AZ - Isabel Mercedes Celis, 6, Tucson, 20 April 2012 - #25

[Mountain Misst]

Other than it wasn't 'happenstance'... IMO someone has told someone.

LE doesn't say what lead them to the remains either.

 

[diamond12]

Both parents, and her brothers were all in the house.
I can't remember if JM (uncle) was there that night. IIRC, he came to the house the next day after 911 was called.

JM wasn't there, he lived nearby though and that night supposedly he was with a friend. As you mentioned he arrived that morning and I remember him talking a lot with the press, I thought it was a bit weird.

 

[diamond12]

I have someone of interest who lives in the area where the child's remains were found. As I am outside the US am unable to search everywhere y'all can. He connects back to a family member - they provided an alibi for each other at the time of the child's disappearance.

http://www.findmugshots.com/arrests/sabastian_blake_hartsfield_id_4281428.html

Is this the friend of the uncle/cousin JM?

I'm seeing several reports stating her remains were found in a remote woodland. So a forested area of Pima County?

I wrote that yesterday as well, I started seeing articles mention woodland, it could help better understand the exact place if true.

 

[BetteDavisEyes]

Missing Arizona Girl Found Dead 5 Years After Vanishing from Her Bed — but the Case Isn’t*Closed

By KC Baker•@kcbaker77777

Posted on April 3, 2017 at 1:32pm EDT

The remains of a 6-year-old girl in Arizona were found, five years after she was reported missing

On Friday, nearly five years after investigators believe 6-year-old Isabel Celis was taken from her bed in Tucson, Arizona, police announced they had found her remains in a remote area nearby, PEOPLE confirms.

“This is not the ending that any of us hoped for, but it is also not the ending of the case,” Tucson Police Chief Chris Magnus told reporters, according to Fox 17.

A portion of Isabel’s remains were sent to an independent lab for DNA analysis, Tucson police said in a statement obtained by PEOPLE.

“Unfortunately, the results of this DNA analysis did confirm that the remains were those of Isabel Celis,” Chief Magnus said Friday.The search for Isabel began on April 21, 2012, after her father discovered her missing from her bedroom on a Saturday morning in early spring. Her case garnered national attention — triggering one of the largest searches for a missing child in Arizona’s history...

http://people.com/crime/missin-isabel-celis-found-dead-tucson-arizona/

 

[BetteDavisEyes]

Any thoughts on why the Celis' home is for sale? Where might they be moving? Curious, given that the house was put on the market around the time that the body was discovered :waitasec:

 

[katydid23]

Any thoughts on why the Celis' home is for sale? Where might they be moving? Very curious given that the house was put on the market around the time that the body was discovered :waitasec:

At one time, Mom had said she would never move as long as it was possible that her daughter might return home. I guess once they knew it was never going to happen, they decided to move. [ there is a link to that upthread here somewhere]

 

[Crosby87]

When I was watching videos yesterday, I heard a police officer say a portion of Isabel's remains were tested.
Are they doing an autopsy?

 

[Crosby87]

Nancy Grace and Alex Sanchez were discussing why Isa's parents aren't saying whether they passed the lie detector tests and the CFS investigation that took place. Here is his response:

ALEX SANCHEZ, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: You know, look, I don`t even know if he`s aware whether or not he passed the polygraph or not. The police are the ones that are aware of that. And they`re not releasing that information.

GRACE: I know that he took it.

SANCHEZ: Well, maybe he took it but they may not have informed him what the results were. And by the way, regarding that CPS investigation that had been conducted there, they must have ruled that those charges were unfounded because they took no action.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1205/17/ng.01.html

 

[Crosby87]

Joe Vega, a close friend of Sergio’s, appeared on Nancy Grace's Show. He told her he suspects Sergio’s phone was being monitored by the police because when he spoke with him on the phone, Sergio said he has to keep his conversations short and get off the phone.

Joe admitted to Nancy that Sergio never told him his phone was being monitored, he only assumed it was because of the comments Sergio made.

Defense Attorneys explain the process involved in obtaining permission from the Court to tap a phone.

RICHARD HERMAN: You got to make an application to the court. You have to put an affidavit of probable cause to get permission and a court order for a judge to give an eaves warrant -- eaves tapping and to allow you to wiretap, to get this phone. If you don`t do that, you just can`t go ahead and tap a phone. You got to have some coherent rationale to tap a phone.

ALEX SANCHEZ, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Yes, I mean, if they didn`t get probable cause, if they obtain any evidence from that, all that evidence is going to be suppressed because it was obtained illegally.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1205/17/ng.01.html

 

[oceanblueeyes]

The 911 call the father made sounded like he chuckling. I wonder if he was drunk or on something?!? Wonder too if that relative with them was also on something. I read early on she was afraid to sleep alone and used sleep with her brothers. That makes me feel just sick thinking about someone taking her and she was afraid already. Poor little soul.

Yet, we know all of this because Sergio told the media. He was open, and honest about falling asleep on the couch that night while watching tv and Isa sleeping in her own room that night. He didn't have to say anything about that. He told what transpired in the home. He didn't have to release any of this information but he did because IMO it was the truth about what happened even though it has been used against him now on social media for years.

As far as the chuckling many people who are nervous will do this. I am sure he wanted to believe she really had left on her own, and all of this would turnout okay... as any parent would try to convince themselves of the same thing. One of my best friends does the same thing and it hides that deep down she is upset and frightened.

While I know the majority find Sergio's mannerisms/speakisms and what he said and how he said everything, suspicious, I do not. I have been a member here since Jan. 2004 and unfortunately have kept up with so many missing/abducted children cases over the years. Not one set of parents that I can ever remember were ever able to please the social media masses when the suspect/s hadn't been caught or during the time the child hadn't been located. They were all criticized 24/7 for the way they spoke, the way they dressed, how they sounded in the 911 call, and many outright accused them of being the ones who had harmed their child or children. However; when the child/children were found murdered or located alive, not one of these parents had one thing to do with harming their children. All of those cases have shown me that no two people (parent/s) act alike when something this traumatic happens to their children. Parents of abducted children only get a reprieve from being accused (falsely) when the actual kidnapper, rapist, and murderer is finally caught and that can be years if the case goes unsolved.

Off hand it happened to:
Marlene Lamar, mother of Sierra Lamar, and her boyfriend Rick
Steve Groene the father of Slade, Shasta, and Dylan
Ed Smart the father of Elizabeth Smart and her Uncle
It even happened at first toward Jessica Ridgeway's mother until LE came out 5 days later clearing her which rarely ever happens.
Mr. Placker the grandfather who raised one of the two young female victims who were found murdered in a ditch in OK.
Mark, Ruthie, and Archie Lunsford- parent, and grandparents of abducted, and later found murdered, Jessica Lunsford.

Not one of those I have listed could catch a break and there are more cases than these I have listed. They were all accused by those on the internet of involvement ..with even accusations they were the ones who had raped, and murdered their own children. The majority was absolutely 100% convinced of their guilt as much as those are now about Sergio killing Isa and Becky covering it up.

Of course when the suspect/s were finally captured, and charged with the murders or kidnapping it was shown none of these parents had any involvement whatsoever to do with their children being abducted/ murdered. All along these parents were also victims themselves of the perpetrator/s who took their precious children away from them either by kidnapping them for months or abducting, raping, murdering them, and discarding their dead bodies like trash.

I have to admit that it gives me a sense of peace that I never accused any of these parents I have listed for there simply was no viable factual evidence to do so. I know human beings aren't clones of each other. I know also that traumatic events affect people differently. I don't expect them to act like how I 'think' I would act nor do I harshly critique every word said, or how they expressed themselves or how they dressed or how they looked down/up or to the left or right.

I totally respect that most do not look at cases like I do. I can only be true to myself, and only own what I write and what others do is also their entitled right to do so. I am mindful of Tricia's words. "Words have power" so therefore "I" try to use them carefully. Just the way I do it though and have for years.

Until I see factual evidence that either or both Celis parents had any involvement in Isa's murder, I will continue to support them. The Celis' have not fled the area. They haven't gone anywhere, and the TPD has been consistent that Isa was abducted from her home. A custodial father would have no need to abduct his child when he lives right inside the home with the custodial mother and their children.

As far as Sergio agreeing to leave his home I think Sergio is a very passionate man and may have displayed anger and talks of killing himself around his boys. He only moved down the street, and he was seen at the fence watching his boy play ball and nothing happened to him. If he had been violent toward the boys he wouldn't have been able to return, and be with them for years now. IMO

I hope justice comes soon for beautiful Isa. Her smile was one of the prettiest I have ever seen and her eyes just twinkled with happiness.

JMO though

 

[Gunslinging Granny]

When I was watching videos yesterday, I heard a police officer say a portion of Isabel's remains were tested.
Are they doing an autopsy?

If she was exposed to the elements for five years, there was nothing left of Isabel except bones, teeth, and hair. Her remains were positively identified by DNA testing. Her hair may have been tested for heavy metals, narcotic analgesics, and sedatives. (Both parents had access to narcotic analgesics and sedatives through their employment.)
.

 

[Gunslinging Granny]

Two years after her disappearance, Isabel's parents stopped updating their Bring Isabel Home page.
http://bringisahome.com/category/news/
They only gave interviews after this time on her birthday or anniversary of her disappearance. After their first initial interview, they never begged Isabel’s kidnapper to contact them, bring her home, or take good care of her. The parents state they have a suspicious relative, but they have never stated the name of this suspicious relative to the press, so the general public could closely watch him and look for Isabel.

Imo, these behaviors do not fit with parents who want their child to be found.

 

[IHAVENOCLUE]

Thank you for the link!
:tyou:

Oops!

This was supposed to add the Celis neighbor video...

 

[Gunslinging Granny]

"I feel like she's somewhere north or in California somewhere out there," Becky said.
The parents believe Isabel is in California because of a strong tip that came in. They don’t believe she is in Arizona.
http://www.azfamily.com/story/28361847/missing-tucson-girls-mother-i-feel-like-shes-in-california


What did the parents do when they thought Isabel was in California? Did they go on news stations in California and beg for information or for the kidnapper to bring her back? Did they put up bulletin boards in California with her photo begging people for info? No. (They have a site and had other fundraisers.)

Why did Sergio and Becky state that when CPS forced Sergio to move out this was their first contact with CPS? It wasn't their first investigation by CPS. CPS had been at their home four months earlier.
http://www.azfamily.com/story/28361847/missing-tucson-girls-mother-i-feel-like-shes-in-california

 

[IHAVENOCLUE]

Yet, we know all of this because Sergio told the media. He was open, and honest about falling asleep on the couch that night while watching tv and Isa sleeping in her own room that night. He didn't have to say anything about that. He told what transpired in the home. He didn't have to release any of this information but he did because IMO it was the truth about what happened even though it has been used against him now on social media for years.

As far as the chuckling many people who are nervous will do this. I am sure he wanted to believe she really had left on her own, and all of this would turnout okay... as any parent would try to convince themselves of the same thing. One of my best friends does the same thing and it hides that deep down she is upset and frightened.

While I know the majority find Sergio's mannerisms/speakisms and what he said and how he said everything, suspicious, I do not. I have been a member here since Jan. 2004 and unfortunately have kept up with so many missing/abducted children cases over the years. Not one set of parents that I can ever remember were ever able to please the social media masses when the suspect/s hadn't been caught or during the time the child hadn't been located. They were all criticized 24/7 for the way they spoke, the way they dressed, how they sounded in the 911 call, and many outright accused them of being the ones who had harmed their child or children. However; when the child/children were found murdered or located alive, not one of these parents had one thing to do with harming their children. All of those cases have shown me that no two people (parent/s) act alike when something this traumatic happens to their children. Parents of abducted children only get a reprieve from being accused (falsely) when the actual kidnapper, rapist, and murderer is finally caught and that can be years if the case goes unsolved.

Off hand it happened to:
Marlene Lamar, mother of Sierra Lamar, and her boyfriend Rick
Steve Groene the father of Slade, Shasta, and Dylan
Ed Smart the father of Elizabeth Smart and her Uncle
It even happened at first toward Jessica Ridgeway's mother until LE came out 5 days later clearing her which rarely ever happens.
Mr. Placker the grandfather who raised one of the two young female victims who were found murdered in a ditch in OK.
Mark, Ruthie, and Archie Lunsford- parent, and grandparents of abducted, and later found murdered, Jessica Lunsford.

Not one of those I have listed could catch a break and there are more cases than these I have listed. They were all accused by those on the internet of involvement ..with even accusations they were the ones who had raped, and murdered their own children. The majority was absolutely 100% convinced of their guilt as much as those are now about Sergio killing Isa and Becky covering it up.

Of course when the suspect/s were finally captured, and charged with the murders or kidnapping it was shown none of these parents had any involvement whatsoever to do with their children being abducted/ murdered. All along these parents were also victims themselves of the perpetrator/s who took their precious children away from them either by kidnapping them for months or abducting, raping, murdering them, and discarding their dead bodies like trash.

I have to admit that it gives me a sense of peace that I never accused any of these parents I have listed for there simply was no viable factual evidence to do so. I know human beings aren't clones of each other. I know also that traumatic events affect people differently. I don't expect them to act like how I 'think' I would act nor do I harshly critique every word said, or how they expressed themselves or how they dressed or how they looked down/up or to the left or right.

I totally respect that most do not look at cases like I do. I can only be true to myself, and only own what I write and what others do is also their entitled right to do so. I am mindful of Tricia's words. "Words have power" so therefore "I" try to use them carefully. Just the way I do it though and have for years.

Until I see factual evidence that either or both Celis parents had any involvement in Isa's murder, I will continue to support them. The Celis' have not fled the area. They haven't gone anywhere, and the TPD has been consistent that Isa was abducted from her home. A custodial father would have no need to abduct his child when he lives right inside the home with the custodial mother and their children.

As far as Sergio agreeing to leave his home I think Sergio is a very passionate man and may have displayed anger and talks of killing himself around his boys. He only moved down the street, and he was seen at the fence watching his boy play ball and nothing happened to him. If he had been violent toward the boys he wouldn't have been able to return, and be with them for years now. IMO

I hope justice comes soon for beautiful Isa. Her smile was one of the prettiest I have ever seen and her eyes just twinkled with happiness.

JMO though

I imagine some people have followed cases where parents have been the perpetrators in the murder of their own children...

and... Though this is not what anyone wants to believe can be factual...
some sleuthers now keep open minds in their opinions of just who the perp is....
Eliminating no one until the final evidence is presented...

Unfortunately, murderers do not come with a sign/tattoo/distinguishing mark identifying their conduct...
And...they come from all walks of life...

JMO...

 

[Gunslinging Granny]

Police: CPS had previous contact with Celis family
The Tucson Police Department said today that Child Protective Services had been involved with the family of a missing Tucson girl months before she disappeared.
http://www.wtvm.com/story/18504085/police-cps-had-previous-contact-with-celis-family

 

[seattlechiquita]

I just heard Isabel has been found. My heart aches, but I know she is at peace now.

 

[Crosby87]

If she was exposed to the elements for five years, there was nothing left of Isabel except bones, teeth, and hair. Her remains were positively identified by DNA testing. Her hair may have been tested for heavy metals, narcotic analgesics, and sedatives. (Both parents had access to narcotic analgesics and sedatives through their employment.)
.

I suppose the medical examiners won't be able to determine the cause of death and whether she was sexually assaulted.

I know police looked into Sergio Celis' employment record at a dental-surgery office but I don't know if they looked into Becky's. After getting a subpoena, the dental office turned over Sergio's employment records, a report states. Here's what it said:

The office manager told police that Sergio Celis did not administer "anesthesia or drugs to patients, but he does prepare them for the doctors."

• Police interviewed several of the doctors who own the surgery office where Sergio works. They all described him as a "model employee."

They told police he is "steady, reliable, dependable, a quick learner, gets along well with staff, co-workers and patients."

The doctors said Sergio Celis doesn't regularly socialize with any other employees outside of work. He never borrowed money from them.

He's been employed at the office as a surgical assistant since 2008.

The reports state the doctors said they had no reason to believe that Sergio Celis was a "substance abuser." They also said the family did not appear to be struggling financially or to be living beyond its finances, the reports state.

http://tucson.com/news/local/crime/...cle_91fee6b2-df37-5c40-bc2a-20e15fe69299.html

 

[katydid23]

I imagine some people have followed cases where parents have been the perpetrators in the murder of their own children...

and... Though this is not what anyone wants to believe can be factual...
some sleuthers now keep open minds in their opinions of just who the perp is....
Eliminating no one until the final evidence is presented...

Unfortunately, murderers do not come with a sign/tattoo/distinguishing mark identifying their conduct...
And...they come from all walks of life...

JMO...

However, this is a victim friendly site. And the parents of a murdered child are victims, until designated by LE as otherwise.

I have always looked sideways at SC because of his odd demeanor, and strange coincidences that night, sleeping on the couch etc. But at the same time, is that enough to outright accuse him of what some are accusing him of? I don't think so....:no:

 

[seattlechiquita]

However, this is a victim friendly site. And the parents of a murdered child are victims, until designated by LE as otherwise.

I have always looked sideways at SC because of his odd demeanor, and strange coincidences that night, sleeping on the couch etc. But at the same time, is that enough to outright accuse him of what some are accusing him of? I don't think so....:no:

Totally with you here. I cannot imagine losing a child under my care. To be honest, I have no clue how I would react, act, etc. I can't even comprehend how folks who lose children go on. Unless you're KCA and have zero care for anyone but yourself of course.