Allison Baden-Clay - GENERAL DISCUSSION THREAD #38

[Liadan]

Makara - anyway we can check if the $$ went overseas?

 

[linette]

http://www.qt.com.au/story/2012/05/04/happy-and-successful-a-portrait-of-allison/

in this report, its say's that police now know Allison was murdered before she was left at Kholo Creek.
How can they know this? did she have something on her body that came from another location? something that might have been used to kill her previously? like rope or something, sheets? I cant understand what this means, how can they know this?
It also says dumped in a creek not left on the banks. So maybe that is evidence that she was not left at the bridge, but further upstream? Coolcat said they thought they could see in the footage that her hands were tied, too. With what? maybe something from her home, or from the parents home.
I also found a post from Keyboredom that said a forum member has told him that police contacted their partner because they had their number plate from driving through the roundabout. so if they could read that number plate, they would be able to read the number plates on all the cars. Maybe they took the plates off, or maybe they drove through there too, close together like being towed the same as the white and blue car story.

Another thing that I found interesting was that Allison stopped being a a property manager for one particular property days before she disappeared.

Hi Jadalyn...
Yes, you would think that if they could see one number plate that they could see them all, wouldn't you? I think that was where the theory started that perhaps they had no number plates on that night?
By going through the old threads you may be able to pick up things that we have forgotten. It'd be interesting too, to see just how many of the early 'rumours' are actually coming true. Quite a few have that were dismissed at the start.
We have had some great discussions on here as to how the police were alerted from day 1 that this was not a simple 'missing woman' case.
You'll also find that many of the posters from back then aren't around anymore... there were so many interesting and thought provoking posts. Definitely keep reading as much as you can, it's very interesting.
If I had the time I wouldn't mind reading some of those old posts myself... might do that.

 

[marlywings]

Just a reminder there will be no discussions about rumours...this includes reposting comments which contain rumours from old threads.

As per Summer's post on page 1.

Please do not discuss rumors. Although SOME rumors turn out to be true in the end, there are also those that are just that 'rumor,' and tend to derail the threads. Until there's a 'link' to verify a circumstance, we ask you do NOT post rumors.

If locals wish to be verified (as local residents with insider information), then we would be able to discuss, unless the information might jeopardize the investigation or case.

Yes, in past threads there had been rumors discussed. Going forward, no rumors. Locals please refrain from posting any insider information unless it can be linked to a valid source, or until you become a verified local member

Clarifying what to do about rumors - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community

 

[linette]

Just a reminder there will be no discussions about rumours...this includes reposting comments which contain rumours from old threads.

As per Summer's post on page 1.

Sorry... I was not trying to bring up old 'rumours', just mentioning to Jadalyn that she may come across a lot of interesting info by reading through all of that stuff.

 

[Liadan]

http://www.qt.com.au/story/2012/05/04/happy-and-successful-a-portrait-of-allison/

in this report, its say's that police now know Allison was murdered before she was left at Kholo Creek.
.
.
.
....
Another thing that I found interesting was that Allison stopped being a a property manager for one particular property days before she disappeared.

Are we allowed to find out which property - could she have walked in on something perhaps?

 

[linette]

Are we allowed to find out which property - could she have walked in on something perhaps?

I think there was a poster earlier on who said Allison was their friends property manager til a week before she went missing. Then it was said that she had stopped being property manager on a few different properties? Have no idea who posted that though. A few people mentioned it.

 

[The Observer]

Thank you for finding those photos, Makara. They do make me feel sad also. I would never comment on how people live because I know that good people live with some mess, and bad people can live in beautiful homes, so it doesnt show what sort of person you are, by your house. But although I see some nice things here for the girls, it looks quite unkempt. Do you think this is an indication that Gerad Baden Clay really looked after himself, so much more than he thought about making things nice for his family/

IMO it seems to me simply just a sign of kids who've out grown equipment or no longer play with it. I doubt GBC did the lawns himself anyway could've easily paid a lawn mowing service. I mean none of the property is manicured lawn, so to speak, to 'play on' its all that bush type grass/weed/undergrowth.

do you think the bwanas visit to townsville was so they could discuss alibis and things in private with ow, out of earshot from possible surveilance bugs? seems weird to visit when ow was to be visiting them here days later?

Yup. I think they were also probably there to get away from any local attention. Oh to be a fly buzzing around Townsville whilst they were there.

So are we to assume they left the Prado in Townsville? Or offloaded it there to sell?

I found that Alcar and Better Cash Flow have the address of 41 Railway Terrace Milton Qld.

http://www.ozeyes.com/company19262241039/ALCAR FINANCIAL SERVICES PTY LTD & NIGEL BADEN-CLAY PTY LTD

Here's what I found at that address. This property was last sold in 2004, yet the ABN for the company mentioned above was not de-registered until 2009.

View attachment 26033

http://www.onthehouse.com.au/reports/property_profile/1341059/51_Railway_Terrace_MILTON_QLD_4064/

BBM. The address is 41 but the picture says 51. Just curious is that an accidental typo? Sorry was gonna snoop online and just wanted to double check.

 

[Makara]

BBM. The address is 41 but the picture says 51. Just curious is that an accidental typo? Sorry was gonna snoop online and just wanted to double check.

Sorry, my mistake. The correct address is 51.

 

[Makara]

Makara - anyway we can check if the $$ went overseas?

IMO that would involve an audit of their accounts Liadan, something that we're not privvy to. I'm sure that the forensic accountants will be onto it.

 

[linette]

IMO it seems to me simply just a sign of kids who've out grown equipment or no longer play with it. I doubt GBC did the lawns himself anyway could've easily paid a lawn mowing service. I mean none of the property is manicured lawn, so to speak, to 'play on' its all that bush type grass/weed/undergrowth.

I don't think that 5 year old kids outgrow play equipment like this. It's more a case of Daddy not caring how nice the area was for them, I'm sure. If he didn't play there, then it didn't matter to him. People with younger children know that these kind of things tend to stay around and get used with kids at that age.

 

[LauraMars]

I just figured the lawns look long in those pics because Makara said the photos were taken 14th June, which is almost 2 months post Allison's death.

I thought GBC and the girls pretty much moved out of the house to Nigelaine's from day one, apart from maybe a short stint back at the house, as some posters mentioned.

Obviously GBC was too busy running round with his floozies to care much about anything else, so maybe he never bothered much with the garden, but as far as those pics go, I assumed the neglect was more that no one was living there in those 2 months.

 

[Opinionsgalore]

http://www.qt.com.au/story/2012/05/04/happy-and-successful-a-portrait-of-allison/

in this report, its say's that police now know Allison was murdered before she was left at Kholo Creek.
How can they know this? did she have something on her body that came from another location? something that might have been used to kill her previously? like rope or something, sheets? I cant understand what this means, how can they know this?
It also says dumped in a creek not left on the banks. So maybe that is evidence that she was not left at the bridge, but further upstream? Coolcat said they thought they could see in the footage that her hands were tied, too. With what? maybe something from her home, or from the parents home.
I also found a post from Keyboredom that said a forum member has told him that police contacted their partner because they had their number plate from driving through the roundabout. so if they could read that number plate, they would be able to read the number plates on all the cars. Maybe they took the plates off, or maybe they drove through there too, close together like being towed the same as the white and blue car story.

Another thing that I found interesting was that Allison stopped being a a property manager for one particular property days before she disappeared.

Hi Jadalyn.
I've pondered the same thing, and after some posts last week about dogs, I did a little research.
The SES was called in to search for Allison, and from I've read, SES uses various means to search including dogs.
I would imagine that they would use tracking dogs AND cadaver dogs. If the first place they went was Allisons home - which would seem reasonable, it's highly possible that a cadaver dog indicated that it picked up the scent of a dead body that HAD been there: these dogs don't just locate dead bodies, they can actually tell IF a dead body has previously been in a location.


All MOO.

 

[Makara]

I don't think that 5 year old kids outgrow play equipment like this. It's more a case of Daddy not caring how nice the area was for them, I'm sure. If he didn't play there, then it didn't matter to him. People with younger children know that these kind of things tend to stay around and get used with kids at that age.

I agree Linette. I just read GBC's blog waffle again. Man that guy is full of shyte!

http://connect.rpdata.com/379/blog/view/Ensuring-your-home-is-safe-for-Children

6 Dec 2010
Ensuring your home is safe for Children.

Play Equipment
One loose bolt on a set of play equipment has the potential to cause some serious damage to a child. Consider the materials you use to construct the set, with an aim to avoid sharp edges and the possibility of splinters. Also take care to choose a soft landing material for around your play equipment set, such as a rubber floor (indoors) or pinebark or sand (outside).

This next part of the article gave me chills!

Air
Poor air quality in homes can be quite problematic, with various pollutants such as formaldehyde and carbon monoxide building up to unacceptable levels if air flow rates are not above a certain point. This can lead to stuffiness and sneezing for all occupants of the home, not just children. Opening windows (with stay locks to avoid break-ins) is one way to achieve the appropriate air flow level in your home.

Is it possible that Allison was placed in the car unconscious or drugged and then died from carbon monoxide asphyxiation? Carbon monoxide poisoning can be easily picked up by forensics but how long after death would the signs still be visible?

I realise that carbon monoxide is not only found in car exhausts but in many things that could be in and around the house but it still makes me wonder.

BBM.

MOO.

 

[BreakingNews]

I don't think that 5 year old kids outgrow play equipment like this. It's more a case of Daddy not caring how nice the area was for them, I'm sure. If he didn't play there, then it didn't matter to him. People with younger children know that these kind of things tend to stay around and get used with kids at that age.

But it had rained a lot which makes grass grow very quickly. Not sure when the photos were taken, but even after 1-2 weeks, things can become overgrown. Heavy rain can cause twigs and bits of branches to blow down also.

But if the home was not a happy home, then it will naturally look unloved.

 

[The Observer]

I don't think that 5 year old kids outgrow play equipment like this. It's more a case of Daddy not caring how nice the area was for them, I'm sure. If he didn't play there, then it didn't matter to him. People with younger children know that these kind of things tend to stay around and get used with kids at that age.

I am a parent myself so I am aware of these things but I guess what I'm trying to say is it doesnt necessarily mean the girls are "outdoor" types. I know of alot of girls that usually rather play in their rooms with dolls etc. I was just throwing an alternative out there is all. I mean't nothing by it. Also they may not have even been home much to play on them. Between school, dancing, music and apparent regular sleep overs (if true) then they were likely not home to play in the yard a great deal.

IMO I think its possible NBC tended to the yard. IMO there's something about them that makes me feel like he is his son's lacky. Or they regularly paid someone.

But it had rained a lot which makes grass grow very quickly. Not sure when the photos were taken, but even after 1-2 weeks, things can become overgrown. Heavy rain can cause twigs and bits of branches to blow down also.

Exactly. Good point.

 

[The Observer]

I just read GBC's blog waffle again. Man that guy is full of shyte!

http://connect.rpdata.com/379/blog/view/Ensuring-your-home-is-safe-for-Children

Oh indeed. He knows what women want to hear. He's all talk.

Is it possible that Allison was placed in the car unconscious or drugged and then died from carbon monoxide asphyxiation? Carbon monoxide poisoning can be easily picked up by forensics but how long after death would the signs still be visible?

I realise that carbon monoxide is not only found in car exhausts but in many things that could be in and around the house but it still makes me wonder.

BBM.

MOO.

Found this:

Carbon monoxide Odorless and colorless. Non-irritating. Found in car exhausts. It is cumulative - repeated small doses can build up over time. It kills by preventing the blood from carrying oxygen. Symptoms: Initially, dizziness and headaches when exerting yourself, then when at rest too. A higher dose affects coordination and makes the heart throb. Then comes collapse and death. Often the victim is unaware and just drifts slowly to sleep. Post-mortem appearance: Pinky skin. Cherry-red blood. Blood is fluid and doesn't want to clot. Lungs congested and the upper air passages contain a frothy fliud. Carbon monoxide remains in the blood for up to six months after death.

and this:

'Homicidal strangulation will almost always fracture the hyiod bone'.

Interesting read http://www.mitchpileggi.net/Deep_Background/resources/forensics/toxicol.htm Multiple pages to read on various causes of death.

Again this will frustrate alot of us as we go back to the 'no visible signs' on the body according to QPS... But they 'knew cause of death' as soon as she was found debate.

 

[Liadan]

Oh indeed. He knows what women want to hear. He's all talk.



Found this:

Carbon monoxide Odorless and colorless. Non-irritating. Found in car exhausts. It is cumulative - repeated small doses can build up over time. It kills by preventing the blood from carrying oxygen. Symptoms: Initially, dizziness and headaches when exerting yourself, then when at rest too. A higher dose affects coordination and makes the heart throb. Then comes collapse and death. Often the victim is unaware and just drifts slowly to sleep. Post-mortem appearance: Pinky skin. Cherry-red blood. Blood is fluid and doesn't want to clot. Lungs congested and the upper air passages contain a frothy fliud. Carbon monoxide remains in the blood for up to six months after death.

and this:

'Homicidal strangulation will almost always fracture the hyiod bone'.

Interesting read http://www.mitchpileggi.net/Deep_Background/resources/forensics/toxicol.htm Multiple pages to read on various causes of death.

Again this will frustrate alot of us as we go back to the 'no visible signs' on the body according to QPS... But they 'knew cause of death' as soon as she was found debate.

hmm Obbie - very interesting stuff - they so know stuff - but have learnt so much from previous cases that have been scrutinised intensely by the media - Lindy, Morcombes etc stay quiet and let things fall into place!

 

[Keentoknow]

Are we allowed to find out which property - could she have walked in on something perhaps?

That property, and the directions to TMs house that were found in Allisons diary.
He might have needed those directions so that he could go over to her place and feed her pussy while she was away.:floorlaugh:

 

[Makara]

Oh indeed. He knows what women want to hear. He's all talk.



Found this:

Carbon monoxide Odorless and colorless. Non-irritating. Found in car exhausts. It is cumulative - repeated small doses can build up over time. It kills by preventing the blood from carrying oxygen. Symptoms: Initially, dizziness and headaches when exerting yourself, then when at rest too. A higher dose affects coordination and makes the heart throb. Then comes collapse and death. Often the victim is unaware and just drifts slowly to sleep. Post-mortem appearance: Pinky skin. Cherry-red blood. Blood is fluid and doesn't want to clot. Lungs congested and the upper air passages contain a frothy fliud. Carbon monoxide remains in the blood for up to six months after death.

and this:

'Homicidal strangulation will almost always fracture the hyiod bone'.

Interesting read http://www.mitchpileggi.net/Deep_Background/resources/forensics/toxicol.htm Multiple pages to read on various causes of death.

Again this will frustrate alot of us as we go back to the 'no visible signs' on the body according to QPS... But they 'knew cause of death' as soon as she was found debate.

Thanks Observer. I had read about the pinkish skin and bright red blood but I'm not sure how long that colouring lasts on a deceased person. So carbon monoxide stays in the blood for up to six months? Interesting.

I read somewhere just recently that Allison's internal organs were found to be normal except for the brain, which was in an advanced stage of decomposition, which makes me wonder once again about carbon monoxide poisoning. I can't remember whether I read it here on in MSM. I'll go hunting for it later.

Carbon monoxide poisoning can cause physical brain injury/trauma

http://www.carbon-monoxide-survivor.com/carbon-monoxide-poisoning-brain-injury-trauma.html

Physical brain injuries are typically caused by physical impacts. However, carbon monoxide poisoning can cause physical injury from cellular destruction/damage caused by oxygen deprivation.

Toxicology would have picked up carbon monoxide in the blood but we're led to believe that the tox results didn't reveal anything to assist GPS. Whether that is in fact true is another thing altogether. I'm hoping that QPS are just playing their cards close to their chest until the trial.

MOO.

 

[Amee]

Did anyone see 60 minutes tonight and the story on murderers getting their sentences reduced from murder to manslaughter by claiming provocation? Scarey stuff and so, so wrong.