Patsy's makeup that morning

[pageantmom]

Hi, I haven't been here in quite a while, just busy with life! For some reason this morning I thought of patsy and her makeup. Last night (saturday) we just got home so late, and I was tired but needed to do some things before bed. Long story short I ended up sitting on the couch just for a few minutes and ended up falling asleep on the couch. Dressed, with all my makeup on, hair done etc. I woke up about 6 am and realized where I was, went to the bathroom and looked in the mirror. My hair looked almost ok. But my face, well since I'd fallen asleep leaning back into the cushions but still sitting UP, my face wasn't like smudged in a pillow or anything which meant my makeup looked nearly ok- eye liner just a tiny but smeared, but otherwise fine. However my face looked oily, and, my eyes had sleepies. Sooo where I am going with this, is, if Patsy really woke up and did her makeup that morning, it should look pretty different from if she was up all night with it and only touched it up in the morning. Also face makeup comes off or runs if you are sweating which I would assume she wound have sweated a bit due to nerves. Even it she didn't sweat at all, faces still get oily through the day and overnight. So, does anyone have a pic of her face that morning? I feel like it would be easy enough to see if her makeup was fresh or only touched up that morning. Also, did any one who was there that morning comment on her face looking oily or anything like that?

 

[bettybaby00]

Interesting, but I have to give her a pass on this one. I know many people who go straight from bed to the bathroom/shower and emerge completely done up for the day. Me......no way, I stumble down the stairs and lunge for the coffee pot, and can go quite a long time before showering and dressing b/c I don't have to get ready for work.

That being said, most people I know who get up, shower and get fully ready for the day before heading downstairs don't put on the same clothes from the day before.

Like so many aspects of this case, we're left with another puzzling contradiction!

 

[pageantmom]

Normally, I get up, head for the bathroom before doing anything else , and as you said "emerge completely done up for the day".

But I just think Patsy's face would tell us if she had been up all night or not.

I think she was up all night and never went to bed...and she would have had to touch up her makeup before the police came since it had been on all night and would look old...but after touching it up, it would still not have looked new and fresh.

I wish I could see how she looked that morning because I just think it would be easy to tell if it was new makup that morning or if it was just touched up makeup from the previous day.

 

[Nom de plume]

TMK, there were no pictures taken that morning. At least I've never seen any. All I've ever heard is that her make up was "freshly" done as well as her hair. She may have had oily skin, or it may have been dry. That would make a big difference.

IMO, she was up all night, and probably cried all her make up off, or at least had it super streaky. In order for the "we just got up and got ready to leave" story to fly, her make up would need to be freshly done, as well as her hair.

JR on the other hand needed to shower to rinse forensic evidence off of himself.

:moo:

 

[Chrishope]

The story being told to police is that "We went to bed after the kids were asleep and we woke up and found this RN, etc."

So, if PR was trying to fool police, wouldn't she have thought to change her clothes?

As for the freshness of the makeup, I'm a guy and would have no idea by looking, and wouldn't know what PR "normally" looked like anyway. I can say that LA was there and being a woman she might have had some impressions as to the makeup, but I'm not aware she ever stated anything about it.

 

[tgirl1130]

I usually don't shower at night, So sometimes I sleep with my makeup on. THe other morning I woke up late 15 min till my ride for work would be here. Looked in the mirror, brushed my teeth, and went to work with yesterdays makeup on. Didn;'t look too bad either...Just thought I'd throw that out there

 

[blefuscu]

I honestly believe that Patsy was the type of woman who wouldn't have answered the telephone without her make-up done. One of her first priorities I would have imagined.

 

[UKGuy]

Hi, I haven't been here in quite a while, just busy with life! For some reason this morning I thought of patsy and her makeup. Last night (saturday) we just got home so late, and I was tired but needed to do some things before bed. Long story short I ended up sitting on the couch just for a few minutes and ended up falling asleep on the couch. Dressed, with all my makeup on, hair done etc. I woke up about 6 am and realized where I was, went to the bathroom and looked in the mirror. My hair looked almost ok. But my face, well since I'd fallen asleep leaning back into the cushions but still sitting UP, my face wasn't like smudged in a pillow or anything which meant my makeup looked nearly ok- eye liner just a tiny but smeared, but otherwise fine. However my face looked oily, and, my eyes had sleepies. Sooo where I am going with this, is, if Patsy really woke up and did her makeup that morning, it should look pretty different from if she was up all night with it and only touched it up in the morning. Also face makeup comes off or runs if you are sweating which I would assume she wound have sweated a bit due to nerves. Even it she didn't sweat at all, faces still get oily through the day and overnight. So, does anyone have a pic of her face that morning? I feel like it would be easy enough to see if her makeup was fresh or only touched up that morning. Also, did any one who was there that morning comment on her face looking oily or anything like that?

pageantmom
I think you are 100% correct, curious that nobody gets you.

Bottom line is that the photographs from the White's party can confirm what you are thinking?

This is another example where its likely LEA knew but gave the R's a pass.

 

[bettybaby00]

I usually don't shower at night, So sometimes I sleep with my makeup on. THe other morning I woke up late 15 min till my ride for work would be here. Looked in the mirror, brushed my teeth, and went to work with yesterdays makeup on. Didn;'t look too bad either...Just thought I'd throw that out there

:floorlaugh:

I could never get away with that!!!!

&&FWIW, speaking for myself, it's not about "not getting" pageantmoms observation/question, I think she brings up a good point. For me though Patsy's makeup and hair "behavior" is difficult to place outside the norm, b/c there is such a wide range of morning routines. That's why I say I give patsy a pass, this one behavior does not point to guilt/remorse etc., etc.

Does that make sense? :lol:

 

[pageantmom]

Yeah, I get what you mean. Her hair and makeup isn't going to scream "she's guilty" and there are soooo many other things that happened that are much better evidence than "oh, her face looks a little greasy".

It was just something I thought of and wondered if anyone ever had photos of her from that morning or had described her face as looking oily. I really wish someone did! It's not evidence but it does make you wonder, and possibly point to her not ever having gone to bed that night..

 

[SapphireSteel]

FWIW, I'd place PR in the "greasy face" category.

In fact I think if you track down her own pageant photos, the grease is obvious. Shiny oily skin that doesn't easily wrinkle.

:twocents:

The clothes are what gets me. An entire houseful of the latest fashion and she keeps yesterday's clothes on? No way.

 

[bettybaby00]

FWIW, I'd place PR in the "greasy face" category.

In fact I think if you track down her own pageant photos, the grease is obvious. Shiny oily skin that doesn't easily wrinkle.

:twocents:

The clothes are what gets me. An entire houseful of the latest fashion and she keeps yesterday's clothes on? No way.

K, that made me :lol:

 

[txsvicki]

I'd be interested to know if her face looked fresh as in hydrated from moisturizer. Patsy was thrown into menopause from the radical surgery and no hormone replacement. She might have needed help with skin dryness.

 

[Chrishope]

FWIW, I'd place PR in the "greasy face" category.

In fact I think if you track down her own pageant photos, the grease is obvious. Shiny oily skin that doesn't easily wrinkle.

:twocents:

The clothes are what gets me. An entire houseful of the latest fashion and she keeps yesterday's clothes on? No way.

Except - if she were in on the plan (even just the cover up) and didn't want anyone to know she'd been up all night staging a crime scene, why wouldn't she grab something from her well stocked closet and put it on? That would take what - 5 minutes?

 

[SwampMama]

I'd be interested to know if her face looked fresh as in hydrated from moisturizer. Patsy was thrown into menopause from the radical surgery and no hormone replacement. She might have needed help with skin dryness.

I had a complete hysterectomy, including removal of ovaries, about 10 years ago, at age 35. I never went on hormone replacement (due to endomitriosis). I have yet to experience any dryness of my skin from that. At age 46 now, I still use alcohol to wipe my face off a few times a day to clean it, remove the icky feeling from the summer heat, oil and sweat. ( I never wear makeup, too lazy and just dont give a rats butt!!)

That's just my experience and hers may have been different. I swear i never thought I would be 46 and still dealing oily skin but I'm not complaining.

 

[KoldKase]

This "fully dressed with make-up" part of this case has always bothered me.

I will give Patsy that people's grooming habits are individual and I've never seen any unbiased proof of what hers truly were on any given day.

But the family was supposed to fly out of Boulder that morning to meet with family, so an argument can be made that it wouldn't be odd for her to get dressed and ready quickly after getting up, before "finding" the ransom note.

What does bother me about any theory that includes Patsy having on the same clothes from the night before is this: many people (me) take off their dressier clothes when they get home after a long day. Why would Patsy still be wearing her slacks, jacket, sweater/turtleneck/whatever she actually had on ALL NIGHT, even if the family were in varying stages of killing JonBenet?

I can see her jacket fibers being transferred to various other items of clothing she wore, as well as to clothing others in the family wore that day. So that's always one of those circumstantial pieces of evidence that has to have a lot of other evidence adding up to make it important, like the ransom note she obviously wrote.

I guess what I contemplate is, if Patsy still had her clothing on she wore to the White's when all this was going down, it must have happened pretty soon after the Ramseys got home.

Like maybe she had taken her jacket off, stepped out of her shoes into some more comfy slippers while she fed the hungry kids a snack before putting them to bed...then BAM! It all blew up and she never got out of her clothing.

But that can be argued so many ways.

What is significant circumstantial evidence to me are the numerous fibers from Patsy's Christmas party clothing found on the duct tape, in the paint tray, and tied into the knots of the garrote cord.

Her make-up could easily have been touched up before calling 911 to back up the story she had concocted for LE. I believe they wanted to be ready to leave the house as soon as the body was found, which ANYONE would have expected that to happen within minutes of LE arriving. The plane was ready to fly that morning, with pilot, and changing the flight from Charlevoix to Atlanta was clearly on JR's mind as he went straight for that plan once he "found" the body. Oops. That quick getaway didn't happen.

Y'all know Patsy wore wigs, right? I can't remember if she had a wig on that morning or not. So long ago now....

 

[eileenhawkeye]

Patsy put on her makeup on the morning of 12/25. At 5 AM on 12:26, what is the chance that it still looks presentable? How many foundations, concealers, eye shadows, mascara actually stay for almost 24 hours? It wouldn't shock me if Patsy touched up her makeup before 911 was called, because she knew that a lot of people were going to be coming to the house.

 

[SapphireSteel]

Patsy put on her makeup on the morning of 12/25. At 5 AM on 12:26, what is the chance that it still looks presentable? How many foundations, concealers, eye shadows, mascara actually stay for almost 24 hours? It wouldn't shock me if Patsy touched up her makeup before 911 was called, because she knew that a lot of people were going to be coming to the house.

Me either. Always ready for the spotlight.

Also, as far as rushing out of the house that morning - the ironing board was set up and PR had been ironing and packing clothes for the trip.

Clothes for the trip.

Which includes the travel.

Who wants to be scrunched up next to an unshowered (and greasy faced) PR while in a private plane? No one, and I doubt PR would ever go unshowered for a trip like that. She'd be all Agatha Christie and have special travelling clothes - these people were seriously rich - probably something in white with a veil and a safari hat.

:moo:

 

[4Jacy]

FWIW, I'd place PR in the "greasy face" category.

In fact I think if you track down her own pageant photos, the grease is obvious. Shiny oily skin that doesn't easily wrinkle.

:twocents:

The clothes are what gets me. An entire houseful of the latest fashion and she keeps yesterday's clothes on? No way.

She had to keep the clothes on she worn the night before so when she threw herself over JohBenet's dead body, her fibers (from clothes) could be explained. JMO

 

[Chelly]

She had to keep the clothes on she worn the night before so when she threw herself over JohBenet's dead body, her fibers (from clothes) could be explained. JMO

I like this theory a lot 4Jacy and it keeps playing in my mind. However, so much was bungled during the staging and coverup, I wonder if PR actually had the presence of mind to make an intelligent decision such as: "Well, I was wearing this outfit while dressing and staging my dead daughter, so I better have it on when the police arrive and find her, so I can throw myself on her lifeless body thus intermingling any fibers that may already be on her."

Another thing about that outfit, it just doesn't impress me as comfortable travel attire, but that's just me.

Just had another thought: It could have been JR who instructed PR to put back on her Christmas outfit and apply a fully made-up face.