Psych Profile- Elizabeth Johnson

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BeanE said:
Yes, and that's not what she did in this case. She gave an explanation of what happened. She didn't do that in the other cases where she did something and then denied it.I thought of a third similar incident from the ones we've been discussing above. The day she wouldn't say what she'd done with Gabe, went to Logan's place of work and tore it up, wouldn't say where Gabe was until finally LE arrested her. Then she said what happened - that she'd given him to the Smiths, and LE checked it out, and indeed she'd been truthful.

That seems to support that when she said hadn't after all killed Gabe, but given him to the couple at the park, that she was telling the truth.
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You sure do make extraordinarily well-reasoned and rational points. I truly do hope you are spot on (as you usually are) with this one, because that would mean Gabe is somewhere being cared for and waiting to come home to his Daddy. :)
 
BeanE said:
I think the police report on when she trashed the apartment that one time (linked in the Important Links sticky thread) gives us an idea of how she treated her dogs. LE found one dog walking around leaving a trail of blood. When she was yelling at someone although nobody was there, I've thought it was one or more of her dogs she may have been yelling at.

IRT Elizabeth's drinking - do you mean that you believe she was drinking the morning she gave Gabe away, i.e., prior to 10am on Dec 27? Only that morning? If so, what leads you to believe that?
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Per Ken Gamble there were entries in her journal that suggested she was drinking. I think she was drinking either the night before or the morning of the 27th unless the newpaper article below is exggerated. Maybe she was drinking the entire time she was in SA. I think there are several possibilities of why she was drinking. One possibility is .....Was the HG was sent by the 3rd party to make sure EJ was drunk, possibly drugged so she wouldn't be able to remember certain things regarding the handoff of Gabriel or was EJ just a drinker? Coming off of her meds could she have just used the alcohol to self medicate or was she somewhat depressed about the whole situation and drank to ease her pain?
My vote is the HG was sent to get her drunk/drugged so she could not remember much.

"There were some entries in the journal which would suggest she had been drinking," Ken Gamble says. "There were some cryptic notes cowards the end of the journal which she had written, making reference to the death of her parents. She was very distraught."
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* Mom's diary shows she was drunk, depressed, when Baby Gabriel was given to couple in Leon Valley Park
PI says indications are Gabriel is still alive
WOAI - Thursday, April 1, 2010

Article (no video): http://radio.woai.com/cc-common/news...rticle=6940800
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Litlred said:
Per Ken Gamble there were entries in her journal that suggested she was drinking. I think she was drinking either the night before or the morning of the 27th unless the newpaper article below is exggerated. Maybe she was drinking the entire time she was in SA. I think there are several possibilities of why she was drinking. One possibility is .....Was the HG was sent by the 3rd party to make sure EJ was drunk, possibly drugged so she wouldn't be able to remember certain things regarding the handoff of Gabriel or was EJ just a drinker? Coming off of her meds could she have just used the alcohol to self medicate or was she somewhat depressed about the whole situation and drank to ease her pain?
My vote is the HG was sent to get her drunk/drugged so she could not remember much.
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Oh okay. I see what you mean in the wording of that second article's headline. I hadn't taken that literally. My overall impression was that she'd been drinking for several days prior, but I do see what you mean.

I think if she'd been drunk and drugged the guy who sold her the bus ticket that morning would have noticed something - slurred speech, closing sleepy eyes, stumbling around, trouble getting her money out and counted. And there probably would have been some comments by people where she was shopping that morning. Not sure she'd be able to drive around as she was either. I don't know.
 
OneLove said:
You sure do make extraordinarily well-reasoned and rational points. I truly do hope you are spot on (as you usually are) with this one, because that would mean Gabe is somewhere being cared for and waiting to come home to his Daddy. :)
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Well thank you, OneLove. I think I just ramble and hope something sticks ;)

I hope Gabe is alive and well, and will be rescued and back with Logan very soon too.
 
DaneBramage said:
ITA here BeanE.

"Leave me alone!" and "Get away from me!!" could have been directed at the dogs IMO.
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This makes perfect sense, her yelling at the dogs. I wonder what she was like with the dogs when she was not upset. I wonder if she was hostile towards them or did she love them? Was it a take them or leave them attitude? I'm thinking if she was kind to the dogs and re-homed them then maybe she was the same way with Gabriel.
 
LiveLaughLuv said:
Did Elizabeth Johnson, Mother of Missing Baby Gabriel Relay Clue In Note to Grandmother in Her “Advance Directive and Will” When She Says Be Happy for “Us”?

http://drlillianglassbodylanguagebl...ve-and-will”-when-she-says-be-happy-for-“us”/
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What bother's me about that analysis, among other's, is that it doesn't even mention Elizabeth's mother, to whom she was referring to about being buried above. I think she has very special thoughts about her mother, who's picture she carried with her...but her mother isn't even addressed. I still think she was referring to her mother and herself as "us".
 
TXHOPE said:
I think it's really strange that EJ lied about how her mom died and a violent lie at that -shot in front of her and her brother??? Was her brother telling the same lie? Maybe this should be in the psych thread but she seems to lie with true conviction.
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This may cross with the psych thread, I agree. I mean, what if EJ made it up to either protect someone, or to protect her own psyche and not put blame on her beloved mother? :waitasec:
 
kissdegirl said:
This may cross with the psych thread, I agree. I mean, what if EJ made it up to either protect someone, or to protect her own psyche and not put blame on her beloved mother? :waitasec:
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Actually, EJ would have been almost 12 years old at the time of her mother's death (11 yrs/11 months). It is quite possible she DID witness someone shot, but it wasn't her mother - it was a foster mother - since she had been in the foster care system already before the age of 12 - maybe someone she really cared about as a mother.



http://www.azcentral.com/news/articl...gbaby0117.html

Gabriel's mother, Elizabeth Johnson, 23, is a product of the Boston foster-care system. She lived with five different families before coming back to the Valley at the age of 12 to stay with her father, a recovering drug addict, according to her grandfather, Bob Johnson.
 
I imagine the time she has been in jail has not been good for her mental health. She has probably been stewing about all the people who did her wrong not to mention dealing with the other inmates. I can see how her thinking hasn't been right.
 
wow. could she FAKE insanity? did she purposely attack those inmates as part of her "insanity" ACT ?

OR she really DID go insane after what she did?

I'd imagine killing your own child is enough to make anyone go insane.... not saying she did, but just saying...
 
noopy said:
wow. could she FAKE insanity? did she purposely attack those inmates as part of her "insanity" ACT ?

OR she really DID go insane after what she did?

I'd imagine killing your own child is enough to make anyone go insane.... not saying she did, but just saying...
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I think EJ has exhibited signs of mental illness for a very long time. Her history in foster care, her history of rage and anger issues as stated by her grandfather speak to the fact that this incompetency didn't just occur recently. The girl has a history of problems and if they would go back to the psychologists/psychiatrists I'm sure she saw while in foster care, I think they would see that the girl has been sick for a very long time. I'd love to take a peek at her psych evals from when she was in foster care but that's for another thread.
 
momtective said:
I think EJ has exhibited signs of mental illness for a very long time. Her history in foster care, her history of rage and anger issues as stated by her grandfather speak to the fact that this incompetency didn't just occur recently. The girl has a history of problems and if they would go back to the psychologists/psychiatrists I'm sure she saw while in foster care, I think they would see that the girl has been sick for a very long time. I'd love to take a peek at her psych evals from when she was in foster care but that's for another thread.
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true true... it's like the chicken or the egg ... one would have to be insane first, in order to kill their own child i believe. it's a sad case.
 
BeanE said:
More from article above:

Johnson could not think clearly and believed she would not be able to think logically or assist an attorney in preparing a defense.
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Could it be severe depression?
 
momtective said:
I think EJ has exhibited signs of mental illness for a very long time. Her history in foster care, her history of rage and anger issues as stated by her grandfather speak to the fact that this incompetency didn't just occur recently. The girl has a history of problems and if they would go back to the psychologists/psychiatrists I'm sure she saw while in foster care, I think they would see that the girl has been sick for a very long time. I'd love to take a peek at her psych evals from when she was in foster care but that's for another thread.
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I completely agree MomT. She has exhibited signs of mental illness for a very long time. I think this could of been an underlying condition for some time that has shown signs but wasn't completely brought to light (possibly psychosis) until after she sat in jail, locked in a box with just her own thoughts for months. This isn't a huge surprise to me because of what has been discussed for months in her psych thread but it is confirmation of how sick she really is and it truly scares me for precious Gabriel. B4E-you took the words right out of my head that I kept repeating last night...what does this mean...where is Gabriel??
 
kissdegirl said:
You put so eloquently into words what I was thinking, thank you! I have been thinking that this time in jail, being treated or not for her mental issues, has not been good for her mental state. That she has deteriorated sitting in there. Being isolated in your cell for 23 hours a day would probably affect a mentally healthy person's mind in a negative way. I have no doubt that she was in a different state of mind back in December. She may have been exhibiting signs of her mental illness, but I believe her illness is a dynamic state. It's not static...she's not in the same state of mind she was, but her mind has deteriorated during these past 5 months.

I pray for Gabriel and his family as always. This must be so difficult. I pray that obtaining treatment for her illness will lead us to the truth, or provide more insight into what happened in SA.

I was much too angry to post anything when I first read the news today. After a long workout at the gym, I've decided to keep looking on the bright side. To keep looking for that little light that Gabriel is shining for us. His mother needs help. She needs this kind of help specifically. As much as I want her charged, and to pay for her crimes against LM and Gabriel, I want her treated. To charge her and punish her will not bring answers, not when she is not competent enough in the eyes of the psychologists who evaluated her to understand anything that is happening right now.
Perhaps when she is returned to competency (and I have total faith she will be), the answers will come.
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Excellent points, Kiss.

Makes me wonder - we don't know what (if anything) happened to her during her time in foster care. What if one of her foster parents had locked her in a closet during one of her rages, and being locked up 23 hours a day triggered some sort of psychotic break because of past experiences?

I suspect based on the way that TPS has talked in interviews, that EJ had looked at TPS as a mother-substitute. And if that's the case, I think EJ had a stronger attachment to TPS than anyone has even considered, and TPS realized it, and took advantage of it. It had to be devastating to EJ to find out that TPS has thrown her under the bus - it would be like losing a mother all over again, and that very well could have been the beginning of the descent into incompetency. EJ "seemed" competent in the beginning because she was protecting "mother", but finding out that "mother" abandoned her (again) would have brought up any deep seeded emotions. Based on the "will" she wrote in jail, it appears to me that she has never gotten over losing her mother, and now she lost a second one as well.

Add that to 23 hours locked in a cell by herself to stew about everything - to me it makes sense that she would be found incompetent. After all, we know that it was her seething anger at LM that started this whole mess with wanting to give Gabe away. But sitting in the jail cell, she has no way to vent - no one to hurt the way she feels hurt, and I would think that would contribute to a breakdown.

I'm not condoning in any way anything that EJ has done - just trying to understand it a little.

:twocents:
 
noopy said:
.......I'd imagine killing your own child is enough to make anyone go insane.... not saying she did, but just saying...
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Not to be too intentionally mean, but I would certainly hope so.... If she has any sensibilities at all I certainly hope that everyting she did to Gabe and IS STILL DOING, makes her crazy...

Like we try to tell our kids - all you have to do is the right thing.
 
I know that we will never be able to find out, but I would SO like to know what her IQ is !
 
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