17 yo Trayvon Martin Shot to Death by Neighborhood Watch Captain #35

[Boytwnmom]

thought of that since one of my twins did go through a biting phase when anything near his mouth, like somehow my husband's thigh, ended up getting bit. Me, he mostly threw up on-projectile vomiting phase.

I would think anyone who put their hand over your mouth and nose better expect to get bitten. Wouldn't it be a reflex action to try and bite someone whose hand is pressing down on your mouth???? jmo

 

[vlpate]

happened according to Zimmerman is that TM had his hand over his mouth and he couldn't breathe and that's when he somehow moved away and shot him. So, it would have been IMPOSSIBLE according to Zimmermans OWN story for him to have been screaming as we heard right before and up until the shot was fired!

The screaming was occuring righ before the shot was fired and ended immediately hereafter. Plus, two experts and Trayvons parents have all said who it was and WASN'T. The evidence, common sense and logic all tell me that it was most definitely Trayvon Martin screaming in fear for his life and not Zimmerman screaming over a couple of small cuts on his head.

I see what you are saying, but my common sense tells me people don't scream when they are on top of and pummeling someone. I think GZ was yelling for help - as opposed to shooting TM, but no one would help, obviously. JMO

 

[Dr.Fessel]

I keep thinking how many peoples lives Zimmerman changed forever in that split second. Some of those witnesses will never get over it. IMO

 

[LambChop]

I see what you are saying, but my common sense tells me people don't scream when they are on top of and pummeling someone. I think GZ was yelling for help - as opposed to shooting TM, but no one would help, obviously. JMO

I think I'd be screaming if someone were holding on to me while I was trying to get away and I saw the gun, then I saw him reach for the gun and then he aimed I'd be screaming so loud it would sound like screeching. Why would GZ be saying no, no? He had the gun. I think GZ wanted someone to help him get TM off him and did call originally for help but also wanted someone to hold onto TM while he got up. When no help arrived it took the matter into his own hands because now he was determined more than ever not to let this kid get away. Common sense tells us that at some point TM saw the gun and that is probably when the screaming started because he knew his life was in danger. jmo

 

[beach]

The iPhone doesn't have a flash does it? I'll have to go look.

I believe only the iPhone 4 has flash.


~jmo~

I can confirm that the iPhone 4 has a flash. I own one and found out the hard way when I was trying to be discreet & did not want it to go off. lol

Not sure about the 4S or the earlier versions.

 

[vlpate]

Common sense tells me that if DA Corey had any tests showing Trayvon was the one screaming that would have ended up in affidavit. Saying his mother identified his voice suggests to me that tests are inconclusive and no good. If Corey wants to present mother's testimony at trial that its Trayvon screaming, all defense has to do is put Zimmerman's relatives on the stand who will say its Zimmerman screaming.

The investigator said the FBI test gave him "no insight", IMO, that's that, ykwim? I agree, and good point Zimmerman's and Fulton's testimonies being a wash.

 

[beach]

Mod Note:

Surprise! This time it is a Thank you mod note.

I just want to say how refreshing it is to come in here tonight and read the civil, respectful discussion taking place between posters who I know see things from different points of view. It is much appreciated and I thank you all for it. :heartbeat:


Yay you guys! :highfive:

 

[Phoenixfla]

So what are you arguing? I thought the argument was that O'Mara knew the answer he would get, that he was following the "rule".

Now suddenly I'm being told he was surprised by Gilbreath's testimony.

My original statement was that it was a big risk for MOM to ask Gilbreath "Has that given any insight as to the voice?"

He also ran a huge risk asking this:

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So do you know who started the fight?

GILBREATH: Do I know?

O'MARA: Right.

GILBREATH: No.

O'MARA: Do you have any evidence that supports who may have started the fight?

GILBREATH: No.

If Gilbreath answered yes to either of those questions, MOM would have been up ^$&* creek without a paddle.

 

[IzzyBlanche]

No gag order and both sides want to delete the names of the witnesses from the document dumps.

Thank you, so when will we see a document dump?

 

[Karmady]

How do you answer "I don't know" to the question "Did such-and-such give you any insight?" It either gave you insight or it didn't and surely YOU would know.

That's right. He had obviously seen the report. I believe the post I was responding to suggested that he didn't have the information. In which case, he would not know. Having seen the report, he answered that it did not.

 

[Dr.Fessel]

Thank you, so when will we see a document dump?

Hoping real soon.

 

[vlpate]

Medical evidence from GZ's physician - How could they not have asked for this?

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1204/20/cnr.01.html

"GILBREATH: I know that that is an injury that is reported to have sustained. I haven't seen any medical records to indicate that. <---- On it's own, without the follow-up, one might take his statement to mean there was nothing in his records to indicate that.

O'MARA: Have you asked him for them?

GILBREATH: Have I asked him for them? No.

O'MARA: Do you want a copy of them?

GILBREATH: Sure."

It seems to me the SP's investigators were on a witch hunt with the rest of the world. They apparently only gathered evidence to prove GZ guilty and ignored the rest. This doesn't really surprise me given the verdict just handed down to the 20 yr. old AA woman whose evidence and "victim" testimony was ignored. Based on this investigator's testimony and the PCA, she could well be jumping the shark with this case.

JMO

 

[Phoenixfla]

But he can't testify to that because he's not the person who conducted the test. The question was about the voice and did he have an insight as to the voice. He does not have to conclude anything because he will never be called to testify regarding whose voice it was because he's not the expert. Remember he is under oath so he can't testify about information he has no first hand knowledge about. So the answer would have been "no". Which is the answer MOM wanted. jmo

So your saying that Gilbreath would have never answered "yes" to "Has that given any insight as to the voice?" Maybe

:fence:

 

[Dr.Fessel]

I don't think any of the test done have given either of the following...............

1. the ability to perceive clearly or deeply; penetration
2. a penetrating and often sudden understanding, as of a complex situation or problem

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/insight

insight [&#712;&#618;n&#716;sa&#618;t]
n
1. the ability to perceive clearly or deeply; penetration
2. a penetrating and often sudden understanding, as of a complex situation or problem

 

[LolaMoon08]

When Zimmerman evidence is released, what will it show?
Things to look for: Evidence of injuries to Zimmerman, bruises and cuts on Trayvon, inconsistencies in Zimmerman's five statements...

What evidence does Special Prosecutor Angela Corey have that prompted her to charge George Zimmerman with murdering Trayvon Martin? So far, she has refused to say.

Before long, though, she will be required by law to release the evidence — which fills several boxes. What will it show?

"It'll be like little bits and pieces that will have to be strung together," said Adam Pollack, an Orlando criminal-trial attorney. "Almost a bunch of little dots. Initially, the little dots don't make much sense, but if you step back, you see a bigger picture."

http://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/lo...man-evidence-trayvon-20120428,0,5841658.story

Medical evidence from GZ's physician - How could they not have asked for this?

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1204/20/cnr.01.html

"GILBREATH: I know that that is an injury that is reported to have sustained. I haven't seen any medical records to indicate that. <---- On it's own, without the follow-up, one might take his statement to mean there was nothing in his records to indicate that.

O'MARA: Have you asked him for them?

GILBREATH: Have I asked him for them? No.

O'MARA: Do you want a copy of them?

GILBREATH: Sure."

It seems to me the SP's investigators were on a witch hunt with the rest of the world. They apparently only gathered evidence to prove GZ guilty and ignored the rest. This doesn't really surprise me given the verdict just handed down to the 20 yr. old AA woman whose evidence and "victim" testimony was ignored. Based on this investigator's testimony and the PCA, she could well be jumping the shark with this case.

JMO

When the evidence doesn't match GZ's version of events -- you know, like innocently checking an address and Trayvon jumping him from behind (1 of 5) -- why would they need to look at GZ's injuries? They know he has them? I'm sure they have the reports from the EMS that night... you know, the ones that cleared him? Why would they need to follow up with GZ's personal visit to the doctor? Do we even know how long GZ waited to get medical attention? We know he had bandaids on his nose and head the next day, but we don't know if a doctor put them on? His wife could have put them on?

If he didn't have medical records from hours after the incident and he waited until days later, that evidence is corrupted, IMO.

MOO

 

[Dr.Fessel]

Medical evidence from GZ's physician - How could they not have asked for this?

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1204/20/cnr.01.html

"GILBREATH: I know that that is an injury that is reported to have sustained. I haven't seen any medical records to indicate that. <---- On it's own, without the follow-up, one might take his statement to mean there was nothing in his records to indicate that.

O'MARA: Have you asked him for them?

GILBREATH: Have I asked him for them? No.

O'MARA: Do you want a copy of them?

GILBREATH: Sure."

It seems to me the SP's investigators were on a witch hunt with the rest of the world. They apparently only gathered evidence to prove GZ guilty and ignored the rest. This doesn't really surprise me given the verdict just handed down to the 20 yr. old AA woman whose evidence and "victim" testimony was ignored. Based on this investigator's testimony and the PCA, she could well be jumping the shark with this case.

JMO

How does a medical report after Zimmerman had been released from custody mean anything in the case?

If he had gotten treatment that night while in custody the chain of evidence would not have been broken.

There is no way to tell now when those injuries were caused since he was released from custody. IMO

 

[Yoda]

Medical evidence from GZ's physician - How could they not have asked for this?

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1204/20/cnr.01.html

"GILBREATH: I know that that is an injury that is reported to have sustained. I haven't seen any medical records to indicate that.

O'MARA: Have you asked him for them?

GILBREATH: Have I asked him for them? No. When he says I, could that also mean that another detective did and he just isn't giving any more info then he has to?

O'MARA: Do you want a copy of them?

GILBREATH: Sure.". Sure? That seems weird. Not yes or no but sure?! Its seems like he doesn't care if they get that evidence. Does anyone else get that vibe? Tia


JMO

(Shortened post). My second question didn't change color, but it is there right after gilbreath:sure

Thanks in advance for your thoughts.

 

[LolaMoon08]

I'm still not totally convinced that George's clothes were collected as evidence that night. I want to see a full account of how they were collected, including time-stamped photographs.

MOO

 

[vlpate]

I don't think they'll need anything else.

Quote:
GILBREATH:
We have Mr. Zimmerman's statements,
we have the shell casings
and we had Mr. Martin's body.

The shell casing(s)??

 

[Yoda]

When the evidence doesn't match GZ's version of events -- you know, like innocently checking an address and Trayvon jumping him from behind (1 of 5) -- why would they need to look at GZ's injuries? They know he has them? I'm sure they have the reports from the EMS that night... you know, the ones that cleared him? Why would they need to follow up with GZ's personal visit to the doctor? Do we even know how long GZ waited to get medical attention? We know he had bandaids on his nose and head the next day, but we don't know if a doctor put them on? His wife could have put them on?

If he didn't have medical records from hours after the incident and he waited until days later, that evidence is corrupted, IMO.

MOO

Hi lolamoon! Would you think that the GF's testimony was corrupt since it was weeks later when her account was brought forward? And if not why the difference? Tia