TN - Gail Nowacki Palmgren, 44, Signal Mountain, 30 April 2011 - #12

[belimom]

Oh Gail...

Thoughts and prayers with her children and loved ones right now...

I am just now seeing this... RIP, Gail. :rose:

 

[hollyblue]

It's interesting because there's a debate on the Chattanoogan website in which some people seem to think that guardrails on the mountain are unecessary. There are several letters to the editor making it sound more macho to live without guardrails.

http://www.chattanoogan.com/articles/article_214749.asp

I don't want to even think the people living in the neighborhood would not say anything about tire tracks, etc, just because of the controversy it might have stirred up again about safety. ?? I hope not.

 

[belimom]

On that part of East Brow Road there isn't a lot of places to turn around. She could have initially headed toward the W then remembered it was closed and tried to turn around and accidently back ed up to far...just a thought.

I'm still playing catch-up... We had a smaller "boulder" in our yard once (smaller than the one involved in this accident), and a neighbor who didn't know it was there ran into it while turning around. It didn't budge: it ripped the bumper off. I haven't read enough yet to comment on what I think really happened, but I just wanted to add this piece of into.

 

[glorias]

Wow. How ironic the name of Helton shows up ---and her house was the last one passed by Gail on the same side she went off. Just sayin'

"People drive very fast down the road. It's very easy to get comfortable with it if you live up here," said Diane Helton, who lives a few houses from the area where the Jeep left the road. "But when it's rainy or foggy, it can be scary. I can't see to the end of my driveway sometimes."

My mind is officially blown.

At what point do all these coincidences cease to be coincidences? I've never seen such an amazing storm of circumstance and coincidences all coming together like this. Never.

 

[hollyblue]

OT: It's 9 degrees in Albuquerque, NM at 6 am !!!! I think it's a new record. Brrrrrrrrrrr!

 

[Oriah]

It's interesting because there's a debate on the Chattanoogan website in which some people seem to think that guardrails on the mountain are unecessary. There are several letters to the editor making it sound more macho to live without guardrails.

http://www.chattanoogan.com/articles/article_214749.asp

I saw that too, ThoughtFox...
Made me go, huh??
Because (please excuse sarcasm here) it's clearly more cost effective to put the resources we've just seen expended into a very significant and costly recovery effort... than it is to a rescue effort of a fender bender??

 

[KathyJ]

Also on her twitter account it say's she will be live from E Brow @ 5. It will be interesting to see if she interviewed the people about the rock.

I just can't understand why if you notice your 450 pound rock missing with tire tracks leading over the side of a cliff from where the rock was, why you don't report it to LE. What were they thinking happened? What did they think caused the tire tracks?

http://www.wrcbtv.com/global/video/...rt=undefined&akProfile=undefined&rnd=98473725

I am with all of you on this. There had to be more than just a rock missing! And with the rock missing of that size that does not send up a red flag? I also have to believe there was some sort of tire marks along with "dragging" marks of the rock going over. Did she really hit the rock that hard that is went airborne and did not cause any marks on the ground? Either way there had to be some sort of marks on that grassy knoll.

For any locals and in case I missed this, is this a road she would have normally traveled? Meaning, heading to a friends house or back to the lake house? I am not local so have no idea where this road would have taken her.

 

[Trident]

I saw that too, ThoughtFox...
Made me go, huh??
Because (please excuse sarcasm here) it's clearly more cost effective to put the resources we've just seen expended into a very significant and costly recovery effort... than it is to a rescue effort of a fender bender??

What fender bender? What am I missing here?

 

[KathyJ]

Then he didn't, and it was just a freak accident.

But long before this we had the fact that MP allowed his attorney to (a) say to the press that Gail was "f--d up" and to (b) have computers removed and wiped clean that should have been included in the home search. Those are puzzling actions. I assume MP sanctioned whatever his attorneys did and said.

http://www.chattanoogan.com/articles/article_203652.asp

He also said he spoke to a couple in Hoover, Ala., who said Ms. Palmgren "had a psychotic episode" while at their house a week before she disappeared.

Attorney Davis said Ms. Palmgren "showed up uninvited" and spent two nights with the family friends.

He said the husband, an attorney, told him, "Gail was flat f----- up. She was out of her mind."


http://timesfreepress.com/news/2011/jul/08/missing-palmgren-computers-turned-over-defense-att/

When Hamilton County Sheriff’s Office detectives entered the Signal Mountain home of a missing woman a couple of weeks ago, the family’s computers were missing.

The computers instead had been turned over to Lee Davis, an attorney representing Matthew Palmgren, the husband of Gail Palmgren, the 44-year-old mother of two who has been missing since April 30.

Davis said in an interview Thursday that the computer hard drives have been sent to technicians to see if any files or history can be recovered that might lead to Gail Palmgren.

“We’ve sent them off to see what’s on them,” he said. “Obviously, if files have been deleted, they’ve been deleted.”

:waitasec:

Psychotic episode..again that is a matter of opinion. Sure she could have been really upset and ranting and raving--it happens and it happens a lot, especially what was going on in her life. Are we supposed to believe that Gail was to be perfectly calm and ok with everything she was finding out about her husband and the affair and everything else? People can perceive things any way they want to, Psychotic episodes are pretty severe and people don't just have a psychotic break one day and are fine the next.

This is still just such a tragic story and still does make any sense.

 

[poppyfrock]

When the rock was first reported they said that it was a small rock and the neighbors say they assumed someone stole it. Now the rock has turned into a 435 pound boulder that the news crews say would have taken a "crew" to move. Did the neighbors think a crew stole it? And for what? Also the tire tracks? What in the world? Did they think a car drove over the cliff and grew wings and flew away? I am astonished!

 

[KathyJ]

Oops one more thing, from what I said above about having a break one day and being fine the next, I am sure some will say that is the point is she was not fine.....that is not what I meant. There are plenty of other people out there that would probably testify that she was upset yes, but no more than any other person who finds their world crumbling. My point is I highly doubt she was psychotic.

From all we have heard she was in a pretty good frame of mind trying to get her ducks in a row anticipating a divorce and or separation.

 

[Oriah]

What fender bender? What am I missing here?

No- no fender bender. Just a reference to other posts on other sites that talk about guard rails in re: to Gail's situation.

There is a lot more rescue expenditure that goes into an extensive fatal accident, than one that is a response to a fender bender. That's all I meant. Sorry for the sarcasm.

 

[Shelby1]

My mind is officially blown.

At what point do all these coincidences cease to be coincidences? I've never seen such an amazing storm of circumstance and coincidences all coming together like this. Never.

That's what I've been saying all along. It's just too many coincidences.

 

[confused]

I have a really close friend whose significant other said almost that same exact thing during a custody battle. That she had "held him back." That she had "ruined his career." And that he saw her as a parasite, only the thing is - she was the parasite taking care of his children and his house. :furious: And in my friend's case, the ex did not get full custody and the Judge asked the kids what they wanted, and they chose Mom.

Talk is cheap, and sometimes meaningless. Whatever MP said doesn't make it true.
In our society, this happens all the time. So now that the body is found, people who support MP shouldn't take it as a time to gloat. Oh, no, my friends. This is not a time to gloat. Because as my own dear husband said to me yesterday, justice in some ways has happened because the truth came out in a most public way, and none of it was Gail's fault.

First, we don't know that Matt ever said this. ARLENE said it, and repeated it, almost like a script, on the news every chance she got. Just because Arlene said it, doesn't make it true either.

 

[Joe Friday]

Along with the tire tracks and the marks that I suspect would have been left from the rock being drug or pushed over the side of the mountain by the Jeep I would think there would be debris such as broken plastic and glass from the grill and headlamps breaking when the Jeep hit the rock lying in the grassy area that the residents would have noticed had they investigated further. That evidence would likely still be there should LE take a closer look if they haven't already.

Watching the clip in the following link you can clearly see the damage to the front of the Jeep from hitting the rock. Just before the 2:00 minute mark in the video. The front bumper is dented on the right side and I believe the front right wheel is pushed back. The grill is lying inside in the front seat and the headlamps are completely gone from the front of the Jeep. The front of the Jeep is remarkably not damaged that badly considering it went over the side of a mountain.

Most of the damage occurred to the rear of the Jeep and looking at the damage to the rear of the Jeep I think this was cause by the impact of the Jeep landing after going over the side of the cliff. The Jeep likely became airborne doing a forward Somersault landing on the rear of the Jeep with the Jeep in a almost upside down position, then tumbling again over forward and landing against the tree where it came to rest.

http://www.wrcbtv.com/story/16188677/investigators-to-try-palmgren-jeep-move


If it is suspected that another vehicle might of bumped the Jeep from behind causing Gail to go over the side of the mountain I would suspect that debris from either vehicle might be found further up the road in the direction in which Gail was traveling from that could be found. I read up thread that MP might have had front end damage repaired to his vehicle following Gail's disappearance. If plastic or glass was broken on his vehicle when it was reparied, assuming his vehicle was involved I would think the plastic or glass would still be along side of the road today and could be recovered.


I too would be interested to know if this was a route that Gail would have normally taken. With what I'm reading about her mental condition, knowing her neighbor tried to stop her to say Hi as she left her house that morning after dropping her children off, but Gail just kept on going and never even acknowledged her, her pending divorce and other problems going on in her life, Gail could have just decided to end it all. The road where she did crash is relatively straight with rock walls for guard rails along most of the road way with only a few areas that were unprotected. For Gail's Jeep to just happen to crash over the side of the mountain in one of those unprotected spots is somewhat of a high odds event. If this was a road in which Gail would not have had a reason to travel than I think that makes an even stronger case that points towards possible this being an intentional accident. Something we might never know.

JMO

 

[Shelby1]

First, we don't know that Matt ever said this. ARLENE said it, and repeated it, almost like a script, on the news every chance she got. Just because Arlene said it, doesn't make it true either.

I also agree that this is no time to gloat. I want to have an investigation, a complete one, to prove that Matt didn't do anything to Gail. It wont really make a difference. There are those so set in their hatred and mistrust that they wouldn't believe it if God himself appeared and told us all that Matt was innocent. What those people think doesn't really matter... Matt's affair made things worse, it most assuredly upset Gail. BUT, there are many people (even many on this forum as evidenced by personal stories that have been shared) who have gone through divorce with cheating spouses and survived. The fact that Matt cheated doesn't mean he killed Gail. The fact that he hasn't spoken to the media doesn't mean he killed Gail. The fact that he hasn't done what people think (demand) that he should have done, doesn't mean he killed Gail.

I agree, cheating doesn't equal a murderer, but what about all of his other actions such as wiping his hard drive, and getting a lawyer etc. etc.? It seems to me that he threw up road blocks at every step of the way in the search for Gail.

Just my opinion.

 

[confused]

I agree, cheating doesn't equal a murderer, but what about all of his other actions such as wiping his hard drive, and getting a lawyer etc. etc.? It seems to me that he threw up road blocks at every step of the way in the search for Gail.

Just my opinion.

There again, we have no one but Arlene stating he 'wiped his hard drive'. From the news reports and the discussions here, I took the comment about if something had been deleted, it's deleted, to mean they were trying to follow Gails emails, etc. And in doing so, would see if they could recover things she may have deleted, but sometimes, if it's deleted you can't get it back. I do not think anyone, esp.. an attorney would be bold enough to say- Hey, we wiped the hard drive, now if it's deleted, it's deleted. Do you really believe that is what they were telling the press? That would be completely stupid.

What makes more sense is that the PI took the computers to try and recover anything like travel plans, bank transfers, etc. that Gail may have done, then deleted to keep Matt from seeing. She was doing lots of things on the sly, and we know she even got Arlene's laptop, so that Matt wouldn't be able to see what she was doing.

 

[realdeal]

Some stream of conciousness posting here; please feel free to dissect and share thoughts!

After pondering this for days, and thinking of the three options: accident, suicide or foul play...I just seem less and less inclined to believe it was an accident.

To accidentally veer off in the particular spot that would be easiest to go over, on a road we cannot explain GP's presence on, seems too coincidental, IMHO. If we find out she was attempting to brake when she went over, I might could see it as a terrible coincidence involving a distraction from cell phone, etc., with her realizing her mistake at the last second, but if it turns out she was accelerating, there goes that.

Soooo...that would leave two options and I don't know what to think, as both require some mind stretching to make all the details fit neatly in a package.

While I don't doubt that MP was morally capable of causing her demise, it would have taken everything falling into place, precisely just so, for him to cause it to happen at 12:25, just minutes after she left the house. Do we actually KNOW, from anything other than his word, what time she dropped the kids?
I keep coming back to the oddity of hearing the press conference before the body was even indentified as GP, of MP's lawyers making such a point of saying "We know that GP lost control of her vehicle at 12:25pm."
For some reason, my hinky meter is buzzing about this strange announcement. I have never once heard of the family of an accident victim calling a presser to say for instance "Jimmy Joe fell off a ladder at precisely 9:07 this morning."

I so want to hear from those children what was happening, although they may have been brainwashed too much by now to even ever tell the real story. How was it possible for MP to block LE from doing their job and interviewing the last people (the children) to be with GP?

MP just reeks of coveing up something, but was it possible for him to orchestrate this so well, or is there just a puzzle piece we are missing that would allow for a scenario in which the Jeep and/or Gail went over at a different time?

As for the suicide theory, I can almost see it, but the stop at the convenience store stumps me. Were there cameras at those stores? Would tape from months ago be erased already? I think knowing what Gail bought or her deameanor at the store would be a huge clue. Someone mentioned it could have been a potty break, but who takes a potty break OR a snack break before intentionally driving off a cliff?

Some have made a lot of the issue of GP not wearing a seatbelt as being evidence of suicide, and that is indeed possible. But it could just as easily be evidence of foul play, or of someone too distressed to use safety precautions. I can remember times I have left in a vehicle after receiving an emergencey phonecall for instance, when I did not buckle up and didn't even realize it until I stopped and started to unbuckle. And sometimes a person under duress will just plain forget things, even something that is a habit (such as brushing teeth, tying shoes, etc. and so on).

Knowing the content of her final cell phone conversations would tell us a LOT about her frame of mind, and whether she was suicidal. Of couse that information would have to come from a reliable source and not someone with an agenda either way.

I am also eager to hear more info re: the will.

So many things could give us clues, and LE is no doubt wise to hold some of this info close to their vest. I just hope they are being as closed to MP as he has been to them. They don't owe him one bit of information about the lady he had such anger and disdain for, that he was not even willing to help find.

My opinions of exactly what happened are conflicted, and certainly not set in stone. I am open to hear alternative opinions of this mystery. How I wish Gail had been recovered while more clues were fresh!

Of course what I really wish is that Gail was alive and happily enjoying the holidays with her children.

 

[confused]

Do we actually KNOW, from anything other than his word, what time she dropped the kids?

I keep coming back to the oddity of hearing the press conference before the body was even indentified as GP, of MP's lawyers making such a point of saying "We know that GP lost control of her vehicle at 12:25pm."

As for the suicide theory, I can almost see it, but the stop at the convenience store stumps me. Were there cameras at those stores? Would tape from months ago be erased already? I think knowing what Gail bought or her deameanor at the store would be a huge clue. Someone mentioned it could have been a potty break, but who takes a potty break OR a snack break before intentionally driving off a cliff?

So many things could give us clues, and LE is no doubt wise to hold some of this info close to their vest. I just hope they are being as closed to MP as he has been to them. They don't owe him one bit of information about the lady he had such anger and disdain for, that he was not even willing to help find.

Of course what I really wish is that Gail was alive and happily enjoying the holidays with her children.

Yes, I don't think Matt actually said that she arrived at 12:15. I believe Susie Button is the one who stated the time.

It is my understanding that this was the info that the LE told the family. They then released it to the public.

Why does everyone think if she stopped at the store, she went in and shopped??? Could be she was sitting there making her mind up to do ??? Or, she could have been talking on the phone, writing a note to the children, or just crying. No one has said (that I have seen) that she got out, grabbed a cart and started shopping.

I believe that Matt has been much more open and forthright with the LE than any of us knows. They continue to state that he is cooperating fully and my guess is that they have worked together thus far. We, the public, are the ones who are not owed any explaination or information, although most of us seem to expect it and get very bent out of shape that we are not getting it.

"he had such anger and disdain for" where did you get the idea that he had anger and disdain for Gail? My guess (and I could be wrong, please let me know if so) is that you are basing your statement on the words Arlene repeats each time she's on tv. Let me ask...has anyone else, any of Gail's friends or Matt's friends said anything similar?? We have several on this forum who know both or them, and have even had them as guests in their homes. NO ONE else has said that they EVER heard Matt utter a hateful word to Gail. NO ONE.

As for your last statement...I agree. I desperately wish that Gail was still with us, with her children.

 

[Cuoco7]

Wow. How ironic the name of Helton shows up ---and her house was the last one passed by Gail on the same side she went off. Just sayin'

"People drive very fast down the road. It's very easy to get comfortable with it if you live up here," said Diane Helton, who lives a few houses from the area where the Jeep left the road. "But when it's rainy or foggy, it can be scary. I can't see to the end of my driveway sometimes."

I'm wondering about the name Helton. I must've missed something along the way, would someone help explain to me? Thanks!