Allison Baden-Clay, GENERAL CASE DISCUSSION THREAD -#31

[Rational]

For a start, we're doing collectively on this forum. Keep up the good work. The conference is another avenue to address these issues which may lead to some kind of to sociolegal action. Many are making a start. There's a mens movement advocating an end to violence against women i.e. the white ribbon movement. This is also a start in the right direction. Let's keep going. Sometimes we have to find the answers along the way.

Thanks Fuskier
I have been thinking about this for the last few minutes and am a bit stumped how to keep this going. I think many of us here have gone through the mill so to speak and hopefully have learned some lessons along the way, or at least like Makara said learned to love and respect ourselves before all else.

Having said that we are still to some degree our own worse enemies, we spent time on here and say it is to the detriment of the washing, ironing, cleaning etc. I never here men on the golf course say 'damn all the emails are piling up or the washing isn't being done'. I agree that a large part of the puzzle has to be men taking responsibility for their behaviour, however there also needs to be a part of us that says my work is not limitless, it has boundaries, there is a place and a time for me to do what I enjoy. Maybe that is the respect for ourselves we need to nurture in our daughters.

Ah damn, too serious, I am doing 'dry' July and it is really starting to have an effect, maybe I need that one glass of single malt just to get me through tonight :floorlaugh:

 

[BJsleuth]

What I have trouble understanding is, why would a parent who's son has been charged twice with domestic violence and had been a victim herself totally deny and refuse to believe her son has done anything wrong? Is it because thats how she dealt with her own situation? Our daughters ex's mum just wont have it he has done anything wrong. He is only 24 and it worries me what he will do to his next partner

Because it would make her feel like she's failed and they're feelings she can't handle for some reason? If she has been in that situation and tolerated then she probably feels responsible in some way. It's easy to deny it because she doesn't know how to undo it. There could be many reasons.

 

[Mani]

Thanks Fuskier
I have been thinking about this for the last few minutes and am a bit stumped how to keep this going. I think many of us here have gone through the mill so to speak and hopefully have learned some lessons along the way, or at least like Makara said learned to love and respect ourselves before all else.

Having said that we are still to some degree our own worse enemies, we spent time on here and say it is to the detriment of the washing, ironing, cleaning etc. I never here men on the golf course say 'damn all the emails are piling up or the washing isn't being done'. I agree that a large part of the puzzle has to be men taking responsibility for their behaviour, however there also needs to be a part of us that says my work is not limitless, it has boundaries, there is a place and a time for me to do what I enjoy. Maybe that is the respect for ourselves we need to nurture in our daughters.

Ah damn, too serious, I am doing 'dry' July and it is really starting to have an effect, maybe I need that one glass of single malt just to get me through tonight :floorlaugh:

You make a valid point as we women do tend to emote more guilt than men regarding housework IMO

 

[BJsleuth]

This is quite a serious matter for it makes the victim of the emotional abuse feel like they are defective and 'crazy'. Overtime they get worn down, feel helpless, lose confidence and you can see it written on their faces. It's called gaslighting by some, but in FT terms it is also called 'crazymaking' and there are families which make a member feel like they are crazy - but the family dynamics are toxic. IMO.

I know, i've been there!

 

[Fuskier]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hawkins
Do not friggin start me. The objectification of women is a vestigial sociological imperative that is well past its use-by-date. Women have been commodities in the physical, emotional and spiritual sense for many thousands of years. Very few people really appreciate the depth to which these subservient roles are ingrained. Violence towards women is still at epidemic levels in our community and this violence is not specific to any demographic. The levels of child sex abuse, especially against girls is a national disgrace. Emotional violence and intimidation starts from a very young age and many, many men humiliate their wives and female relatives without any sense that they are doing so. Any man who thinks that Australia is a society which has turned the corner and which provides equal expectations and opportunities for women should experience life from a woman's perspective for a while. Boys need to be exposed to male role models who treat women as human beings, not as some other species who they should look after and 'respect'. Respect is a human right, not a right that you get by being a woman. Women are not furniture, they are not fashion accessories, they are not property, they are not investments. They are not cute things that you have a duty to look after like a pet. Violence against, and the objectification of, women is a deep social problem that is only vaguely recognised and addressed despite ridiculous claims that women are now somehow mostly 'equal'. If Mrs Baden Clay has died as the result of domestic or partner violence then hopefully the result will be something more than a shallow sense of satisfaction that her 'killer' is broughtto justice. All men need to look at their own hearts and their own values and ask what their potential is to act in the same way as her killer(s). We should all look at her death and ask how we collectively failed her and what we can do to empower our daughters to ensure that they do not suffer a similar fate. I am a man.

I think this was one of the best of Hawkins earlier posts and relates very much to Grannie's suggestion and Fuskier's subsequent comment.

Well WOW! Thanks for reposting RATIONAL. I must have missed that one! Bloody brilliant! Couldn't have said it better myself! I have copied & pasted into word, then enlarged and printed this. It says it all. It'll hang for all to see.

 

[Mothergoose]

Hi MaxwellSmart...
The moment that you have pressed that Quote button you have cooked your goose. lol :floorlaugh:

I above all have many reasons why I should not be here as well. Welcome aboard.

OYE .....:waitasec:O.K. I heard "Cooked Goose" c'mon who was it ? My geese Camilla and Charles heard it too. Fess up....this sight should be Goose friendly ya know :what::anguish: That's it I need a wine .

 

[Mani]

OYE .....:waitasec:O.K. I heard "Cooked Goose" c'mon who was it ? My geese Camilla and Charles heard it too. Fess up....this sight should be Goose friendly ya know :what::anguish: That's it I need a wine .

ROFL :floorlaugh: I love geese - they make great watchdogs, erm I mean watchgeese apparently!

MG is it geese that mate for life and if one dies the surviving goose doesn't take another partner?

More than we can say for some people IMO

 

[Mani]

:fireworks:


Sending up a flare to minni - wherever you are!

Come in minni!

 

[BJsleuth]

If I can give a piece of advice to anyone, male or female in a relationship, it's this: Trust your gut. If something doesn't feel right and you can't quite put your finger on it, get help! Don't allow your perception to be denied. It might be nothing, but it's better that than the alternative!

 

[Makara]

Thanks Fuskier
I have been thinking about this for the last few minutes and am a bit stumped how to keep this going. I think many of us here have gone through the mill so to speak and hopefully have learned some lessons along the way, or at least like Makara said learned to love and respect ourselves before all else.

Having said that we are still to some degree our own worse enemies, we spent time on here and say it is to the detriment of the washing, ironing, cleaning etc. I never here men on the golf course say 'damn all the emails are piling up or the washing isn't being done'. I agree that a large part of the puzzle has to be men taking responsibility for their behaviour, however there also needs to be a part of us that says my work is not limitless, it has boundaries, there is a place and a time for me to do what I enjoy. Maybe that is the respect for ourselves we need to nurture in our daughters.

Ah damn, too serious, I am doing 'dry' July and it is really starting to have an effect, maybe I need that one glass of single malt just to get me through tonight :floorlaugh:

Well said Rational. I've also passed on the "respect yourself and don't lower the bar" to my daughter and she is now passing it onto her daughters. It's fantastic to see the wonderful friends (of both gender) my girls attract into their lives. They're pretty savvy at sorting out the wheat from the chaff.

Similarly, when my husband was a young police cadet many, many years ago, his Senior Sergeant gave him some great advice that has stuck with him throughout his life.

Treat everyone how you would like your mother to be treated.

And hey, if you want that glass of single malt, you have it. :twocents:

:cheers:

Sorry everyone, I'm really off topic now.

 

[Mani]

Apologies if this has been posted before - Olave sounds like an interesting person and it is a great pity that the work of a great woman has been blighted by the irreverence of her g.grandson IMHO

http://olavebadenpowell.worldguiding.net/stories/mygran.pdf

Is it my imagination or has the support on here from the BC camp for GBC abated since his arrest?

And does anyone know what happens to the caption in Burke's Peerage if you are charged with murder? IMO
Do they show you the door?

 

[Mothergoose]

ROFL :floorlaugh: I love geese - they make great watchdogs, erm I mean watchgeese apparently!

MG is it geese that mate for life and if one dies the surviving goose doesn't take another partner?

More than we can say for some people IMO

Sorry OT

They sure do. Their loyalty is just amazing! Charles and Camilla are so devoted.
All my Geese have paired up for spring apart from I young male who we'll call Harry. He is one sad and lonely goose.Walks around the paddock head held low. Have advertised to buy for a mate for him but no luck yet. Not many geese around called Pippa Middleton LOL I seriously think I'm going nuts !!:what: Sorry Mods .........another wine please a-hem

 

[Mani]

Sorry OT

They sure do. Their loyalty is just amazing! Charles and Camilla are so devoted.
All my Geese have paired up for spring apart from I young male who we'll call Harry. He is one sad and lonely goose.Walks around the paddock head held low. Have advertised to buy for a mate for him but no luck yet. Not many geese around called Pippa Middleton LOL I seriously think I'm going nuts !!:what: Sorry Mods .........another wine please a-hem

Are you sure his names isn't supposed to be Gerry? "Gerry no mates!"

Sorry MG, forgive my play on words - OT, I know mods -
I hope Harry finds a mate soon.

 

[Fuskier]

You've hit the nail on the head. IMO the bottom line is RESPECT. Respect firstly for yourself. IMO respect is the most important thing in any relationship and it has to be mutual. Second is honesty and then comes communication.

Don't ever lower the bar of your expectations in what you want and how you expect to be treated. If partner's etc. don't measure up to that bar, then IMO they don't deserve to be a part of your life. I learned this the hard way and I'm now happy, contented and very much loved.

:goodpost:

 

[Dodo]

:fireworks:


Sending up a flare to minni - wherever you are!

Come in minni!

And I was wondering where madamoiselle Willough was too! perhaps they are being 'good' wives.

 

[itsthevibe]

That would be normal of anyone to say thank you wouldn't it?
Im sure they have a lot of friends who have made contact to show support.

Im confused as to how she may be the former business partner?

No, why would it be normal? Thank you for what? I am saying the woman friend is thanking EBC. I would think it more normal if EBC was thanking the friend - as under the circumstances they had just lost their daughter-in-law and were going through a trying time. But it is the friend thanking EBC. I was speculating that this woman might have been involved. speculation only of course, but just thought it unusual that the senior BC's would have been doing anything for a friend at that particular time, something that warranted a 'thanks for all your support". After such a tragedy, one would think that their friends would be doing things for them, not the other way around.

Your statement "I'm confused as to how she may be the former business partner", I dont understand. Why are you confused? I dont know if she is, I am simply speculating. Based on the fact that the former business partner is owed money, plus the sighting of the silver 4 wheel drive and the blue small 4 wheel drive driving close together with lights off/low near Kholo Creek. If the former business partner drives a blue Honda 4 wheel drive, it could mean they were involved. As to the woman in the video, i am posing the question - "Who is this woman - and could she be the former business partner?"

Just my speculating and questioning - up for discussion. Not sure if there has been further discussion, as I am about 10 pages behind right now.

 

[itsthevibe]

Just to clarify - EBC says "Thank you for your support" to the dark haired lady, not the other way around. Suspect she is a family friend supporting them in their "not being allowed to be normal" situation. IMO

Oh! did I get it totally wrong? I did go back and check once before and was sure it was the friend who said it, sheesh, I wonder how I have got it so wrong? Sorry if I've confused anyone.

I will have to find that link and go back and check it again more carefully.

 

[Fuskier]

'... I think many of us... have learned some lessons along the way, or at least like Makara said learned to love and respect ourselves before all else.

... we are still to some degree our own worse enemies, we spent time on here and say it is to the detriment of the washing, ironing, cleaning etc. I never here men on the golf course say 'damn all the emails are piling up or the washing isn't being done'. I agree that a large part of the puzzle has to be men taking responsibility for their behaviour, however there also needs to be a part of us that says my work is not limitless, it has boundaries, there is a place and a time for me to do what I enjoy. Maybe that is the respect for ourselves we need to nurture in our daughters...

:goodpost:

 

[KG1]

Hi Mani - yes, just sat down at the computer. But it would have shown me as being logged on here all day - the computer just sits turned on but with the screen blanked off, while email, this forum, and a couple of other things just update 24/7. Not very carbon-friendly, I know, but much easier than logging in and out all the time.

What a day...! Won't go into details though.

Re the ageing tests on blood - I'm not a forensic pathologist, as you know, (only a dumb surgeon) but the only thing I can recall reading about was some obscure test using RNA (not DNA) and the amount of breakdown of the RNA in the specimen. I vaguely recall reading something about that a few years ago, but I can't remember where. Or it may have been a presentation at a conference.

My overall impression is that determining the length of time since a bloodstain was created is very difficult and unreliable - but I stress I'm not up with the VERY latest in forensic testing in the lab.

I have found a couple of articles which may be of interest in relation to the ability to 'age' bloodstains. The first one is from 2006 and sounded promising, insofar as my ability to interpret scientific data is concerned, and the second attachment pdf is in relation to an instrument developed to read and age the bloodstains to assist forensics. So it seems that the process, if not already available is well on the way.

https://www.ncjrs.gov/pdffiles1/nij/grants/213892.pdf

 

[bellgirl]

:fireworks:


Sending up a flare to minni - wherever you are!

Come in minni!

and hugs for CJ60 who is sick in bed tonight! :grouphug: