. Known]

Target market and most Vans "wearers" 12-21 year olds, so certainly college kids

Off the Wall: Vans Target Market & A History of the Popular Skate Shoes

Vans took over the west coast skate scene in the 70s and now teenage boys and girls love these classic skate shoes.

www.qualitylogoproducts.com

Yep. I teach HS and Vans are quite popular

 

[Helechawagirl]

I'm glad you found it helpful and yes, problematic to say the least. The hours that they geofenced at first didn't even have BK's phone b/c the assumption is that he turned it off (that's per the PCA). and re the cnet link - yowza! - "That could be a minor inconvenience if you're using Google Maps to find a store, but a serious flaw if you're using that data in a criminal prosecution."

This case is really getting to me because there are so many things that don't make sense if you're not the sort to snap at an easy explanation, and I'm not, so I broke the warrants out into two piles - Before BK and After BK. This is not all of the warrants, just the ones that are specific to BK and the victims.

After BK
11.25 earliest, 11.29 at 12:58 a.m. latest date of IDing him

Kaylee Tinder 1.1.2021. Warrant dated 11.29.22
Why would they look at her Tinder right after IDing BK, why not before?
Kaylee Reddit 1.1.2021. Warrant dated 12.1.22, motion for extension 12.14
Maddie Tinder 1.1.2021. Warrant dated 12.6.22
BK Google 1.1.2021. Warrant dated 1.3.23

Kaylee Google 8.1.2022 Warrant dated 12.5.22.
Kaylee Yahoo 8.1.2022 Warrant 12.1.22
(Right after he moved to WA, and on page 16 of the PCA he used cell resources at King Road residence)

BK Tinder 6.1.2022. Warrant dated 1.25.23 (same date as DropBox)
BK Yik Yak 6.1.2022 Warrant dated 1.25.23 (same date as DropBox)
my best guess, and this is only a guess, is that they had a pretty darned good idea what they were getting from Dropbox. just a guess though.

Dropbox anonymous and warrant dated 1.25.2023
What Dropbox requires: https://help.dropbox.com/transparency/reports
right off their website:
“Search warrants require a showing of probable cause, must meet specificity requirements regarding the location to be searched and the items to be seized, and must be reviewed and signed by a judge or magistrate. Search warrants may be issued by local, state, or federal governments, and may only be used in criminal cases. In response to valid search warrants, we may produce non-content and content information.”

Door Dash 1.1.2022 to present Warrant dated 12.6.22 - same date as anonymous Tinder
Tinder 19 or 20 redacted 11.3.2022 to present. Warrant dated 12.6.22
Then finding something
Tinder from March 1, 2021 to March 31, 2021 for 20 redacted accounts - warrant dated 12.22.2022

20 redacted accts?

 

[maconrich]

I did a little Dropbox research myself and if you google DropBox when to get a warrant and variations on that, you'll find lots of helpful info imo jmo ime.

It is possible that the information was put into Dropbox by a CI. LE would have to get a warrant (and it would be smart anyway imo jmo). That's just one possibility imo jmo. It's probably not BK's Dropbox account or his name would be on the warrant imo jmo.

A possible CI. Who could have sensitive information / knowledge about the murders. Possibly regarding BK's involvement. With BK being portrayed as being too standoffish and socially inept to interact well with others (FWIW I'm not sure I believe that) much less to share his plans, intent or conspire / work with anyone else (I might believe that part). Unless a CI might be tied to the purchase of a K-Bar knife. Or I'm not looking at this right? Which is very possible. I'll let the idea(s) settle a bit while I google the Dropbox info you suggested. All IMHO.

 

[Sister Golden Hair]

Target market and most Vans "wearers" 12-21 year olds, so certainly college kids

Off the Wall: Vans Target Market & A History of the Popular Skate Shoes

Vans took over the west coast skate scene in the 70s and now teenage boys and girls love these classic skate shoes.

www.qualitylogoproducts.com

I thought this was pretty interesting, and after Squid Game they took off again in all demographics. I think Vans are pretty ubiquitous at this point imo jmo. Regardless, they do have a distinctive sole, and would leave an identifiable footprint, if LE had one imo jmo.

'Squid Game' caused a 7,800% spike in Vans searches, report says

The popular white slip-on shoes are prominently featured in the new Netflix drama

www.sfgate.com

 

[Sister Golden Hair]

20 redacted accts?

That's what I counted, but I could be off by a dot:

https://coi.isc.idaho.gov/docs/case/CR29-22-2805/030723%20Order%20to%20Seal%20%20Redact%20-%20Match%20Group%20LLC%204.pdf

Warrant dated 22 December.

counted again - 20. I get 20

All subscriber information between March 1, 2021, through March 31,
2021, including but not limited to biographical data, geographical location, user name, phone number associated, electronic mail (email) address, profile infomiation, primary picture, other private images, pictures, or videos, credit card information, and billing and information for the following UID accounts:

and 20 bullet dots follow

 

[Twistinginthewind]

Thanks. Looks like I'm not able to see the '48 Hours' interview, apparently because I'm in the wrong country. Does anyone know of another site/account which may have published that interview?

From what I can tell, that interview has been deleted. I'm guessing as with other things that made it into MSM in the past and were later removed, there were legal reasons and/or LE indicated what was said was not to be given out as public knowledge to protect the integrity of the investigation (paraphrasing/speculating but IIRC SG and family hired a lawyer to assist with interactions/legalities between LE and them and the public, and maybe why the entirety of the interview due to statements in it ended up on the "cutting room floor"). All this is MOO.

That said, here are 2 links to 2 video sources (Twitter and YouTube) that mention what SG said about BK's phone being close enough to the Kings Rd house to "touch their wifi", with some copied written content pasted here in case the links don't work outside the US:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1612916989131096064

@MorganRomeroTV

"For those asking: Yes, Steve Goncalves did tell me that investigators told him Bryan Kohberger was close enough to 1122 King Road in #Moscow that he was touching their wifi."
3:59 PM · Jan 10, 2023 from Boise, ID

AND

Idaho4 - Suspect Bryan Kohberger “Touching into their WiFi” says Steve Goncalves : Deleted Interview

Aspen Conner
Jan 10, 2023 #idaho4 #bryankohberger #truecrime
#idaho4 #bryankohberger #idahostudents #truecrime #bck
"Father of slain Idaho College student , Kaylee Goncalves says suspect Bryan Kohberger was “touching into their WIFI” regarding the homicides of his daughter, her best friend Madison Mogen, roommate Xan Kernodle, and Xana’s boyfriend Ethan Chapin - Steve Goncalves tells news channel King5 in now deleted interview.

What (if anything) does this detail provide and why was the interview so quickly removed by the news station?

What does “touching into their WIFI” mean?

We all want to know whatever answers can help provide insight into the reason these 4 innocent souls were taken in the early morning hours of November 13, 2022 by a sadistic monster in a manner described as nothing short of “horrific” & “brutal”"

 

[Sister Golden Hair]

Unless a CI might be tied to the purchase of a K-Bar knife. Or I'm not looking at this right?

I was thinking it was something of a more lurid nature because his yik yak and tinder came at the same time but that's a leap and ICBW

 

[Nila Aella]

Good point, Nila Aella, that "communications" with officers from Idaho Fish and Game were included and could be recorded and would be available on request in the State's response to request for discovery.

I had always thought the route BK took south after the time of the murders based on the map that was labelled "This is a possible route based off cellular device location" in the PCA was proximate with the actual roadway from Moscow on 95 South and then North on 195 to Pullman.

Dunno if this is helpful or not to others, but it was helpful for me to see different maps focused on different features side by side, IMO.

Looking at (from left to right) Google Maps of those roadways (95S/195N) next to the "possible route" from the PCA and the Idaho Fish and Game Fishing and Boating (Public) Access Locations map, it looks like to me that BK's route may have "swung out" to the southeast and then maybe a bit to the southwest more than the roadways does, although it is probably splitting hairs since the "cellular device location" could have inaccuracies introduced in the "possible route". Just mullin'. All MOO.

View attachment 410711

Very helpful! thank you.

We were thinking the same. Both photos of his route in the PCA say not to scale. It sure does look like it goes off to the east though. I looked up Blaine idaho to Genessee and found there are two roads to go...one way takes that outward, off to the east route. MOO

Looking at the Historical CSLI of Dec 23rd: (Jepop mentioned earlier)
November 13th 12:36 Kates in Clarkston, then albertsons, then leaves at 1:04
5:32-5:36 Near Johnson Idaho
5:36 to 8:30 phone stops reporting.

https://coi.isc.idaho.gov/docs/case/CR29-22-2805/122922%20Affidavit%20-%20Exhibit%20A%20-%20Statement%20of%20Brett-Payne.pdf

Approximately 4 1/2 hours down the road from Clarkston the phone stops reporting near Johnson ID: if he goes straight he ends up in Horseshoebend when his phone stops reporting. If he turns left on Garden Valley, up ahead is the Boise National Forest. Really, he could have gone anywhere since his phone stopped reporting for 3 hours, and they do not mention when or where it starts reporting again. MOO