CA CA - Mark Wilson, 13, Quincy, 4 Nov 1967

[leilarose68]

Sheriff pledges to find funding to unearth the bones in the well

http://www.plumasnews.com/index.php...find-funding-to-unearth-the-bones-in-the-well

perhaps this sounds a bit crass, but can someone start a kickstarter for it? there has to be SOME way of getting the funds. telling the parents about this excavation and not being able to do it is unacceptable.

 

[Salem]

This is actually a problem with the County Board of Supervisors. They are really good at finding ways to get around things that should be done.

But - there has to be grant money or something out there.

Time to do some researching, I guess.

Salem

Sadly,

It sounds like "budget concerns" are more important to the investigators than finally perhaps getting some closure for Mark's loved ones! This is a human life we are talking about here!

Satch

 

[bflocket]

Is it me or do a lot of these boys that go missing have very similar features?

I happened to see his profile again from something on another thread. I'd seen it years ago, but there was little info then so I didn't really keep up with him.


When I viewed it again earlier today, I saw his pic and automatically assumed he went missing in the early (or any of the) 1970's. But it was a few years earlier...

I saw from the pic that he was a "Cute White Boy" that was starting to turn into a man.

With Corll, Kraft, Bonin, Eyler, Gacy, Kearney and a few other gay serial killers "coming out of the closet" (so to speak) throughout the 1970's and early '80's, that timeframe just came to mind.
Just look them up and see what their victims looked like. The victims weren't carbon copies of each other, but you'll get a good idea of their "type."

This boy fits that "look" to a "T."

I know that many of these serial killers (at least some of the CA ones) traveled a lot. I wonder if he could have been taken by one of them?

If there is not any reason to have suspicion on someone else for some personal grudge, this angle definitely needs to be looked into further.

 

[Satch]

I happened to see his profile again from something on another thread. I'd seen it years ago, but there was little info then so I didn't really keep up with him.


When I viewed it again earlier today, I saw his pic and automatically assumed he went missing in the early (or any of the) 1970's. But it was a few years earlier...

I saw from the pic that he was a "Cute White Boy" that was starting to turn into a man.

With Corll, Kraft, Bonin, Eyler, Gacy, Kearney and a few other gay serial killers "coming out of the closet" (so to speak) throughout the 1970's and early '80's, that timeframe just came to mind.
Just look them up and see what their victims looked like. The victims weren't carbon copies of each other, but you'll get a good idea of their "type."

This boy fits that "look" to a "T."

I know that many of these serial killers (at least some of the CA ones) traveled a lot. I wonder if he could have been taken by one of them?

If there is not any reason to have suspicion on someone else for some personal grudge, this angle definitely needs to be looked into further.

Greetings,

Interesting observations! What "looks" do you believe would make Mark an easy target for someone? I was always concerned with Mark being raised in a small town, that this would make him more trusting of strangers. The isolation of the roads and areas where Mark could have traveled from Meadow Valley California to Quincy, traveling through most-likely deserted streets. Mark may not have had time to flee a bad situation. Those close to the case seem to think that he got a "bad ride" when hitchhiking into town. Back than, the horrific dangers of hitchhiking were usually not discussed like they are today.

I think Mark's location and possible over trust of strangers led to a likely tragedy for him.

Satch

 

[leilarose68]

i really really hope they are able to take some action re: this well, soon.

 

[dmac]

[modsnip] The more we learn about 'the well', IF the three independent cadaver dogs' hits are about Mark, it seems he took a short-cut from home to the road he was to hitch-hike on. It means he never got so far as the main road. The well in question is supposed to be on private land directly between where he lived and that main road, with no other roads between.

We don't have a lot to go on, but the well is tangible, understandable, believable. [modsnip] What does Mark's adolescent features have to do with reality?

 

[Satch]

[modsnip] The more we learn about 'the well', IF the three independent cadaver dogs' hits are about Mark, it seems he took a short-cut from home to the road he was to hitch-hike on. It means he never got so far as the main road. The well in question is supposed to be on private land directly between where he lived and that main road, with no other roads between.

We don't have a lot to go on, but the well is tangible, understandable, believable. [modsnip] What does Mark's adolescent features have to do with reality?

Interesting points!

It didn't have to be a serial killer. However, it still could have been some sick individual who Mark trusted, lured him into a car, and killed him at some point later in the day or days ahead. Didn't Mark even tell his Mother that he had planned to hitchhike into town? How far is this well between Meadow Valley and Quincy?

Satch

 

[dmac]

"Orville Brown, the long-time Forest Service land surveyor, told me years ago that his family lived in the little house at the junction of Bucks Lake Road and Spanish Ranch Road, where the Pineleaf [creek] intersection comes in. His family moved the well house from the property on the rise above or across from their place, and attached it to their house for his bedroom. The left-behind well must have been covered over with planks, or some such. The location of this abandoned well is between the Wilson place and the road to town. It makes sense that that this well should be excavated."

link- see the comments at bottom

My point is Mark lived on rural property, and the well was on property between his home and the main road. It was probably a daily routine to cut across the property to hit the bus stop, which would have been located on the same main road where he intended to hitch into town (Bucks Lake Rd, now also known as the Oroville-Quincy Hwy). From the above-quoted description, the well and Wilson property was north of the junction pinpointed here. If so, it meant he had to cross the creek at this rural bridge to reach Bucks Lake Rd.

I just realized this morning a very good friend of mine has been friends with Mark's mom for decades, so I hope to soon know much more about where the property and well are, and other details pertinent to Mark's case.

 

[leilarose68]

"Orville Brown, the long-time Forest Service land surveyor, told me years ago that his family lived in the little house at the junction of Bucks Lake Road and Spanish Ranch Road, where the Pineleaf [creek] intersection comes in. His family moved the well house from the property on the rise above or across from their place, and attached it to their house for his bedroom. The left-behind well must have been covered over with planks, or some such. The location of this abandoned well is between the Wilson place and the road to town. It makes sense that that this well should be excavated."

link- see the comments at bottom

My point is Mark lived on rural property, and the well was on property between his home and the main road. It was probably a daily routine to cut across the property to hit the bus stop, which would have been located on the same main road where he intended to hitch into town (Bucks Lake Rd, now also known as the Oroville-Quincy Hwy). From the above-quoted description, the well and Wilson property was north of the junction pinpointed here. If so, it meant he had to cross the creek at this rural bridge to reach Bucks Lake Rd.

I just realized this morning a very good friend of mine has been friends with Mark's mom for decades, so I hope to soon know much more about where the property and well are, and other details pertinent to Mark's case.

i can't imagine what emotions this brings forward for the mom.

i wonder if there are any leads, considering a tip lead to this. i wonder if the killer was on his deathbed or something and suddenly felt guilt? the perp would be quite old by now.

 

[j123]

I don't at all mean this sarcastically, but how does one fall into a well? My knowledge of rural areas is very, very limited but I thought wells usually had structures above ground? Or if not, they would be covered? If a well had been left uncovered, I would imagine someone was probably using it regularly; since Mark could swim, wouldn't he have been found in time in that case?

 

[Satch]

there is no killer or deathbed. Or serial killer. If the well pans out and he's there, will any of you spend 100 years wondering if he fell or was he pushed?

The case is cold and has been since 67. Give drama a rest.

All of this could be true IF those remains are Mark. If not, than we are back to the hitchhiker/abduction theory. A good point raised. Let's say that the investigation happens, concludes, and yes, those are Mark's remains in the well. All of this could have been an accident if he fell. Did Mark just go out exploring an uncovered hole ,misstep and fall? If he got a bad ride hitchhiking, it would be a stretch that a killer would sadistically bury him in that well between the road and his own property. However, nut-cases are capable of anything.

The incredible sadness is that if this was an accident, he could have suffered in that well for a long time. For now, everything hinges on whether those remains are his or not.

Satch

 

[dmac]

three individual sets of cadaver dogs. All pointing to the well.

If you want to proclaim a serial killer did it, be on your very own. [modsnip]
I do NOT trust Hagwood for many other reasons, but this seems like Mark may be in that well.

[modsnip]

 

[Satch]

three individual sets of cadaver dogs. All pointing to the well.

If you want to proclaim a serial killer did it, be on your very own. [modsnip].

I do NOT trust Hagwood for many other reasons, but this seems like Mark may be in that well.

[modsnip]

For me,

I am just hoping for closure in this case. For Mark's family, for those that love, loved, and remember him. Let's hope it doesn't take three years to begin to investigate the well!

Satch

 

[leilarose68]

All of this could be true IF those remains are Mark. If not, than we are back to the hitchhiker/abduction theory. A good point raised. Let's say that the investigation happens, concludes, and yes, those are Mark's remains in the well. All of this could have been an accident if he fell. Did Mark just go out exploring an uncovered hole ,misstep and fall? If he got a bad ride hitchhiking, it would be a stretch that a killer would sadistically bury him in that well between the road and his own property. However, nut-cases are capable of anything.

The incredible sadness is that if this was an accident, he could have suffered in that well for a long time. For now, everything hinges on whether those remains are his or not.

Satch

if mark made a misstep and fell, why would there be a tip leading to this area after all this time? i don't think LE would send cadaver dogs out there, 50+ years after the disappearance just because someone was like 'oh why not check out that area.' no. it seems like someone decided to divulge specific information they had been withholding.

where exactly is this well located in relation to mark's house and where he went missing? it was my impression that the well was located close to where mark was presumed missing, and somewhat far away from mark's house. why is it so hard to believe a perp would dump a body in that well?

 

[Satch]

if mark made a misstep and fell, why would there be a tip leading to this area after all this time? i don't think LE would send cadaver dogs out there, 50+ years after the disappearance just because someone was like 'oh why not check out that area.' no. it seems like someone decided to divulge specific information they had been withholding.

where exactly is this well located in relation to mark's house and where he went missing? it was my impression that the well was located close to where mark was presumed missing, and somewhat far away from mark's house. why is it so hard to believe a perp would dump a body in that well?

Good point,

An almost fifty year "accident" with Mark falling into that well, now that I think about it just doesn't seem to add up very well. I mean, it could have still happened, but the Wilson family would seemingly be aware of the areas between their property and the road were this well was. Wouldn't that be one of the first things that LE would check out after taking to neighbors and family within weeks, not almost five decades later? In fact, why all this time in the first place? If this is a well between the Wilson's property and the roads, shouldn't that have been checked in November of 1967? If those remains are Mark, he was obviously there way back then.

If something has changed with a tip, it likely means that someone knows something, or saw something, or has information that is important to an investigation. Hiding "an accident" for fifty years seems like a stretch.

However, I want to know about this well in as much detail as possible. How enclosed was it? Could someone have fallen into it by accident? Or be purposely pushed into it? What years was the well used? What was the status of the well in November of 1967?

Satch

 

[leilarose68]

WHEN is the well going to be excavated? it's been forever! mark's poor family

 

[Satch]

Bumping for Mark. Waiting for answers!

Will this be the year we find out what happened?

Satch

 

[leilarose68]

Good point,

An almost fifty year "accident" with Mark falling into that well, now that I think about it just doesn't seem to add up very well. I mean, it could have still happened, but the Wilson family would seemingly be aware of the areas between their property and the road were this well was. Wouldn't that be one of the first things that LE would check out after taking to neighbors and family within weeks, not almost five decades later? In fact, why all this time in the first place? If this is a well between the Wilson's property and the roads, shouldn't that have been checked in November of 1967? If those remains are Mark, he was obviously there way back then.

If something has changed with a tip, it likely means that someone knows something, or saw something, or has information that is important to an investigation. Hiding "an accident" for fifty years seems like a stretch.

However, I want to know about this well in as much detail as possible. How enclosed was it? Could someone have fallen into it by accident? Or be purposely pushed into it? What years was the well used? What was the status of the well in November of 1967?

Satch

people go to the grave with all kinds of secrets.

 

[dmac]

Sorry for the lag in time, and also sorry for being a modsnip jacka$$ in my last post. I do have more info concerning the circumstances of his disappearance, particularly with the well theory. And, yes, I still strongly laugh at anyone who wants to attribute an MPD to their fave serial killer. it's asinine.

The critical point is understanding the terrain from where Mark lived to the road he was headed to, in order to get to Quincy from Meadow Valley. If he's down a well it's on nearby property, and it's hilly terrain about 1/2 to a 1/4 mile from crossing the only bridge around by which Mark could access the main road.

In other words, he may have died mere feet from his front door, never reaching the road where most abduction theories begin and end.

That's a reality, and not a serial killer in the mix.

PS. I've been unabashedly harsh towards LE due to personal experiences with other LE, not personal experiences with PCSO. My blanket statements about PCSO corruption are accurate, but I wrongfully lumped current sheriff Hagwood in with the other corrupt jackasses that have littered Plumas' past. I've had good dealings with Sheriff Hagwood and his staff. Also, if reading anything about the Keddie murders, when anyone says PCSO is corrupt, as always the meaning is very select few PCSO were screwing the case. Higher-ups were perverting justice, and it unfortunately reflects on the rest of the staff. It's not a blanket indictment, just like saying justice is rich and white. Oops, that last bit is 100% true.

I do apologize to Sheriff Hagwood and his entire staff. My apology isn't forced, my admission of my own shortcomings are the core issue. I get very frustrated and angry about the the case, and I make blanket (and blank) indictments, but nobody can place blame or a hook over Hagwood's head for 1981 Keddie. I've dealt with Hagwood and, as a result, find my own built-in rage towards PCSO to be blinding and stupid. I wrongfully lumped him in with the corrupt past.

Let Hagwood's legacy be of his own making, not built on snide BS remarks from a$$hats like me.

 

[dmac]

PS Hagwood made a sponsored video where his staff pulled unsuspecting people off the road and gave them ice cream instead of tickets. Hag donated his earnings from that gig to local charities.