The Flashlight.....

Was The Flashlight The Weapon?

  • Yes, The Flashlight Was The Weapon.

    Votes: 29 35.4%

  • No, The Flashlight Was NOT The Weapon.

    Votes: 28 34.1%

  • I Have No Clue!

    Votes: 25 30.5%
  • Total voters
    82

New Posts

bettybaby00 said:
I know I'm probably in the minority, but I still favor the golf club :dunno:

Especially a wedge putter, or even a wood driver?
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Don't feel badly bettybaby00. I'm in the minority too because I favor Steve Thomas's version that her head hit something (maybe a bathroom fixture?) instead of being hit with something. The wound is consistent with a high pressure-low velocity wound, which is consistent with Steve Thomas's speculation on what happened. I think the event was reckless but accidental. :twocents: :moo:
 
Don't feel badly bettybaby00. I'm in the minority too because I favor Steve Thomas's version that her head hit something (maybe a bathroom fixture?) instead of being hit with something. The wound is consistent with a high pressure-low velocity wound, which is consistent with Steve Thomas's speculation on what happened. I think the event was reckless but accidental.
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A good reason to leave the body in the basement with the garrotte. It gives the impression that was the murder scene.

Maybe that's why they decided against losing the body. They were afraid the police might discover the true murder scene and weapon....and the true culprit!
 
THE BUNK said:
It may be needed again. Jonbenet's body is still in the house.
Also at the time it was wiped, John Ramsey may have put on gloves so he can continue using it without risk of fingerprints.
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OK, so since the flashlight was still out on the bench after the 911 call, are you saying that John didn't get around to using the flashlight again before they called police and then forgot to put it back in the drawer?
 
bettybaby00 said:
I know I'm probably in the minority, but I still favor the golf club :dunno:

Especially a wedge putter, or even a wood driver?
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the main principle in golf is a strong, smooth, controlled swing. IMO if you have some degree of properly mastering a standard swing you are also capable of performing an accurate swing in an alternate stance
 
questfortrue said:
Someone pointed out that it may be that the CBI report stated that there were no “usable” fingerprints. Consequently those reading the report believed it meant that the flashlight was wiped down. However, it would be a mistake to conclude that partial or smudged fingerprints were not examined. Typically, lab people will lift even partials or smudged fingerprints from an item, because there may exist some small identifiable “points” of comparison. We won’t know because as poster otg commented once: “We can only guess, since we don't have access to the lab reports on evidence.”
Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Was BR involved? #2


As for the psychology of wiping down the flashlight, you bet, it doesn’t really make sense for RDI or IDI. If one thinks it was an intruder, why didn’t the intruder take it with him? Likewise, why wouldn’t the family have just left the fingerprints on the flashlight, after all it was their Mag-lite (identified by friend JF and housekeeper LHP). For my 2 cents: I agree totally with DeeDee249 and that’s because of my viewpoint of the distancing aspect. For me the intent of all of the staging is to distance the crime from the family. ( I can picture a chaotic, panicked scene, and baffling choices of altering the crime scene to create this distance.) IIRC, some of the FBI (not JD) did evaluate the cs from the perspective of staging.

This topic may just come down to our speculation as to what was in the mind of the perp, and that can be interpreted differently.
1) If one believes it was in realty an intruder, then the idea of staging and distancing is nonsense. The perp was simply eliminating the forensic evidence he left behind.
2) If, on the other hand, the family was involved, then the distancing worked like a charm and created enough confusion that we still speculate what could have been in the mind of the perpetrator or the stagers.

MHO
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Yes questfortrue I completely agree, none of us knows for sure, we are all speculating. That's why I object to posters stating it is a known fact that the flashlight and the batteries were wiped clean of prints. It is so frequently repeated and it is so wrong
 
aussiesheila2 said:
OK, so since the flashlight was still out on the bench after the 911 call, are you saying that John didn't get around to using the flashlight again before they called police and then forgot to put it back in the drawer?
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Forgot to put it back? Probably. Or Patsy took it out again for some reason. It's not like they had this complete thought out plan of action written down. All this had to be done on spec and in the mind.

More than likely the flashlight was going to be taken when and if, John had to do the "money drop". Or in John Benet's body being disposed.

Keep in mind we are talking about a flashlight..not a loaded gun. There is nothing strange about it being out in the open.
 
Lacking the ability and or willingness to see human behavior for what it is people resort to conspiracy theories.
 
Blue Bottle 01 said:
Lacking the ability and or willingness to see human behavior for what it is people resort to conspiracy theories.
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Whether you are RDI or IDI this crime was most likely committed by at least two people. The person who wrote the ransom letter is not the same person who placed the garrotte on Jonbenet.
 
Blue Bottle 01 said:
Lacking the ability and or willingness to see human behavior for what it is people resort to conspiracy theories.
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I really have no idea what you mean by this?

The Grand Jury indictments clearly states there was conspiracy, actually. Conspiracy to cover a crime.
 
THE BUNK said:
Forgot to put it back? Probably. Or Patsy took it out again for some reason. It's not like they had this complete thought out plan of action written down. All this had to be done on spec and in the mind.

More than likely the flashlight was going to be taken when and if, John had to do the "money drop". Or in John Benet's body being disposed.

Keep in mind we are talking about a flashlight..not a loaded gun. There is nothing strange about it being out in the open.
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OK thanks for the explanation bunk
 
Is there any other reason to be talking about the flashlight on the bench other than it being the possible murder weapon? Because if there isn't I just don't see the point - the whole idea of an item the size and construction of that flashlight still being intact after delivering a force of such magnitude that it caused a 6 inch comminuted fracture of a human skull is simply ludicrous IMO
 
I believe the FL has long been an issue in the staging debate
 
aussiesheila2 said:
Is there any other reason to be talking about the flashlight on the bench other than it being the possible murder weapon? Because if there isn't I just don't see the point - the whole idea of an item the size and construction of that flashlight still being intact after delivering a force of such magnitude that it caused a 6 inch comminuted fracture of a human skull is simply ludicrous IMO
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The flashlight is interesting for a few reasons; example: matches characteristics of head blow instrument; seems out of place on the counter; not identified by the Ramseys; reportedly wiped clean of prints inside and out. So, yes there are reasons to discuss the flashlight beyond it being the possible murder weapon; but, really, I think its status as possible murder weapon is sufficient cause.
...

AK
 
Anti-K said:
The flashlight is interesting for a few reasons; example: matches characteristics of head blow instrument; seems out of place on the counter; not identified by the Ramseys; reportedly wiped clean of prints inside and out. So, yes there are reasons to discuss the flashlight beyond it being the possible murder weapon; but, really, I think its status as possible murder weapon is sufficient cause.
...

AK
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But AK don't you think the flashlight would show signs of damage if it had been used to crack JonBenet's skull open? Like a dislodged globe or broken glass or a dint in the casing?
 
aussiesheila2 said:
Is there any other reason to be talking about the flashlight on the bench other than it being the possible murder weapon? Because if there isn't I just don't see the point - the whole idea of an item the size and construction of that flashlight still being intact after delivering a force of such magnitude that it caused a 6 inch comminuted fracture of a human skull is simply ludicrous IMO
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BBM

Not remotely. Maglite flashlights are extremely durable and sturdy. You could use it as a hammer to pound nails into wood and it would likely still turn on like normal.
 
Tawny said:
BBM

Not remotely. Maglite flashlights are extremely durable and sturdy. You could use it as a hammer to pound nails into wood and it would likely still turn on like normal.
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It has never been determined that the flashlight on the bench was a Maglite so we don't know how durable and sturdy it was
 
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