CA - 13 victims, ages 2 to 29, shackled in home by parents, Perris, 15 Jan 2018 #9

[rsd1200]

My niece who is adopted and has fetal alcohol syndrome convinced her older sister who was six to escape their abusive adoptive home. This was a different home than my sister who adopted them after they escaped. My niece who has fetal alcohol syndrome was four and she planned the escape.

They are from a foreign country. They escaped to an orphanage. The niece has cognitvie skills in different types of ways. She had trouble in school starting in 8th grade.

Humans are the most adaptable of species. Just because kids are uneducated, or young, does not mean that they cannot problem solve. I've sat and watched my dog problem solve on how to get into a groundhog hole. Again, kids as young as 7 & 8, around here, drive farm machinery on the highway. You don't need a college degree, nor be over a certain age, to begin thinking for yourself, or learning on your own. An acquaintance's son decided at age 5 that he was going to drive. Snuck out, got into the car, put it in gear, and got it rolling. Unfortunately it was on a hill and he couldn't reach the brake. It came to rest across the street in a neighbor's yard, thankfully no one was hurt. Same, very inquisitive kid, was not even in Kindergarten but figured out, just by watching, how to navigate, and buy stuff, on the computer. His grandparents had a whopper of a bill after stuff from Amazon started showing up on their doorstep.

 

[Satch]

In studying this case it appears that the following occurred:

The Turpin's followed multiple cult-like religions at the same time. Can someone tell us what the practiced and a brief description (like one sentence) of each one. I wonder how much each religion played into no social life for the kids, except without a parent present, no TV, no music, no media influence. Many of these cult religions demand authority compliance.

What would be the justification for the Turpin parents to have a filthy house with human waste? How would there legal defense justify this, other than an insanity plea? I could see those monsters doing that to torture the kids. The problem is the parents having to live in the same environment. And most narcissists, like the Turpin's, have an obsession with cleanliness, not keeping things filthy.

Did Louise ever work in her life? Or have any responsibilities growing up through the years? She reminds me so much of Carrie White's Mother in the movie Carrie. Carrie was abused by her religious-fanatic Mother who also isolated her from the outside world. Carrie had telekinetic powers. The ability to move objects by force, and used her powers to strike back at her bullying high school classmates at her Senior Prom.

I wonder if Louise and/or David believed in Witchcraft or spiritual rituals? Is there any religion out there sick enough that would in practice justify the abuse and torture of kids as a way to control them?

Satch

 

[rsd1200]

In one of the locations in Texas, yes two dogs ran out of the house when someone opened the door after the Turpins had abandoned it. No one mentioned finding dead animals in cages (I think they were elsewhere in the house and dead), but it would not surprise me if the older kids were kept in closets and the smaller kids were kept in cages. There are not many closets in most houses after all (usually one in each bedroom and perhaps one other main closet). In the newer house in Perris, most of the closet doors seem to be sliding double doors. If they were kept in cages, it will probably come out in later court proceedings.

I saw no locks on those doors. I just don't want to make this worse than it is with information that we don't have. The charges are from 2010 forward so I'd not be sure if the TX home will even be allowed into evidence. Gitana1, might would know about that though.

 

[rsd1200]

That's why it is even more shocking that the dogs in the Turpin's California house were well-fed and cared for.

Satch

I think those dogs were only about a year old, iirc. The new hadn't worn off. The new hadn't worn off of Survivor 13 yet, either.

 

[SATA]

It makes me sad to know the victims are being split apart ----wish they could all heal together. I wonder how they all feel.

As for the "aunties" and other "family members".... I can't even tell you how I feel sans breaking the TOS and ending up in WS time out. arghhhhh

We don´t know anything about the dynamics between the siblings.
There may be a reason to split them up.

Often abusers like the Turpins have their favourite children who help with the abuse.

I am not blaming anyone (but the parents), but think about the Knorr case.
Theresa Knorr groomed her boys to torment the girls.
There have been other cases, can´t remember the names from the top of my head.

So we just don´t know.

_______________________

You have to wonder WHY this happened.
There is a lot of hate in what the parents did.
Louise Turpin was sexually abused (grandfather?) when she was a child.
That would have messed her up big time.

What about David Turpin?
To me he looks like he could have mild to medium autism - has anyone else thought that?
Was he easily led?

Who was the "leader" in all this? Louise or David? Both - a united front against their children?

 

[Zelda1010]

These kids are about a year apart in age near the end so I think the child being held is about 4 maybe?

It seems clear that the kids were subject to severe neglect as in hygiene issues, extreme hoarding and filth in their homes over time, as well as severe emotional abuse, such as isolation, control and punishment through food, as well as some physical abuse (probably whipping them) throughout their childhoods. This overall neglect and abuse was interspersed with episodes of cleaner environments, when they abandoned one house and moved to a new place, and bizarre, surreal trips to Disney or Vegas, during which they were suddenly cleaned up and given new clothes to project a veneer of normalcy.

It also appears that the parents made occasional, self-serving efforts at normalcy with the kids in other ways such as allowing a few to get driver's licenses in order to help transport their group, and allowing the oldest boy to go to community college in a strictly monitored manner.

As LE states, the abuse escalated over time. Indeed it seems that it escalated since the youngest was born. Not sure why or if that was the catalyst or just a coincidence. But clearly, the crazy got more intense. Now, kids who had been isolated and punished at times physically, or with tying, or withholding/limiting foods and neglected when it came to hygiene and education, were now suddenly being chained and for ever-longer periods, strangled, beaten more, forced to lie in their own waste, not given any opportunity to clean themselves, and downright starved.

I never really made the connection, (I can be dense at times!) but the birth of the child coincides exactly with the report that the kids had been planning an escape for two years. Why did her birth cause things to get even worse? Post-partum psychosis? (Ugh, will she try to go for that defense?) The birth causing an increase in psych issues? Suddenly getting a new baby to fawn over after years of not having any, leading to an increase in hatred of the older kids because they more clearly saw the older age of the kids in relation to a new baby? (I get the sense that after the kids are too old to hold, they become objects of disgust and hatred for some reason). As you said, her struggle to carry the child? Why did that lead to an increase in maltreatment?

Your theory is an interesting one. It's so hard to figure this out.

Not that you need me to tell you this, but you have a way with words. You've stated this so much better than I.

It does make sense that #12 is closer to 4 and #1 would be closer to 21 (making her young teen appearance more uncomfortable for me, but still within the realms of "normal" criminal negligence and abuse).

And would this then also jive with the move to CA and place it closer to 2010 as PP proposed?

 

[Stunned]

At least two of them are capable of higher learning though. They may see the world through the "eyes" of a first grader but they set up and planned this escape. Several of them, with the 17 y.o. actually going through with her part. Also, we know that the adult son went to some type of college, or jr. college, classes, and made good grades, and the one sib was able to drive a car (of course I know folks who drove tractors at age 7 or 8, so maybe driving a car and learning traffic laws is not that far-fetched for someone with the mind of a first grader).

Do we know for sure she had a drivers license?

 

[Leila]

So Dr. Oz is saying the older ones have the mind of a first grader? How would he know? Just curious because I question if the facility they're at would release any information about them.

I seem to remember an article in the first few days after this story broke that stated that the older children had the 'knowledge' of a first grader. This makes sense. I think what it may be referring to is the childrens knowledge of what life in the world outside the confines of their home is like. How things work, how society functions, etc.

I can't see any hospital (assisted living) releasing any information on a patient in their care, and especially not to a celebrity doctor who would be likely to repeat that information publicly.

I think Dr. Oz has read the same article we have read and is stating the older ones have a "mind of a first grader" suggesting they have a low IQ as opposed to a lack of knowledge.

 

[Spice]

Do we know for sure she had a drivers license?

No. We don't.

We have :

One known occasion that an "older survivor" escaped / ran away and was given a ride by a local back to her house. ( I 'cant) While in the car, this sibling asked "how do I get a drivers license" and "How do I get a job?"
This was in Texas, shortly after they arrived in the neighborhood.

And

Statements from Neighbors in Perris that "the oldest girl was seen driving the car".

As far as I know, that hasn't been substantiated, and we don't know if the neighbor saw LT driving and thought she saw one of the siblings. Neighbors were also stunned to learn that DT/LT had 13 children, as they only ever saw a few of the older ones outside of the home on specific occasions. Nativity etc.

It has never been reported that the survivor has an actual drivers license, just a neighbor stating that she saw one of the oldest siblings driving.

:moo:

 

[Leila]

I have read so many posts here and so many articles...forgive me if this has been discussed and I don't remember!!

Do we know a ballpark of when the last time the children and adult children were captured in photos or seen by other people? How many years it's been? Was it the last vow renewal and the older son being in college until 2016?

The pictures that include the baby who was born in the spring of 2015 are the most recent pictures. The picture where all the children are wearing the "Thing" tee-shirts, in which the baby appears to be about 6 to 9 months old, is probably the latest picture. So, my guess is that's the latest picture of the all the children and taken in late fall - November of 2015 - January 2016. About 2 years ago.

 

[Bill Carson]

In between the other two pictures we have several sets of group pictures at Disney.

They appeared to pose with 3 different characters this day. I'm sad to say I believe this could be around the lewd act charge time frame, but maybe a couple years prior. The older kids are way too thin. Goodness knows if any marks are visible. There are four girls with pigtails and one with bangs.

There are two group shots with similar clothes, but they are from two more separate "photo ops", I believe. The hairband changes and hair length in general, plus obv. parents clothes. In one there is pretty serious bruising on one of the youngest that isn't visible unless you find an unblurred version. No one is well, imo.

I think the other red shirt photo I posted would come after this, perhaps recreating the grandparent photo. No one is well in that one, imo, and it was taken years ago already too.

Okay, this is creepier than I had imagined. You've got twelve kids in four groups of three, each group wearing the same outfit. One group has the three boys, then three groups of girls by age.

I'd bet good money that the Turpin home was set up for five bedrooms (remember, it had a room that was an option of a den or 5th bedroom): One bedroom for the parents, and one bedroom for each of the groups of three.

Makes you wonder if the 13th child was the first of the next group of three.

 

[seattlechiquita]

Seriously ??? Give all of those children to a Duggar ?
Fgs, haven't the Turpin children (adults and minors) suffered enough ??
Thankfully, I don't believe this would ever happen.
They're not puppies or kittens, or the "mission outreach of the month" garbage idea.
:moo:

Gag me with a spoon. Is this REALLY being considered? Please say no. I can't even.

 

[Spice]

It was definitely reported early on that the survivors were kept "separated" from each other. Certain groups in certain bedrooms.

And BT stated that LT/DT would "line" the children up by age in photographs and when "out" in public. Which was basically never, and which she was likely gathering for the posed "normalcy" photos on FB and the orchestrated "family' trip to Disney.

I remember that clearly.

 

[newsjunkie]

In regards to the neighbor seeing one of the girls driving, we have no way of knowing which girl they supposedly saw. They never saw all 13 together. Didn’t even know that many kids were there. The first three girls could be interchangeable at a glance from a neighbor’s yard. Same with the other two sets of three girls.

 

[rsd1200]

We don´t know anything about the dynamics between the siblings.
There may be a reason to split them up.

Often abusers like the Turpins have their favourite children who help with the abuse.

I am not blaming anyone (but the parents), but think about the Knorr case.
Theresa Knorr groomed her boys to torment the girls.
There have been other cases, can´t remember the names from the top of my head.

So we just don´t know.

_______________________

You have to wonder WHY this happened.
There is a lot of hate in what the parents did.
Louise Turpin was sexually abused (grandfather?) when she was a child.
That would have messed her up big time.

What about David Turpin?
To me he looks like he could have mild to medium autism - has anyone else thought that?
Was he easily led?

Who was the "leader" in all this? Louise or David? Both - a united front against their children?

In the case of the young man, Wesley, that I linked earlier, (and again, below) his siblings had tried to sneak him food. They got caught and then were afraid to help him anymore. He was his step-father's whipping boy. His mom stood by and did nothing. She knew, before they married, that he hated Wesley, she'd witnessed him punch him in the face, before they married.

It only took a year for the starving to cause a very significant change to appear in Wesley (along with the severe physical abuse).

"I didn't recognize who he was," says one son, Scott Davis, 16. "Because I had gotten a lot bigger, and he had gotten a lot smaller." They invited Wesley to sit down and have something to eat. "The little guy, he was starving to death," Smith says. "He was eating everything he could get a hold of. I mean, he was just gobbling it down."

This is why I think that there may have been periods of the T sibs getting more food. I don't think anyone could survive on a meager meal, once a day, from the age of a very young child, to adulthood. It would lend to why they had growth spurts, allowing them to reach heights as tall, and taller than, their mom, and in some photos, some of them looked to carry a bit more weight,than others, too. If one or more got caught planning an escape, or attempted one, or broke a rule, one or all, may have gotten put on lock-down, and on the one meal plan. Perhaps for weeks/months, with the most serious offender(s) shackled, as well (three at the time LE came to the door b/c they'd discovered an escape attempt, iirc.).

I think the parents had come up with their own stripe of "religion" but like other abusers, may have used it as their justification to do what they did. Just using as an example, the Duggar girl spoke of being lifted by the throat for not brushing her teeth.

There are many who are sexually abused, and who have had trusted family, do highly inappropriate things to them, that they struggle with throughout life, but it comes out in different ways for different people. LT may have started out being fearful of letting them out into the world, and her paranoia grew into something very sick, and twisted. I see her as having some sort of psychiatric problem and, DT seems to be very awkward/backward, but I'd not make the mistake of thinking of him as being a pushover.

IANA psychiatrist, just going on the videos, and gut, FWIW, I think the two became a united front. They remind me of people who are very wrapped up in each other, and "things", but the kids, not so much. Had they married someone else, this may never have happened. Together, it was a match and gasoline.

Wesley's story:
http://articles.latimes.com/1997/jul/27/news/mn-16711

 

[rsd1200]

Do we know for sure she had a drivers license?

We have only been told, through MSM that one was seen driving a vehicle. I didn't state that she had a license.

 

[rsd1200]

I seem to remember an article in the first few days after this story broke that stated that the older children had the 'knowledge' of a first grader. This makes sense. I think what it may be referring to is the childrens knowledge of what life in the world outside the confines of their home is like. How things work, how society functions, etc.

I can't see any hospital (assisted living) releasing any information on a patient in their care, and especially not to a celebrity doctor who would be likely to repeat that information publicly.

I think Dr. Oz has read the same article we have read and is stating the older ones have a "mind of a first grader" suggesting they have a low IQ as opposed to a lack of knowledge.

BBM
This is how I think too, but, this is where the old game "Telephone" comes into play.

 

[msphilosopher]

Okay, this is creepier than I had imagined. You've got twelve kids in four groups of three, each group wearing the same outfit. One group has the three boys, then three groups of girls by age.

I'd bet good money that the Turpin home was set up for five bedrooms (remember, it had a room that was an option of a den or 5th bedroom): One bedroom for the parents, and one bedroom for each of the groups of three.

Makes you wonder if the 13th child was the first of the next group of three.

BBM - Yes, very creepy. I've studied all of the uncensored pictures immensely. The more you look at them, more creepy and odd things you start to notice.

Ps the order goes: girl, boy, girl, boy, girl, girl, girl, girl (who escaped), boy, girl, girl, girl, and lastly baby girl.

MSM article which showed the names and relative ages of the adult children is wrong in terms of the order of the adult children.

 

[rsd1200]

In regards to the neighbor seeing one of the girls driving, we have no way of knowing which girl they supposedly saw. They never saw all 13 together. Didn’t even know that many kids were there. The first three girls could be interchangeable at a glance from a neighbor’s yard. Same with the other two sets of three girls.

I have a hard time distinguishing them. I finally made photo and listed the names over the heads of the ones I'd figured out so I could have something to refer to, myself, in my head, rather than calling them #s.

 

[Lilibet]

Gag me with a spoon. Is this REALLY being considered? Please say no. I can't even.

BBM

This is what Amy Duggar wants. So I will say “No” it’s not really being considered, except by Amy on Twitter. There is no way this will happen. The state is working hard for the benefit of the survivors, and handing them over to a reality show family would not be to their benefit at all.