Allison Baden-Clay - GENERAL DISCUSSION THREAD #32

[Berry]

The fence is all around the house...you really can't imagine how high it is! Clearly p..... off with the media or neighbours or.......dare I say the people who are curious.

Hey when you look from the road to NBCs was the fence on the left side property?

 

[DrWatson]

For those, last night, who were discussing the creek flow/torrential rain I found this post from back in May...


#94 05-19-2012, 10:04 AM
Blacklodge
Registered User Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 55

On the night of the torrential rain, I was at a wedding about 2kms from where ABC's body was discovered. We all watched as a dry creek bed soon became a flowing river. It was unbelievable. In fact, the reception was cancelled early and we were told to leave ASAP as flooding was soon imminent and all access out of Brookfield was to be cut off. It makes perfect sense that the body would have been dislodged and carried downstream, especially with such a current like there was on that night. I wonder if police have conducted a search of waterways that lead to where she was found. By starting at the end point and working backwards, vital evidence may be found.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=7937055&highlight=torrential+rain#post7937055

That's what I was getting at with a couple of my previous posts. We have a creek running through our bottom paddock.
That creek can come up from a trickle, or even a dry creek bed, to a raging torrent in minutes - literally. That's how and why cars get washed off the road if they're silly enough to try and cross it. I drive a 4WD with all the off-road goodies including raised suspension etc - and I would NOT try to drive along the road when that creek is flooding across it.

In the floods in January 2011, that gentle, babbling brook of a creek was roaring 2 metres deep, and with enough force that it literally peeled back the bitumen off the road surface over quite a distance, and washed it up and over so that when the water receded, it looked like a perfect surf wave frozen in time, on the other side of the road. Like a peeled back sardine can lid.

Most of the creeks around here can do that - and it can be quite sudden, as the flood surge comes down out of the hills we have all around Brookfield. Once that ground is saturated, and the runoff channels into all the creek beds, then we can get situations just like that creek that flooded in the centre of Toowoomba shown on all the news footage last year. Tragic but spectacular. Most of the locals here are used to it, and know where to avoid.

The whole point being that Kholo Creek and Little Ugly Creek would have done just that on that fateful weekend. And why I'm in the "washed down to the bridge" camp. If Allison had been placed (or dropped) AT the bridge, surely she would have been washed away into the Brisbane River with the flood surge coming down the creek? Unless she was somehow tied to the bridge supports, which I'm pretty sure she wasn't....

 

[Indromum]

Hey when you look from the road to NBCs was the fence on the left side property?

Hi Berry...as you are standing out the front looking at the house, the fence is on the right.

 

[Indromum]

Also, surely the chain would be attached securely and it would be hard to get off. Still, it would explain NBC at the bus stop.

The chain at the ANZ car park goes into a hollow metal post...you can see the lock sitting at the top of it.

 

[Strangeworld]

There are some really good arguments for Allison's body been dumped upstream. I just can't get out of my mind the fact that if this happened, that she found her resting place right under that bridge. Seems so coincidental especially if she travelled a fair way along that creek. What are the odds that she comes to rest right under that bridge?

 

[minusfour]

Firstly, a great big thank you to you all for all your efforts. Drawn here by my horror at what happened to Allison I have found the site informative, well researched and sensitively written.
Could the chipped tooth be the source of the blood found in the car? Teeth have a vascularised central pulp- these normally don't bleed profusely unless the pulp is inflammed, (which wouldn't be expected), but certainly do bleed if exposed by trauma. (The blood is then diluted by salvia, which can produce quite a large volume of blood stained fluid) Canines are pretty solid teeth, and unless heavily filled, (Allison's teeth look lovely in the photos), would take some trauma to chip, so this injury, without any damage to the lips of cheek, seems a bit odd.

Sorry if this is a dense question, but is there any clue where all the money had gone? I understand we might not be talking about the businessman of the year, but it's a big sum?

 

[Mani]

There are some really good arguments for Allison's body been dumped upstream. I just can't get out of my mind the fact that if this happened, that she found her resting place right under that bridge. Seems so coincidental especially if she travelled a fair way along that creek. What are the odds that she comes to rest right under that bridge?

I know it might sound weird but life is like that and fate can sometimes hang by a thread -
think of all the stories you have heard in your life where people have escaped death by the skin of their teeth - what about the Stuart Diver story - read that Strangeworld - that man had so much going against him and yet he lived.

It does appear strange that Allison ended up on the creek bank under the bridge but hey - we don't yet know where she was placed and given the combination of tide and floodwaters, it could have been a couple of kilometres upstream easily.

MOO

 

[Thinking]

Hi Berry...as you are standing out the front looking at the house, the fence is on the right.

So it wasn't the yard GBC and OW were racing round like chooks with their heads chopped off, avoiding the media unsuccessfully?

 

[Nads]

The chain at the ANZ car park goes into a hollow metal post...you can see the lock sitting at the top of it.

So anybody could just take it off or if You don't have a key would you need a big tool?

 

[Indromum]

So anybody could just take it off or if You don't have a key would you need a big tool?

Big tool??? Don't start me! Well I'm not sure how they work, but I imagine it would be anchored fairly soundly otherwise what would be the point of having it there.
The Coles guy I spoke with was really surprised at my question, so I think from his response we can rule out the three chains he unlocks - at the roundabout, the ANZ carpark and the top exit/entrance.

 

[marlywings]

That's what I was getting at with a couple of my previous posts. We have a creek running through our bottom paddock.
That creek can come up from a trickle, or even a dry creek bed, to a raging torrent in minutes - literally. That's how and why cars get washed off the road if they're silly enough to try and cross it. I drive a 4WD with all the off-road goodies including raised suspension etc - and I would NOT try to drive along the road when that creek is flooding across it.

In the floods in January 2011, that gentle, babbling brook of a creek was roaring 2 metres deep, and with enough force that it literally peeled back the bitumen off the road surface over quite a distance, and washed it up and over so that when the water receded, it looked like a perfect surf wave frozen in time, on the other side of the road. Like a peeled back sardine can lid.

Most of the creeks around here can do that - and it can be quite sudden, as the flood surge comes down out of the hills we have all around Brookfield. Once that ground is saturated, and the runoff channels into all the creek beds, then we can get situations just like that creek that flooded in the centre of Toowoomba shown on all the news footage last year. Tragic but spectacular. Most of the locals here are used to it, and know where to avoid.

The whole point being that Kholo Creek and Little Ugly Creek would have done just that on that fateful weekend. And why I'm in the "washed down to the bridge" camp. If Allison had been placed (or dropped) AT the bridge, surely she would have been washed away into the Brisbane River with the flood surge coming down the creek? Unless she was somehow tied to the bridge supports, which I'm pretty sure she wasn't....

Yes I think she was washed down with the power of all that water....may have even been washed down from a lot further upstream from where police were said to be first searching around scout camp. If the water was flowing very rapidly then it wouldn't take too long at all to be washed downstream to where she was found.

 

[marlywings]

There are some really good arguments for Allison's body been dumped upstream. I just can't get out of my mind the fact that if this happened, that she found her resting place right under that bridge. Seems so coincidental especially if she travelled a fair way along that creek. What are the odds that she comes to rest right under that bridge?

This is a post from a local...

05-12-2012, 06:36 PM #914
Keyboredom
Registered User Join Date: Apr 2012

There's a lot of swirling backwash around bridge pylons under flood. I've found large animal carcasses in very similar situations (which again is an awful comparison) following heavy rain and flash flood? Dead bodies after a week or more are likely to be floating and at the mercy of the water flow.

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7909149&postcount=91"]Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Australia - Allison Baden-Clay, 43, Brisbane QLD, 19 April 2012 - #6[/ame]

 

[BreakingNews]

Has anyone any clue about where the money is coming from for all these expensive legal people who have been visiting GBC please? If the funds are being provided by his family what does his dad do for a living or does he own property? Someone will have to pay.

I wondered where the legal fees were coming from also. Might be from whoever was willing to put up the bail - a doctor, wasn't it? Or family may be out selling Girl Guide cookies.

 

[Rational]

Yes the prosecution can ask for an extension of time however the grounds for doing so would need to be pretty solid. The Magistrates comments today indicate a judicial sensitivity to delays IMO

Of course there is a sensitivity as they have just announced an additional judge no doubt on the basis that 2 to 3 year waits for trial are unreasonable. This is politics not necessarily anything to do with how long it takes to get evidence. Maybe if they had appointed an additional forensic accountant and some detectives things would be speeded up more than appointing another judge at $350,000 salary costs plus addtionals!?
All IMO

 

[BJsleuth]

The actual report of the Forensic Accountant takes 4-6 weeks. The delays are in discovery ie: banks & other relevant institutions handing over that information. In some cases the institutions procedure is that their own Accountants review the information first to ensure their records are accurate. It's a legal process and may involve the financial provider's own legal team.

 

[Rational]

Mmmmmm - Tim Tams...!

Sorry - off-topic :woohoo:

Enjoying a quick break, and a couple of Tim Tams - just thought I'd share that thought.... :rocker:

Careful Doc Watson too much sugar may give you an energy boost but it is not a great thing for your blood sugar!!?

 

[Thinking]

I know it might sound weird but life is like that and fate can sometimes hang by a thread -
think of all the stories you have heard in your life where people have escaped death by the skin of their teeth - what about the Stuart Diver story - read that Strangeworld - that man had so much going against him and yet he lived.

It does appear strange that Allison ended up on the creek bank under the bridge but hey - we don't yet know where she was placed and given the combination of tide and floodwaters, it could have been a couple of kilometres upstream easily.

MOO

Every time I think of the possibility that Allison was not meant to be found (or not meant to be found at the bridge) I can't help but think of gbc's face in that infamous "pie face" shot, taken the day she was found.

I realize his expression could be described as that of shock and grief, but I can't help but see it as an expression of utter shock and disbelief that she was found where she was, as if it wasn't what he was expecting. He looks really shocked!

 

[Rational]

I am with you on this. I just dont know what to think anymore regarding COD,visible injuries, broken bones....blood loss etc.

I heard a few of the old rumours today with a little spin on them. To be taken with a big grain of salt....


RUMOUR ALERT!! dont want anyone to take this any more seriously than other gossip, just saying what i heard through the grapevine.


1. GBC visited the doctor, claimed he was depressed,not sleeping, was given a script for sedatives. These were NOT given to Allison, suggestion is children were sedated.

2. The Coles trolley boy actually entered a missing chain report into the Coles logbook.

3. Drag marks were found at the badenclay residence that morning....either in dirt or across grass


In reference to what I said this morning: please dont read anymore into this than any other theory/suggestion/rumour. It definitely is not verified

I had a gut feeling about that chain!!:floorlaugh:

 

[Rational]

Love your username Maigret. I studied La Pipe de Maigret at school. Is that what it's from?

George Simenon

 

[Berry]

Hi Berry...as you are standing out the front looking at the house, the fence is on the right.

Oh my....they were the bag getters from NBCs car on Bail afternoon..

And the garden path owners that OW wan down like a wabbit to escape media..

MMmmmm wonder why fence now........