George Zimmerman /Trayvon Martin General Discussion #13 Thursday July 11

[SilkySifaka]

Looks like she won't include Felony Child Abuse....don't really know.She will give West time to look at it...I think IMO
She hasn't ruled yet.

I agree it won't come in from the way she is talking about it

 

[DIBSY]

Sad that people forget Trayvon was a child, defined by US Law....not by anything else. The prejudice against him is breathtaking in that Court Room. IMO

 

[Just K]

One very honest question:
I know that all law abiding, mentally sound adults have a right to carry a concealed weapon, in Florida but I must ask...
What is the motivation...why do people feel the need to arm themselves with a CONCEALED weapon (to the grocery store, to the car wash, to the dog park, to the whatever)....What the heck do they fear so much that they need to carry a weapon everywhere except the bar, court rooms, police departments, banks, etc?

I ask WHY?

 

[Donnareit]

There are a lot of things that are not against the law but still can provoke anger or discord or ill feelings. A husband can cheat on his wife, or vice versa which is not against the law but look at what can happen. I'm just using that as an example of "not against the law but not a good idea to do. I can go out and provoke someone into a fight to the point of where they may even throw the 1st punch, then I get my butt kicked, kill them in self defense and have wounds to prove it, and yet I come out like the victim? Did I play a part in that? Yes, I did. I provoked someone, I may have even pushed that person but no one saw it. Hope this makes sense

:goodpost: Makes sense very well, thanks.

 

[Love Never Fails]

Are there any legal professionals who can explain how the pros. could add a charge now? Wouldn't this potentially have changed the defense's arguments, etc? How do you defend/have a fair trial against a charge added at the last minute?

Scary isn't it? The prosecution is doing their best to divide this country.

 

[faw720]

Wonder if they will even get around to closing arguments today??? At the rate they're going now, the attorneys will still be arguing on the Biblical final judgement day.

 

[Perthgirl62]

But there is nothing to indicate that TM was assaulted first; that is opinion (which you are entitled) but not backed up by any evidence. The evidence shows that GZ was beaten by TM.

This is a tragedy and our opinions are just that. I have certain opinions about this matter myself but they are simply that. I've actually tried VERY HARD to go ONLY by what the law indicates and the evidence proving what GZ is accused of and it's just not there. What if's on both sides could have changed everything but it is past that and based on what has been shown during this trial, he did not commit the crime he is being charged with.

The evidence of one witness was that after hearing shouting he saw TM on top of GZ, he also saw downward arm movements but can't say for sure it was punching. Another witness states that she saw GZ on top of TM and also reported similar arm movements.

That does not prove that TM assaulted GZ first or vica versa. If we are going to keep an open mind we have to consider that perhaps it was TM who was acting in self defence? None of us knows what took place prior to eye witness accounts accept for GZ & TM and only one of them is around to give their story. IMO

 

[Chester_from_THM]

Where is MOM? Seems odd to have West arguing this, considering he is the object of the judge's ire.

I wonder if she's got a window up on her laptop watching the twitter feeds. She sure seemed to do a 180 yesterday after that exchange about GZ testifying.

 

[danzn16]

One very honest question:
I know that all law abiding, mentally sound adults have a right to carry a concealed weapon, in Florida but I must ask...
What is the motivation...why do people feel the need to arm themselves with a CONCEALED weapon (to the grocery store, to the car wash, to the dog park, to the whatever)....What the heck do they fear so much that they need to carry a weapon everywhere except the bar, court rooms, police departments, banks, etc?

I ask WHY?

Take a look around the cases on websleuths... That's why.


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[gxm]

If he was a responsible gun owner, he didn't carry with a round in the chamber.
If his arms were pinned and/ or only had use of one at any time it takes two hands on his 9mm to put a round in the chamber to slide the barrel. He couldn't have.

Which witness said that a "responsible" gun owner doesn't carry with a round in the chamber? And which witness testified that GZ couldn't have possibly reached his gun while being attacked? JMO. OMO. MOO.

 

[danzn16]

Is it common for the judge to add sentences other than the ones he prosecution originally went for???


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[Sonya610]

Where is O'Mara? Of all the days he is needed today is the day! I am just glad West hasn't peeved the judge off to the point of a contempt charge.

IMO.

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

Sad that people forget Trayvon was a child, defined by US Law....not by anything else. The prejudice against him is breathtaking in that Court Room. IMO

To be honest, I don't care how old he was. If he had killed GZ he would have been tried as an adult.

Would you have any idea how many 17 year olds have been charged with felony assault or murder?

It makes no difference. He was more than capable of injuring GZ. He pounded GZ.

That leads me to believe in my opinion that he had no fear of GZ and that he felt he could TAKE him. Not the actions of a child.

 

[DIBSY]

So the prosecution failed in every attempt to prove GZ guilty and now they want to add felony child abuse?

Actually it is always available under Florida's Murder 2 with which he is charged and it's called Felony Child Abuse, Murder 2 and can be applied in cases where the Victim is under 18 years of age.IMO

 

[danzn16]

If he was a responsible gun owner, he didn't carry with a round in the chamber.
If his arms were pinned and/ or only had use of one at any time it takes two hands on his 9mm to put a round in the chamber to slide the barrel. He couldn't have.

Most responsible gun owners do in fact carry a round in the chamber for situations where you don't have two hands or where seconds count. Very few gun owners don't carry with a round in the chamber. And that doesn't make them irresponsible. You never pull your gun out if you don't intend to use so it doesn't matter if GZ had one in the chamber or not. He intended and did use it


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[Bernina]

Would GZ, who has been described as "soft", "obese", "a wanna-be cop", have followed (and IMO, GZ FOLLOWED TM, as I perceive from the location of GZ's truck and TM's body) TM if GZ DID NOT HAVE A GUN?

IMO: GZ had NO reason to get out of his vehicle. It was raining and he could have followed TM in his vehicle and reported it to LE.
IMO: Florida does NOT have the experience needed, both by LE, CCW classes, and the citizenry, to embrace their current SYG, CCW laws.

I only know of ONE case here in Arizona, where a deadly shooting occurred, where there was information found later that made the LE take a second look at proffering charges to the CA......and it involved an attorney as the shooter and the deceased being on his cell phone in his vehicle in a parking lot, AT NIGHT.

This would not have happened in Arizona. Regardless of GZ's previous charges being reduced (assaulting LE) or a restraining order being reciprocated and then dropped, he would have NOT gotten a CCW in Arizona.

You do NOT follow someone who is suspicious, "is on something", generally fits into the decription of local burglary suspects, and puts his hands in his waist in a gesture that they have a weapon. You leave it to the LE to handle.

He disregarded the SOP when the shooting occurred taught in CCW classes:
1. I was in fear for my life
2. I am too shaken up to give a statement
3. I need to contact my attorney

IMO: GZ was a <mod snip>, who became a killer when Florida gave him a CCW and the right to own a gun.

IMO, OMO, JMO.

 

[Love Never Fails]

One very honest question:
I know that all law abiding, mentally sound adults have a right to carry a concealed weapon, in Florida but I must ask...
What is the motivation...why do people feel the need to arm themselves with a CONCEALED weapon (to the grocery store, to the car wash, to the dog park, to the whatever)....What the heck do they fear so much that they need to carry a weapon everywhere except the bar, court rooms, police departments, banks, etc?

I ask WHY?

Being attacked
Murdered
Raped
Robbed
Kidnapped

<mod snip> It goes on every day and as a victim of crime, I am all for it.

 

[Donnareit]

I think the type of gun he had, you had to have a round in the chamber. What's the point of carrying around an unloaded gun. He was within his rights, people carry loaded guns all the time.

Just because the gun isn't cocked doesn't mean it's unloaded. Carrying a pistol with a round in the chamber is the equivalent of sticking a revolver in your holster with a fully loaded cylinder and the hammer back. :twocents:

 

[Just K]

Where is MOM? Seems odd to have West arguing this, considering he is the object of the judge's ire.

I wonder if she's got a window up on her laptop watching the twitter feeds. She sure seemed to do a 180 yesterday after that exchange about GZ testifying.

Perhaps another defense strategy to increase the chances of more reversible errors...maybe.

 

[RANCH]

The judge has ruled,your done.