Patsy Ramsey

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Someone seemed right miffed about the 118k. Did John not tell Patsy of his mega-bonus? That Rn, which I totally believe PR wrote, just digs and digs at "John."
 
Meara said:
Wow, otg. That's wild. Right down to the instant crowd and media circus. Damn. If you didn't see + hear it yourself, you wouldn't believe it!

At least the kidnapper in the movie says, "If you deviate from our instructions..." The RN has "Any deviation of my instructions," which is incorrect - and rare. I've often wished we could find even one document in which either parent uses this construction :please:
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Very interesting, Meara. A mathematics/science-minded person might use the term "deviation" followed by "of", rather than "from", simply out of habit.
 
Okay, this thread has been going on forever and we seem to discuss the same topics.
I have some questions:
When the family got home that night JB feel asleep in the car. Was so zonked out that JB slept through Patsy dressing her in her pj's. So then how did JB consume pineapple approximately 2 hours before she was brutalized and murdered? How come Burke stated that JB walked up the stairs when they got home with Patsy right behind her? How come JR read a bedtime story to JB when she was already dead asleep? What part of any of this makes sense?
Fact JB ate pineapple and not at the Whites house. Therefore she wasn't asleep. Why lie about this? Cause we just got to stick with the story.

Why would somebody seeking ransom money lure JB into the basement. Sexually molest her with a broken paintbrush leaving shards in your vagina? Why were fibers found in the ligature consistent with PR sweater she wore that night and the next day? Why brutally murder JB when what your after is money? Why hit her on the head so hard you crack her skull in its entirety lengthwise and then tie cord around her neck and strangle her? Then wrap her up and tuck her in a swaddling blanket if you just want money?
Why carry all this out in the wine cellar? Hardest room in the house to find and located directly below BR and the parents bedrooms. Why not just slip out one of the many exit doors located closer to JB bedroom and the rest if the house? Because we didn't mean to kill her.

Why doesn't the RN have both JR and PR fingerprints on them? Both said they handled it. Oh, maybe that was before we removed the gloves.

We can start there.
 
the accounts of that night differ from time to time. i remember reading in PMPT (sorry, don't have a copy of that book to quote) that JR stated that JB was asleep, continued to be asleep when changed and that he read a book to her while JB was asleep. that statement always intrigued me, who starts reading a book to a kid who is already, by all JR's accounts, so deeply asleep that she had to be carried into the house, undresses and dressed without waking up once?

i agree with you flatlander, it does not make sense. i thought that JR was trying to paint himself as a doting dad that read nighttime stories to his kids and had no idea (because he has never done it) that the kid needs to be awake to enjoy that moment


lupus est homini *advertiser censored*, non *advertiser censored*, non quom qualis sit novit
 
THE BUNK said:
Did Patsy ever show or had been diagnosed for Post Portem Depression?
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that is an interesting theory. i had PPD with both my kids and worked very hard to hid it. eventually i was diagnosed with chronic depression

that would make sense re: her need for perfection, i used to feel like a kind of fraud, like i wasn't a real mum and that any little thing might show to others that i didn't belong

i still find hard to see PR as the perpetrator though, not because i live with my head in the sand, but because it seems that JB was PR's validation, every little triumph of JB reflected on PR and make her feel like she was a good mother like any little failure became a huge black mark against PR

sorry, i am no mental illness expert and i am reflecting a bit of my own feelings and experience in this post


lupus est homini *advertiser censored*, non *advertiser censored*, non quom qualis sit novit
 
Flatlander said:
Okay, this thread has been going on forever and we seem to discuss the same topics.
I have some questions:
When the family got home that night JB feel asleep in the car. Was so zonked out that JB slept through Patsy dressing her in her pj's. So then how did JB consume pineapple approximately 2 hours before she was brutalized and murdered? How come Burke stated that JB walked up the stairs when they got home with Patsy right behind her? How come JR read a bedtime story to JB when she was already dead asleep? What part of any of this makes sense?
Fact JB ate pineapple and not at the Whites house. Therefore she wasn't asleep. Why lie about this? Cause we just got to stick with the story.

Why would somebody seeking ransom money lure JB into the basement. Sexually molest her with a broken paintbrush leaving shards in your vagina? Why were fibers found in the ligature consistent with PR sweater she wore that night and the next day? Why brutally murder JB when what your after is money? Why hit her on the head so hard you crack her skull in its entirety lengthwise and then tie cord around her neck and strangle her? Then wrap her up and tuck her in a swaddling blanket if you just want money?
Why carry all this out in the wine cellar? Hardest room in the house to find and located directly below BR and the parents bedrooms. Why not just slip out one of the many exit doors located closer to JB bedroom and the rest if the house? Because we didn't mean to kill her.

Why doesn't the RN have both JR and PR fingerprints on them? Both said they handled it. Oh, maybe that was before we removed the gloves.

We can start there.
Click to expand...

Three lies that were central to their "innocence."

1) JRB was asleep by the time we got home.
2) what pinapple?
3) BR slept through the entire incident.

All serve to distance the Rs from having anything to do with JonBenet from the minute they got home.

It's obvious that JRB was awake after they got home. BRs story confirms this, but even if she had been put to bed, she obviously didn't stay there as evidenced by the pinapple in her digestive system, and the fact that CSI techs documented that her bedding reeked of urine when they processed her room.

She couldn't have eaten pinapple at the White's based on where it was found in her system, along with the forensic analysis that the pinapple was the same as what was found in the Rs refrigerator.

And lastly, oops, BR could be heard on the 911 tape. Gotta also question how the soiled PJ bottoms believed to have belonged to BR were found by the CSI techs that morning in JRBs bedroom.
 
BBM

bettybaby00 said:
Three lies that were central to their "innocence."

1) JRB was asleep by the time we got home.
2) what pinapple?
3) BR slept through the entire incident.

All serve to distance the Rs from having anything to do with JonBenet from the minute they got home.

It's obvious that JRB was awake after they got home. BRs story confirms this, but even if she had been put to bed, she obviously didn't stay there as evidenced by the pinapple in her digestive system, and the fact that CSI techs documented that her bedding reeked of urine when they processed her room.

She couldn't have eaten pinapple at the White's based on where it was found in her system, along with the forensic analysis that the pinapple was the same as what was found in the Rs refrigerator.

And lastly, oops, BR could be heard on the 911 tape. Gotta also question how the soiled PJ bottoms believed to have belonged to BR were found by the CSI techs that morning in JRBs bedroom.
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Don't get me started this late at night about all of the nasty excrement in the home. It always bothered me that she allowed cops into her home while a box of candy is smeared in JBs bedroom and not discarded into the trash. And why didn't she flush the toilet? Was that her way of showing: See. I did not flush any evidence down this toilet.

along with the forensic analysis that the pineapple was the same as what was found in the Rs refrigerator
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I don't think this is accurate and I'll share why. I thought the same thing until I read somewhere fairly recently that the pineapple in JB's duodenum was consistent down to the rind with the pineapple chunks in the bowl on the table. Unfortunately, CS techs did not know to take, mark and preserve the pineapple from the Rs frig.
 
DeDee said:
BBM







Don't get me started this late at night about all of the nasty excrement in the home. It always bothered me that she allowed cops into her home while a box of candy is smeared in JBs bedroom and not discarded into the trash. And why didn't she flush the toilet? Was that her way of showing: See. I did not flush any evidence down this toilet.







I don't think this is accurate and I'll share why. I thought the same thing until I read somewhere fairly recently that the pineapple in JB's duodenum was consistent down to the rind with the pineapple chunks in the bowl on the table. Unfortunately, CS techs did not know to take, mark and preserve the pineapple from the Rs frig.
Click to expand...


The Whites didn't serve pineapple.

The kidnapper/murderer/pedophile brought the pineapple;) cough cough...



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
DeDee said:
BBM



Don't get me started this late at night about all of the nasty excrement in the home. It always bothered me that she allowed cops into her home while a box of candy is smeared in JBs bedroom and not discarded into the trash. And why didn't she flush the toilet? Was that her way of showing: See. I did not flush any evidence down this toilet.



I don't think this is accurate and I'll share why. I thought the same thing until I read somewhere fairly recently that the pineapple in JB's duodenum was consistent down to the rind with the pineapple chunks in the bowl on the table. Unfortunately, CS techs did not know to take, mark and preserve the pineapple from the Rs frig.
Click to expand...

There is no proof that there was candy smeared with anything. I just don't believe it. kids make messes in the bathroom that is not big deal.

The pineapple only helps about possible time of the crime nothing more, But I am not sure it is really pineapple and if it is I think it could have been in something she ate at the Whites.
 
ScarlettScarpetta said:
There is no proof that there was candy smeared with anything. I just don't believe it. kids make messes in the bathroom that is not big deal.

The pineapple only helps about possible time of the crime nothing more, But I am not sure it is really pineapple and if it is I think it could have been in something she ate at the Whites.
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Why don't you believe it was pineapple? Why do you doubt this fact? If it was in something she ate at the Whites (which I believe has been denied) then she was killed while the parents were awake in the house.

It is the one fact (and it is fact) that really hurts the R's case. If she ate it at the White's then she was killed not long after they got home. If she didn't eat it at the White's then it makes holes in their statements about whether she was awake or asleep when she got home. If she was awake then why say she was asleep? If she was asleep, when did she eat the pineapple? And is some intruder going to sit in the house waiting for them to come home, write a ransom note and then waste time feeding JB pineapple from a bowl, all the while hoping they won't get caught/leave too much evidence?
 
Detective Pinkie said:
Why don't you believe it was pineapple? Why do you doubt this fact? If it was in something she ate at the Whites (which I believe has been denied) then she was killed while the parents were awake in the house.

It is the one fact (and it is fact) that really hurts the R's case. If she ate it at the White's then she was killed not long after they got home. If she didn't eat it at the White's then it makes holes in their statements about whether she was awake or asleep when she got home. If she was awake then why say she was asleep? If she was asleep, when did she eat the pineapple? And is some intruder going to sit in the house waiting for them to come home, write a ransom note and then waste time feeding JB pineapple from a bowl, all the while hoping they won't get caught/leave too much evidence?
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Because I have never seen it outright called pineapple by the ME. He said it appeared to be pineapple, Just never said outright it was.
And even if it was, It still does not mean anything. It may not have been out at the whites although no one could really recall if there was pineapple there or not, But it could have been in something, a cake, A treat.

I think that you can not say for a fact how she got that substance in her belly so that it becomes nothing more than an aside.
 
There was nothing else noted in her digestive system along with the "pineapple-like" substance, so saying it could have been in something else isn't a viable option.

There was pineapple on the table. She had "pineapple-like" substance in her digestive system. It was pineapple.
 
ScarlettScarpetta said:
Because I have never seen it outright called pineapple by the ME. He said it appeared to be pineapple, Just never said outright it was.
And even if it was, It still does not mean anything. It may not have been out at the whites although no one could really recall if there was pineapple there or not, But it could have been in something, a cake, A treat.

I think that you can not say for a fact how she got that substance in her belly so that it becomes nothing more than an aside.
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Autopsy clearly states pineapple.
Ever read acandyrose JR interview about the pineapple?
Research
Facts
http://www.acandyrose.com/s-evidence-pineapple.htm
 
It doesn't matter. The pineapple doesn't tell us who killed JonBenét.
 
The pinapple contradicts the Rs version of events.

Also from ACR link by Flatliner

Today Show March 2000

COURIC: For every clue, a new question, like the autopsy finding that JonBenet ate pineapple just hours before she died. None was served at dinner that night, so when did JonBenet eat it? Let's address the mystery of the pineapple. That's been a source of a lot of speculation about what she did when you all got home from that Christmas party. Did she really go straight to bed? Did she eat pineapple...

Mr. RAMSEY: Let's...

COURIC: ...before she went to bed?

Mr. RAMSEY: Let's deal with the facts that I know. The facts are that JonBenet was asleep when we brought her home, we put her to bed, and neither Patsy or I fed her anything, because she was asleep. Those are the facts.
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PMPT 443

In the Ramseys' dining room, just steps away from the kitchen, the police had found a bowl with fresh pineapple in it. Meyer noted in his report that the pineapple in JonBenet's small intestine was in near-perfect condition-it had sharp edges and looked as if it had been recently eaten and poorly chewed.

Based on the condition of the pineapple in her intestine, the experts estimated that JonBenet had eaten it an hour and a half or two hours before she died, most likely after the family returned home that night. However, one Boulder medical examiner stated it could have been eaten as early as 4:30 p.M.- before the Ramseys left their home for a dinner at the Whites. If JonBenet had eaten the pineapple after 10:30 P.M., that made the approximate time, of death not earlier than midnight."
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ST 165

"She confirmed that the last thing JonBenet had to eat was some cracked crab at the Whites' dinner party on December 25. I knew the Whites served no pineapple that night, but pineapple was found in the victim's stomach, and a bowl of pineapple bearing Patsy's fingerprints was on her kitchen table."


ST Page 192-93

"Our experts studied the pineapple in the stomach and reported that it was fresh-cut pineapple, consistent down to the rind with what had been found in the bowl. It was solid proof that it wasn't canned pineapple, and what were the chances that an intruder would have brought in a fresh pineapple to cut up for his victim?

At lunch we had our sandwiches at that table while trying to convince Lou Smit of the connection between the mother's fingerprints on the bowl and the pineapple remains found in the child's body. He countered that a crime scene photo showed a Tupperware container in a - paper sack in JonBenet's bedroom, and he believed the contents of that plastic bowl might have been pineapple.

Maybe she got up during the night and ate the pineapple in her room, he said, giving us an unlikely alternative. The Tupperware container, never seized, was long gone, and the grainy photo on which he relied was totally inconclusive. I thought the material could have been popcorn, maybe beads, certainly not unrefrigerated pineapple. Perhaps, Smit argued, if she knew the intruder, he might have fed her. "Maybe Santa," he ventured.
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And BM becomes road kill.
 
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