ID - DeOrr Kunz, Jr., 2, Timber Creek Campground, 10 July 2015 - #30

[koios]

I've commented about this before. Obviously Jessica knew her Mom couldn't take phone calls because she was texting her earlier that morning (about the personal items). Yet when Deorr supposedly goes missing, she suddenly forgets, and starts calling her repeatedly, yet DOESN'T SEND A TEXT that he is missing? Trina sent me a screen shot of all her messages from Jess that day. One in the morning, about 9:30ish saying she started her monthly and needed to go to town, one around 12:30 saying all was well and they were headed back to the campsite, then one very strange message at 2:26 stating "911", which is when she finally called 911. Why would she text her mom "911", if she had just spoken with her (according to Trina) and mom told her to call 911? Isn't that what Trina stated? She told Jess to call 911, then she did? If she did so immediately after talking to her mom, why did she need to text her "911"?

Thankyou for that very useful information SubtleGrace. To explain the text from J to T containing simply "911" I think turtletur has offered a good idea

Maybe Trina called Jessica back to make sure she was calling and Jessica texted her "911" to show her she was on the phone with them?

The call from J to 911 is officially time-stamped at 2:28:04, this time is according to the clock of the 911 recording system at Salmon dispatch center, which was a recently installed new state of the art system, and likely to have an accurate clock,. The text from J to T containing simply "911" is timed at 2:26 but this is according to the clock on T's mobile, which I suggest would be less accurate, and was probably a little more than 2 minutes ahead of real time, which would mean the real time of that text was sometime after 2:28:04, in other words, sent by J during her 911 call. All MOO.

 

[The Apparition]

Thankyou for that very useful information SubtleGrace. To explain the text from J to T containing simply "911" I think turtletur has offered a good idea

The call from J to 911 is officially time-stamped at 2:28:04, this time is according to the clock of the 911 recording system at Salmon dispatch center, which was a recently installed new state of the art system, and likely to have an accurate clock,. The text from J to T containing simply "911" is timed at 2:26 but this is according to the clock on T's mobile, which I suggest would be less accurate, and was probably a little more than 2 minutes ahead of real time, which would mean the real time of that text was sometime after 2:28:04, in other words, sent by J during her 911 call. All MOO.

Really?

To what end do are you going through these machinations? Why would the clock on anyone's cell phone be 2 minutes fast? With your love of telecom trivia, I imagine you'd know phones get "network" time. What that means to you and I (and Trina's phone) is that your phone is always getting up to the second time information from it's cell network. Gone are the days of "oh my clock must be fast" being a viable excuse. Anyone with a plugged in cable box, cell phone, or computer with internet connection has accurate synchronized time with no effort.

 

[bluesneakers]

Thankyou for that very useful information SubtleGrace. To explain the text from J to T containing simply "911" I think turtletur has offered a good idea

The call from J to 911 is officially time-stamped at 2:28:04, this time is according to the clock of the 911 recording system at Salmon dispatch center, which was a recently installed new state of the art system, and likely to have an accurate clock,. The text from J to T containing simply "911" is timed at 2:26 but this is according to the clock on T's mobile, which I suggest would be less accurate, and was probably a little more than 2 minutes ahead of real time, which would mean the real time of that text was sometime after 2:28:04, in other words, sent by J during her 911 call. All MOO.

Has this been proven, or mentioned by LE, or in MSM? If not, what are you basing this "suggestion" on?

 

[ZooSleuth]

Really?

To what end do are you going through these machinations? Why would the clock on anyone's cell phone be 2 minutes fast? With your love of telecom trivia, I imagine you'd know phones get "network" time. What that means to you and I (and Trina's phone) is that your phone is always getting up to the second time information from it's cell network. Gone are the days of "oh my clock must be fast" being a viable excuse. Anyone with a plugged in cable box, cell phone, or computer with internet connection has accurate synchronized time with no effort.

The cell phone clock is more likely to be accurate IMO for the reasons you mentioned. The 911 clock may have to be set manually or it uses a different internet server than the cell tower does to sync up the time. Whatever clock was correct is pretty much irrelevant though because it does not explain the reason she would text her mom 911.

 

[The Apparition]

The cell phone clock is more likely to be accurate IMO for the reasons you mentioned. The 911 clock may have to be set manually or it uses a different internet server than the cell tower does to sync up the time. Whatever clock was correct is pretty much irrelevant though because it does not explain the reason she would text her mom 911.

I certainly don't want to argue with you ZooSleuth you're one of the good ones!

My only contention is anything hooked to a network is getting the same time. Take your cell and stand next to your cable box and the time is synced perfectly, ditto for your laptop. They are all getting "internet" time so there is no variation. Any modern call center has the phones synced up to the the computer system and is using VOIP connections. Nerd alert: most people are already using VOIP (voice over internet protocol) for their business and land phone needs. Copper wire i.e non smart phone lines are virtually extinct. No internet connection, no talkie in other words.

Your most important point and one that I agree with entirely is this hypothetical time difference doesn't explain the text anyways.

 

[ZooSleuth]

I certainly don't want to argue with you ZooSleuth you're one of the good ones!

My only contention is anything hooked to a network is getting the same time. Take your cell and stand next to your cable box and the time is synced perfectly, ditto for your laptop. They are all getting "internet" time so there is no variation. Any modern call center has the phones synced up to the the computer system and is using VOIP connections. Nerd alert: most people are already using VOIP (voice over internet protocol) for their business and land phone needs. Copper wire i.e non smart phone lines are virtually extinct. No internet connection, no talkie in other words.

Your most important point and one that I agree with entirely is this hypothetical time difference doesn't explain the text anyways.

I don't know enough about 911 call center equipment to know about how they set the time. If they're using VOIP you're definitely correct the time is synced to the internet. Even so, not all internet synced time is exactly the same because it all depends on what time server they use to fetch/sync the time from and those aren't necessarily synced with each other. In my experience the difference is usually, but not always, only a matter of seconds, if there is any difference at all. (Source: I'm a web dev and have seen time servers +-1-2 minutes difference between the clock on my phone. That's not common though and probably wasn't the case here.)

The main point I was trying to make is that a cell phone's clock should be dead-on accurate as long as it has service because it's not going to be based off of a clock inside of the device. It's synced off the tower, which is synced off an internet timer server, as you stated. I was definitely not disagreeing with you but I didn't make that very clear in my post.

 

[koios]

Really?

To what end do are you going through these machinations? Why would the clock on anyone's cell phone be 2 minutes fast? With your love of telecom trivia, I imagine you'd know phones get "network" time. What that means to you and I (and Trina's phone) is that your phone is always getting up to the second time information from it's cell network. Gone are the days of "oh my clock must be fast" being a viable excuse. Anyone with a plugged in cable box, cell phone, or computer with internet connection has accurate synchronized time with no effort.

Just trying to solve the times of the calls and texts. I knew the majority of cellphones synch time of the network but didn't realise that 100% of cellphones do so thankyou Apparition for correcting me.

 

[koios]

I don't know enough about 911 call center equipment to know about how they set the time. If they're using VOIP you're definitely correct the time is synced to the internet. Even so, not all internet synced time is exactly the same because it all depends on what time server they use to fetch/sync the time from and those aren't necessarily synced with each other. In my experience the difference is usually, but not always, only a matter of seconds, if there is any difference at all. (Source: I'm a web dev and have seen time servers +-1-2 minutes difference between the clock on my phone. That's not common though and probably wasn't the case here.)

The main point I was trying to make is that a cell phone's clock should be dead-on accurate as long as it has service because it's not going to be based off of a clock inside of the device. It's synced off the tower, which is synced off an internet timer server, as you stated. I was definitely not disagreeing with you but I didn't make that very clear in my post.

Thanks. Salmon dispatch had 275K of new equipment early 2014, so I'm guessing the recording equipment clock is probably synced off a time server, but could be wrong.
And if a cellphone is synced off a time server, it should still be very accurate even after a few hours without service.
So I'm leaning towards the Salmon recording timestamp clock, and the individuals' cellphone clocks, all being accurate. All MOO
http://salmonidaho.com/content/grant-awarded-lemhi-county-update-911-system

 

[ZooSleuth]

Thanks. Salmon dispatch had 275K of new equipment early 2014, so I'm guessing the recording equipment clock is probably synced off a time server, but could be wrong.
And if a cellphone is synced off a time server, it should still be very accurate even after a few hours without service.
So I'm leaning towards the Salmon recording timestamp clock, and the individuals' cellphone clocks, all being accurate. All MOO
http://salmonidaho.com/content/grant-awarded-lemhi-county-update-911-system

BBM: Since we are talking about a timestamp on a text on TBC's phone, which would have had service all day long, this doesn't even apply.

I'd also like to add that 2:26 is the very earliest that Jessica could have sent the text if that's the timestamp from TBC's phone. Texts aren't instantaneous (although they are close to it) and can take longer to go through depending on where the two phones are in relation to towers. So it could have been sent from J's phone at 2:24 or 2:25 even if it arrived at TBC's phone at 2:26, which makes it even more likely the 911 text came before the 911 call.

So if you're in agreement the clocks on TBC's phone and the 911 center are close to being exactly synced, then you must believe the 911 text at 2:26 more than likely happened before the 911 call. And if that's the case then we are back to zero reasonable explanations for the 911 text.

 

[The Apparition]

Well at least it seems "we" all came to basically the same conclusion for once. Thanks for the info about the time servers ZooSleuth. I had always thought they were within seconds of each other, didn't know they could vary more. Perhaps it's the area I live in but all of my stuff seems like it is controlled by sorcery as my cell (AT&T) switches exactly at the same time as my Fios stuff in the house.

The fact Jessica sent a 911 text to her mom certainly seems like some kind of collusion on their part as if they are carefully trying to stage timing. I don't want to go in too deep (gotta respect the board's TOS) but I feel like Trina knows what happened. I also thought it was kinda a Freudian slip when she said if she was present on the trip she'd be a suspect also, but perhaps I've just seen too many old Columbo episodes.

 

[Deleted member 102539]

I've commented about this before. Obviously Jessica knew her Mom couldn't take phone calls because she was texting her earlier that morning (about the personal items). Yet when Deorr supposedly goes missing, she suddenly forgets, and starts calling her repeatedly, yet DOESN'T SEND A TEXT that he is missing? Trina sent me a screen shot of all her messages from Jess that day. One in the morning, about 9:30ish saying she started her monthly and needed to go to town, one around 12:30 saying all was well and they were headed back to the campsite, then one very strange message at 2:26 stating "911", which is when she finally called 911. Why would she text her mom "911", if she had just spoken with her (according to Trina) and mom told her to call 911? Isn't that what Trina stated? She told Jess to call 911, then she did? If she did so immediately after talking to her mom, why did she need to text her "911"?

bbm

Maybe the text "911" meant the green light for TBC to be prepared from that time getting a call from police. Maybe VDK called 911, J texted to TBC and then also called herself immediately 911.

 

[Deleted member 278]

bbm

Maybe the text "911" meant the green light for TBC to be prepared from that time getting a call from police. Maybe VDK called 911, J texted to TBC and then also called herself immediately 911.

why would the police call TBC?

 

[Maggie_Mayz]

bbm

Maybe the text "911" meant the green light for TBC to be prepared from that time getting a call from police. Maybe VDK called 911, J texted to TBC and then also called herself immediately 911.

That is how I took it or see it.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Tapatalk

 

[Deleted member 102539]

why would the police call TBC?

You (TBC) never would exactly know when police would have a question to closest relatives, maybe because of some mentions V would do after the 911-call or J or old papa RW ..... very insecure this whole situation for all involved. Someone with a guilty conscience would have even more fear LE would perhaps call for information/questioning/confirming some alleged facts/....

Btw: Why had TBC to know the exact time for J going to Leadore and buying some utensils which are completely unimportant for a mother (at another town, at work) to learn of if her daughter is an adult woman with three (!) children, currently just "camping" or "fishing" at a far away campground??? When I think about it: was that another signalling? "Let us meet there near X between x hour and x hour and maybe change cars/change whatever ...?" My thoughts only.

 

[ZooSleuth]

bbm

Maybe the text "911" meant the green light for TBC to be prepared from that time getting a call from police. Maybe VDK called 911, J texted to TBC and then also called herself immediately 911.

But didn't she just get off the phone with TBC immediately prior to calling 911? And in that convo didn't TBC tell J to call 911?

Say I am on the phone with a friend and they tell me to hang up the phone and order a pizza. Would it make any sense if I texted my friend "pizza" after getting off the phone with them, before calling in the order for pizza?

 

[neesaki]

I just remembered something from a few years ago, when you text 911 to someone it means it's important and you need them to call you immediately. As in emergency.

 

[ZooSleuth]

I just remembered something from a few years ago, when you text 911 to someone it means it's important and you need them to call you immediately. As in emergency.

Yup, and that dates all the way back to pagers/beepers. In this situation though, when she had just got off the phone with her mom where they discussed calling 911, it seems out of place.

 

[neesaki]

Yup, and that dates all the way back to pagers/beepers. In this situation though, when she had just got off the phone with her mom where they discussed calling 911, it seems out of place.

Except do we know without a doubt that J actually talked to her mother before the 911 text? I actually don't recall if this timeline was from TBC or if it's been verified by LE or Klein.

I'm just thinking she may have sent it because TBC hadn't returned her calls.

 

[ZooSleuth]

Except do we know without a doubt that J actually talked to her mother before the 911 text? I actually don't recall if this timeline was from TBC or if it's been verified by LE or Klein.

I'm just thinking she may have sent it because TBC hadn't returned her calls.

Ya I could be wrong, I always thought the story was she was trying to get a hold of her mom and when she finally spoke to her she said to call 911. The timeline in this case is a moving target so it's hard to keep track of.

 

[koios]

Just to explain where I was coming from, my cellphone never syncs the time. Yes "auto time" is turned on in the settings. I set it 10 minutes fast to test it. Hours later it is still 10 minutes fast. But I'm not in USA.