Australia Australia - Claremont SK, 1996-97, Perth, WA - #14

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I'll comment on the VC article later but can't even see the first image it's all a blur, not sure where red dot man fits in the video. However I've been looking at a few stills and one on left with mystery man JR recognises and laughs looks very like BRE IMO, but interestingly the guy on the left leaning very awkwardly against the pole looked away so quickly when MM came into frame you would think he gave himself whiplash. Is this red dot man? I have an interesting ob on the image from inside by the stairs, if someone has the sharp version. I have seen it on this site I think.

Hopefully these shots might explain what I'm trying to get across....Follow Mr Red Dot on the footage..see how he interacts with Jane...how Jane watches him then turns to watch him as he returns from the Gugeri St direction
 

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I've been too busy too contribute but I will say that everyone is doing an awesome job of sleuthing!
Well done team!
Gold stars all round [emoji2][emoji859]🏼[emoji859][emoji471][emoji954]🥇
 
I have been back and looked at the original article and is confusing when first reading it. It does not clearly say what evidence they have, whether it is he kimono or something on the kimono but it is a link between the two crime. It would be clear to the criminal they have his evidence possibly semen.

Later it is made clear that Kimono was taken from a washing line and DNA was left on it a Huntingale which linked the two crime. I have been following The Post reports on CSK for years and it was this link (DNA?) to the serious VC crime that was identified as the key to finding CSK.

The same DNA was at VC violent rape and murder. I don't mean to demean the effect on the Huntingdale victim and BRE charged with assault, but unless cops had that evidence link to VC they would not have made her case front page news. There were another 18 unsolved rapes committed but none of them were on the front page.

DNA profiling first developed and used in 1984 and used in prosecution in 1986 in England and 2001 in Aust (Wiki). Aussies knew about an cold use DNA profiling at time but hadn't prosecuted yet.

Masters confessed in 1991 to VC although no evidence, served 7 years for his 1991 murder, extradited and sentenced to life with 7 years non parole for VC. He thought he would be out in 7 again, but has been refused every parole hearing since 7 years and will end up serving 20. In his 1991 murder he attempted rape but unable to.

I originally only had BRE at VC scene as he only 18, Masters 21, however my apologies to all his family and friends who must not believe any accusations, my guess now is he may have not just have been an onlooker in this violent and sustained sexual assault and murder but a serious perp.

t

Could you share where u saw the original kimono article.
Thanks


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MyLeftFoot - can you please direct me to the version of the MM footage you took these stills from. The timestamp looks to be the clearest I have seen & there is something else in that video I been looking at for years too. I would love to see a clearer version before commenting though as I dont believe it has ever been discussed, yet since BRE arrest it is all the more compelling - thats if it looks the same in a clearer version of course.
 
Liddieth may be the south side rapist referenced, a dozen or more hot prowl rapes in affluent suburbs south of the CBD, at night, armed with a knife, from the late 80's to 91.
FWIW - I think the South Side Rapist was probably actually many "rapists". Lyddieth, Narkle, BRE perhaps, amongst several others. Theres nothing quite like "someone getting away with something" to bring others out to try to get away with it too. The time frame police referenced at VD murder for rapes attributed to SSR was "16 rapes...in past 2 years" ie 1986-1988 at least. There were a few people convicted of multiple rapes overlapping those years both north and south of the river. IMO no one person was responsible for them all regardless of whether they ending up pinning the term to 1 person or not, and which I think we would have found reference to by now if they had. Just a whole lot of creeps creeping around without getting caught & a whole lot of cops too busy being corrupt to actually solve the crimes & just when they were getting so good at fitting the crime to the person rather than the person to the crime too. I wouldnt be surprised one little bit if it turns out that single piece of DNA evidence they claim to have is contaminated. Just my opinion of course.
 
MyLeftFoot - can you please direct me to the version of the MM footage you took these stills from. The timestamp looks to be the clearest I have seen & there is something else in that video I been looking at for years too. I would love to see a clearer version before commenting though as I dont believe it has ever been discussed, yet since BRE arrest it is all the more compelling - thats if it looks the same in a clearer version of course.

Hi Noname..the stills shown were taken from the Haleyjane version. Some (most) I have had to enhance to direct posters to the particular person to watch.
If you want, I can do the same for you privately!
 
Outake from "Hunt for a Killer" showing Jane Rimmer CCTV footage:
[video=youtube;eTpMkQV_bfk]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eTpMkQV_bfk[/video]

All the previous suspects on TV (for comparison to CCTV footage):
[video=youtube;XR-CbLBIDOg]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XR-CbLBIDOg[/video]

[video=youtube;7LBItwcXBM8]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7LBItwcXBM8[/video]
 
Hunt for a Killer Documentary posted by HayleyJane1985: [video=youtube;nNNF1E3mg3c]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nNNF1E3mg3c[/video]
Note that the Jane Rimmer CCTV footage is actually from an earlier news program aired in Perth when the footage was first released.
 
I'll comment on the VC article later but can't even see the first image it's all a blur, not sure where red dot man fits in the video. However I've been looking at a few stills and one on left with mystery man JR recognises and laughs looks very like BRE IMO, but interestingly the guy on the left leaning very awkwardly against the pole looked away so quickly when MM came into frame you would think he gave himself whiplash. Is this red dot man? I have an interesting ob on the image from inside by the stairs, if someone has the sharp version. I have seen it on this site I think.

I dont think Jane recognised that guy at all. I think he made a smart, perhaps flirty comment to her in passing, nothing more. If I am wrong and she did recognise him, i think it is more than likely that he was someone familiar through either seeing him around there on past occassions or seeing him there earlier that night. Perhaps he had an encounter with her earlier in which he said nah, im over it, not going to CBV, going home. Then changed his mind. Then when walking past her again outside he said something like - not coming to CBV? Her reaction was clearly to whatever was said to her in passing, whatever it was, which I dont particularly think was important anyway.

Just to throw a spanner in the works though - any takers on Adrian Bayley being MM? Interestingly, he changed his surname by deed poll from Edwards off all things.
 
When looking at the shot with the detective holding it up, did anyone else happen to notice the rather large size of the Kimono? The owner must have been a tubgirl - it would slip right off anyone smaller! Could this be a hint as to the owner?
 
When looking at the shot with the detective holding it up, did anyone else happen to notice the rather large size of the Kimono? The owner must have been a tubgirl - it would slip right off anyone smaller! Could this be a hint as to the owner?

*tubgirl* ?
 
I've had a look at some of the videos posted and think I've identified your RDM, but not sure when looking at your stills. The time and order of the security vision jumps around so I've just described a simple chronological order.

Security Vison: JR and 3 friends exit Conti, talk on path outside for a short time. Red Dot Man exits. RDM (suddenly appears in JR and friends shot from a “splice” or different time jump) and shorter powerpole man (PPman) following him putting his jumper on, walks up to girls. RDM brushes past group possibly looking at JR, maybe making comment, seems familiar, definitely looks in her direction.

Girls go to Club Bay View but the line is too long and they decide to get a taxi and go home. JR declines to go with them and even when they drive past her in the taxi, she refuses lift.

Back on security camera, JR is back outside Conti and waits seemingly looking for a lift or person she may have made arrangements with. PPman is outside as well, seems to be keeping an eye on JR, shadowing her actions at times, or tries to look inconspicuous, alone holding one arm on a pole....(see description of a few extra frames from another video which seem to insert here)... Red Dot man exits Conti (this footage didn’t show him going back in, but he must have when girls went to ClubBayView line). He brushes past JR standing by pole seeming to interact but doesn’t stop. When he looks at camera his face is totally obscured by what looks to be an added block bar to the video clip and his face is invisible.

PPman stays where he is seemly keeping eye on JR.

Red Dot man who is now MM in widely recognisable stills comes into frame. JR seems delighted and interacts with a big smile. PPman turns his head away abruptly awkwardly looking over his shoulder directly away from MM and JR, while having one outstretched arm on PP. MM keeps on walking past JR.

Next shots with JR, waiting , looking at watch and going on road, PPman has gone. They make a big cut from 2.19 to 3.58 so you don't see when and where PPman goes. Commentator says JR then is gone from security vision two and a half minutes later.

RDM looked like MM who looks like BRE, IMO. If I have the wrong man for RDM, it looks to me it's MM. But in reply to noname, what about Adrian Bailey being PPman?

There were some extra frames from another video which adds to this scenario:

... MM sticks his head outside the door and looks left to right... gives sort of look to PPman who walks toward the Conti door straight after. Seems this fits just before MM comes out and brushes past JR waiting by pole.
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I’m interested in the couple of frames from inside the Conti from this video and have a still posted by Papertrail and Enzeder 11_09_2015 Thread #3 posts #4 and #15, which shows MM inside by stairs. Is anyone is able to make this image sharper?
 

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FWIW - I think the South Side Rapist was probably actually many "rapists". Lyddieth, Narkle, BRE perhaps, amongst several others. Theres nothing quite like "someone getting away with something" to bring others out to try to get away with it too. The time frame police referenced at VD murder for rapes attributed to SSR was "16 rapes...in past 2 years" ie 1986-1988 at least. There were a few people convicted of multiple rapes overlapping those years both north and south of the river. IMO no one person was responsible for them all regardless of whether they ending up pinning the term to 1 person or not, and which I think we would have found reference to by now if they had. Just a whole lot of creeps creeping around without getting caught & a whole lot of cops too busy being corrupt to actually solve the crimes & just when they were getting so good at fitting the crime to the person rather than the person to the crime too. I wouldnt be surprised one little bit if it turns out that single piece of DNA evidence they claim to have is contaminated. Just my opinion of course.
Thanks noname good posts .


Thanks nocomment :quoted "Liddieth may be the south side rapist referenced, a dozen or more hot prowl rapes in affluent suburbs south of the CBD, at night, armed with a knife, from the late 80's to 91."(Unquote )


There's many reports on dennis john lyddieth that all mention the western suburbs , Also a particular modus operandi.

Quote from article :WA today:

"In 1992, Lyddieth was sentenced to 19 years' jail after pleading guilty to 48 charges relating to the planned sex attacks against women in Nedlands, Claremont, Shenton Park, Subiaco and Leederville."(Unquote )


That may or may not Perhaps exclude him from the southside area attacks ?
He was released from prison recently a few years ago, theres the news report about that here in the links .
Anyway theres countless google links more than these here .

https://www.google.com.au/amp/s/amp...l/news-story/bedade24854ae379e6574da7411027cc

http://www.news.com.au/national/wes...n/news-story/c1285a54931209be94dfa9350084c11f

http://www.mako.org.au/Dennis-Lyddieth-serial-rapist-to-remain-behind-bars.html

https://www.google.com.au/amp/s/aus...ress.com/2014/10/27/dennis-john-lyddieth/amp/

https://www.google.com.au/amp/s/amp...m/news-story/76de976930615339fd9b2df479e2b44c

http://www.watoday.com.au/wa-news/rapist-wanted-victims-to-fall-in-love-with-him-20120605-1ztyr.html

.
 
Oops SORRY folks didnt mean Adrian Bayley. Meant to say Richard Dorrough. Guy who was suspected of Sara Lee Davy murder in Broome. Something about the hair gets me
 
With all the DNA bungles in WA at the moment, is anyone else having slight doubts as to whether BRE is the right guy? At first, I was thinking the WAPOL must be certain... but I remember thinking that about LW too! (And, of course, innocent until proven guilty)
 
With all the DNA bungles in WA at the moment, is anyone else having slight doubts as to whether BRE is the right guy? At first, I was thinking the WAPOL must be certain... but I remember thinking that about LW too! (And, of course, innocent until proven guilty)
A WA police sergeant will fight allegations he sexually abused four boys while he was a school teacher at a Catholic college more than 30 years ago.

Eamon Dominic Heary, 56, faced Perth Magistrates Court on Monday, accused of indecently dealing with the eight-year-old boys sometime between 1984 and 1985.

Heary, who has been stood down from operational duties, pleaded not guilty to all charges and had his bail extended before a committal mention on July 22

http://www.watoday.com.au/wa-news/wa-policeman-to-fight-child-sex-abuse-charges-20170501-gvwdao.html

Extract from Hansard 6/5/2004
Address to WA Parliament by Mr Eric Ripper Deputy Premier
29cc631a493ca855adc9d45e65c2101e.jpg


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With all the DNA bungles in WA at the moment, is anyone else having slight doubts as to whether BRE is the right guy? At first, I was thinking the WAPOL must be certain... but I remember thinking that about LW too! (And, of course, innocent until proven guilty)

100% have doubts over the DNA results. The incidents of late have created doubt in the mind of most people regarding a form of evidence that was thought to be the nail in the coffin for most cases. The most recent one the guy could prove he was somewhere else at the time but it still didn't matter. There has been stories in the past about evidence being misplaced or lost and then found again and tested.


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Suggest searching DPP WA nolle prosequi cases. Same with WA Police summary prosecution noble prosequi cases. There are many. It's where the prosecution pulls the charges. A judge can't enter a nolle prosequi, only the prosecution can, but it must be done before judgement otherwise a double jeopardy scenario would exist, if the prosecution wanted to recharge later on after new evidence is found.
a80c2e246c1c82031b8b285d07eecff5.jpg


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On your advice, I just did look it up. The ‘nolle prosequi’ was abolished in WA eleven years ago. You are right in one sense, it is better to look things up properly !
 
I've had a look at some of the videos posted and think I've identified your RDM, but not sure when looking at your stills. The time and order of the security vision jumps around so I've just described a simple chronological order.

Security Vison: JR and 3 friends exit Conti, talk on path outside for a short time. Red Dot Man exits. RDM (suddenly appears in JR and friends shot from a “splice” or different time jump) and shorter powerpole man (PPman) following him putting his jumper on, walks up to girls. RDM brushes past group possibly looking at JR, maybe making comment, seems familiar, definitely looks in her direction.

Girls go to Club Bay View but the line is too long and they decide to get a taxi and go home. JR declines to go with them and even when they drive past her in the taxi, she refuses lift.

Back on security camera, JR is back outside Conti and waits seemingly looking for a lift or person she may have made arrangements with. PPman is outside as well, seems to be keeping an eye on JR, shadowing her actions at times, or tries to look inconspicuous, alone holding one arm on a pole....(see description of a few extra frames from another video which seem to insert here)... Red Dot man exits Conti (this footage didn’t show him going back in, but he must have when girls went to ClubBayView line). He brushes past JR standing by pole seeming to interact but doesn’t stop. When he looks at camera his face is totally obscured by what looks to be an added block bar to the video clip and his face is invisible.

PPman stays where he is seemly keeping eye on JR.

Red Dot man who is now MM in widely recognisable stills comes into frame. JR seems delighted and interacts with a big smile. PPman turns his head away abruptly awkwardly looking over his shoulder directly away from MM and JR, while having one outstretched arm on PP. MM keeps on walking past JR.

Next shots with JR, waiting , looking at watch and going on road, PPman has gone. They make a big cut from 2.19 to 3.58 so you don't see when and where PPman goes. Commentator says JR then is gone from security vision two and a half minutes later.

RDM looked like MM who looks like BRE, IMO. If I have the wrong man for RDM, it looks to me it's MM. But in reply to noname, what about Adrian Bailey being PPman?

There were some extra frames from another video which adds to this scenario:

... MM sticks his head outside the door and looks left to right... gives sort of look to PPman who walks toward the Conti door straight after. Seems this fits just before MM comes out and brushes past JR waiting by pole.
attachment.php


I’m interested in the couple of frames from inside the Conti from this video and have a still posted by Papertrail and Enzeder 11_09_2015 Thread #3 posts #4 and #15, which shows MM inside by stairs. Is anyone is able to make this image sharper?

Thanks No name and Innerchild for your insights! Innerchild you did some great work there sussing out Red Dot Man's movements..There's more to that than I'm willing to say and I suspect the man inside by the stairs is also Red Dot Man, shortly before he exits and heads towards his vehicle...shortly before Jane disappears!


Quote Originally Posted by Xyz
With all the DNA bungles in WA at the moment, is anyone else having slight doubts as to whether BRE is the right guy? At first, I was thinking the WAPOL must be certain... but I remember thinking that about LW too! (And, of course, innocent until proven guilty)

Xyz..no I don't have slight doubts...I have very serious doubts and always have! I predicted an arrest no later than Feb 2017 well over a year ago....Fancy that! They are so predictable!
 
Agree - if I recall correctly being a child of the 80's there were plenty of blokes getting around in yellow cars in the late 80's. Especially Toyota Celica's, Corollas and plenty of yellow datsuns around aswell.


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Not at all surprising, given that the ‘Karate Kid’ drove yellow …
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