Things That Make You Go "Hmmmmm . . ."

[STEADFAST]

http://www.azcentral.com/video/#/Ne...re+lawyer/40280768001/35150280001/63955508001

Here's the link. It's a video.

Gotcha. Thanks, deb.

Well now, proof of the S's innocence. Glad that's going to be all cleared up.
Must be a pretty long letter.

 

[BeanE]

Gotcha. Thanks, deb.

Well now, proof of the S's innocence. Glad that's going to be all cleared up.
Must be a pretty long letter.

BBM

:floorlaugh:

 

[Kamille]

Gotcha. Thanks, deb.

Well now, proof of the S's innocence. Glad that's going to be all cleared up.
Must be a pretty long letter.

How on earth was the lawyer able to get any coherent sentences out of those two to put together a letter? :waitasec:

 

[Bforster]

HMMMMMMMMM
Just watched the video:laughitup:

Really????? a letter?????:waitasec::doh:

Well I'm sure the LE will take that into account and believe of thier innocents!!!
:floorlaugh::floorlaugh::floorlaugh::floorlaugh:

 

[b4e]

Gotcha. Thanks, deb.

Well now, proof of the S's innocence. Glad that's going to be all cleared up.
Must be a pretty long letter.

I wonder if that letter is anything like the letter their civil attorney was working on (over a week ago) to post on the "Fan" page about making false accusations. Surprisingly, the civil attorney's letter never materialized.

 

[danisisa]

Sorry.....I can't get off of the carseat thing.. How do we know TS did not by 2 of the same and give whoever who went to SA one to get G? I like my baby stuff to match. What do you think. THey should check her purchases at TOYSRUS and BABIESRUS.

To me TS asking the color confirms if whoever the sent to get G were the ones picking him up. Remember--TS and EJ stopped contact. I think the emails after the 27th were CYA emails to throw anyone off track who looks at them.

 

[W8nC]

W8nC, do you have something that supports Tammi having a hand in setting up Eliz's trip. The reason I ask, is because after I recently went back through reviewing the case, I couldn't find anything that definitely pinpointed Tammi helping with the trip. I could only find one statement that indicated that Tammi may have even known beforehand about the trip.

I'm trying to keep an eye on this aspect particularly, because it would raise the likelihood of certain other things.

Thanks for all your work on this case!

BeanF, no, I can't point to any one thing that supports my opinion, but let me think about it a bit and get back to you. There's something....maybe that she knew about the things EJ had sold to raise money for her trip, or when she looked up the info regarding changing jurisdictions and changing SSN/id.....not that I have proof of when she knew that, or looked that up....but maybe I can find something. I believe it for some reason. I just have to find what it was that caused me to believe it.

 

[STEADFAST]

BeanF, no, I can't point to any one thing that supports my opinion, but let me think about it a bit and get back to you. There's something....maybe that she knew about the things EJ had sold to raise money for her trip, or when she looked up the info regarding changing jurisdictions and changing SSN/id.....not that I have proof of when she knew that, or looked that up....but maybe I can find something. I believe it for some reason. I just have to find what it was that caused me to believe it.

I do think TS helped EJ leave, and I think she did it because she thought EJ could change jurisdictions and get sole custody of Gabriel in TX. Here's something she said on NG: (BBM, with my translation of Tamminese in blue)

SMITH: Well, OK, in -- from the beginning, in talking to the police, they asked us, you know, did we ever try to help her. And I said, Well, the only way we ever tried to help her was, you know, before we knew she could change her -- whether or not she could change jurisdictions. She was telling us that she was going to run. She was go into hiding, change her Social Security number.
[ Note that they would not have even been discussing jurisdictions if they didn't know Logan had joint custody.]

And so we panicked at that point, and we did not want that baby to vanish into thin air for the rest of his life. And so we were grabbing at straws, like the police are right now, trying to figure out how to keep that baby still surfaced, you know? And so we had thought of scenarios, and we talked to a couple of friends and people about the scenarios of -- you know, we have a house in Tennessee, and you know, things like that, that maybe she can go stay there. We can let her stay there. We could help her and all this, and while she`s changing jurisdictions.

Well, by the next day, after doing research throughout the next day, we realized, Oh, she cannot change jurisdictions. It`s illegal. So immediately, we started, you know, telling her, You need to come back, you can`t change jurisdictions.
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1001/15/ng.01.html

Translation:
So basically, our story is she ran away at a time when we didn't know whether or not she could change jurisdictions. Then she threatened to run away even farther. So we panicked and planned to hide her while she changed jurisdictions to keep her from running. But then, we found out that she couldn't change jurisdictions and told her she might as well come back.

And they expect people to believe there wasn't a plan from the beginning for EJ to go to TX and try to change jurisdictions?

 

[BeanE]

BeanF, no, I can't point to any one thing that supports my opinion, but let me think about it a bit and get back to you. There's something....maybe that she knew about the things EJ had sold to raise money for her trip, or when she looked up the info regarding changing jurisdictions and changing SSN/id.....not that I have proof of when she knew that, or looked that up....but maybe I can find something. I believe it for some reason. I just have to find what it was that caused me to believe it.

Thanks, w8nc.

 

[DairyGirl]

One thing I wonder is if the Smiths thought that EJ was heading to TN or if that was the original plan? I am terrible with geography so I don't know if San Antonio was in the same direction or if that was the plan and them EJ took off on her own. Maybe she was courting another adoptive family behind the Smiths back.

 

[BeanE]

I do think TS helped EJ leave, and I think she did it because she thought EJ could change jurisdictions and get sole custody of Gabriel in TX. Here's something she said on NG: (BBM, with my translation of Tamminese in blue)

SMITH: Well, OK, in -- from the beginning, in talking to the police, they asked us, you know, did we ever try to help her. And I said, Well, the only way we ever tried to help her was, you know, before we knew she could change her -- whether or not she could change jurisdictions. She was telling us that she was going to run. She was go into hiding, change her Social Security number.
[ Note that they would not have even been discussing jurisdictions if they didn't know Logan had joint custody.]

And so we panicked at that point, and we did not want that baby to vanish into thin air for the rest of his life. And so we were grabbing at straws, like the police are right now, trying to figure out how to keep that baby still surfaced, you know? And so we had thought of scenarios, and we talked to a couple of friends and people about the scenarios of -- you know, we have a house in Tennessee, and you know, things like that, that maybe she can go stay there. We can let her stay there. We could help her and all this, and while she`s changing jurisdictions.

Well, by the next day, after doing research throughout the next day, we realized, Oh, she cannot change jurisdictions. It`s illegal. So immediately, we started, you know, telling her, You need to come back, you can`t change jurisdictions.
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1001/15/ng.01.html

Translation:
So basically, our story is she ran away at a time when we didn't know whether or not she could change jurisdictions. Then she threatened to run away even farther. So we panicked and planned to hide her while she changed jurisdictions to keep her from running. But then, we found out that she couldn't change jurisdictions and told her she might as well come back.

And they expect people to believe there wasn't a plan from the beginning for EJ to go to TX and try to change jurisdictions?

All of that easily applies to the time she was already in SA.

I just haven't seen anything that says the Smiths definitely knew she was going to SA, let alone had a hand in planning it.

And, actually, I'm not even sure it matters. It may rack up some more evidence for charges of conspiracy to custodial interference. It still doesn't mean they have any idea of what Eliz later did with Gabe. And that's really what I want to know. What did Eliz do with Gabe?

 

[BeanE]

One thing I wonder is if the Smiths thought that EJ was heading to TN or if that was the original plan? I am terrible with geography so I don't know if San Antonio was in the same direction or if that was the plan and them EJ took off on her own. Maybe she was courting another adoptive family behind the Smiths back.

BBM. We need to sleuth that more.

 

[STEADFAST]

All of that easily applies to the time she was already in SA.

I just haven't seen anything that says the Smiths definitely knew she was going to SA, let alone had a hand in planning it.

And, actually, I'm not even sure it matters. It may rack up some more evidence for charges of conspiracy to custodial interference. It still doesn't mean they have any idea of what Eliz later did with Gabe. And that's really what I want to know. What did Eliz do with Gabe?

I don't think the Smiths know what EJ did with Gabriel. You're right; there's certainly no evidence that they knew of or had control of anything going on in S.A. And the whole jurisdictional thing could have come up after EJ arrived in S.A., though it seems unlikely to me that it hadn't come up earlier.

 

[LandAuxvasse]

One thing I wonder is if the Smiths thought that EJ was heading to TN or if that was the original plan? I am terrible with geography so I don't know if San Antonio was in the same direction or if that was the plan and them EJ took off on her own. Maybe she was courting another adoptive family behind the Smiths back.

I did a google maps from Tempe, AZ to Nashville, TN and EJ would have to have taken a very southern route for it to be "in the same direction"...

Through Albuquerque, Amarillo, OK City would have been the shortest, direct route (about 1700 miles). To get to San Antonio she had to go the southern route which would have been over 1900 miles. Tempe, Tucson, Las Cruces, and then on to San Antonio.

 

[W8nC]

I do think TS helped EJ leave, and I think she did it because she thought EJ could change jurisdictions and get sole custody of Gabriel in TX. Here's something she said on NG: (BBM, with my translation of Tamminese in blue)

SMITH: Well, OK, in -- from the beginning, in talking to the police, they asked us, you know, did we ever try to help her. And I said, Well, the only way we ever tried to help her was, you know, before we knew she could change her -- whether or not she could change jurisdictions. She was telling us that she was going to run. She was go into hiding, change her Social Security number.
[ Note that they would not have even been discussing jurisdictions if they didn't know Logan had joint custody.]

And so we panicked at that point, and we did not want that baby to vanish into thin air for the rest of his life. And so we were grabbing at straws, like the police are right now, trying to figure out how to keep that baby still surfaced, you know? And so we had thought of scenarios, and we talked to a couple of friends and people about the scenarios of -- you know, we have a house in Tennessee, and you know, things like that, that maybe she can go stay there. We can let her stay there. We could help her and all this, and while she`s changing jurisdictions.

Well, by the next day, after doing research throughout the next day, we realized, Oh, she cannot change jurisdictions. It`s illegal. So immediately, we started, you know, telling her, You need to come back, you can`t change jurisdictions.
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1001/15/ng.01.html

Translation:
So basically, our story is she ran away at a time when we didn't know whether or not she could change jurisdictions. Then she threatened to run away even farther. So we panicked and planned to hide her while she changed jurisdictions to keep her from running. But then, we found out that she couldn't change jurisdictions and told her she might as well come back.

And they expect people to believe there wasn't a plan from the beginning for EJ to go to TX and try to change jurisdictions?

This line above, in green, I know added a lot to my belief that Tammi knew about Elizabeth's trip to SA before she left. See, I was under the impression that she was admitting it with this statement. It's true, we can't tell what time period Tammi is talking about here. She says "in the beginning", referring to the start of talks between LE, and herself and Jack. She says this is before they knew if she could change jurisdiction...which is when? Did they know this when they picked up Gabe at E's trailer? Or was it around the time they arranged to return Gabe to EJ on the 18th? Or was it sometime after EJ left town? I thought it was early on, before E left town...still looking for why I thought that........

 

[kappy50]

It's all about the bus route, which NO ONE knows anything about that.....have you ever wondered about that!

 

[kappy50]

what really concerns me...we talk about landfills, hotels, gps, this cell phone and that cell phone...TS this and JS that....but has ANYTHING been documented about the bus trip....I'm telling ya...that is the key!

 

[Prof]

The key to what, Kappy? do you think EJ concealed carried Gabriel in a back pack on a crowded bus? I just can't seem to go there, dead or alive I think it would be crazy and risky behavior

I do remember that LE stated early on that there was a 3 day gap between the bus and the hostel that they could not fill in - but I have not seen any documentation on when EJ actually checked in to the hostel -- has anyone?

I am interested in hearing more of your thoughts on the bus trip --

 

[kissdegirl]

I have wondered about the trip too kappy. My thoughts were that she gave Gabriel to someone in SA, then got on the bus, only to meet them again somewhere else and finish the process. Especially if TS says (and you believe) she heard him in the background after the 27th.

 

[Litlred]

While EJ is on the run with Gabriel TS is shopping? If I need to remove this please let me know. I'm 99.9% sure it is her because of the purchase from Seller: raggedyplace. I remember seeing a picture of TS, JS and H in raggedy ann halloween costumes.

http://feedback.ebay.com/ws/eBayISA...d=tammifaysmith&ftab=AllFeedback&myworld=true
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This next one looks to be a vehicle, I'm not sure. I need some help with this one.....

Marketplace on Facebook Can her and her father come look at it tomorrow or sometime this week? Thanks, Tammi email tammifaysmith@gmail.com. Marketplace Users ...
apps.facebook.com/marketplace/view/-/1341102732/