MI - Two couples robbed, stripped, sexually assaulted, Detroit, 16 July 2015

[~greeneyedgirl~]

I fear this case will not be solved at least not in the near or far future.

I haven't heard anything new about this case however this new article from day sure shows the bleakness of such a great city. It really saddens me, as I've said previously it's a beautiful view from my side and the food and great things to do there have been a huge factor in my whole life. As a border city almost all the "culture" we get en masses in in Detroit. Music and comedians and sports shows, the Detroit zoo, international car show, too many festivals to count, most of my big nights are done there. Now I don't go to the casinos there as we have our own and don't pay taxes on our winnings [emoji39]

http://detroit.cbslocal.com/2012/10...is-unsafe-for-visitors/#.VbYrp7G8qFk.facebook



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[dotr]

http://detroit.cbslocal.com/2015/07...lf-in-3-remain-at-large-in-detroit-gang-rape/

"DETROIT (WWJ) – A third man wanted in connection with two robberies and sexual assaults on Detroit’s west side has turned himself in to police — but insists he had nothing to do with the crimes.

Chico Bruce, 22, turned himself in Monday evening after authorities publicly identified him as a suspect in the attack, which happened July 16 in the area of West McNichols and Birwood Street, just blocks away from Marygrove College."

 

[Keefer]

Teach or have your children taught how to defend themselves. This means more than being able to use their cell phone camera or dialing 911.
If they are attacked they will likely be outnumbered in numbers and or weight. Take this into account very seriously, it's not a game.

 

[Always Amazed]

Teach or have your children taught how to defend themselves. This means more than being able to use their cell phone camera or dialing 911.
If they are attacked they will likely be outnumbered in numbers and or weight. Take this into account very seriously, it's not a game.

What teaching would you recommend? I have been taught self defense and even taken classes by a quite respected criminal profiler. In all cases avoidance of these situations has been recommended.

HOW does one defend themselves when outnumbered by a group? I have known a few instances where grown, large men, trained to fight (boxing), bouncers, etc. have been set upon by a group and they gave up their assets. If they can't fight a group what chance does a young couple out for a night on the town have?

I feel a great sadness for the couples that were victimized and outrage that their attackers have not all been apprehended.

 

[Keefer]

I agree wholeheartedly that avoiding certain people and situations is the most important thing. Just like a secure home should have a layered defense so should a person. Know the enemy and yourself and you may be able to get away. That said have you known any marines fresh out of boot camp? Attitude and confidence cannot be underestimated.

 

[Always Amazed]

I agree wholeheartedly that avoiding certain people and situations is the most important thing. Just like a secure home should have a layered defense so should a person. Know the enemy and yourself and you may be able to get away. That said have you known any marines fresh out of boot camp? Attitude and confidence cannot be underestimated.

I agree that attitude and confidence cannot be underestimated.

I don't know any Marines fresh out of bootcamp. I have known quite a few people with a military training. Not sure how that would play against a group of six men intent on gang rape though. Especially when they can terrorize one and hold that over the head of the other to gain compliance. It is a very scary situation.

I am not very familiar with Detroit, just what I read/hear about the city having so many problems. I would think this a big enough issue that LE would be deeply involved in an investigation to bring these criminals to justice.

I feel like if I had a business anywhere near these areas that I would also be working closely with LE, that I would try to acquire as much security equipment/personnel as I could afford to make this area safe for my customers/clients.

I'm not sure what the answer to stop this type of crime would be. It does not make Detroit a desirable destination for me.

 

[Keefer]

It is unlikely that society can be managed to the point that we will be safe from crime, do you agree? If so, who is ultimately responsible for your safety?
Do you want me to give you a detailed account of how a smaller force can prevail over a larger one in all circumstances? Please.
Who gets picked to be a victim? Why are some picked and some not?
criminals and predators can size up their prey quickly often without verbal communication.

 

[Constance]

I fear this case will not be solved at least not in the near or far future.

I haven't heard anything new about this case however this new article from day sure shows the bleakness of such a great city. It really saddens me, as I've said previously it's a beautiful view from my side and the food and great things to do there have been a huge factor in my whole life. As a border city almost all the "culture" we get en masses in in Detroit. Music and comedians and sports shows, the Detroit zoo, international car show, too many festivals to count, most of my big nights are done there. Now I don't go to the casinos there as we have our own and don't pay taxes on our winnings [emoji39]

http://detroit.cbslocal.com/2012/10...is-unsafe-for-visitors/#.VbYrp7G8qFk.facebook



Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

That news article is from 2012 and reads like political posturing to me.

Some here may be interested in the City of Detroit's official flag and the mottos on it:

Speramus Meliora = "We hope for better things" and Resurget Cineribus = "It will rise from the ashes"


For every bad guy you hear about there are 100 good ones working to make the city great again.

I believe in Detroit.

 

[dotr]

That news article is from 2012 and reads like political posturing to me.

Some here may be interested in the City of Detroit's official flag and the mottos on it:

Speramus Meliora = "We hope for better things" and Resurget Cineribus = "It will rise from the ashes"


For every bad guy you hear about there are 100 good ones working to make the city great again.

I believe in Detroit.

A diamond in the rough!
Every city has hoodlums, not just Detroit, which apparently has many fans!

[video=youtube;j0mv3RNKr14]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j0mv3RNKr14[/video]

 

[~greeneyedgirl~]

That news article is from 2012 and reads like political posturing to me.

Some here may be interested in the City of Detroit's official flag and the mottos on it:

Speramus Meliora = "We hope for better things" and Resurget Cineribus = "It will rise from the ashes"


For every bad guy you hear about there are 100 good ones working to make the city great again.

I believe in Detroit.

Thank you so much for bringing this to my attention I saw it for the first time yesterday... I must say in my defense its 100 degrees outside and my air conditioner broke down last Saturday and we finally got the new install today... My brain feels like it's been baking all week, I am so sorry for posting old information... (Hangs head in shame ...)


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[Constance]

A diamond in the rough!
Every city has hoodlums, not just Detroit, which apparently has many fans!

[video=youtube;j0mv3RNKr14]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j0mv3RNKr14[/video]

I think people either love it or hate it, there's not much in-between that I've seen. I try not to take slurs against it personally; I'm not even from there, just nearby, lol. I just really love that city. It's super exciting to see the positive changes that are happening there every day. The Detroit River Conservancy group is making a lot of really cool stuff happen. Thanks for the vid, gonna go watch it!

 

[Constance]

Thank you so much for bringing this to my attention I saw it for the first time yesterday... I must say in my defense its 100 degrees outside and my air conditioner broke down last Saturday and we finally got the new install today... My brain feels like it's been baking all week, I am so sorry for posting old information... (Hangs head in shame ...)


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

You're welcome, and no need to be ashamed -- it's super easy to overlook the date on online news stories. I don't envy your AC-less state in the humidity we've been having, ugh! I'm glad you've got it turned back on now!

 

[Always Amazed]

It is unlikely that society can be managed to the point that we will be safe from crime, do you agree? If so, who is ultimately responsible for your safety?
Do you want me to give you a detailed account of how a smaller force can prevail over a larger one in all circumstances? Please.
Who gets picked to be a victim? Why are some picked and some not?
criminals and predators can size up their prey quickly often without verbal communication.

I agree to a point we cannot expect to be "safe from crime". I also believe that we can all work together to make it safer for each other.

I do know about predators choosing their victims. I can't claim to know everything about it but I do know how to make oneself less (or more) vulnerable to attack.

Yes, a detailed account of how a smaller force can prevail over a larger one would be interesting.

 

[Keefer]

There are plenty of accounts in the history books of a smaller force defeating a larger one. Find the common variables and apply judiciously.
Here are a few hints; will the couple work as a team? Do they have a plan? Will they discuss where they will "draw the line" as to when they will be forced to commit to their plan. Say if they are told to separate, get into a vehicle or move to a more secluded place?
What is any female partners greatest asset ?
Much to ponder on besides actual cqc tactics wouldn't you say?

 

[dotr]

There are plenty of accounts in the history books of a smaller force defeating a larger one. Find the common variables and apply judiciously.
Here are a few hints; will the couple work as a team? Do they have a plan? Will they discuss where they will "draw the line" as to when they will be forced to commit to their plan. Say if they are told to separate, get into a vehicle or move to a more secluded place?
What is any female partners greatest asset ?
Much to ponder on besides actual cqc tactics wouldn't you say?

Had to look up cqc tactics, very interesting!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Close_quarters_combat
"Surprise

The objective is to complete all offensive action before the party being engaged is able to react. To gain this element of surprise, the entry teams use stealth movement and noise/light discipline to get as close to the targets as possible. The teams aim to put themselves in a position to be able to engage the targets from the moment they become aware of the teams. Some teams use suppressed sniper rifles for their initial shots on sentries or dogs.[4]

An assault should come at a time when least expected, taking into consideration fatigue, normal sleep periods, and other factors that detract from the target's alertness. Diversions are an essential element in achieving surprise. Staged emergencies, such as a mock auto accident, fire, or explosion near the crisis site, can divert the target's attention away from the assaulting elements. Explosive breaching and diversionary devices, such as flashbang, smoke, or gas grenades can be employed to distract and disorient the targets. Negotiators can try to manipulate the defenders into a more vulnerable position or convince them that their position will not be stormed.[4]"

 

[BetteDavisEyes]

Charges dropped against 3 accused in Detroit gang rape

Tom Greenwood, The Detroit News 12:49 p.m. EDT August 11, 2015

Detroit — Three males charged with a rape and gang attack on a woman and her boyfriend had all charges dismissed Tuesday morning when the complainants failed to appear in court.

All charges, including kidnapping, robbery and assault, were dropped without prejudice against Antoine Edward-Ikie Orr, 18, Chico Lee Bruce, 22, and Jordan Reese, 17, by 36th District Court Judge Kenneth King...

http://www.detroitnews.com/story/ne...s-dropped-accused-detroit-gang-rape/31462093/

http://www.clickondetroit.com/news/3-suspects-in-detroit-gang-rape-due-in-court-tuesday/34650062

 

[dotr]

Charges dropped against 3 accused in Detroit gang rape

Tom Greenwood, The Detroit News 12:49 p.m. EDT August 11, 2015

Detroit — Three males charged with a rape and gang attack on a woman and her boyfriend had all charges dismissed Tuesday morning when the complainants failed to appear in court.

All charges, including kidnapping, robbery and assault, were dropped without prejudice against Antoine Edward-Ikie Orr, 18, Chico Lee Bruce, 22, and Jordan Reese, 17, by 36th District Court Judge Kenneth King...

http://www.detroitnews.com/story/ne...s-dropped-accused-detroit-gang-rape/31462093/

http://www.clickondetroit.com/news/3-suspects-in-detroit-gang-rape-due-in-court-tuesday/34650062

Wonder if those guys got mixed up with these alleged perps?

Aug. 11/15
"Detroit police are investigating the reported robbery and sexual assault of two teens on the city's west side.

Police said the victims -- a 17-year-old girl and an 18-year-old man -- reported being approached early Tuesday morning on Mansfield Street by two gunmen who walked them to a vacant house.

Police said the boy was robbed and held on the floor while the girl was forced to perform sex acts on the gunmen."

http://www.clickondetroit.com/news/...-robbed-by-gunmen-detroit-police-say/34651794

 

[Hatfield]

Charges dropped against 3 accused in Detroit gang rape

Tom Greenwood, The Detroit News 12:49 p.m. EDT August 11, 2015

Detroit — Three males charged with a rape and gang attack on a woman and her boyfriend had all charges dismissed Tuesday morning when the complainants failed to appear in court.

All charges, including kidnapping, robbery and assault, were dropped without prejudice against Antoine Edward-Ikie Orr, 18, Chico Lee Bruce, 22, and Jordan Reese, 17, by 36th District Court Judge Kenneth King...

http://www.detroitnews.com/story/ne...s-dropped-accused-detroit-gang-rape/31462093/

http://www.clickondetroit.com/news/3-suspects-in-detroit-gang-rape-due-in-court-tuesday/34650062

I sure hope witness intimidation did not come into play.

Surely the victims were informed of the proper date and time to show up by LE ?

This is upsetting if the victims did not show due to lack of being informed or by some form of intimidation.

Uggggg. If they are guilty now they will be back on the street more empowered to do this again to someone else. This is upsetting to hear.

 

[heartfortruth]

I think I'm going to throw up. What kind of country are we turning into??

 

[Hatfield]

What teaching would you recommend? I have been taught self defense and even taken classes by a quite respected criminal profiler. In all cases avoidance of these situations has been recommended.

HOW does one defend themselves when outnumbered by a group? I have known a few instances where grown, large men, trained to fight (boxing), bouncers, etc. have been set upon by a group and they gave up their assets. If they can't fight a group what chance does a young couple out for a night on the town have?

I feel a great sadness for the couples that were victimized and outrage that their attackers have not all been apprehended.

These are great questions and a good discussion to have so we can learn from this tragedy.

JMO
There are some things I am trying to practice to avoid becoming a victim. I agree wth others that my best thing that I have been doing and working so far (lol) is to avoid places and times where I would be most at danger.

For me there is a certain area of town that I just will not go to after a certain time. Dark. LOL
The place changes after dark and I just avoid it. On the news almost daily the next day I always hear news reports of stabbings and killings in this area and usually it is very late at night.

So I have personally chosen to avoid it. I realize some people dont have an option to practice that when they have to work somewhere. They may have no choice to go to some areas.

That is where my 2nd best option that I do comes into play. And that is being armed. Its just a personal choice I have made and I am lucky to live in a place that allows conceal carry. Other people may not choose that option and may not even be allowed to have that option.

Even with that option I understand that it may not always work if I was ever in a terrible situation. For example someone may pull a weapon on me before I can even react.
But one thing I have come to accept is that every situation is unique so it is important to be able to decide and make the best decision possible.

And if I was ever in that situation that this example shows, there is a point where I would have to maybe make a decision that could get me killed or hurt badly. I may decide to do something anyway knowing I am likely to be hurt but I may choose to do it anyway and not just be a willing victim.

That is where things get very sticky. Each person has choices they would have to make and each situation is different.

There is no single way to deal with it and there is lots of good advice out there.
I think most people can agree that learning and getting educated and getting prepared in advance is the best advice. Its people that never even consider that someday something bad may happen that are the ones that would really struggle.

That is why your questions were really good ones. So thanks.