CO- Dylan Redwine, 13, Vallecito, 19 November 2012 - #7

[mck16]

Oh this is not always the case. Many perceive the hiring of an attorney as an admission of guilt, so I'm sure he was reluctant to do so-guilty or innocent. Already people's minds are turning just solely for the fact that he has hired an attorney. It should make no difference. IMO anyone with any common sense would hire an attorney in this situation no matter how innocent they are. It would be foolish not to. The attorney is there to make sure LE stays within the rights of the law and make sure their client does not do anything they shouldn't. Most people don't know all the legal ins and outs. That's why they hire attorneys.
It really infuriates me that people don't understand this. Hiring an attorney is not an admission of guilt and not hiring an attorney does not mean they're innocent.

I had not heard this. When was this released and when did he hire this attorney. tia

 

[Linda7NJ]

So my DH has spoken and he's solved the case
He's been home all weekend, which is rare, and couldn't help but
noticing how much attention I was not paying to him or anything else.
I told him the cliff notes version of what we've been discussing.
He says MR is not guilty of anything because he did not hire a lawyer
until the last few days. The fact that he went in for all those LE
interviews alone is not the acts of a guilty man, in Dh's opinion. I tend
to agree. I said MR would have to be a ) innocent or b ) the most cunning
and arrogant and pridefilled criminal to think he could face LE and make
them believe his story. So I ask to all of you , does MR come across
as arrogant enough to face LE knowing he'd done something, without a
lawyer AND get away with it?

IMO the fact that Dylan parents have been litigating the divorce and custody for 7 years tells me one of them is a narcissist. My money is on dad.


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[Seajay]

Dad must have a cell phone because he said he "tried" to text DR on Monday. The Ipod could belong to Dad for music-listening only (I have the iPad, iPhone and iPod). Depends on how old the IPod is -- newer versions have wi-fi (mine doesn't - I use it strictly for music).

Everything boils down to whether Dad is telling the truth. If he hasn't, then we know what the answer is; if he is being truthful, then LE needs to ascertain this and move forward. It seems to me this case cannot budge until the events of Sunday pm are verified.
I have such a hard time considering a parent could harm/murder his/her child for ANY reason. My mind won't go there in this case. Even if Dad somehow harmed Dylan, I hope that he would have manned up in the beginning. However, the circumstances as we know them look very bad for Dad, and Dylan, of course. I pray that the obvious isn't what occurred. This is heartbreaking.

Where are you, Dylan ?

BBM: Absolutely. I hope he's telling the truth because if he's lying, Dylan is dead and I don't want that to be true. Maybe that's why I keep looking for other reasons for the things we know for sure have happened and try to be patient and wait on what information we don't know yet.

I want Dylan to come home safe and sound. I want to think that a number of other things could be the reason he hasn't been heard from besides the one everyone seems to think it is. If people think I'm being naive at taking the father at his word, it's because I do not want to think that this child is DEAD. Anything else is acceptable to me.

 

[NC Analyzer]

IMO the fact that Dylan patents have been litigating the divorce and custody for 7 years tells me one of them is a narcissist. My money is on dad.


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Or very controlling....or both :banghead:

 

[Pensfan]

Can dad's new attorney, hired to "cover his back", stop the release of the court documents or are those documents considered to be public information? tia

 

[shefner]

Take, for instance, the recent Katrina Smith case. Hubby did not hire a lawyer. Hubby worked with LE...and LE even admitted he had been fully cooperating. Hubby was at the vigil and the searches. Katrina's family stood by hubby completely and publicly. His friends vehemently defended him. Until he was arrested for Katrina's murder.

 

[Tennlyn]

So my DH has spoken and he's solved the case
He's been home all weekend, which is rare, and couldn't help but
noticing how much attention I was not paying to him or anything else.
I told him the cliff notes version of what we've been discussing.
He says MR is not guilty of anything because he did not hire a lawyer
until the last few days. The fact that he went in for all those LE
interviews alone is not the acts of a guilty man, in Dh's opinion. I tend
to agree. I said MR would have to be a ) innocent or b ) the most cunning
and arrogant and pridefilled criminal to think he could face LE and make
them believe his story. So I ask to all of you , does MR come across
as arrogant enough to face LE knowing he'd done something, without a
lawyer AND get away with it?

not exactly the way I'd phrase it, but yea...he does seem like that kind of guy to me.
oh and my DH (my expert on all things tech, male and mountain lion) has also been getting dragged into this case by me ,
he agrees with me, but then I've trained him well

Oh...and he thinks if the cellphone is not getting any signal from any tower and not able to send one back to a tower as well, it will seem to be powered off to the phone company. But if Dylan did go walkabout to find a signal, it would have pinged once he hit one.

 

[Pensfan]

I had not heard this. When was this released and when did he hire this attorney. tia

http://www.upi.com/Top_News/US/2012/12/02/Colorado-youth-missing-two-weeks/UPI-85631354470782/

 

[DylansMom34]

I have a feeling something major is about to happen. An arrest maybe or something definitive from LE. Or maybe I am just overly hopeful.

 

[shefner]

BBM: Absolutely. I hope he's telling the truth because if he's lying, Dylan is dead and I don't want that to be true. Maybe that's why I keep looking for other reasons for the things we know for sure have happened and try to be patient and wait on what information we don't know yet.

I want Dylan to come home safe and sound. I want to think that a number of other things could be the reason he hasn't been heard from besides the one everyone seems to think it is. If people think I'm being naive at taking the father at his word, it's because I do not want to think that this child is DEAD. Anything else is acceptable to me.

My heart wants to believe Dylan is living....my head thinks otherwise.

 

[TxLady2]

I finally decided to skip a couple pages of posts, I hope I didn't miss anything new. Seems like every time I leave for a bit, I come back to 500-1000 new posts to read. :banghead: Anyway, sorry if my post doesn't fit in with the conversation, or repeats something already said (not likely, most people don't think like I do!)

Seeing Salem's posts about someone taking him from the home, and more accepting responses than I got when I suggested something similar, I'm going to try again. Hopefully it will coffer problems from previous ideas - phone, backpack, fishing pole, etc.

...After getting groceries and eating, MR starts heading for home. DR accepts that he has to wait until the next morning to see his friends and sends a text to let them know. They start talking about what they'll do over the week, and DR maybe gets a text or two, so MR tells him to say he'll see them tomorrow and turn off the phone. If he tells him they have to figure out some things, and the service will be getting bad pretty soon - which will drain the battery quickly if it does anything.

DR turns off the phone and they talk for a while. Once they get to the house, DR turns the phone back on to text again, but their no service. He turns it off, lays on the couch to watch tv and falls asleep. MR covers him with a blanket and goes to bed. In the morning, MR gets up and spends about an hour messing around and making noise, but DR doesn't stir. He finally wakes him up enough to tell him that if he wants to go, he has to do it now. DR says he's not ready to get up, so MR says he'll be back around 11 and take him then, and leaves.

A while later, Dylan wakes up, turns the tv back on, digs through the backpack for something (toothbrush?) and eats a bowl of cereal. When he does everything he needs to do in the house, he grabs his stuff and goes outside to go to a spot he's found good reception in the past. When he gets outside, someone drives by and stops. Seeing that MR's car is gone, the guy says he's looking for him and talks to DR for a few minutes. DR tells him he was just going to find a spot with better cell reception and try to find a ride to his friend's place. The guy offers to take him, DR assumes he's a friend of his father and goes, and whatever happens to him happens.

The fishing pole may have already been missing, but MR hadn't noticed, or he may have grabbed it in case they decided to go fishing. He may have never gotten the chance to turn his phone on, and there wouldn't be any sign of forced entry (nobody ever entered the home) or a struggle. So, what did I miss this time?

Not a thing, dear. And it's a nice break from the multitple pages of cell phones, chargers, pings, pods, pads and arguing back and forth.

 

[Seajay]

Why would he go to an old uncapped well or mine? Just curious...

Just as a possibility that he was out wandering around, walking his area, on a lark, just checking things out the way 13 year old boys are apt to do.

He could have been walking out in the wilds and fell into an uncapped well, not that that is where he was specifically heading.

Looking for something besides his father killing him or him being dead somewhere...........

 

[vasportsmom]

Argh! By the time I catch up on this thread we will be on to #8! Then #9 will be here before I know it. Great job sleuthers


We won't give up Dylan!!!!

Just get back over in Morgan's thread. We know what is what there and where all the crazy is hidden, lol.


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[Flutterflies]

An iPod Touch can be used to text and even make calls using Google Voice. I have an 11yo niece that uses hers to FaceTime me pretty often.


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Thanks for posting - was unaware of this. My soon to be 11 yo wants an iPhone but we do not think she is ready for one. She does have a hand me down (remember when those were clothes?) iPod Touch. We will look into Google Voice for her. Thanks again.

 

[NC Analyzer]

BBM: Absolutely. I hope he's telling the truth because if he's lying, Dylan is dead and I don't want that to be true. Maybe that's why I keep looking for other reasons for the things we know for sure have happened and try to be patient and wait on what information we don't know yet.

I want Dylan to come home safe and sound. I want to think that a number of other things could be the reason he hasn't been heard from besides the one everyone seems to think it is. If people think I'm being naive at taking the father at his word, it's because I do not want to think that this child is DEAD. Anything else is acceptable to me.

I think most everyone feels that way.
I've been following these kind of cases for a long time. I NEVER, "don't care" and I'm always enraged, but I probably come across totally opposite of that because I tend to apply critical analysis what is known, combined with my own research and years of personal experience to formulate a pretty quick opinion. Most of the time Occam's Razor and a little bit of gut instinct applies, but it's rare when I don't call it correctly.
The ones that drive me crazy are the truly "unsolved"....Madeline McCann, Kyron Hormon, Holly Bobo, JonBennet Ramsey, to name a few.

 

[Seajay]

SBM

Minor point: we don't know all that was taken from dad's home by LE, other than the iPod and two trucks, but both my iPhone and my iPad work without wifi. FYI

True, caught that. However he would need satellite of some kind, 3G, 4G. And once again, up at my mom's in the mountains where she has zero cell phone reception, she also doesn't have satellite. I bought a hotspot specifically for up there to get satellite or some kind of means to email/get on my computer and I could not get a satellite signal. Zip, zilch, nada.

 

[dogsearch]

I think it's very possible that nobody took this very seriously at first. He's old enough to run away, impatient to see his friends, there are some custody issues. It's not as likely, but possible, that there was just lack of communication when it came to getting a Dylan scented item. Clearly there were some (clothes, a blanket, whatever he had his head on, etc). But it's possible police didn't get that to the search teams, which can be outside resources.

That means it is also possible the first searches were very cursory. Clothes could have easily been washed since then (with people not realizing they'd be needed for scent). Although I doubt the blanket or furniture was washed.

I find it a little odd that LE is asking for pictures of traffic from certain hours which include from the time that Dylan arrived. If they've confirmed Dylan is at the house, then it would be more likely the time span would have been narrowed to that morning. Or if they were looking for just a general list of people passing through the area (as in want to check out people who might have been around to later kidnap Dylan), then I would think the range would be wider. Why only right from his arrival to the father's report? Do they think someone probably followed him from the airport?

Kids leave the TV on. But if he's planning to be with his friends all day, and had the forthought to pack up most of his things as well as grab his fishing pole, why leave the TV and satelight on.

What is the timeout on his dish? Mine defaults at 2 hours, but I changed it. Had it turned itself off? If not, then he'd have been there up to the timer started counting.

I'm not concerned with watching spongebob. He may have turned it on just for noise as he got ready to rush out to be with his friends.

However I am very concerned that he texted or emailed nobody, and emailed nobody (IF a computer was available). Especially if there is spotty coverage. My experience has been that with spotty coverage, you send texts because as the signal comes and goes the texts can eek out (unlike calls) as the signal fluctuates. Or even has you walk into a coverage zone.

Did something say that Dylan hitchhiked often? I know his friends said he wouldn't be afraid to hitchhike at all. But that doesn't mean that he did it. If he had his fishing pole and a full back pack, he probably wouldn't take his bike, or walk. I think you set out with those things even if you plan to get a ride. Or if you are really unprepared (which lends itself to hitchhiking - if he planned to walk and got tired very fast). And who knows if the bike was functional. When I was a kid my chain was always falling off and I was too lazy to put it back on.

However if he hitchhiked bloodhounds would have likely been able to follow him to where the pickup occurred. Bloodhounds can follow the scent left by people who got in a car and drove away. Unless he caught a ride immediately outside his house, I would think there would be some trail of some sort.

I don't have a problem with the lawyer. If he didn't do anything, then he wouldn't want the police to get sidetracked by only looking at him. Getting a noisey lawyer to talk to the media could help with that.

One news article said LE does not consider Mark a suspect. If that is true, than I'm sure they have more info that we do. However I'm wondering if that was just phrased poorly, as other articles say they have no suspects, or nobody is considered being a suspect at this time (versus "ruled out" as a suspect).

I don't see "evil" here. Mark appears hurt and hopeless to me. So if he was involved (which no evidence shows at this point), I think the situation would be more of an accident type thing. Like a teenager was complaining, and something stupid happened. Like if you told the kid "fine, get out of the car and you can walk to your friends in the dark!". And then you can't find him, or he is injured, or he starts to text his mom and you know you'll lose custody or go to jail. Or you go to take away his phone, and he resists so you shove him.

I find Mark's choice of topics unusual. He makes a point of things like saying how Dylan returned safe from the last trip. Ok, so you are trying to point out that you didn't hurt or lose him last time, so you didn't hurt him this time either? That seems like a strange argument.

And I've watched a few interviews, and in those Mark has yet to say what parents who are under suspicion say when people question the suspicions - that he had nothing to do with it, and doesn't know where he is, and Elane I didn't hurt Dylan. Instead he turns the statements around into thoughts of I don't want to talk bad about his mother, and at times like this "we" should be together, and I can't believe someone who you were with for 20 years could say things like that. It's not just the wife that says those things - everyone asks those questions in a case like this and he says he knows that. So why not point out your innocence? Point out passing lie detector tests, or police saying they don't suspect you, etc. Why instead focus on others?

Since Dylan didn't show up at the friends house, or the planned location, at the correct time I have a hard time believing that he didn't:
1. Answer his friend's texts all morning
2. Attempt to contact his friends first thing when he finally did wake up, eat cereal, and watch TV.
3. Attempt to contact his friends as he was leaving. If cell reception is spotty, send a text. If those aren't going through either, use the home phone. Or get on the computer and send an email. But no contact, whatsoever? Was the group planning an activity where they wouldn't leave home all day, so he could arrive anytime without making sure they were there first? i.e. does that friend have a fishing pond in is back yard?
4. Contact his abductor immediately before the abduction to say "go" if the meeting was preplanned, or plan to see his friends when someone was coming to get him purposely.

It's certainly possible that all did happen. He made no contact. His phone was dead. He hitched right outside his home, so no scent was left. Someone scratched themselves in the woods, leaving blood, that the cadaver team hit on. So he was kidnapped by a stranger. A stranger that didn't know a boy would be passing through the area, and just happened to be driving by at the exact time Dylan needed a ride. And happened to have the materials needed to abduct a human (maybe a weapon, tape, rope, etc). He drove away from the scene really fast, so bloodhounds weren't able to follow a scent. Certainly possible. The odds are against this, but I can hope and pray that it did happen and he's being held.

My nervousness comes more from the parents not seeming to be holding out much hope, given their words and appearances.


Originally Posted by dogsearch View Post
I really wanted to believe that Dylan ran away or was being "harbored" by someone who felt they needed to "help" him stay away from what they thought of as an abusive father. Kids tend to exaggerate, and mom probably said the worst about him the father to everyone, so I could totally see someone trying to step in thinking they were helping. Hell, I'd consider it myself if a kid needed it. And I'm one of those people who feels like they could never serve on a jury, because I always feel there is some doubt.

But watching Dylan's fathers interviews just makes my hair stand on end. The words he uses and non-verbal signs have clues in them. Certainly a person's speech, actions, or there demeanor can be misinterpreted. But with his statements I see multiple clues that are typical of someone being dishonest or not forthcoming.

- He is laughing before one interview before he realizes it's live. Even a nervous laugh isn't natural when you are consumed by thoughts of a lost son and are about to go on camera to talk about how to get him back. But the laugh doesn't look like a simple polite laugh to me.

- "Well it's been a tough time for all of us, I know, it ca"
--His voice goes up when saying this. Have someone tell you a truthful statement, and then a lie. Which version has the higher voice?
--It sounds like he is about to say "it can" be something, and then stops mid sentence. He uses "can" and "could" in his interviews. Why talk about what it "could" be like when it IS?
--Mark has a kind of a bob while he talks. when he's is saying things like "your welcome", "how difficult it's been for his mom and his brother", "and his family over the colorado springs area", "I'm doing everything I know how to do", he has some average movement. But when he says certain things he has a huge shake of his head, indicating he may not believe what he is saying: "We are doing everything we can to find dillan" and we "want to keep the focus on dylan", "You know, I've been working with the investigators to make sure that, you know..."
--"He, a, i, was last seen at my house..." - voice goes up alot, and stumbling here trying to say the right thing. The sentence goes on and on and starts to not make much sense, like he's really strugging to make a point and come out with convincing things to say:
--"I know there is rumors going around that he has been spotted by people and n, you know, our concern is that, you know that something has happened, to the point now, that we just, we're...we just want to keep in the public's eye, you know, dylan's face, and keep the focus on dylan, and you know, don't worry about me, and everything (huge head shake here) is going to be alright on my end, that I know this is only a troubling time for elane and my son cory and i spoke with him last night and you know surprised that we haven't been able to hook up today because one of the things we are trying to do is unite, together, and I have my oldest son from the phoenix area and of course my brother is here, so we're trying to unite as a family and stay focused on what is important here and you know...and I saw him ___ and I saw him___ the morning I left to run my errands"... well you can listen to the rest.
- This all sounds to me like a rambling attempt to point blame away from himself, and convince us that his family thinks we need to believe him. And that he needs his son and ex wife to get on board (unite) with the plan.

It seems he is downplaying the situation also. The police say your son is missing, hasn't run away, and cadaver dogs hit on places near his father's home (the father that he was very upset at having to go stay with, and who refused to let him go out with his friends), and that is a "troubling time"? You hear your son's gone missing, and you think for the mother it is "frustrating"? "Devastating", "Painful" is more what comes to mind for me. He really doesn't talk about any of his own emotions whatsoever, and he doesn't seem to take the situation very seriously. Maybe he is medicated???

At this point I'm starting to wonder where his concern is. At this point parents of missing kids are talking to the people at home, telling them what to do ("Please keep his name out there. We are devastated. We need him home. We don't care what happened, we just want him home. Please"). Press interviews are opportunities to get your kid's name out there, and to move people to action. Mark hasn't even mentioned that maybe someone took him, or kidnapped him. He says in another interview that he doesn't feel Dylan ran away (and the police ruled that out). So why no attempt to even ask for his return, if that's pretty much what you are assuming happened?

And he seems like talking the police and providing his home for a search would be a privilege or a chore. If it were my kid I'd have been begging police to go through it with a fine tooth come, over and over and over until they found something. For me they wouldn't have to just ask to search it - they'd have ask to leave it!

"Do you have anything to say directly to Dylan"?
"Dylan my prayers are with you...I love you very much". Not "If you are out there and can, please come home" or "we'll find you", but "my prayers are with you"???? And I would assume they fought when Dylan got there - the kid is 13, is being forced to visit his father against his will, and was prevented from going to a planned playdate by said father that night. No "If there is a problem we can work through it. Please come home"? And he doesn't look at the camera when he talks to hypothetical Dylan - he looks up in the air. It sounds to me like he believes there is absolutely no chance he is actually saying something that Dylan can ever hear.

Then he immediately follows with "He was the light of my life. And he meant everything to me". My heart just dived when I heard this. I feel very strongly the father believes Dylan is dead. I so hope I'm wrong.

You can use this to get out ANY message you want"
Answer - "Well, I know, but I don't want the focus to be mainly on me, I want the focus to be mainly on...". As a parent of a missing child, you now have the chance to beg his captors to let him go, or to encourage the neighborhood to come out and keep looking for him. Instead, Mark seems to immediately think about the reason he decided to the interview (make sure the focus is not mainly on himself).

Maybe Mark thinks Dylan is dead from natural causes (accident in the woods?). I would find this highly unlikely since his body has not been found yet. It seems more likely they got in a fight about seeing his friends and having to stay there. Mark probably felt Dylan was ungrateful. Mark made a point of saying how he "made sure" Dylan got a direct flight on the last trip - I'm sure he had to pay for that, and pay extra for it. And he points out how very important Dylan's friends were and how he couldn't possibly expect Dylan to spend time there without spending much of it with his friends. I think he felt Dylan should be grateful that he brought him out there, but instead a very overtired and cynical Dylan gave him a very hard time. Maybe something happened that Mark knew he was going to be in serious trouble for (like something that would not just lose him the rest of his family, but risk jail time and reputation)?

The fact that multiple cadaver dogs hit on locations nearby means decaying human remains were there. That could just be a drop of blood. But human, since they differentiate human from animal. And they differentiate live from decaying. The fact that the dogs hit on a scent, but there was nothing to show for it, is suspicious to me. Like something was there, but then was removed.

I also notice they don't say anything about wilderness, search, or trailing dogs finding anything. That might be one of the major reasons they say they are confident Dylan didn't run way. He was probably taken from the home via a vehicle. I don't believe Dylan even got out of bed on his own. I think he would have texted his friends first thing.

I wonder if they boy Dylan wanted to meet talked to him, or texted with him.

I found it odd that they they brought in equipment to search every building, but told neighbors to please not go knock on people's doors because it would hinder the search. I've not heard that tactic before. Usually I read about search parties that are purposely formed to knock on every door. That sounds like they are interested in preserving evidence.

I find it very unlikely that a stranger would happen to show up just at the right few hours to kidnap Dylan. So if it was an abduction, a family or friend seems more likely. Yet Mark doesn't mention this as a possibility, or seem angry at someone who might have taken his son. As a bitter husband with a seemingly vindictive wife accusing him of ridiculous things, I'm surprised he doesn't suspect that just maybe she or a family member had a hand in it and is just trying to hurt him.

Mark just seems somber and hopeless. There is no urgency in him whatsoever to find his son, and his words seem strangely detached. He's appears from this early interview to have given up. Why?

I read that his mother and brother have also used past tense. I think the context is a little different (I think her meaning was more of "he WAS learning so much" i.e. doing well and getting out of the rut they were in with he was being raised with his father, UNTIL he was forced deal with his father or the custody dispute stuff.), but I do think she also believes it is unlikely that Dylan is alive, and I do think she suspects the father accidentally hurt him. I think she sincerely hopes otherwise, but doesn't have a lot of hope to go on.

Or maybe I'm just projecting my own feelings there. I sincerely pray I'm very very wrong.

 

[TxLady2]

I definitely don't think what Mom or Dad says is fact. What I'm saying is either Dad did something to him, an abductor got him, an animal got him, there was an accident or he ran away. If he was taken by an abductor in the middle of the night why would Dad lie and say he nudged him in the morning? It's one or the other not both. If the abductor theory is true and Dad lied about seeing Dylan in the morning that would mean that Dad was in cahoots with the abductor. You see what I mean?

He would not have had to be abducted in the middle of the night, it could have been after Dad left that morning and it didn't have to be from inside the house.

For some reason, he had his backpack with him, so that leads me to think he started out somewhere, didn't get very far and something happened.

 

[Seajay]

I have not been able to keep up today (but it makes me happy that so many of us have taken such an interest in the case!). And I hesitate to post about an issue that we have already beaten to death but...

I do not find it odd that Dylan was "out like a light" on Monday morning, despite supposedly going to bed early on Sunday night. He's 13. At least myself and my siblings were all the absolute opposite of a morning person at that age, and could sleep for hours and hours without just hopping out bed refreshed. At that age (and honestly, even now) it wouldn't have mattered how early I went to bed, it would be a struggle for me to get out of bed at 6:30am. But, every teenager is different. His mom is most likely to know whether this sounds like typical Dylan behavior at 6:30am.

JMO

Teenagers need a lot of sleep. Their bodies are growing, their bones are stretching. I remember when my niece and nephew were teens, every time I had a family get together at my house, they'd walk in the door and go climb in one of the beds at my house and sleep the entire day away.

 

[cluciano63]

Without any more info, there really seems to be nothing that has not been hashed out, over and back again. Now we know the habits of all of the teenagers belonging to posters, lol, and I know more about I -phones than I ever wished to know...but nothing more about Dylan, where he could be or what LE really thinks has happened to him.

All I can say is that I hope this is not another one of "those" cases; I tend to be bad luck, I fear, as the cases I have been following for the past two or so years remain in limbo.