Casey and Family Psych Profile #11

[crimesnooper]

Here is my take on the family Anthony. CA is BPD with huge narcisstistic traits. ICA the same, but actually is a sociopath. GA, passive aggressive, addiction issues, anger issues, not very bright, needy, dependant personality. LA..trying to be the good boy so he finally gets mommy's love. Can't be done. His issues reflect years of trying to figure out the code to acceptance in this family and failing everytime. But I think think there is hope for him after tons of therapy and moving physically away from this family. So many of the forums have posts about how much CA loved Caylee. I suspect had this poor child lived, CA would have repeated the same mo with this child. CA's love is self love.JMO

 

[rose222]

Grammy Jean..here they are:

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=100781"]Reference: Typed Letters List ONLY - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community[/ame]

 

[nerdy]

Learned helplessness. You are literally taught to believe you are helpless without the person who has always taken care of you. You can't do it as good as, as pretty as, as quick as them. I don't think casey is a narcissist either, I think she hates herself.. I think she feels unloved, unloveable and unaccepted. How can you not when your mother creates a whole other life story about you to fit her picture perfect word that's acceptable to her and ignores who and what you really are?! to the extent of allowing you to steal from her, lie to her, whatever, doesn't matter so long as she can keep her fairytale for outsiders. All the While she's saying she loves you unconditionally but she can't even accept your truth. I don't like who Casey let herself become but I get her rage.. I don't see the treatment she received as spoiling either, not in the least!!

This.

i've had to detach from the trial a lot because i started to realize how similar my family is to the Anthonys. Thankfully i moved far away from them when i was 18, which saved my life. Several years later, though, they still have a negative influence on me. Somehow i can't get free. My mother rewrites reality all the time and refuses to consider anyone else could be right - JUST like CA. My mother's philosophy is "it's not a lie if no one can prove the truth."

Watching CA now makes me physically ill. Too close to my reality. And this case has triggered a grief response in myself regarding my own low self-esteem and learned helplessness from years of my "dictator" mother. it gets in - it never goes away. i've never had a successful romantic relationship and even friendships take a lot of effort. These realizations have all come from watching this trial!!

This family is so tragic - and it is but one of many like them.

Sorry for my Sunday morning confessional but reading this thread is intense for me! :crazy:

 

[sappysoul]

Learned helplessness. You are literally taught to believe you are helpless without the person who has always taken care of you. You can't do it as good as, as pretty as, as quick as them. I don't think casey is a narcissist either, I think she hates herself.. I think she feels unloved, unloveable and unaccepted. How can you not when your mother creates a whole other life story about you to fit her picture perfect word that's acceptable to her and ignores who and what you really are?! to the extent of allowing you to steal from her, lie to her, whatever, doesn't matter so long as she can keep her fairytale for outsiders. All the While she's saying she loves you unconditionally but she can't even accept your truth. I don't like who Casey let herself become but I get her rage.. I don't see the treatment she received as spoiling either, not in the least!!

I think narcissism is more complicated than whether or not one necessarily loves herself/himself. It is largely accepted that people lie about themselves by embellishing their accomplishments, etc. because they dislike who they truly are. People also do this to gain control over others, avoid responsibility, gain privileges they otherwise wouldn't be entitled to, etc. In order for ICA to be affected by CA's lies she would have to be capable of feeling shame and IMO she isn't. It amazes me how she is able to sit stoically while her lies and acts are broadcast across America. Her narcissism is most obvious in a sense of entitlement and consistently putting her needs above others. ICA may have (and I believe did) lie about having a job to make things easier for herself, not because she felt shame about being jobless. She lied about the nanny, Caylee's whereabouts, etc. for the same reason IMO. These lies were not attempts at covering up feelings of inadequacy or shame.

 

[pip]

I think narcissism is more complicated than whether or not one necessarily loves herself/himself. It is largely accepted that people lie about themselves by embellishing their accomplishments, etc. because they dislike who they truly are. People also do this to gain control over others, avoid responsibility, gain privileges they otherwise wouldn't be entitled to, etc. In order for ICA to be affected by CA's lies she would have to be capable of feeling shame and IMO she isn't. It amazes me how she is able to sit stoically while her lies and acts are broadcast across America. Her narcissism is most obvious in a sense of entitlement and consistently putting her needs above others. ICA may have (and I believe did) lie about having a job to make things easier for herself, not because she felt shame about being jobless. She lied about the nanny, Caylee's whereabouts, etc. for the same reason IMO. These lies were not attempts at covering up feelings of inadequacy or shame.

I agree to most of what you said, except I think she told Tony and her friends (who were either employed and/or in college going somewhere with their lives) that she worked out of a bit of shame of being jobless and living at home with mom and dad and as a single parent. I think it gave her feelings of inadequacy, powerlessness. The Event Coordinator for Universal title gave the impression of power, prestige and control in her life, which she did not really have. She lied to her parents to make her life easier, she lied to her peers out of feelings of inadequacy.

 

[JBounds]

I found this excerpt from Cindy in August, 2008 interesting.

"It was a very difficult decision for me not to see Casey. I think it's in Caylee's best interest. I wanted to go there and support her, but those conversations are recorded and can be released as public record, so I just couldn't," she said.

She said she thinks some secrecy helps protect Caylee.

"There's certain things we do know, certain things Casey knows that she can't tell. But you know, frankly, there's not a whole lot of people that we trust. I trust Casey, I trust her attorney, I trust my son, and I trust my husband, and I trust God, and that's about the only people right now and the only things I can have faith in," Cindy Anthony said.

http://www.wesh.com/r/17099679/detail.html

 

[sappysoul]

I agree to most of what you said, except I think she told Tony and her friends (who were either employed and/or in college going somewhere with their lives) that she worked out of a bit of shame of being jobless and living at home with mom and dad and as a single parent. I think it gave her feelings of inadequacy, powerlessness. The Event Coordinator for Universal title gave the impression of power, prestige and control in her life, which she did not really have. She lied to her parents to make her life easier, she lied to her peers out of feelings of inadequacy.

I can see your point because that is the reason most of us would lie about such a thing. I disagree in regard to ICA. We'll never know the real reason I'm sure. IMO ICA lied about the job because she knew what it would take to get accepted by these people and played the role. She was a chameleon who could play whatever role she needed to. She understood the "qualifications" it took to achieve a certain status within a group of people. I've never seen any evidence that she valued employment or education herself (actually the opposite) but she knew Tony L. and others did. They were a means to an end for her. To me it is very similar to how an undercover cop will pretend to be like a group of drug dealers in order to fit in and get what he wanted as a result...if that makes sense.

 

[nerdy]

I can see your point because that is the reason most of us would lie about such a thing. I disagree in regard to ICA. We'll never know the real reason I'm sure. IMO ICA lied about the job because she knew what it would take to get accepted by these people and played the role. She was a chameleon who could play whatever role she needed to. She understood the "qualifications" it took to achieve a certain status within a group of people. I've never seen any evidence that she valued employment or education herself (actually the opposite) but she knew Tony L. and others did. They were a means to an end for her. To me it is very similar to how an undercover cop will pretend to be like a group of drug dealers in order to fit in and get what he wanted as a result...if that makes sense.

your thoughts are very interesting to me, and i don't disagree with them, as i think we'll never know exactly how ICA's mind works. i don't think it's "normally" that's for certain.

but the undercover cop wants to take down the group - whereas Casey might have just wanted to belong to it. i wonder if maybe she had big plans to take out her family - but was actually sort of placated by the temporary social acceptance and belonging she had for the 31 days. that was her end. she didn't need to carry out the rest.

just one theory of course!

 

[sappysoul]

your thoughts are very interesting to me, and i don't disagree with them, as i think we'll never know exactly how ICA's mind works. i don't think it's "normally" that's for certain.

but the undercover cop wants to take down the group - whereas Casey might have just wanted to belong to it. i wonder if maybe she had big plans to take out her family - but was actually sort of placated by the temporary social acceptance and belonging she had for the 31 days. that was her end. she didn't need to carry out the rest.

just one theory of course!

I think she did want to belong to that group but why she wanted to belong seems to be where the difference of opinion is. While some think it is because she actually wanted to be like them where I think she actually just wanted the lifestyle. If her lies were truly shame-based I think we would see some effort, however minimal, to change. I don't think laziness explains this away. She seemed to put effort into the things she wanted or valued. She just didn't value education or employment IMO.

 

[pip]

I think she did want to belong to that group but why she wanted to belong seems to be where the difference of opinion is. While some think it is because she actually wanted to be like them where I think she actually just wanted the lifestyle. If her lies were truly shame-based I think we would see some effort, however minimal, to change. I don't think laziness explains this away. She seemed to put effort into the things she wanted or valued. She just didn't value education or employment IMO.

I guess as a sociopath, her bottom line would be to lie and embellish to gain power and control rather than for the value of fitting in. I see your point. She recognized her tools to divide and conquer were inadequate with this group, not 'feelings' of inadequacy with this group.

 

[wishuwerehere]

Hello - I'm new to posting here, so please bear w/me.

I have often wondered how Casey treated Caylee when they were alone together. I do not believe that Casey physically abused Caylee. However, I do believe there was abuse involved. I suspect she IGNORED little Caylee (psychological abuse). Any thoughts?

 

[pip]

Hello - I'm new to posting here, so please bear w/me.

I have often wondered how Casey treated Caylee when they were alone together. I do not believe that Casey physically abused Caylee. However, I do believe there was abuse involved. I suspect she IGNORED little Caylee (physchological abuse). Any thoughts?

I agree. I don't think she would risk leaving a mark on that child for Cindy to find. Cindy was already considering trying to get custody. I bet she ignored her and/or was verbally abusive and emotional deprivation.

 

[Woe.be.gone]

Any of the viewpoints above may contain truths imo. I'm unable to wrap my brain around the truth at this time.

Talking about Lee though, I'm wondering why I'm not getting the same impression of him that some other peeps have expressed. When he got emotional on the stand Friday, I felt he was expressing authentic buried hurt. He indicated that he's different now and I took that to mean that he's grown up and regrets he didn't take a more active role in being Caylee's uncle (maybe he meant being more open to caring for Caylee when KC wanted a babysitter versus just going about his own life). When peeps are in their early twenties, in this day and age, I don't think it's that uncommon to have an 'all about me' attitude - it's when a person never comes out of that mindset that it becomes detrimental to relationships. I took it that Lee was saying that he's become aware of alot of things he wasn't concerned with before, that is, KC's troubles to include her daughter/being a single mom. Afterall, his parents had that covered and encouraged him to disengage from the situation which to me seems especially weird considering he was living in the same house before Caylee was born (and maybe shortly after her birth?). It was time for him to move out anyway imo.

Is it common to have one's brother visit the hospital after giving birth? I visited my best friend in the hospital at the birth of her first child but, other than that, I usually wait to see newborns at a later date. Why do I want my brother seeing me while giving birth? You're usually in the hospital one day!
Now I'm hoping I haven't offended people by not visiting them in the hospital.

 

[NoeticSoul]

I believe that all that has happened is karma coming back to bite CA in the tush. In my viewpoint, CA is the #1 toxic force in the family dysfunction and the root cause of Caylee's demise. Yes, ICA did the deed, but CA is the driving force behind the all angst and illness in the Anthony family. She personifies BPD, narcissism and all the destructive/manipulative behaviors associated.
George is a co-dependent, powerless zombie...and apparently finds comfort in this role, as even a tragedy as powerful as the murder of his grandchild by his own daughter has not blown him into reality. If anything, it has made him even more co-dependent and zombified. Watching him next to CA in court and in all their media interviews of the past is fascinating/pathetic at the same time. He is like a little beaten puppydog waiting for his next cue from his master, CA.
Unreal.

bbm

A little beaten puppy-dog that enjoys crab puffs & cruises. Just sayin.
I hope he does the right thing, he still has time.

(always mho)

 

[pip]

bbm

A little beaten puppy-dog that enjoys crab puffs & cruises. Just sayin.
I hope he does the right thing, he still has time.

(always mho)

LOL. No doubt. I think that too is part of George's M.O.. He likes the co-dependent easy road where all he has to do is make minimum wage guarding malls, mow the lawn, wash the cars, take orders from Cindy the strong female, not use his own brain, have a newer car to drive, a roof over his head, food in his belly and a few nice perks along the way. Groomed appearance and pressed shirts. He is kind of like a gigolo in a sense. Yeah, George IS getting something in return for his chosen role in life. He has sold his soul for the low road, the big easy. When is he going to wake up and realize that his chosen path in life is not that easy? In fact, it's created dire situations for himself.

 

[JBounds]

Hello - I'm new to posting here, so please bear w/me.

I have often wondered how Casey treated Caylee when they were alone together. I do not believe that Casey physically abused Caylee. However, I do believe there was abuse involved. I suspect she IGNORED little Caylee (psychological abuse). Any thoughts?

I've asked myself that question too. They claim she was good mother, but that was in front of everyone. What was she like when no one was looking?

 

[wishuwerehere]

I agree. I don't think she would risk leaving a mark on that child for Cindy to find. Cindy was already considering trying to get custody. I bet she ignored her and/or was verbally abusive and emotional deprivation.

Except-at the very end when (IMO) she killed Caylee. The ultimate of abuses. I also believe the duct tape was used as a weapon to kill. Casey strikes me as someone who is very symbolic (tattoos, posting lots of photos online, etc.). I believe the duct tape symbolizes Casey wanting Caylee to shut up. (this is hard to type). MOO.

 

[NoeticSoul]

Except-at the very end when (IMO) she killed Caylee. The ultimate of abuses. I also believe the duct tape was used as a weapon to kill. Casey strikes me as someone who is very symbolic (tattoos, posting lots of photos online, etc.). I believe the duct tape symbolizes Casey wanting Caylee to shut up. (this is hard to type). MOO.

bbm

Yup. I thought that too. Those "terrible two's" will stress out the most even tempered mom! I'm sure it didn't coincide with ICA's daily agenda.

ETA: Especially if she couldn't get a babysitter (Mom) when she absolutely wanted one.

 

[rose222]

Hello - I'm new to posting here, so please bear w/me.

I have often wondered how Casey treated Caylee when they were alone together. I do not believe that Casey physically abused Caylee. However, I do believe there was abuse involved. I suspect she IGNORED little Caylee (psychological abuse). Any thoughts?

Right you are wishuwerehere! Have you seen the videos of Caylee eating breakfast and another one where the little angel is drawing? Watch them. Caylee is practically begging for some loving attention and Casey (who I'm sure is filming) gives her nothing but the silent treatment. You can see Caylee getting frustrated and confused. How I wish the jurors could see those videos.

 

[NoeticSoul]

Right you are wishuwerehere! Have you seen the videos of Caylee eating breakfast and another one where the little angel is drawing? Watch them. Caylee is practically begging for some loving attention and Casey (who I'm sure is filming) gives her nothing but the silent treatment. You can see Caylee getting frustrated and confused. How I wish the jurors could see those videos.

ITA

example

Who would take a photo like that? Poor Caylee looks terrorized imho. It's chilling...