AUS - Khandalyce Kiara Pearce (Wynarka) and mum Karlie Pearce-Stevenson (Belanglo) #1

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im still wondering why the killer didnt hide khandalyces body in belanglo when he hid her mother there, its such a huge dense forest he could have just thrown or buried her anywhere there? could this indicate karlie was murdered first and the little girl kept for awhile?
 
I've already forgotten who these two replies are to. My apologies!

1. Whoever asked about prisons in the ACT - Yes, there are and remand centres. And youth 'training' facilities.

2. If the authorities concluded Karlie wasn't australian because her bone isotope whosiwhatsits suggested she hadn't spent much time in australia (when in fact she was born and grew up in the alice and travelled around!) then what makes us put any faith that they could tell she had a bubba from her bones?

I don't mean that to be rude, I just believe that it could be a major undoing in any future case relying on this kind of evidence - It makes me very worried! Whomever said that they shouldn't narrow it down a bit solely on that kind of evidence - spot on.
I understand the hard work our forensics do - and appreciate it- but putting all stock in something that isn't an exact science can undo cases against perps!
 
silverau said:
I've already forgotten who these two replies are to. My apologies!

1. Whoever asked about prisons in the ACT - Yes, there are and remand centres. And youth 'training' facilities.

2. If the authorities concluded Karlie wasn't australian because her bone isotope whosiwhatsits suggested she hadn't spent much time in australia (when in fact she was born and grew up in the alice and travelled around!) then what makes us put any faith that they could tell she had a bubba from her bones?

I don't mean that to be rude, I just believe that it could be a major undoing in any future case relying on this kind of evidence - It makes me very worried! Whomever said that they shouldn't narrow it down a bit solely on that kind of evidence - spot on.
I understand the hard work our forensics do - and appreciate it- but putting all stock in something that isn't an exact science can undo cases against perps!
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I agree. Combined with the facial reconstruction (not to be rude, but it is just so completely wrong), the fact that they got so many things so far from the mark is worrying.
 
musicaljoke said:
No no... I surely don't mean that she killed her child. Not at all. But if a partner killed her child while she was still alive, she may have wrapped her daughter's body in a blanket and hid it somewhere close to her, but away from the murderer, and then Karlie was murdered by the same person who killed her child.

Someone completely unrelated to the crime, wishing to remain anonymous, may have found the bones, and left them out to be discovered somewhere other than his own back yard.
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I agree with your line of thinking Musicalnote
Khandlyce was killed first as a show of his capabilities to her mum
Mum wraps her daughter in the quilt. Mum killed sometime later and driven in mums car to dumping site in forest. Bubs body & belongings placed in boot and murderer returns home leaving the remains in boot of car in an isolated area for a considerable amount of time. Car more recently disposed of and body placed in suitcase and dumped in Wynarka by a second party
 
fruity said:
I agree. Combined with the facial reconstruction (not to be rude, but it is just so completely wrong), the fact that they got so many things so far from the mark is worrying.
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I read that Dr Hayes who did the facial reconstruction actually said that it should be used as a likeness. Which is fair. If you look closely (and ignore the hair), the angel depiction actually looks a lot like Khandalyce as an older girl! It's hard to see Karlie there because of Karlie's lack of facial fat and that hair.
 
silverau said:
I read that Dr Hayes who did the facial reconstruction actually said that it should be used as a likeness. Which is fair. If you look closely (and ignore the hair), the angel depiction actually looks a lot like Khandalyce as an older girl! It's hard to see Karlie there because of Karlie's lack of facial fat and that hair.
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Dr Hayes stated that it was not meant to be a photographic likeness but if you concentrate on the wide jaw for instance there will be a definite likeness. Which there is IMO
 
silverau said:
I've already forgotten who these two replies are to. My apologies!

1. Whoever asked about prisons in the ACT - Yes, there are and remand centres. And youth 'training' facilities.

2. If the authorities concluded Karlie wasn't australian because her bone isotope whosiwhatsits suggested she hadn't spent much time in australia (when in fact she was born and grew up in the alice and travelled around!) then what makes us put any faith that they could tell she had a bubba from her bones?

I don't mean that to be rude, I just believe that it could be a major undoing in any future case relying on this kind of evidence - It makes me very worried! Whomever said that they shouldn't narrow it down a bit solely on that kind of evidence - spot on.
I understand the hard work our forensics do - and appreciate it- but putting all stock in something that isn't an exact science can undo cases against perps!
Click to expand...

I completely agree. But I think that the woman who did the facial reconstruction was spot on.
If the missing persons report of Karlie would have turned up (even if it was withdrawn later) and it would have had a clear picture on it, the Belanglo State Forest Angel should have been identified much sooner.
 
This was actually published at the beginning of this month - uncanny that SMH compared the two cases!

http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/little-girl-lost-trying-to-identify-the-nameless-victim-of-wynarkas-homicide-20150923-gjt1ah.html

The case has similarities to the discovery of a girl's skeleton in NSW's Belanglo State Forest in 2010.
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and then the very last sentence

Until someone's conscience prompts them to come forward, both the girl in the suitcase and the girl in Belanglo State Forest will remain nameless.

Click to expand...

Published Oct 2nd 2015. The calls to crimestoppers came about a week and a half later.

Very uncanny.
 
silverau said:
This was actually published at the beginning of this month - uncanny that SMH compared the two cases!

http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/little-girl-lost-trying-to-identify-the-nameless-victim-of-wynarkas-homicide-20150923-gjt1ah.html



and then the very last sentence



Published Oct 2nd 2015. The calls to crimestoppers came about a week and a half later.

Very uncanny.
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That comparison could very well be what prompted the person that made the call to crimestoppers, to connect the dots. And name Khandelyce as the Wynarka girl.
 
Dogface said:
Also how do you pronounce our little Wynarka Angels name?
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I've heard it pronounced "Candle - eese." I heard the story on the radio driving home from work, before I had a chance to come home and turn on the computer.

As the owner of an unusual name myself, and fed up with years of teasing at school and having to spell it over and over for people, I'm not normally a fan of "kreeaytiv" names for kids, but I do like Khandalyce. It sounds pretty and rolls off the tongue easily.
 
Candles was only reported missing for a week someone told me a couple of pages back. So while they were reported missing. It was a very short period and taken off the register. Which was quite confusing, although, in the future....

Karlie was also in another 'state'.

I know government databases are being rapidly clustered but not sure whether a local police officer can go interstate at a whim, as yet.

This is procrastination on my behalf, but the quote may help others that missed it.
JaneSA said:
Paraphrasing my previous post <modsnip> from The Australian...

The Chief Commander of the NT Police explained that the missing persons report was cancelled by Colleen Povey (Karlie's mother) when she reported that she had got through to Karlie on her mobile phone and ascertained that she and her granddaughter were alive and well in Canberra. Police saw no reason to doubt Mrs Povey's evidence as she was clearly relieved.
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Rayemonde said:
Yeah - people keep saying that LE have done an amazing job, but if it wasn't for someone actually calling and telling them who Khandalyce was and actually sending them a photo of her with the quilt, they might never have discovered her identity. I know that waaaay back at the beginning of these threads people were speculating that little "Angel" was never reported missing because her mother had also been murdered, but we assumed that her DNA was being compared to all unidentified murdered women of childbearing age - obviously we were wrong.
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The key could just be decorative, other than that it reminds me of keys I kept on my diaries as a kid. However, considering the other trinkets around it, it looks more like a 'key to my heart' kind of keepsake.
 
How do we know the body was wrapped in the quilt ?
 
Inquiries were made with state agencies that deal with young runaways


They looked at the cases of missing children, like Quanne Diec, a 12-year-old who disappeared from Granville in 1998, but none matched up. Angel's DNA profile was handed to interpol but to date, investigators haven't had any matches.
They also explored the theory the girl came into Australia illegally and wasn't registered on any immigration records.
In a first for the NSW Homicide Squad, a facial anthropologist was brought in to create a image of what the girl's face may have looked like. A stable isotopes analysis was also done on her bones.
"The chemical markers that were in her tissue and bones indicated she had not spent much time in Australia," Detective Sergeant Tim Attwood told Fairfax Media.


http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/little-gi...tim-of-wynarkas-homicide-20150923-gjt1ah.html

This is where they went wrong. Looking for 12 year old runaways in stead of a 20 year old mother. And for someone who had not spend much time in Australia. While she in fact had lived there all her life.
They narrowed it down so much that if it hadn't been for the Wynarka remains, both probably never would have gotten a name.
 
What also puzzles me if they haven't been able to see Karlie had given birth to a child by investigating her pelvic bones. They assumed she was a lot younger than she actually was.
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Being young (18yo when she had Khandelyce) and small & with a slight build, she may have had a C-section. It would mean the pelvis never got to stretch by having a baby pass through the birth canal. Her slight build (remember that her fellow netball players called her "Mouse" because she was small and very quick) would also explain why estimates of her age tended to be towards the lower side. I actually read estimates of 13-25 and 15-25 which are actually correct.
 
The facial anthropologist probably also based the reconstruction on the facial features of a 12 year old. I bet if she had been told to reconstruct the face of a 20 year old mother living a hard life, it would have been stunning.
 
plongi said:
All immunization records were supposedly checked. This little girl was last immunized at 18 months so why didn't she come up as dropping from the records? and if she did come up as missing her jabs, she couldn't have been physically sighted as maybe at risk by the task force... sloppy or did they know.
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I'm assuming the immunization schedule is the same in South Australia - in VIC, after the 18-month jabs, the next scheduled shots are the pre-school ones (age 4-5). If she went missing/ died between those times it would not have raised any alarm bells. And even if she missed her 4-5yo jabs, the health authorities may have contacted her family doctor and been told "we haven't seen her for 2 1/2 years - we don't have a current address for her".
 
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