VA - Nicole Lovell, 13, Blacksburg, 27 January 2016 #3 *Arrests*

[danzn16]

If I had done this at 19, and had the guts to then COMPLAIN to my parents about jail.... Wow. They would have NO sympathy! They would say, "I guess you shouldn't have committed murder."

My parents would tell the judge to take out the mattress and let me sleep on the concrete floor. Wow.


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[Night-owl]

You cannot be charged with murder in Virginia if you are just an accessory, however often the sentencing for accessory to murder before the fact is the same as murder, 20 years TO life. So while the charge isn't the same, the penalty can be.

I am curious as to why the FBI is getting involved. I wonder if they are going to make a federal case out of this. In Virginia the two barely miss one of the capital murder qualifications, the murder of a 13 year old is a capital crime if the perpetrator is 21 or over. But that is state law. Since this involved a juvenile and they took the body over state lines, maybe that is where the FBI comes in. But sometimes when under state law you cannot get a capital crime or the death penalty, the feds step in. For example in the early 2000s when the DC/MD/Va area had the sniper killing people, Maryland wanted to try him first but they don't have the death penalty, so the feds threatened to take the case on federal charges unless Maryland agreed to let Virginia try him first as a capital crime for one of the Virginia shootings (I think the one in Fairfax), so if Virginia got him first he was found guilty of capital murder and sentenced to death. I'm just guessing here.

FBI probably since the body was transported across state lines.

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[mayita]

My parents would tell the judge to take out the mattress and let me sleep on the concrete floor. Wow.


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Same here. My parents would have probably seated on the victim's family side and told the prosecutor to lock me up and throw away the key. Sigh. Latin parents do not play.

 

[Night-owl]

I agree it does occasionally happen. It doesn't appear that Natalie's involvement will rise to the charge of murder, and she hasn't been charged with that yet.

I did try to find a case quickly on google that someone who drove the getaway car was charged with murder, and couldn't do it although I only spent a couple minutes. Someone who was driving a getaway car and struck and killed a baby in a stroller was charged with murder, but it was because he struck the child.

I think that charge is coming. Not as if the prosecution really needs either DE or NK to prove a crime.

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[NCsleuther]

So it appears now that it was her lawyer and NK asking for bail citing the ridiculous reasons of diet (that we all think is BS now), etc.
who are these lawyers anyway. Swedish fish, mattresses, Disney princess club..: way to bring up the important stuff... Smh

I think the lawyers are trying to normalize her in the eyes of the court and the public. She sounds like less of a monster when you describe her as a Disney Princess loving swedish fish eating teenager.

 

[Night-owl]

I agree it does occasionally happen. It doesn't appear that Natalie's involvement will rise to the charge of murder, and she hasn't been charged with that yet.

I did try to find a case quickly on google that someone who drove the getaway car was charged with murder, and couldn't do it although I only spent a couple minutes. Someone who was driving a getaway car and struck and killed a baby in a stroller was charged with murder, but it was because he struck the child.

http://www.nhregister.com/general-n...-murder-in-robbery-that-led-to-fatal-shooting

http://theprez98.blogspot.com/2013/11/get-away-driver-gets-felony-murder.html?m=1

And here is a case where the police shot a girl and the father is charged with murder

http://m.nydailynews.com/news/natio...ed-constable-charged-murder-article-1.2513820

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[JohnTate90210]

From Minnesota. A woman hired a hitman who proceeded to kill her boyfriend. She was charged with second-degree murder.

http://www.twincities.com/2015/09/0...ys-she-arranged-for-hitman-to-kill-boyfriend/

I'm still looking for a good Virginia case but these hitman attempts don't seem to work out too often. Here's a woman who attempted to hire a hitman. She was charged with soliciting for murder, attempted capital murder for hire and "for intending to murder."

http://wtvr.com/2015/11/20/tammy-kelly-grandmother-hitman-arrest/

 

[JohnTate90210]

Keepers shouldn't be so worried about the mattress since she'll be occupied with illness from the gluten!

 

[Missoni]

http://uk.businessinsider.com/murder-and-kidnap-of-nicole-lovell-2016-2?r=US&IR=T

Snipped from the article above - the full quote is a reminder of how this affects friends too:

"The David I knew had his faults, but this is beyond the scope of imagination," Gaige Kern, who ran cross country with Eisenhauer at Virginia Tech, wrote on Facebook.

 

[Inthedetails]

I think the lawyers are trying to normalize her in the eyes of the court and the public. She sounds like less of a monster when you describe her as a Disney Princess loving swedish fish eating teenager.

I guess that is what they were trying to do, but imo, it totally backfired. A little 13yo was murdered....it's hardly the time to say how sweet the accused perp is by talking about candy and princesses. It looks thoughtless to the victim and it looks pampered. She should be released on bail because she likes candy, princesses, and a comfortable mattress?

When this case first broke, I assumed NK got caught into something over her head. After yesterday, I think she's a monster.

JMO at the moment, subject to change. I realize we don't have all the info yet.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

I agree it does occasionally happen. It doesn't appear that Natalie's involvement will rise to the charge of murder, and she hasn't been charged with that yet.

I did try to find a case quickly on google that someone who drove the getaway car was charged with murder, and couldn't do it although I only spent a couple minutes. Someone who was driving a getaway car and struck and killed a baby in a stroller was charged with murder, but it was because he struck the child.

What Keepers did is more inline with masterminds who had someone else do the actual murder. Like females who have had a male murder her parents etc. or talked them into murdering a female rival. The mastermind is also charged with first degree since they were a part of the plot to murder.

Or like Fred Tozars, Rabbi Neulander, or James Sullivan who were the masterminds behind murders done by someone else, and I believe they all... not only were convicted of first degree murder, but were also sentenced to death.

To me anyone who is part of a plot to murder someone.. even choosing the weapon to be used on the victim... should be charged equally along with the actual murderer. If Keepers had any part of this by setting up Nicole in any manner she should be charged with first degree murder or conspiracy to commit first degree murder.

I don't think we really know what will become known as the investigation goes along. No investigation stay the same and is constantly fluid as more information and evidence is collected. So she certainly could have additional charges added later on and so could DE.

I don't believe for one second Keepers wasn't there as Nicole was being murdered. She was too excited about being involved and it makes no sense she would want to miss the main part.

IMO

 

[Mims]

Narcissism might or might not be relevant in this case, but I found this interesting.

This is a quote from a book called The Narcissism Epidemic: Living in the Age of Entitlement by Jean M. Twenge and W. Keith Campbell

In data from 37,000 college students, narcissistic personality traits rose just as fast as obesity from the 1980s to the present, with the shift especially pronounced for women. The rise in narcissism is accelerating, with scores rising faster in the 2000s than in previous decades.

This is not surprising to me. Look at the way kids are raised now. It starts with the whole Princess crap, every little girl is a princess now. Then it moves on to parents being friends to their kids, instead of teaching them empathy, and gratefulness, personal responsibility, and kindness to others, etc. Mom and dad rush to schools when their angels are in trouble, threatening to sue, because their babies would NEVER!!! Then they watch shows like My Super Sweet 16, and all the other crap on MTV. It is completely understandable that kids are more and more narcissistic when you look at the culture they are exposed to from a very young age. This is a scary trend that needs to end.

 

[rob]

http://definitions.uslegal.com/h/hand-of-one-is-hand-of-all-theory/

The hand of one is the hand of all.

In SC (I thought it was everywhere), if you are present at a crime, participate in any way, are aware and don't report it, you will be charged just the same as the person who did it.
I had assumed that if NK was present or involved in the planning, she would be charged with murder same as DE.
Oh well, live and learn.

 

[rob]

What Keepers did is more inline with masterminds who had someone else do the actual murder. Like females who have had a male murder her parents etc. or talked them into murdering a female rival. The mastermind is also charged with first degree since they were a part of the plot to murder.

Or like Fred Tozars, Rabbi Neulander, or James Sullivan who were the masterminds behind murders done by someone else, and I believe they all... not only were convicted of first degree murder, but were also sentenced to death.

To me anyone who is part of a plot to murder someone.. even choosing the weapon to be used on the victim... should be charged equally along with the actual murderer. If Keepers had any part of this by setting up Nicole in any manner she should be charged with first degree murder or conspiracy to commit first degree murder.

I don't think we really know what will become known as the investigation goes along. No investigation stay the same and is constantly fluid as more information and evidence is collected. So she certainly could have additional charges added later on and so could DE.

I don't believe for one second Keepers wasn't there as Nicole was being murdered. She was too excited about being involved and it makes no sense she would want to miss the main part.

IMO

Based on the statement BE made at his arrest and her statement about being excited about being a part of it, I'm not totally convinced she didn't yield the knife.

 

[JeannaT]

http://definitions.uslegal.com/h/hand-of-one-is-hand-of-all-theory/

In SC (I thought it was everywhere), if you are present at a crime, participate in any way, are aware and don't report it, you will be charged just the same as the person who did it.
I had assumed that if NK was present or involved in the planning, she would be charged with murder same as DE.
Oh well, live and learn.

Well, I'm sure glad that's not true everywhere. That takes "punishing the whole class for the misbehavior of one" to a twisted extreme.

If someone is murdered in the commission of a petty burglary, the murderer, and accessories should be charged, and not the one who stands there in horror with their mouth open, in my opinion. And thank goodness in the opinion of most courtrooms. Otherwise everyone standing around during a crime would be in prison. There'd be no one left to be wardens.

 

[whiskers]

Is this the first time DE lured Nicole out of her window? Did they meet up in person before this night? People keep saying Nicole planned to tell on DE and expose him, but wouldn't that mean they had to have met before?

 

[QueenBea13]

"Eisenhauer was taken to the Blacksburg Police Department on January 30, where he denied involvement but admitted to communicating with Lovell and driving to her house on or about the time of the last message, received at 12:39 a.m. on January 27. He said he saw Lovell come out of her window at her Lantern Ridge apartment, gave her a “side hug” and returned to Virginia Tech to see his close friend, Keepers, Pettitt explained."

Hmmmm sounds like he expected they would be each others' alibi. Whoops

Or he just "delivered the goods" to NK, maybe he didn't do anything....seems NK is the one spilling all the beans, imo to glorify it or relive this exciting moment of her life. She really seems to enjoy talking about it, hence the reason she told her roommate all about it as soon as she got back, like she was telling her about the super duper date she'd just went on.
It's possible all DE did was lure NL out of her house, brought NL to NK & then helped load the body & drove, almost like their roles in this are totally reversed!
Just thinking out loud here & it strikes me odd all this talking NK keeps doing & makes me doubt just how much she supposedly wasn't involved.


The thoughts & opinions stated above are that, MY random thoughts & opinions.

 

[pappa rob]

LOL I thought the same thing. She's only allergic to the gluten in jail food. :facepalm:

More likely just allergic to jail food. It's not like anything she's used to. There's no way for her to pick and choose what she wants to eat..

 

[JeannaT]

This discussion reminds me of a case about 5 years ago in the Dallas area. There were two teens who were planning to meet up to buy a misdemeanor amount of marijuana from another couple of teens. In the process, the driver of the car of teens who wanted to buy marijuana shot the dealer, completely to the surprise of the other teen in the car.

In court, the prosecutor tried to pin murder on the one unsuspecting marijuana buying passenger, but the charges didn't stick. The defense lawyer argued that the surviving teen in the other car (the car that contained the murdered dealer) was just as culpable - even more so than the witnessing teen in the buyers car, because the surviving teen in the other car was participating in a higher crime - selling, not buying marijuana.

In any case, only the actual murderer was charged with murder and the witnesses were charged with something lesser.

Sorry I don't have a link. The case involved classmates of my nephew.

 

[JeannaT]

Is this the first time DE lured Nicole out of her window? Did they meet up in person before this night? People keep saying Nicole planned to tell on DE and expose him, but wouldn't that mean they had to have met before?

I think it's been established they met before, but I haven't heard any further details.