Theories on what may have happened to Benjaman Kyle

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http://drphil.com/slideshows/slideshow/4682/?id=4682&slide=1&showID=1146&preview=&versionID=

“Do you have any idea of what you were doing in Georgia?” Dr. Phil asks.

“I think I came down there to see the ocean,” Ben says.

..Question..
Is CAME DOWN THERE a colloquoism? Something that someone from Indiana would say?

I live in Oregon and if I was in Georgia and I was asked, what are you doing in Georgia? I would say, I CAME OVER HERE to visit Savannah.
and if I was back in Oregon after the trip .... and then asked.... what were you doing in Georgia? I would say, I WENT DOWN there to visit Savannah.

It makes me think he lived in a state above Georgia.
http://www.mapquest.com/maps?1c=Sav...s=IN&2y=US&2l=39.768299&2g=-86.158096&2v=CITY

Maybe I am making too much of his choice of words, but he does have a good grasp of the English language and appears intelligent.
So, it is a regional way of saying things? Anyone?

carolwood: What would you say if you were asked, what were you doing in Georgia?

Anyone else? What would be the way you answered the question? What were you doing in Georgia?
 
dreamweaver said:
http://drphil.com/slideshows/slideshow/4682/?id=4682&slide=1&showID=1146&preview=&versionID=

“Do you have any idea of what you were doing in Georgia?” Dr. Phil asks.

“I think I came down there to see the ocean,” Ben says.

..Question..
Is CAME DOWN THERE a colloquoism? Something that someone from Indiana would say?

I live in Oregon and if I was in Georgia and I was asked, what are you doing in Georgia? I would say, I CAME OVER HERE to visit Savannah.
and if I was back in Oregon after the trip .... and then asked.... what were you doing in Georgia? I would say, I WENT DOWN there to visit Savannah.

It makes me think he lived in a state above Georgia.
http://www.mapquest.com/maps?1c=Sav...s=IN&2y=US&2l=39.768299&2g=-86.158096&2v=CITY

Maybe I am making too much of his choice of words, but he does have a good grasp of the English language and appears intelligent.
So, it is a regional way of saying things? Anyone?

carolwood: What would you say if you were asked, what were you doing in Georgia?

Anyone else? What would be the way you answered the question? What were you doing in Georgia?
Click to expand...

Excellent, dream. Now you know I live in Louisiana. My answer:
"I went down there to see the ocean."

And with that said, how would you say "Put up the dishes"
I would not, I would most likely say
"could you save the dishes"
well, my husband prayed over the dishes one day, and I laughed, but he now knows what save the dishes mean.

Another one: Are you getting out the car?
no, not me, "are you getting down, out the car?"
Well, my husband began dancing in the seat of the car, and when I ask what he was doing, well he was gettin' down. I laughed, now I don't say it anymore.

so yes I would believe, how we use words are specific to certain areas.
 
carolwood said:
Excellent, dream. Now you know I live in Louisiana. My answer:
"I went down there to see the ocean."

And with that said, how would you say "Put up the dishes"
I would not, I would most likely say
"could you save the dishes"
well, my husband prayed over the dishes one day, and I laughed, but he now knows what save the dishes mean.

Another one: Are you getting out the car?
no, not me, "are you getting down, out the car?"
Well, my husband began dancing in the seat of the car, and when I ask what he was doing, well he was gettin' down. I laughed, now I don't say it anymore.

so yes I would believe, how we use words are specific to certain areas.
Click to expand...
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Put up the dishes: I would say, would you put the dishes away?
Are you getting out of the car: I would say, are you getting out of the car? same.

So, we are in agreement, words are specific to certain areas.

My parents were from the south.
Right after they moved to Oregon, 1948,
They would say, would you carry me to the store?
I say, can you take me to the store?

Dad was a timber faller. He would always say, got to go get my rig.
I would have said, I have to get my car.
 
Some south Mississippians, born early 1930-1950, use the expression
"chaps" for the word "children"
I would say, can you take me to the store.
I would say, I have to go get my car.

I, like you, think how we say things, is area specific.

I think this is one of the things the voice expert was talking about too on Dr. Phil, not only his voice and how it sounds, but how he might pronouce certain words, correct?

I would think, but don't remember if it was mentioned, that specific dialect is used to determine this too. I am going to see what I can find on this subject.
 
carolwood said:
Not knowing how they determined Ben's voice, here are a couple of articles that might help to give ideas on how it may have been done.

Speech recognition/identification: article from wikipedia

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speaker_identification

Speech analysis tool:

http://www.phon.ucl.ac.uk/resource/sfs/wasp.htm

Voice Indentification for forensics:

http://www.owlinvestigations.com/forensic_articles/aural_spectrographic/fulltext.html
Click to expand...
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-Great sites:
Here is another one.
http://www.geocities.com/yvain.geo/dialects.html
number 11 appears to be where they have identified BK's speech is from. 'snipped'
North Midland (11)
Created as the people in Pennsylvania migrated westward and influenced by Scotch-Irish, German, and English Quaker settlers. This and the South Midland dialect can actually be considered a separate Midland Dialect region that serves as a transition zone between the north and south. They call doughnuts belly sinkers, doorknobs, dunkers, and fatcakes.
 
I don't think that BK was taken to Burger King to dispose of his body in the dumpster. If the attacker wanted him dead, they would have just left him somewhere isolated, where there was no chance of recovery. If his attacker brought him to Burger King it was because the attack was an accident ,self-defense perhaps or mistaken identity or the attack was purely to take money or a car. The intent was never to kill BK. They/ She/He wanted him found.

The other possibility is that somehow BK wandered around with a head wound, totally out of it, for some time. It was long enough to get sunburned, he took his own clothes off to get the fire ants off from him and eventually collapsed by the dumpster. Was there any evidence taken to find out what was used to cause the head wounds? That could be telling about where the attack actually occured.
 
Hi vtgirl, I think somewhat like you as far as how Ben got to the dumpster at Burger King. I think he may have been attacked at another location and was rendered unconcious at that time. He may have layed in the sun for sometime before he came to and somehow he was able to wander over to the area by the dumpster and passed out again.

vtgirl said:
I don't think that BK was taken to Burger King to dispose of his body in the dumpster. If the attacker wanted him dead, they would have just left him somewhere isolated, where there was no chance of recovery. If his attacker brought him to Burger King it was because the attack was an accident ,self-defense perhaps or mistaken identity or the attack was purely to take money or a car. The intent was never to kill BK. They/ She/He wanted him found.
Click to expand...
vtgirl said:
The other possibility is that somehow BK wandered around with a head wound, totally out of it, for some time. It was long enough to get sunburned, he took his own clothes off to get the fire ants off from him and eventually collapsed by the dumpster. Was there any evidence taken to find out what was used to cause the head wounds? That could be telling about where the attack actually occured.
Click to expand...
 
I don't think this was ever discussed, and I know Ben only has scars on his arm from surgery. But I have to ask this question. Does Ben have the shot scar on the arm? Mine isn't real big, and you can barely see it. I have not idea what it was given for back then, just know we had to have it to be able to go to school, but I am a bit younger, and my mom is, I think older than Ben, and she does not have it. Dream, you would be about Ben's age, do you have one? Anyone else?
 
carolwood said:
I don't think this was ever discussed, and I know Ben only has scars on his arm from surgery. But I have to ask this question. Does Ben have the shot scar on the arm? Mine isn't real big, and you can barely see it. I have not idea what it was given for back then, just know we had to have it to be able to go to school, but I am a bit younger, and my mom is, I think older than Ben, and she does not have it. Dream, you would be about Ben's age, do you have one? Anyone else?
Click to expand...
----------------------------------------------------------

It is a smallpox vaccination scar.
They scratched the skin a couple of times.
For some, it would cause a blister, then filled with pus, drain, and cause scarring.
For others, it just itched.

Mine is a round circular scar. I do not remember getting it. I do remember all my friends had one.

I do remember when the first polio vaccine came out. It was on a sugar cube and we lined up at school to take ours.

My adult children have smallpox scars also. But they had a shot, leaving the scar.
 
These are confirmed scarings in friends:
born 1947 - had shot, remembers, no scar
born 1949 - had shot, remembers, scar
born 1951 - had shot, remembers, scar
Someone told me, but I can't find anything on it, that the some people of the Appalachian Mountians, never did receive the shots and he believes it became manadatory for all in the early 1950's. He also believes the Native Indians were the first to receive the shots.
Talking to mom again, b. 1942 and still in school in the 1950's, she remembers the shot, but don't remember if she had one, or what.
I will keep digging into this, maybe the first shots didn't scar people. I am also wondering when, if, Canada followed with this are what.
 
carolwood said:
These are confirmed scarings in friends:
born 1947 - had shot, remembers, no scar
born 1949 - had shot, remembers, scar
born 1951 - had shot, remembers, scar
Someone told me, but I can't find anything on it, that the some people of the Appalachian Mountians, never did receive the shots and he believes it became manadatory for all in the early 1950's. He also believes the Native Indians were the first to receive the shots.
Talking to mom again, b. 1942 and still in school in the 1950's, she remembers the shot, but don't remember if she had one, or what.
I will keep digging into this, maybe the first shots didn't scar people. I am also wondering when, if, Canada followed with this are what.
Click to expand...
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carolwood:
I was born in 1947. I had the shot. I don't remember. I have a faint scar. I was in Oregon.
 
After furthering the research of small pox vaccination, this was a world wide effort and everyone born prior to 1979, should have this. It seems the US was among the first to start with the vaccinations in 1950.
So it is possible that someone born before 1950 may not have the vaccination, but if they went to school, they should have received it then. Not sure how they handled absentee's at school, but if this was a major effort, which it was, I would be willing to bet they made sure to go back and get the absentee's from school. All Military had the vaccination until 1980. Only Military after 1980 to receive the vaccination, were the ones who went to the Middle East and Korea.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smallpox

If Ben doesn't have the vaccination scar, doesn't mean he didn't have the shot. Some people don't have a scar. It would be interesting to know if he does have a scar though.
 
I'm not sure if I read correctly about the smallpox vaccination, but people who were prone to rashes (excema, etc...) may have been excused from the vaccination. This probably has no bearing on Ben- just some people may have not been vaccinated.
 
Boyz_Mum said:
I'm not sure if I read correctly about the smallpox vaccination, but people who were prone to rashes (excema, etc...) may have been excused from the vaccination. This probably has no bearing on Ben- just some people may have not been vaccinated.
Click to expand...
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Benjaman K and I are about the same age.
When I was in grade school, from 1953 to 1959, if there was a vaccination drive, you just did it.
I cannot remember anyone refusing or a parent refusing.
Of course, this was back when parents remembered what smallpox could be like. And no one knew of potential side effects.
 
Theories:
IMO: His attack seems personal. Because he was not only beaten, he was left out in the sun, all identification taken, stripped naked and discarded by a dumpster.

If just a random attack, why do all of the above? Why not just take the money or car and run?

Of course, there are strange people out there, but I am trying to K I S S.

Personal attack: to harm or kill:
Main motives:
revenge, money, greed
love, hate, fear, rage, betrayal, jealousy,
power, cover up a crime, enjoyment, mob hits.

BK comes to Richmond Hill, Ga., with his wife.
He confesses a secret. She attacks him.
Probably not.

BK comes to Richmond Hill with his wife.
She has planned to kill him. The hired guns
fail.
She does not report him missing. She is
terrified he will 'remember.' So are the hired guns.

BK comes to Richmond Hill alone.
But, his wife, a business partner, the person in his lawsuit,
has set him up. He is attacked. He was only supposed
to be 'roughed up.' It goes too far. They think he may
die. They just dump him.
Again, they fear his memory returning.

BK does go to Ga, as he said, ' he came down to see the ocean.'
But he has been in the Colorado witness protection
program. He is recognized. They try to kill him.
They fail.
Again, what happens when his memory returns?

BK rides motorcycles. When he goes to Ga to see the ocean,
he is beaten and robbed of his motorcycle.
No car left behind. Attackers can say they bought
the motorcycle.
Why would they strip him naked? To slow his identification?
So they could get away? to where?
And when his memory returns? What? They wore masks?
No.

Maybe it is a good thing Benjaman Kyle is not answering any of our posted questions.
Maybe BK does not live in Savannah. Maybe he lives in San Diego now?
Maybe he lives in a small cabin in the forest in Big Sur?
Maybe he lives in a small apartment in Dallas?

Maybe he is NOW in the witness protection program.

Whatever happened and whereever he is, I hope he finds out who he is and has a good life from now on.
 
Lurker here, just had to comment.

Is CAME DOWN THERE a colloquoism?
Click to expand...

I'm originally from Ontario, Canada and that is what I would say.

Edit - though I can definately say that his current dialect is not Canadian. Not Michigan either - similar but more nasal on the vowels. He has a very distinctive way of saying the word 'thought.' Almost like Pittsburghese. I know that he was evaluated by a speech expert - I will go look for that info.
 
dreamweaver said:
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Benjaman K and I are about the same age.
When I was in grade school, from 1953 to 1959, if there was a vaccination drive, you just did it.
I cannot remember anyone refusing or a parent refusing.
Of course, this was back when parents remembered what smallpox could be like. And no one knew of potential side effects.
Click to expand...

My brother was born in 1954 and the pediatrician would not do the vaccination on him- because of skin rashes. I'm not sure how common it was for people to be excused from the vaccination. It was just a thought~ in regards to the vaccination mark being present or not on BK.

Have a great day!
 
The theory about the witness protection program is pretty intriguing.

I have to agree with dreamweaver- I also hope that Ben can find out who he is and have a good life from now on.
 
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