George Zimmerman /Trayvon Martin General Discussion #13 Thursday July 11

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One very honest question:
I know that all law abiding, mentally sound adults have a right to carry a concealed weapon, in Florida but I must ask...
What is the motivation...why do people feel the need to arm themselves with a CONCEALED weapon (to the grocery store, to the car wash, to the dog park, to the whatever)....What the heck do they fear so much that they need to carry a weapon everywhere except the bar, court rooms, police departments, banks, etc?

I ask WHY?

Good question JustK. We have a hunting/gun culture in Florida. Kids grow up hunting and shooting. We've picked out numerous BB's from our pool from the neighbor kid next door who was given a BB gun at 5 years old! Further, with the proliferation of thugs with guns, people feel at a disadvantage. Consequently, they want to arm themselves in readiness. We had a senior citizen who was in a casino that was being robbed by armed robbers; he pulled out his gun and began shooting at the robbers, who then fled. Carjackers are now more careful because they don't know who may be armed. I hope this helps explain and anyone else, please add. Thanks.
 
I am so glad I am not on this jury.

When I first heard about this case I thought for sure GZ was guilty, I don't anymore how ever I am still not in GZs corner.

I didn't see grave bodily injury, and I still don't see how GZ was in a fight for his life, justifying using a gun. Not to mention TM didn't have any injuries on him. It leads ME to believe that GZ pulled a gun with out using other methods first. (How did he get the gun out in the first place if he wasn't prepared to pull it?)

Following people is not illegal, yet I still have a hard time to not see it as the catalyst.

Lastly I can easily see a lot of boys/young men confronting someone who is following them...being macho about it.

It's like these two people created the perfect storm.

All moo.
 
Would GZ, who has been described as "soft", "obese", "a wanna-be cop", have followed (and IMO, GZ FOLLOWED TM, as I perceive from the location of GZ's truck and TM's body) TM if GZ DID NOT HAVE A GUN?

IMO: GZ had NO reason to get out of his vehicle. It was raining and he could have followed TM in his vehicle and reported it to LE.
IMO: Florida does NOT have the experience needed, both by LE, CCW classes, and the citizenry, to embrace their current SYG, CCW laws.

I only know of ONE case here in Arizona, where a deadly shooting occurred, where there was information found later that made the LE take a second look at proffering charges to the CA......and it involved an attorney as the shooter and the deceased being on his cell phone in his vehicle in a parking lot, AT NIGHT.

This would not have happened in Arizona. Regardless of GZ's previous charges being reduced (assaulting LE) or a restraining order being reciprocated and then dropped, he would have NOT gotten a CCW in Arizona.

You do NOT follow someone who is suspicious, "is on something", generally fits into the decription of local burglary suspects, and puts his hands in his waist in a gesture that they have a weapon. You leave it to the LE to handle.

He disregarded the SOP when the shooting occurred taught in CCW classes:
1. I was in fear for my life
2. I am too shaken up to give a statement
3. I need to contact my attorney

IMO: GZ was a wimp, who became a killer when Florida gave him a CCW and the right to own a gun.

IMO, OMO, JMO.

You are correct about how he should not have gotten out of the car. But if he then received a beating from TM then he was using his gun in self defense. In NC you can never use your CCW if you instigated the situation. Getting out of your car could definitely be seen as instigating or it could not since its a free country. What happened next is what is important.


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Where is O'Mara? Of all the days he is needed today is the day! I am just glad West hasn't peeved the judge off to the point of a contempt charge. :)

IMO.

West & the judge are going at it again! Peace didn't last long. JMO, but West would tick me off too, even if he were defending Snow White.
 
Does anyone else find it ironic that the state that could not convict Casey Anthony of child abuse is now going to go after GZ on that charge?

Yes. Have the good people of Florida gone nuts having a prosecutor who is so overly zealous he would do this?

I hope the six jurors, although they are from Florida, use reason and acquit Mr. Zimmerman. Then I hope he goes after the state of Florida for wrongful prosecution. I am sure he won't but that would make my day.
IMO. MOO.
 
Doesn't matter....it is an erroneous charge and top that with the prosecuton KNOWING this case was only charged out of political pressure. Extreme cruelty on the part of the prosecution. IMO!

The Judge hasn't yet ruled....To me, it's absolutely unforgivable that GZ was originally allowed to keep walking free after what he did to a 17 year old boy. And that the public had to make the DA feel ashamed to even get any attempt at seeking justice. What's cruel to me is the brutal unjustified killing of a child, child in the eyes of the law. IMO
 
There are a lot of things that are not against the law but still can provoke anger or discord or ill feelings. A husband can cheat on his wife, or vice versa which is not against the law but look at what can happen. I'm just using that as an example of "not against the law but not a good idea to do. I can go out and provoke someone into a fight to the point of where they may even throw the 1st punch, then I get my butt kicked, kill them in self defense and have wounds to prove it, and yet I come out like the victim? Did I play a part in that? Yes, I did. I provoked someone, I may have even pushed that person but no one saw it. Hope this makes sense :)

Perfectly said. I find it to be willfully obtuse for people to claim following someone isn't threatening. The legality of it isn't the point; it's provocative. If I stand in your face with my finger an inch from your eye and say "I'm not touching you" repeatedly, am I doing anything illegal? Of course not. And if you try to walk away, and I keep following you doing it, am I still acting legally? Sure. But do you want to punch my lights out? Of course you do. Again, it's provocative, just as repeatedly following someone in the dark is frightening and provocative.
 
Being attacked
Murdered
Raped
Robbed
Kidnapped

Do you watch the news? It goes on every day and as a victim of crime, I am all for it.

My entire family lives in MAJOR metropolitan areas. None of us has ever needed to carry a loaded gun. Where I live, used to be called "the murder capital of the world." The only thing I ever carried was a knife...and two times...displaying those knives caused a possible attacker to back away and look for another victim. (Fact not opinion)

IMO, You can't kill someone because they rob you, rape you, or kidnap you, even in Florida, unless "you say" were in fear of great bodily harm.
 
One very honest question:
I know that all law abiding, mentally sound adults have a right to carry a concealed weapon, in Florida but I must ask...
What is the motivation...why do people feel the need to arm themselves with a CONCEALED weapon (to the grocery store, to the car wash, to the dog park, to the whatever)....What the heck do they fear so much that they need to carry a weapon everywhere except the bar, court rooms, police departments, banks, etc?

I ask WHY?

I've been carrying a weapon for over 30 years. It's not fear, it's the culture I was raised in, and legally I CAN.
If you are stopped by traffic LE, and they ask you WHY your have a weapon, the answer is "Because I can."
In the culture I was raised in, it's as common as making sure you have your cell phone when you leave your house. IMO.
You look at a weapon and feel "fear".
I look at a weapon and feel "safety".
IMO.
 
Did I hear this correctly, manslaughter will be considered?
 
And if he used his fists because he felt threatened and needed to defend himself...? IMO

JMO he is certainly allowed to defend himself. However testimony is he punched GZ in the nose and instead of running off once GZ was down from that punch, TM straddled him and continued attacking It is unfortunate that TM continued attacking so earnestly a citizen who was legally on a sidewalk and legally carrying a weapon IMO
 
I am so glad I am not on this jury.

When I first heard about this case I thought for sure GZ was guilty, I don't anymore how ever I am still not in GZs corner.

I didn't see grave bodily injury, and I still don't see how GZ was in a fight for his life, justifying using a gun. Not to mention TM didn't have any injuries on him. It leads ME to believe that GZ pulled a gun with out using other methods first. (How did he get the gun out in the first place if he wasn't prepared to pull it?)

Following people is not illegal, yet I still have a hard time to not see it as the catalyst.

Lastly I can easily see a lot of boys/young men confronting someone who is following them...being macho about it.

It's like these two people created the perfect storm.

All moo.

I dont' think that GZ is awesome either... :)

I do think he acted in selfdefense. To me that TM does not have injuries just shows me how overpowered GZ was. That he was indeed in fear of great bodily harm and death.
Remember the law is that he only had to have REASONABLE FEAR OF... Not actual injuries or life threatening injuries.

It is horrible no matter what. Tragic.

Glad you posted!
 
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