Israel Keyes: General Discussion

[Backwoods]

Just to add: Keyes might also have looked at real estate agents as possible victims.

Former FBI profiler Roy Hazelwood, quoted in Stephen G. Michaud's book about counterfeiter and suspected serial killer "Mike" Debardeleben, pointed out that real estate agents (and he was especially talking about female real estate agents) are put into very risky situations:

"To me, it's the most dangerous legitimate profession in America."

https://books.google.com/books?id=S...most dangerous legitimate profession"&f=false

 

[Iwatchingeye]

THANKS for your post scoobydoobie, I agree with everything you said here 100%, always had Keyes picked for the Jamison Family, for the reason so much in that case fits with all we know about Keyes and in my opinion it very well could be the victim's he stated he buried in a valley

I will only add, the real-estate listings found may have been that of the girlfriend since she was a real-estate broker

thanks again for your posts

I also thought of them for IK but I don't understand the large amount of money left behind in their truck and the more I read about their unusual behavior and watch the video of them preparing to leave that day makes me think there was other factors within this family that caused their deaths.

This case frustrates me so much I have followed here since the beginning. In fact I have read Websleuths as a guest for years but never joined until this case and I found one possible victim and wanted to post about her but was unsure so I didn't her name was Debra Feldman. I have search hundreds, maybe thousands of missing persons comparing to his known travels but the key here is known. I have often wondered if he took a victim and their car killed the victim then used their car to do other things then that would change the potential radius for the rental cars. There are just so many unknowns. I had hoped the girlfriendor daughter's mother would come forward and do some interviews on Dateline, 48 Hours or something because I think since he was never convicted of a crime his family could benifit $$$$ in telling their stories.

Oh how I wish we had a verified insider here on WS.

 

[digndoodle]

I also thought of them for IK but I don't understand the large amount of money left behind in their truck and the more I read about their unusual behavior and watch the video of them preparing to leave that day makes me think there was other factors within this family that caused their deaths.

This case frustrates me so much I have followed here since the beginning. In fact I have read Websleuths as a guest for years but never joined until this case and I found one possible victim and wanted to post about her but was unsure so I didn't her name was Debra Feldman. I have search hundreds, maybe thousands of missing persons comparing to his known travels but the key here is known. I have often wondered if he took a victim and their car killed the victim then used their car to do other things then that would change the potential radius for the rental cars. There are just so many unknowns. I had hoped the girlfriendor daughter's mother would come forward and do some interviews on Dateline, 48 Hours or something because I think since he was never convicted of a crime his family could benifit $$$$ in telling their stories.

Oh how I wish we had a verified insider here on WS.

Sadly I don't feel we will ever know the full ?? Craziness of Keyes and his doings but I just get a deep gut feeling he would have loved taunting people like the Jamisons, no matter
what their behaviors were the day they went missing and I have thought long and hard about all the spray painted messages and etc. left behind...In my mind I can see Keyes
having a ball at a very childish game such as this also...just anything to throw off LE investigations.

I still hope that a family member, girlfriend or anyone that knew him personally will come forth with some type of interview but it just don't look positive that they will but I know 100% that one of the above you mentioned did talk with FBI and tried to help but we may or may not hear of anything further at this point...I watch each day to see if anything new has been released but I also know it takes some serious time to positively link him to a particular victim and I'm sure it is just a long-drawn out process each lead requires to go further...I have hope they will sometime in the future at least share any more victims they can positively link to Keyes.
As far as family members, I do not think this will ever come out in public as far as them releasing information or doing interviews and I'm sure if this happened in my family I would do just as they have done...remain quiet

Just wondering if anyone else has ever thought about Keyes may have used Amtrak in some of his travels???......I have really thought long and hard on this subject...as far as I know he would not have had to give any identification (if so please correct me)...tons of stations in big cities and it would have been a perfect travel method when he did not wish to use rental cars or maybe just wanted to stay off car travel exposure for a period of time.......I'm thinking more of the southern US states when mentioning Amtrak, you can google map all the stations and there are tons in Georgia, Florida and etc.........Would love to hear from anyone else that has considered this method of travel for Keyes!!!

 

[scoobydoobie]

Keyes' father died on a train trip out of Maine, right? So I guess you could say there is a family history of riding on locomotives

But I feel bad posting about his family

But to address the naysayer attitude of giving up on his 8 unknown victims, I quote a nice article I just found at

http://www.seattleweekly.com/2013-01-23/news/israel-keyes-in-plane-sight/

"Though the heists were thousands of miles and years apart, security-camera videos show him wearing the same striped and padded gloves and holding what appears to be the same silver-and-black semiautomatic handgun at both banks. In other words, he had a pattern."

 

[Iwatchingeye]

I go back to this article often. It has good info. Does anyone know why the Israel Keyes blog was locked? It had a lot of good info I went back to often also. The author mentioned she was going to write a book.

 

[HereWeGo2]

Just wondering if anyone else has ever thought about Keyes may have used Amtrak in some of his travels???......I have really thought long and hard on this subject...as far as I know he would not have had to give any identification (if so please correct me)

You do have to give identification, at least that's been my experience.

However, I'm sure someone like him was fully capable of getting ahold of or creating fake ID.

 

[digndoodle]

You do have to give identification, at least that's been my experience.

However, I'm sure someone like him was fully capable of getting ahold of or creating fake ID.

Thanks for informing us on Amtrak, I have never traveled using it so I was not 100% sure but when I googled all the
stations for Amtrak there is tons of rails that seem to run all over the USA and would be so easy to get to a rural place
but I just keep wondering if FBI has checked to see if he did travel this form of transportation and hopefully we will find
out soon.

 

[chaplain1]

I believe Amtrack has required id since 9/11 or the Japanese subway attack. But, I could not find a policy.

 

[scoobydoobie]

http://www.chicagotribune.com/classified/automotive/chi-0109230240sep23-story.html#page=1

"After the Sept. 11 attacks, the FBI asked Amtrak and intercity bus operators to require passengers to show identification that matches the names on their tickets."

However, according to several internet discussions I found it seems they rarely actually check your ID, and that it varies by area.

Many posts like these....

"Unless they do the "random ID checks", it should not matter the name on the ticket! Except once (inside the NOL station - where they checked EVERY passenger's tickets), I have NEVER been asked for ID aboard a train. My name is David, but I've traveled with Marek's name on the ticket a few times without incident (as he doesn't travel that much, but wanted to keep his AGR account active). I doubt I could pass for Susan or Dorothy or Amanda though!"

 

[Backwoods]

I go back to this article often. It has good info. Does anyone know why the Israel Keyes blog was locked? It had a lot of good info I went back to often also. The author mentioned she was going to write a book.

bbm: I asked the same on here a while back. I hate that it's no longer accessible, too. I wonder if it doesn't have something to do with "the book" -- and also (related?), maybe she is communicating thereon with some of the Keyes family and/or acquaintances -- and doesn't want everything open to public perusal. I do miss that blog. Would like to know if the book is coming along...

 

[belmont]

I have often see the Israel Keyes blog referenced (on this site and others) as a valuable resource, but never had a chance to read it. I check it every day to see if it's unlocked- - hopefully soon!

 

[scoobydoobie]

I guess it makes sense that that blog is getting turned into a book. I remember there were parts of it that seemed like the person writing it either had inside information, maybe from a private interview, or that they were speculating in a storytelling kind of way. Specifically I remember it describing Keyes in Essex and him almost kidnapping someone outside the Pearl St. apartments and it was very detailed with imagery about the temperature, rain hitting his jacket, and some other details I can't remember now. I thought either the author is being creative and assuming, or that they possibly had access to a additional information.

 

[Skully]

I went back and reread the suicide note and put my thoughts down as I read each stance and after doing so, I can see where he was a good candidate to be one of these survivalist. I would bet there is a place that is set up for him to live, comfortably for months, undetected so he could just hunt and kill. He was a hunter, a hunter of humans. He felt superior to most of us, but cheated by us. Anyone who had success or money or he felt had a cushy life and didn't give back , he looked down on them. Yet he had no regard for life, no belief of a here after.

 

[Aynia]

That suicide note is one of the most bizarre things I ever read. Despite the FBI denying it, I still believe it holds many clues about his victims.

 

[gtm]

That suicide note is one of the most bizarre things I ever read. Despite the FBI denying it, I still believe it holds many clues about his victims.

I wouldn't waste time analyzing the suicide note. It is just an incoherent rambling of a depressed and suicidal nut trying to make some grand final statement; but failed to do so. Just incoherent rambling.

I know a lot about this case, and find nothing notable in the letter.

 

[scoobydoobie]

Gtm,
I didn't think Keyes seemed depressed, but I suppose my definition of depression is different than most folks. To me, the opposite of depression is vitality. In other words, I imagine depressed people laying in bed all day doing nothing, and Keyes seemed the exact opposite of that. But nobody really knows what goes on in other people's heads I suppose. Anyway, his suicide seemed more premeditated than the average 'emotional' suicide. I imagine he might have felt proud doing it, a final act of control, exercising power over the investigators and choosing his own destiny. So I wouldn't dismiss the possibility that he left a few faint clues or hidden messages in the note to **** with the FBI one more time. To put it another way, I think he killed himself because he was backed into a corner with no way out, not because he was depressed or sad or overly emotional. And in that sense, I would think he would try to save grace and **** with the FBI somehow in the note. The simple fact that he put it under his body knowing he was going to bleed all over it seems premeditated, like he wanted them to have to work really hard just to be able to read his note. But who really knows, oh yeah, the FBI does, but they aren't telling, imo. [emoji12]

 

[shandram19]

I wouldn't waste time analyzing the suicide note. It is just an incoherent rambling of a depressed and suicidal nut trying to make some grand final statement; but failed to do so. Just incoherent rambling.

I know a lot about this case, and find nothing notable in the letter.

Many thoughts crossed my mind when I read that note. I was wondering if his murder that he made look like an accident could have been made to look like a car accident. Looking at pictures of Samantha and Lorraine (spelling?) ,his known female victims, it looks like he likes reddish brown hair IMO. Also the picture of his family at his funeral, his mother has that same color/type of hair. There were a couple of other things in that note I pondered over but I can't remember without actually reading the note again, and right now I just don't have the time.


"If you pick up a starving dog and make him prosperous, he will not bite you. This is the principal difference between a dog and a man."

 

[Aynia]

FWIW I can't believe the 11 figure given by the FBI .
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel_Keyes

On August 12, 2012, the FBI said Keyes burglarized 20 to 30 homes across the United States and robbed several banks during that time period to fund his hobby of killing people. He may be linked to as many as 11 deaths in the U.S., and there might be even more victims outside the country.[

Seriously I just get this vibe that he was one of the most prolific serial killers ever...we wouldn't know about the Currier's fate if he didn't confessed... I sure wish my sleuthing capability would be enough to find more about his crimes.

 

[digndoodle]

Updated information on IK

Keyes traveled internationally and it is unknown if he committed any homicides while outside of the United States. In addition to the specific dates below, it is important to note that while living in New York, Keyes was in close proximity to the border with Canada and may have crossed into Canada on multiple occasions. He reported several trips to Montreal in which he sought out prostitutes. In addition, on his way to Alaska in 2007, Keyes drove alone through Canada.

Law enforcement is aware of the following dates of international travel:

04/20/2005 to 04/25/2005
British Columbia
10/3/2001 to 10/31/2005
Belize
03/01/2007 to 03/09/2007
Canada (drove to Alaska)
04/24/2007 to 05/04/2007
Mexico
12/11/2008 to 12/25/2008
Mexico

 

[scoobydoobie]

I can't remember if I posted about this before, but here goes...

Keyes' family moved to Smyrna, Maine in the late 90s and were involved in the maple syrup industry. If I google map car routes from Smyrna to Montreal I get three route options. Two go through Canada, but the third goes mostly through the US and crosses the border at Derby VT. A strange coincidence is that the Curriers owned a cabin there in Derby! Now if Keyes took this route he would have been driving for 7 hours or more before hitting the border. He seems the type to bring a gun for that long of a trip, and probably some marijuana too. He probably carried that stuff all the time everyday if I had to guess. But he can't pass the border carrying that, so what's the solution? Cache the guns and drugs near the border, get them on the way back. Did he somehow run across the curriers near the border? Maybe while he was sneaking around stashing his stuff or maybe while just passing through town? I listened to the audio interviews with keyes and one part gave me the impression the curriers were not random. The part where keyes is talking about after breaking into the garage and how he went into their car and went into the glove box to see if it was "the right house" and he saw a picture in the car too. It seemed he knew their names and immediately went to the glove box to check if the name was right. But the moment he said that I think he realized he didn't want to reveal why he really picked them. But he was rather sharp and had been a psycopath liar for so long he was able to quickly divert attention and started covering it up by saying, "yeah, you know, the right house with no kids and no dog hair in the car, and a ranch style house" I'm paraphrasing.