State rests rebuttal case- thread #163

[ElleElle]

Gotcha! I get the donor card thing.

Harvesting a Death Row inmate would be very similar to they do in Asia and the Middle East. However, with that people sell the organs for heroin habits but others are ripped open in the middle of the street.

As much as it would be considered torture, the rule "eye for an eye" is not applicable here. moo

I'm not sure that you still understand what organ harvesting is.

Let's say a person is killed in a motorcycle accident and is brought in to the hospital dead (within a certain period of time -- I'm not exactly sure of the window of opportunity). If he has a donor card (or if his survivors are on hand), the transplant team removes or 'harvests' any useful organs and prepares them to be received by a needy patient.

Emmi's point was that another poster was suggesting that death row prisoners should have their organs 'harvested' involuntarily while they are still ALIVE -- like strapping them down and taking their kidney, or cornea, or part of their liver, etc. ! The prisoner would not necessarily die from the procedure and could be made to have as many as possible.

 

[Dana]

I'm not sure that you still understand what organ harvesting is.

Let's say a person is killed in a motorcycle hospital and is brought in to the hospital dead (within a certain period of time -- I'm not exactly sure of the window of opportunity). If he has a donor card (or if his survivors are on hand), the transplant team removes or 'harvests' any useful organs and prepares them to be received by a needy patient.

Emmi's point was that another poster was suggesting that death row prisoners should have their organs 'harvested' involuntarily while they are still ALIVE -- like strapping them down and taking their kidney, or cornea, or part of their liver, etc. ! The prisoner would not necessarily die from the procedure and could be made to have as many as possible.

:doh: Well, no WONDER people were having a conniption fit over this. I can't even imagine how this was even being debated since it would be against the law. I was under the assumption that the inmate would be already dead.

 

[Mrs G Norris]

Well it's obvious you need me to do an intervention on you so sit back and LISTEN to the advice of an old woman ok?

First off, don't give your right arm away or you won't be able to do this: :seeya:

Secondly, it's really only natural to fantasize about a man who is completely inaccessible to you. Travis Alexander has passed away and you don't get to see all of his trivial failings as a human being, which was what he was...a human being.

He was not a saint, or perfect or an angel he was a human being. He had his personality traits as well. We ALL DO.

Now, on to this statement you've made here which I have bolded: "I'm just angry that I'll never get to meet a wonderful man like Travis."

We need to work on your perception as to why you think you will never meet a wonderful man. There ARE wonderful men out there. (And when you find any I want you to call me immediately :floorlaugh

I'm JOKING. But there are wonderful men out there and you are only 33 holy smokes what I would do to go back to my 30's. Heh, heh...I'd be a rich woman.

I've been around the block more times than Girl Scouts selling cookies and I'm here to tell you to GET OFF the dating sites. Go get into life!! Join some kind of club that goes hiking or boating or fishing or something where men with shared interests will be.

Try selling fresh bread at the farmer's market, men LOVE fresh bread.

I LOVE this!!! Great advice!!

Can I just ad:

And yes get off single sites and go out .. Have a few affairs with men you'd never marry like an artist or a musician. I was 40 when I met Mr Norris .. I was having an affair with an artist at the time .. Mr N was a friend .. We hung out for months as just friends .. That only happened because I didn't see him as a potential partner so I think the whole thing's pretty random. Why are affairs important? Because you get your 'needs' met while you're clocking up experience but you're not getting your heart broke and needing it mended constantly! Sow your wild oats and have fun so you've got stories to look back on when you're sitting on the couch getting fat with your future hubby

P.S. affairs with single men only of course ..

 

[Katie-L]

I did a quick search to see if anyone else has pointed this out... didn't see anything, so here goes.

Jodi Arias is still obsessed with Travis, even now as she conceptualizes her prison artwork.

Right now, on her art website (won't post the link, don't want to give her free advertising) there is a piece that she did titled "Blissful Ignorance." It shows a woman's lips with a blue pill clasped between her teeth.

Well, any film fans out there would instantly recognize the blue pill vs. red pill dilemma from the movie The Matrix. Choose the blue pill, you continue living in the fabricated world of the matrix, in "blissful ignorance" of the real world that exists outside of the matrix... to see the real world, you have to take the red pill.

So there's no doubt that her drawing refers to the iconic film The Matrix.

Now, let's look at one of Travis' blog entries--this one entitled "Why We Are Here."

Quoting Travis: "We Only live once, we dont get another shot if we screw it up. Why not live life to the fullest. On our death bed, none of us will wish they watched more TV or read more tabloids or liste to foul music, and they certainly wont wish that they blamed there lives on someone else a liitle more.

"It is my prayer that we live all the days of our lives. That we will be brave enough to unplug from the matrix and let the greatness within us manifest to all the world so that you will provide courage for others to do the same. Then can you live an abundant fulfilling life with out regret. A life that most are afraid to even dream about. I know that such a life exist. That it is intended for all of us."

So his blog entry is undoubtedly about the movie The Matrix.

SNIP....

...eh..... how do you know that idea didn't originate with Jodi? Travis and Jodi dated (like in a major way). They remained secret lovers long after their public relationship was over.

They likely shared many ideas.

Us people tend to get our ideas from the people in our lives.... just sayin.

 

[ElleElle]

Very powerful! Good catch on The Matrix connection. Yes. Jodi could ultimately believe she is the superhuman.

I did a quick search to see if anyone else has pointed this out... didn't see anything, so here goes.

Jodi Arias is still obsessed with Travis, even now as she conceptualizes her prison artwork.

Right now, on her art website (won't post the link, don't want to give her free advertising) there is a piece that she did titled "Blissful Ignorance." It shows a woman's lips with a blue pill clasped between her teeth.

Well, any film fans out there would instantly recognize the blue pill vs. red pill dilemma from the movie The Matrix. Choose the blue pill, you continue living in the fabricated world of the matrix, in "blissful ignorance" of the real world that exists outside of the matrix... to see the real world, you have to take the red pill.

So there's no doubt that her drawing refers to the iconic film The Matrix.

Now, let's look at one of Travis' blog entries--this one entitled "Why We Are Here."

Quoting Travis: "We Only live once, we dont get another shot if we screw it up. Why not live life to the fullest. On our death bed, none of us will wish they watched more TV or read more tabloids or liste to foul music, and they certainly wont wish that they blamed there lives on someone else a liitle more.

"It is my prayer that we live all the days of our lives. That we will be brave enough to unplug from the matrix and let the greatness within us manifest to all the world so that you will provide courage for others to do the same. Then can you live an abundant fulfilling life with out regret. A life that most are afraid to even dream about. I know that such a life exist. That it is intended for all of us."

So his blog entry is undoubtedly about the movie The Matrix.

There's no point to this post, I guess, other than to point out that Jodi's art reflects knowledge of an aspect of a film with which Travis was familiar. Here we are, five years after his murder, and she's still enamored with his interests.

There's a huge messianic theme to the movie, but I won't go into that but to ask the rhetorical question of whether or not Jodi has some grand delusion that she's "The One" and, as she faces death, that she is making some sacrifice for humankind. Ridiculous, I know, but who knows what's in her mind. She cares enough about the film to create a piece of artwork about it, so...

 

[verbonica]

Gotcha! I get the donor card thing.

Harvesting a Death Row inmate would be very similar to they do in Asia and the Middle East. However, with that people sell the organs for heroin habits but others are ripped open in the middle of the street.

As much as it would be considered torture, the rule "eye for an eye" is not applicable here. moo

Actually, the rule "an eye for an eye" was first instituted by the Code of Hammurabi (and later in Hebrew law) to limit overly harsh vengeance. No more than an "eye for an eye" is how it was proscribed.

Eye for an eye - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[pufnstuf]

...eh..... how do you know that idea didn't originate with Jodi? Travis and Jodi dated (like in a major way). They remained secret lovers long after their public relationship was over.

They likely shared many ideas.

Us people tend to get our ideas from the people in our lives.... just sayin.

Well, considering that his blog entry was created five years before her drawing, I'd say that he related to the movie before her.

Also considering the fact that she's a personality leech who seems to morph her ideas to fit those of the person with whom she's obsessed... I'd guess that his relation to the movie preceded hers.

 

[Emmi]

:doh: Well, no WONDER people were having a conniption fit over this. I can't even imagine how this was even being debated since it would be against the law. I was under the assumption that the inmate would be already dead.

Snort. These kind of debates, arguments, etc. sometimes take place over several pages, and many hours/days, don't they? It takes a lot of time and energy to "drill down" to where it all started!

 

[ElleElle]

This is interesting...

The concept of an eye for an eye is generally distinct from its application. In the context of homicide it generally only applies to murder or intentional killings despite the fact that a negligent homicide also results in the loss of a person's life. This application implicitly recognizes that the mens rea element of the crime rather than the actual harm to the victim will ultimately determine the application of an eye for eye justice.

Actually, the rule "eye for an eye" was first instituted by the Code of Hammurabi (and later in Hebrew law) to limit overly harsh vengeance. No more than and "eye for an eye" is how it was proscribed.

Eye for an eye - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Sedonia Sunset]

I'm watching trial Day 10 right now. It's the day we got to know what a charming wheeler-dealer Gus Searcy is (not to mention how much of a legend in his own mind he is). There was a shot of the gallery and I noticed that Jodi's aunt was sitting BEHIND her sister, rather than right next to her. Wow, they look SO much alike. That got me to thinking ... Do they ever switch off and pretend to be one another in court? Would the jury realize it, or would they notice subtle differences?

I can see how that would come in handy just to give one another a break for a while and still be seen as a loving (not to mention long-suffering) mother who never or rarely misses a day in court, despite the fact that her daughter is a vengeful, spiteful, conniving, pathologically lying, mother-and-dog-kicking homicidal sociopath.

I can see where being an identical twin can come in handy on occasion.

 

[MeeBee]

Reading this debate did remind me of the movie Never Let Me Go. I loved it. I should read the book. I like sad, haunting books. For some reason my favorite books are ones with very tragic endings.

Yes, I can see that, to this day, Jodi is still obsessed with Travis. It is just so tragic and creepy. It's like Travis is still a person to be controlled and manipulated and owned by her and her only, even in death.

 

[ElleElle]

BBM~ :floorlaugh: :floorlaugh:

Well, considering that his blog entry was created five years before her drawing, I'd say that he related to the movie before her.

Also considering the fact that she's a personality leech who seems to morph her ideas to fit those of the person with whom she's obsessed... I'd guess that his relation to the movie preceded hers.

 

[Dana]

Snort. These kind of debates, arguments, etc. sometimes take place over several pages, and many hours/days, don't they? It takes a lot of time and energy to "drill down" to where it all started!

I agree. I still can't understand how it was ever a debate/argument since harvesting can NOT be done while someone is alive. Why even talk about it? We don't live in an extreme 3rd world country.

Next time before I question, I'm going to sift through the 1 million pages and posts to find the original post made beforehand. So, if I don't answer for months, that's why LOL!! Actually, I'm too lazy for that so I'll just stay out it all

 

[Curious Me]

Some people who receive the death penalty thank the warden. This polite guy did.


Texas inmate shouts 'Wow' during execution

Just before the lethal drug took effect and at the conclusion of his statement, Cobb twisted his head back, raised it off a pillow placed on the gurney and then toward the warden standing behind him.

"Wow!" the inmate exclaimed in a loud voice. "That is great. That is awesome! Thank you, warden! Thank you (expletive) warden!"

http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/04/26/17935113-texas-inmate-shouts-wow-during-execution?lite=

 

[gwenabob]

Snort. These kind of debates, arguments, etc. sometimes take place over several pages, and many hours/days, don't they? It takes a lot of time and energy to "drill down" to where it all started!

What? Someone thought "harvesting" meant removing organs from the living? As in "not brain dead?" I don't think anyone was advocating that!

But like I said earlier, you cannot harvest organs from someone who is put to death. A person needs to have a beating heart, and no brain activity.

 

[gauntlet]

Oh yeah, who is doing closing arguments Nurmi or Wilmott?

I've no idea. At least we'll find out very soon. :rocker::rocker: Knowing the DT read here, it's very hard to not put who I don't think should do it as the person who I think should

 

[josie1986]

Re the organ donation debate...

What if the person dies in prison and has consented to have all their viable organs donated?

Im sorry but if me or my children are dying and the only way to be saved is a transplant, I do not care where It comes from as long as I/they would get to live.

This is just one of the articles I found

http://vitals.nbcnews.com/_news/201...ations-from-prisoners-nearly-250-sign-up?lite

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2

 

[KandyKane]

ITA but isn't the dragging pic taken in the bathroom?

No. It was taken in the hallway where she slit his throat which is why that big pool of blood soaked the carpet. After slitting his throat she turned him from his side onto his back and dragged him by his feet down the hallway and back into the bathroom. That photo shows her standing over him while he was on his side with her foot close to his head actually in the act of either just having completed slitting his throat or in the process of it enough for that much blood to flow from his neck down the back of his shoulder and start pooling on the carpet.

If you look at the crime scene photos there is a photo of that big blood stain just at the end of the tiled hallway to where it opens up into his bedroom. He had managed to get himself all the way down that hallway and had his throat slit where the carpet of his bedroom began so that big pool of blood soaked into the carpet and couldn't be cleaned up.

In order to drag him all the way back down the hallway to the bathroom it is believed she flooded the floor with water in order to make him slide easily along the tile floor. There is another crime scene photo that shows a cardboard box he had on the floor with a dried stain of water and blood from the bottom of the box where it rested on the floor that the cardboard soaked upward a good couple of inches before stopping and drying out. I think that's what she used that cup for that was found in the shower with Travis's body... she used it to fill with water to dump on the floor to make it easier to drag him back down the hallway and back into the bathroom to stuff him back into the shower stall. I believe she threw that cup into the shower with his body to clean it of blood and any of her fingerprints or DNA. This is another reason why I believe he was dead when she shot him in the bathroom. Not only would it have taken time to drag him back to the bathroom to shoot him it also would have taken extra time for her to go get that cup and fill it a few times to dump water on the tile floor of the hallway. Sine the ME found no blood in his sinuses from the gunshot wound he likely bled out from the throat slit at the end of the hallway and died while she was busy filling the cup with water and dumping it on the floor several times and then dragging him back down the hallway and into the bathroom. He had already lost a great deal of blood from all the stab wounds before that slitting of his throat occurred.

Incidentally, the tile in the bathroom was the same tile used in the hallway. I think some people believe that photo with her foot in it was taken in the bathroom because the tile is the same as the bathroom tile not realizing that the hallway tile was the same as the bathroom tile.

 

[Curious Me]

Staying out of that conversation. Too tired to think.

But, if Jodi happens to hear a crazy rumor that people are planning to swipe her organs, she might finally have some real fear.

"Mark my words, no jury...."

Good Night All who are still awake........fftobed:

 

[ATasteOfHoney]

I was yelling @ the screen when she paused for so long
"You know where we are, right? You know why we are here, right?"[/QUOTE]

BBM: Not that I feel sympathetic towards JW but this is the stuff that worries me the most about JW.....she truly is over her head a lot and it shows. There is a lack of confidence, lack of flow to her mannerisms in court, and she will not be able to sustain herself in her chosen profession for long without causing herself undo duress, moo. And now she has encountered her biggest monster which is not her ineptitude, it is JA. I predict JW will soon start to see the tip of the iceberg of the problem once the verdict is announced. I say "hello JW, your problems have only just begun!"

It seems like a challenge for JW to do her job competently and that takes a toll on a person. She doesn't have the smarts or fortitude. Her demeanor in the courtroom leaves me feeling slightly embarassed for her......or at least a tad uncomfortable. Like watching a rowdy teenager stick his hand into the lion's cage at the zoo.

And the last straw will be the rage and revenge that JA will unleash upon you for years, JW. How do you like them apples?