weekend break: discuss the latest here #124

[Sleuth5]

Just thinking about how both defense experts denied the negative behaviors that Jodi exhibited in her relationship with Travis...particularly the stalking. Here is what I found on Stalkingriskprofile.com and it boggles my mind with how spot on it is to Jodi.

Rejected stalking arises in the context of the breakdown of a close relationship. Victims are usually former sexual intimates; however family members, close friends, or others with a very close relationship to the stalker can also become targets of Rejected stalking. The initial motivation of a Rejected stalker is either attempting to reconcile the relationship, or to exacting revenge for a perceived rejection. In many cases Rejected stalkers present as ambivalent about the victim and sometimes appear to want the relationship back, while at other times they are clearly angry and want revenge on the victim. In some cases of protracted stalking, the behaviour is maintained because becomes a substitute for the past relationship as it allows the stalker to continue to feel close to the victim. In other cases the behaviour is maintained because it allows the stalker to salvage their damage self-esteem and feel better about themselves.
***Research clearly shows that ex-intimates are far more likely to be violent than other types of stalkers, and victims may have to take different precautions if someone who is very familiar with them is harassing them.****

I found the statement that many stalkers appear to be ambivalent to their victims very interesting since Jodi was always saying how FINE she was that Travis was moving on, and how she wished him the best blah blah blah. It always strikes me funny when she insists that in almost Every interview shes done. Why are so many of these experts glossing over this clearly dangerous pattern of behaviors that Jodi exhibited? What are your thoughts?

BBM. There's no question in my mind that she exhibits all the symptoms of stalking behavior, but I recoil reflexively at any suggestion of a "close relationship" (I know that's not your terminology, but the author's) between these two. The defense foundation rests on some battered/abused nonsense predicated on a "relationship" which never existed other than in the deranged imagination of the defendant.

No matter how many times I hear them repeat the terms of this so-called "relationship" I always come to the same conclusion -- casual sex, sexting, pic exchanges, convenience -- it just doesn't add up to anything remotely approximating an actual romantic relationship. JA constructed that out of whole cloth and served it up via her "journals," which are nothing more than pure fantasy masquerading as an "alibi" for her vicious slaughter of Travis Alexander.

This is just one hot button for me right now. I, like many of you, have had it up to here with all this "relationship" talk. These two had nothing more than a casual fling spread over a five month period. I do imagine that at some point in the beginning Travis might have actually had romantic feelings for JA, but those evaporated quickly when her stalking behaviors escalated (reading his emails, texts, breaking into FB, etc.) He was a human being, starting to hear footsteps regarding his age and marriage, probably felt more than a little inadequate regarding sex given his lack of a partner, and she stepped right in to take care of that deficit and intended to fill the spousal role as well.

Let's not forget -- he made it clear to her where their "relationship" stood early on. She stalked and killed him for it, and not because he strung her along with "I love you's," or anything of the sort. Yet now, that is precisely what she's trying to hang her at on as an excuse. I think if I hear one more retelling of the Virgin Jodi's shameful treatment at the hands of boorish old TA I am going to absolutely explode. Puhhhhhhleeeeeeeze. She all but carried a kit wit her everywhere she went in preparation for being "spun around," as she liked to put it (for entirely unconsensual and largely unpleasant sexual acts.) I can take no more. :furious::furious::furious:

Okay, end of rant. :seeya:

 

[rose222]

there's no reason to address him as Mr. Martinez either :facepalm:

At one point she said Mr., waited for a bit and then said Martinez.

It sound like MISTER (like hey there Mister!) and then she added the Martinez.

 

[thefragile7393]

Who's eating ice cream???? I found the most ah-mazing ice cream at my local grocery store.

Bourbon Vanilla Bean made by Silver Moon
Tennessee Bourbon and Real Vanilla Beans

Love!!!!!

I need to try this! Although via icecreamsource.com

Sent from my SGH-T989 using Tapatalk 2

 

[SallyLu]

I posted this on another thread earlier.

My apologies if these details have been mentioned before.

ALV is no shrinking violet - no pun intended - as at college she was the leader in lots of groups and was Queen of - argghh I forget.

She has also been married.

Her old fashioned and dressed down appearance to me is intentional. She's no dummy but a narcissist building an image for you to buy into.

All public information from Ancestry.com

 

[Sleuth5]

Well I'm from Arizona so it's only 11pm here And this is my first day posting so I'm a little yakky!

:welcome: :seeya:

 

[ricky_ticky]

Please, wise sleuthers, give me your insight into this question - (playing devil's advocate here)

Assuming that JA was a victim of DV and she was attacked by TA that day and she viciously murdered him while in a fog that made her unaware of the extreme cruelty of her actions - why, then, the extensive attempts at cover up?

Things like deleting photos, washing sheets, mopping up blood, washing off body, putting a knife in the dishwasher, removing evidence, placing camera in the washing machine, locking a door, penning up the dog, calling and leaving messages later, going to meet RB and pretending nothing is wrong, contacting the family, etc etc etc. These are the actions of a mind clearly bent on covering up the truth.

How is all of that related to accusations of dv? Are we supposed to believe those are actions taken under the onus of PTSD? If JA was in a fog that day, or suffered extreme trauma how on earth was she able to go about her business so methodically, (admittedly making critical errors.) I'm trying to put myself in that situation and I really don't think I'd be capable of stripping a bed, running a load of laundry or a dishwasher, and certainly wouldn't be thinking about my dna.

 

[Sleuth5]

Today, 12:06 AM
usnuzuloose usnuzuloose is online now
Registered User

Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 29
This is just my opinion, but I believe AL was hired to coach Jodi to defend herself against men. She was also taught about Snow White being abused. That picture was put out long before we knew that AL used that in her lectures. I mean there is not much this woman could do but go buy the things she read. Her and Jodi were mirror images of each other on the stand, almost word for word, how they spoke to Juan and anything else in between.
________

This is the post from previous thread I bring forward that deserves a response.

Someone on here said that JA drew a picture of Snow White with a black eye. Is this true? I didn't follow this case from beginning to end but wouldn't that be something? JA may have thought in her mind that Snow White would come to her rescue.

ITA. ALV's behavior on the stand is just a bit too reminiscent of JA's -- and given that ALV also offers training on how to handle courtroom questioning, it seems a bit too close for coincidence. On the other hand, they may both share a common narcissistic personality profile as well. :facepalm:
:cow:

 

[thefragile7393]

It's more than sad, isn't it? I hope that Travis' family was asked and turned down sleazy Phil. It angers, but doesn't surprise me that SA would cash in. I have had a bad feeling about that woman(x2) and her disquieting affect since I laid eyes on her. I did not have the same feeling about JA's dad.

I doubt he asked T's family....for some reason. They may have said yes had he asked. I would have a hard time turning it down if I was desparate to get to this trial (if I was somehow involved). He preys on the desparate though. Would I sell my soul to him? I don't honestly know what i would do in that situation.

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[PattyMI]

Brought over from closed thread:

Posted by: SassyMom

It's going to be very tasty and delicious when Juan starts plugging Jodi's abusive/manipulative behavior into AL's little Aggression Continuum chart, especially because I seriously doubt she even analyzed those behaviors, and maybe the defense didn't even clue her in about them.

That is going to be a supremely pleasurable viewing experience.
=======================================================


YES. Thank You. Very well said. :goodpost:And :welcome: to WS.

Did you see how hard she resisted owning any of that silly continuum. She treated it like a freakin hot potato. She wanted nothing to do with it. Which was funny since we saw it pasted on the wall for seven tedious, torturous days already. JW LOVED to plug Travis into it and have serious discussions about it's importance and relevance, as if it had any.

And then as soon as Juan asked her about it she pretended like she put no stock in it at all. :giggle: :giggle: She knows whats coming and she is trying to postpone the inevitable. Juan's coming for ya, Alyce. illowfight:

Yes, Katydid, I got that exact impression also about how she resisted owning her all important aggression continuum guideline. Then she minimizes its importance once Juan starts his cross. If you noticed it, I noticed it, does she think the jury didn't notice it? What? Does Alyce think she's going to use reverse psychology on Juan?

BTW, I read yesterday that she is not appearing at her speaking engagement today due to attendee outrage - LMAO! HAHAHA Alyce! Yeah, no SH__! She'll probably just take the money and run, and become a recluse since she's ready to retire anyway.

 

[kayice]

Did you hear Alyce sing like 'Snow White' in part 2 of that video? LOL! I also didn't realize she asked Juan if he wanted to play her 'Was Snow White a Battered Woman' in open court either, well...that would have been PR for Alyce. Of course, she wanted that!

 

[dog.gone.cute]

:seeya:

If anyone wants a "break" from this case, the ID Channel show "Disappeared" is coming on at 9:00 CST -- it is about the Bob Harrod case which the WS here have worked hard on !

 

[Mykeru]

Last night, I was reading on the Justice for Travis FB site ...

OMG ... I was absolutely :furious: when I saw the recent "scoop" about Dr. Phil and Jodi Arias !

This is despicable what he is doing for the murderess Jodi !

- Phil's producer visited Jodi twice in jail per the visitor log.

- Phil paid a "license fee" for photos and videos -- "license fee" ? riiiiiiiiiiiight !

- Phil is paying for Jodi's family expenses while in Airzona -- what about the VICTIM TRAVIS and HIS FAMILY ?

- Phil is paying for "daily notes" taken by Jodi's mother during the trial -- OFGS -- she sits there laughing and smirking -- who in the hello would be interested in her notes !

This is an absolute insult to Travis and his Family !

:moo:

You ever notice on the Maury show, when they are doing paternity testing, and they have some woman on who has gone through 10 tries to find the father (which you can read as ten tries due to confusion or ten false claims) and yet another guy gets dragged into this, he gets booed. Now, I'm hoping all this is staged, but even if it is, what are they selling? Well, even after false claim after false claim there's yet one more guy to shame, to tell "be a man" to "step up" while shaming the woman is absolutely forbidden even if she hopped from bed to bed with the frequency of a microwave oven and getting serial knocked-up in a society where birth control is safe, cheap and readily available.

I have no idea of the sociological implications of this, but it's obvious that the Maury show is making bank appealing to a certain day-time TV-watching demographic.

Dr. Phil is just the same thing. He's either a "while knight" who makes a career out of validating stupid people provided they are the right gender or just pandering in general and would appeal to Klansmen if that's where the ratings came from.

And if there is an arms race of pandering for ratings through appealing to a certain demographic, what better way to show your "it's never your fault girls" validation street cred by defending someone so gawd-awful guilty that even people burning in the 9th circle of Hell with disgraced televangelists feel embarrassed for her.

As I said before, if Jodi Arias was a 300 lb black guy who stabbed his girlfriend once, he (she) would have been quietly convicted and executed with nary a blip on the media radar.

 

[Sleuth5]

I happened to be listening to old testimony and the sex tape is on the one I'm watching. Listening to Travis talking sexy to Jodi, I get some new impressions. The first one is--why should we believe that this tape was made because Jodi was going along with Travis? Why can't it be that Jodi was the one who wanted him to say things to get her off? He's the one doing most of the talking it seems. Is that because he likes his own sexual fantasies or because he is trying to get her off?

Maybe a combination of both, but this whole sexual aggressor thing with Travis is a stretch because, frankly, he sounds like he doesnt know how to have sex talk. He sounds like a novice. And that bit about him never jacking off before Jodi? I think he's just saying that to make her hot, and it's not necessarily asserted as fact in the matter (or whatever JW always says when JM objects.) Some think Jodi had planned to blackmail him with this tape, which is even more reason for him to have the impression that he was doing it for her. She could have told coaxed him into it before she started recording.

I am one who believes that Travis had sex with other women and perhaps before Jodi. I don't really ascribe to a person being 100% moral in their religion even though they strive to be, so I can imagine it was hard for Travis to get sex while living in the ward and being so overly cautious about who saw what going on at his house.

I think that's one of the main reasons he kept Jodi around so long despite how difficult she was. He could get the sex in secret. She was trained to let it stay secret, and he could still appear upstanding as a Mormon. Easy as a pizza delivery. But, he just picked the crazy chick, plain and simple.

BBM A thank you was insufficient,Wasn't Me. Great post.

I too have always believed that the reason we hear Travis saying the things he does is that he has been given a framework within which to operate. That is, Jodi made it clear to him what sort of things to say to "turn her on," and he is parroting them. You can tell by the robotic quality of his voice as he constructs "his" fantasies with her. I never believed that nonsense about her simply "going along with him." You're quite right that it had to be the other way around.

Now, I'm not saying the guy was an angel. You never know what people will or won't say when engaging in sexy talk. But there's no way you're going to convince me that this particular guy would have opened up a can of filthy sex talk with some woman unless he knew she wanted to hear what he was saying. The sex tape always stunk to high heaven to me. He did not know she was recording him. She set him up deliberately, and that included all sorts of coaching -- "Ooh, I like it when you talk about tying me up and forcing me," that kind of thing. I'm convinced.
:cow:

 

[pinkie60]

Nothing would surprise me. But what happened to the Mom since that police interrogation? Seems like a different woman. Didn't the Mom try to sell letters to a daily rag?

i've turned into a real cynic. I think mom was acting in the police interrogation and both mom and dad were planting seeds for an insanity defense.

 

[DebinGA]

ITA. ALV's behavior on the stand is just a bit too reminiscent of JA's -- and given that ALV also offers training on how to handle courtroom questioning, it seems a bit too close for coincidence. On the other hand, they may both share a common narcissistic personality profile as well. :facepalm:
:cow:

In Steely Dan's two video clips above of ALV beginning her Snow White schtick she's very relaxed and funny in a low-key way. She appears to be speaking at eye-level to a very small group (not shown) in a small meeting room. Thank goodness that likable Alyce stayed home and sent smug, condescending ALV to Phoenix in her place.

 

[LambChop]

To get rid of Jodis' scent?:facepalm: IIRC, the crime scene photos show the bed stripped. The only thing on the bed was the mattress cover and I believe the comforter was in a pile on the floor next to the bed. I wonder if Travis had planned on putting the sheets in the dryer after he got out of the shower but instead were put in there by Jodi who discovered they were in there when she went to put the towels and clothes of Travis' in after the murder.

Sometime between the time when Travis' roommate came home with his girlfriend at 3pm then left around 4, and when the other roommate came home that evening, Travis had pulled out the floor cleaner. He could have put the sheets and duvet cover in the washer at that time. He had a conference call coming in around 6 or 7pm and one or two roommates who'd be coming home so I imagine he wanted Jodi out of there before 6pm. This could be why we see her fully dressed in the pictures. He may have actually thought she was gone.

I never could get why she claims Travis brought in all her things (computer, backpack, cameras, suitcase, etc.) when she was only suppose to stay for a couple of hours and then head up to Utah. Jodi could have very well called Ryan from Travis' house. She knew what time he was expecting her and she knew her phone was off. Jodi could have even asked Travis to borrow his phone to call Ryan. Not as if she can't deleted the number afterwards so he would not know who she was calling.

The fact is all these coincidences are way too many to be just that. Truth does not have versions and doesn't suddenly change just because you get caught in a lie.

Listening to the angry texts from Travis I now think, without a doubt, that the stabbings took place first. Stabbing is personal. It gives the killer a chance to see something in the eyes of the victim that are not visible with shooting them in the head to kill them. Shooting in the head is intended to end their life. Stabbing is a slower process with the victim knowing they are about to die and giving the killer a chance to savor the experience. This is who Jodi is. We can see this in her when she was on the stand being crossed by Juan. We can see it in her blank stare when she's caught in a lie. We look into the eyes of Jodi and what we sometimes see is evil.

 

[Sleuth5]

Do we have OCD?

Any "shrinks" here now?

Some of us may wonder at times, "why am I spending so much time with this?" Yet seem powerless to stop!

Do we have OCD or what???

Yes I know most of us want to see justice done and so on, but still....

Speak for yourself. I need to answer about 400 posts before 9:00, but first I've got to arrange the table next to me so that my coffee cup is exactly centered on the pattern of the mat. It's probably going to take longer to straighten up the paper clip drawer so that all of the paper clips are facing exactly the same way. And I've notice that it's been nearly five minutes since I've checked the end of the thread to see if anyone responded to my posts.

Let me know how your psych survey comes out.

:seeya:

 

[indycornstalk]

Dr. Phil show needs to be BOYCOTTED. This is just SO disrespectful on so many level and shows this man has NO respect for the REAL VICTIM and that is Travis and his family. He is a sell out and would rather get ratings than do the right thing.

Dr Phil Production Company is paying for #JodiArias Family living expenses.
Hotel and food TRAVEL for the last 94 days in Arizona

Excuse: paying MOM Sandra for her daily NOTES she writes while trial testimony takes place.

Dr Phil paid license fee for photos and video of Arias Family

Dr. Phil producer visited Jodi 2 times in jail so far per jailhouse visitor log

Dr Phil paid Cindy Anthony $600,000.00 for her interview after the trial
As for Cindy Anthony's Charity. ITS CLOSED 90% of the $600k went to ADMINISTRATIVE COST = FACT

http://www.nonprofitquarterly.org/p...d-dr-phil-give-600000-to-anthony-charity.html

 

[pip]

Somebody PM'd me yesterday asking what ALV was talking about in this video. I told them I hadn't really figured it out. So I just watched it again and this is what I think she's saying about Jodi. I think JM's analogy is quite good on this.

IMO, ALV sees Jodi as a young woman who came from an abused background. She was trying to escape her troubled family life by trying to establish a safe normal family life for future children. (watch the last two minutes of the second video.)

Then she met the evil dark lord Travis Vader. He took Jodi's dream and played with it to his advantage. Using her as a :censored: toy. He led her to thinking that she would attain that perfect life and that by satisfying Travis' sexual peccadillos she would gain ground on the competition.

When she learned on that fateful day that TA was so abusive that he'd kill her she snapped and all of the pent up aggression came flooding out while the fog settled in. I think she believes this is normal in over 95% of the cases in DV.

I just want to reemphasize that's ALV's theory, IMO, and not mine.

Alyce seems to be myopic in her understanding of what DV is. She didn't, as far as I know, interview any of TA's family or friends. That might have cast Jodi in a bad light and make her confused and start thinking JA wasn't the sweet little abused kid she claimed to be. JMO

There was no need to interview anyone else. She was paid for her specific testimony. If she were honest and unbiased she would have needed to interview others to attain the full view picture of JA (knowing that JA was such a liar). She didn't. I doubt her family would have told the truth about her at this point anyways, but it is still pretty obvious ALV is just paid to give the DT what they want. Shameful.

 

[Clue Finder 55]

Wouldn't This Be Cool

If Jodie is convicted of first degree premeditated murder and gets the death penalty.
Now after she is convicted Juror # 5 did a press release and said she was totaly on Jodi's side and would have held out for a hung jury.
That would make Jodi's head explode knowing her only hope was the juror #5 her and her defense team had kicked off.
If I was juor #5 I would say that even if it wasn't true just to leave her with the thought that the only person that could save her was kicked off the jury by the defense team and Jodi.
It would be a thought Jodi would have to live with everyday for the rest of her life ( as long as that might be).