CA - Hannah,16,Devonte,15,&Ciera Hart,12 (fnd deceased),Mendocino Cty,26 Mar 2018 #5

[Sleuth99]

I think they said they are waiting for the tox on the third child? And they are waiting on DNA to ID and probably tox on fourth child.

Appreciate all of the responses. I thought it was odd but I must have read the early reports only. Thanks!


IMO

 

[Talulah]

I have zero sympathy for any of the adult family in this case

I can understand why you feel that way. I do think the biological family is minimizing. But just what if PC (the aunt) knew the mother was clean and had been in rehab when she allowed her to cook dinner and watch the kids? (I know the court documents says it was the aunt's daughter that allowed it, but I don't really believe it). Maybe there really was a judicious judgement made there and it got the kids removed. We don't really know.

 

[Quill]

I have zero sympathy for any of the adult family in this case

I totally agree. These children were failed miserably by every adult ever charged with protecting and caring for them.

 

[bluesneakers]

PLEASE PAY ATTENTION TO THE ABOVE MOD NOTE!

In case this is not clear do not sleuth any of the bio family. I'm sure they are devastated.

Please try and think about how you would feel. By no fault of your own, some of your beloved relatives/children were murdered AND it became a national story.

Then, you read where people are not only discussing you but JUDGING YOU about your lives with these kids.

I can guarantee without anyone telling me that the people you have posted about were told they were being discussed on Websleuths. Their hearts must be in shreds.

YOU WORDS HAVE POWER. Think of a steaming hot butter knife slicking through a stick of butter. Those are your words slicing through these people's hearts.

Please, stop.

Thank you,
Tricia

Bump.

 

[Talulah]

I can understand why you feel that way. I do think the biological family is minimizing. But just what if PC (the aunt) knew the mother was clean and had been in rehab when she allowed her to cook dinner and watch the kids? (I know the court documents says it was the aunt's daughter that allowed it, but I don't really believe it). Maybe there really was a judicious judgement made there and it got the kids removed. We don't really know.

On the other hand, it still screams to me that she didn't have adequate support to raise the kids without the help of their parents. Still very problematic.

 

[Sleuth99]

Devonte Hart's biological mom: They gave my kids 'to monsters'

http://www.oregonlive.com/pacific-n...f/2018/04/devonte_harts_biological_mom_t.html

May she be able to lay her children to rest [emoji1488] Shame


IMO

 

[Talulah]

I'd like to know how the guidelines about commenting on bio family relates to the current MSM interviews with the aunt and mother.

edited to not sound snarky. I didn't intend for it to.

 

[Whiteorchids]

Nasalle, in addition to having Finn Festivals, has an 8-mile stretch of "dog-friendly" beach they may have visited prior. It also has the river which dumps into the bay, and eventually out into the Pacific. Might they have gone to Nasalle to dispose of bodies, then the opposite direction miles south to have their 'accident', thus confusing LE (who might not think to look for the missing children in the river or beach areas up there)?

It also has a no-kill animal shelter...(330 2nd St NE, Long Beach, WA). Which maybe seems absurd, when you consider things, but who knows how the mind was thinking at this point.(See funbeach.com and click 'Plan With Pets' in the left side margin.)

That’s something to think about as the dogs are missing too

 

[KaaBoom]

Around 2013 Max Ribner gave the children music lessons. Twice a month for a year. The kids also volunteer on the farm but I don't have the exact time frame at my finger tips. Those outside the home activities for the kids, if limited, are maybe important? Imho.

OK, thanks. I think Max Ribner is a little biased in favor of the Harts. He seemed to be trying to paint them in the best light, but I added it into the timeline anyway. Thanks.

March 2004: Earliest known public record that shows Jennifer Hart and Sarah Gengler, both from South Dakota, residing in Alexandria, Minnesota.

May 2005: Sarah Hart petitions to change her last name from Gengler to Hart.

September 2006: Jennifer and Sarah Hart adopt siblings Markis, Abigail and Hannah.

September 2008: According to a police report from Alexandria, Minnesota, Hannah, then 6, tells authorities that one of her mothers bruised her with a belt. Asked about the beating, Jennifer and Sarah Hart tell a police investigator and social worker the girl had fallen down the stairs.

February 2009: Jennifer and Sarah adopt Devonte and two of his siblings — bringing their number of children to six. An article from Paper Trail, a New Zealand-based news outlet, describes his adoption. The article said by age 4, the boy had been abused, neglected, shot at and had endured other traumas.

November 2010: Police in Alexandria, Minnesota interview Abigail Hart, 6 at the time, after a teacher discovers bruises stretching from her sternum to her navel. The girl says Jennifer Hart hit her with a closed fist, put her head in a cold bath, then hit her again, court records show. She was then grounded, the girl told police, which meant she had to stay in bed and miss lunch.

December 2010: Alexandria, MN home listed for sale.

April 2011: Sarah Hart pleads guilty to abusing Abigail Hart and is sentenced to a year of probation for misdemeanor domestic assault, court records show. Sarah told police she was the one who hit Abigail, even though the girl told authorities her mother Jennifer had done it. The next day, all six of the Hart children are taken out of public schools. They never attend public school again.

October 2011: The family lives in Alexandria, Minnesota, for a time and takes part in local activism. Hart family members including Devonte and Jennifer Hart participate in an Occupy Minneapolis demonstration.

2012: According to friends in Oregon, Sarah Hart travels to Portland to look for work. Jennifer Hart and their children later join her. Hannah loses front teeth after allegedly falling in house acceding to Jen's FB post.

August 2012: Alexandria MN house re-listed for sale.

October 2012: Sarah begins work at Kohls in Oregon (Sarah's LinkedIn resume).

December 2012: Jen and kids travel to Oregon, getting a ride with the Lees after rollover accident in Missoula According to Statesman Journal article.

April 2013- Alexandria, MN house sold. The family moves to West Linn, family friend Alexandra Argyropoulos tells Oregon child welfare officials that the Hart parents have been depriving their kids of food as punishment, she says. The Harts break off contact with her when they learn of it. Argyropoulos says she was told the Hart children had been interviewed by Oregon officials; it was apparent that each child had been coached by their mothers on what to say; and nothing more could be done by the Oregon Department of Human Services.

2013: Portland musician Max Ribner, of the band Nahko and Medicine for the People, began offering music classes to the Hart children. The Hart children also started volunteering at the Good Neighbor Family Pantry

July 2013: The police department responds to a call to the Hart's house.

November 2014: Family members participate in a Portland protest of a Missouri grand jury declining to indict a Ferguson police officer in the fatal shooting of Michael Brown. Devonte and a Portland police officer hug, and the photo of the moment goes viral.

March 2016: Family members join U.S. Sen. Bernie Sanders of Vermont onstage during a presidential campaign rally in Vancouver.

May 2017: Jennifer and Sarah Hart buy a two-story, 3-bedroom home on 2 acres of land in the Woodland area of Clark County, Washington, property records show.

June 2017: Jen's rough year FB post.

March 23, 2018: The Washington State Department of Social and Health Services opens a Child Protective Services investigation in which the Hart children are "identified as potential victims of alleged abuse or neglect."

March 23, 2018: The Washington State Department of Social and Health Services attempts without success to make contact with the Hart family.

March 24, 2018 - 3:00 AM: Sarah Hart sends a middle-of-the-night text message to friend Cheryl Hart, only hours after child protective services first visited the family's home, saying she was so sick she might have to go to the hospital. The friend never made contact again.

March 24, 2018 - 8:14 AM: The family is in or around Newport, Oregon, police say. It's believed they continue south on Route 101 until they reach State Route 1 in Leggett, California.

March 24, 2018 - 8:00 PM The Harts travel south on State Route 1 until they reach the Fort Bragg area in Mendocino.

March 25, 2018 - 9:00 PM: The family leaves Fort Bragg.

March 26, 2018: The Washington State Department of Social and Health Services again unsuccessfully attempts to make contact with the Hart family. They call 911 and ask the Sheriff's Department to do a welfare check on the family.

March 26, 2018 - 1:15 PM: Cheryl Hart calls 911 and asked the Sheriff's Department to do a welfare check on Sarah Hart. "Nobody has been able to get ahold of her, talk to her or seen her since," she told the dispatcher.

March 26, 2018: A passer-by along Highway 1 in Westport, California, calls 911 after looking down a 100-foot embankment and seeing an SUV upside down on the rocky shoreline. Five people are found dead: three children outside the SUV and two women inside.

March 27, 2018: The Washington State Department of Social and Health Services makes a third unsuccessful attempt to contact the Hart family.

March 28, 2018: The women are identified by the Mendocino County's Sheriff's Office as Jennifer and Sarah Hart and their children as Markis, Jeremiah and Abigail. Three of their other children: Devonte, Hannah and Sierra, remain missing. Sheriff Tom Allman said a search is ongoing for the remaining three children.

March 29, 2018: Police continue to search for the three missing children, including Devonte, and to investigate why the SUV plunged off the California cliff. Authorities don't know if the kids were also in the car, but are basing their search on the assumption that they were thrown from the car into the cliffs or the surf.

March 31, 2018: Officials reveal the speedometer on the Harts' wrecked SUV was "pinned" at 90 mph.

April 2, 2018: Officials say the crash may have been intentional, saying data taken from the family's SUV shows the vehicle came to a complete stop at the Route 1 pullout before speeding off the cliff. The search for the missing children becomes a "recovery effort."

April 2, 2018: "I'm to the point where I'm no longer calling this an accident, I'm calling it a crime," Mendocino County Sheriff Tom Allman tells HLN's Ashleigh Banfield.

April 7, 2018: An unidentified body, believed to be that of a black female, is found in the ocean near the site of the crash. Officials said an identification could take weeks.

 

[goldenbear]

That’s something to think about as the dogs are missing too

I think the dogs could have been let out at the last site. People do this for animals. Then the next morning they let them back in again.

 

[Talulah]

OK, thanks. I think Max Ribner is a little biased in favor of the Harts. He seemed to be trying to paint them in the best light, but I added it into the timeline anyway. Thanks.

March 2004: Earliest known public record that shows Jennifer Hart and Sarah Gengler, both from South Dakota, residing in Alexandria, Minnesota.

May 2005: Sarah Hart petitions to change her last name from Gengler to Hart.

September 2006: Jennifer and Sarah Hart adopt siblings Markis, Abigail and Hannah.

September 2008: According to a police report from Alexandria, Minnesota, Hannah, then 6, tells authorities that one of her mothers bruised her with a belt. Asked about the beating, Jennifer and Sarah Hart tell a police investigator and social worker the girl had fallen down the stairs.

February 2009: Jennifer and Sarah adopt Devonte and two of his siblings — bringing their number of children to six. An article from Paper Trail, a New Zealand-based news outlet, describes his adoption. The article said by age 4, the boy had been abused, neglected, shot at and had endured other traumas.

November 2010: Police in Alexandria, Minnesota interview Abigail Hart, 6 at the time, after a teacher discovers bruises stretching from her sternum to her navel. The girl says Jennifer Hart hit her with a closed fist, put her head in a cold bath, then hit her again, court records show. She was then grounded, the girl told police, which meant she had to stay in bed and miss lunch.

December 2010: Alexandria, MN home listed for sale.

April 2011: Sarah Hart pleads guilty to abusing Abigail Hart and is sentenced to a year of probation for misdemeanor domestic assault, court records show. Sarah told police she was the one who hit Abigail, even though the girl told authorities her mother Jennifer had done it. The next day, all six of the Hart children are taken out of public schools. They never attend public school again.

October 2011: The family lives in Alexandria, Minnesota, for a time and takes part in local activism. Hart family members including Devonte and Jennifer Hart participate in an Occupy Minneapolis demonstration.

2012: According to friends in Oregon, Sarah Hart travels to Portland to look for work. Jennifer Hart and their children later join her. Hannah loses front teeth after allegedly falling in house acceding to Jen's FB post.

August 2012: Alexandria MN house re-listed for sale.

October 2012: Sarah begins work at Kohls in Oregon (Sarah's LinkedIn resume).

December 2012: Jen and kids travel to Oregon, getting a ride with the Lees after rollover accident in Missoula According to Statesman Journal article.

April 2013- Alexandria, MN house sold. The family moves to West Linn, family friend Alexandra Argyropoulos tells Oregon child welfare officials that the Hart parents have been depriving their kids of food as punishment, she says. The Harts break off contact with her when they learn of it. Argyropoulos says she was told the Hart children had been interviewed by Oregon officials; it was apparent that each child had been coached by their mothers on what to say; and nothing more could be done by the Oregon Department of Human Services.

2013: Portland musician Max Ribner, of the band Nahko and Medicine for the People, began offering music classes to the Hart children. The Hart children also started volunteering at the Good Neighbor Family Pantry

July 2013: The police department responds to a call to the Hart's house.

November 2014: Family members participate in a Portland protest of a Missouri grand jury declining to indict a Ferguson police officer in the fatal shooting of Michael Brown. Devonte and a Portland police officer hug, and the photo of the moment goes viral.

March 2016: Family members join U.S. Sen. Bernie Sanders of Vermont onstage during a presidential campaign rally in Vancouver.

May 2017: Jennifer and Sarah Hart buy a two-story, 3-bedroom home on 2 acres of land in the Woodland area of Clark County, Washington, property records show.

June 2017: Jen's rough year FB post.

March 23, 2018: The Washington State Department of Social and Health Services opens a Child Protective Services investigation in which the Hart children are "identified as potential victims of alleged abuse or neglect."

March 23, 2018: The Washington State Department of Social and Health Services attempts without success to make contact with the Hart family.

March 24, 2018 - 3:00 AM: Sarah Hart sends a middle-of-the-night text message to friend Cheryl Hart, only hours after child protective services first visited the family's home, saying she was so sick she might have to go to the hospital. The friend never made contact again.

March 24, 2018 - 8:14 AM: The family is in or around Newport, Oregon, police say. It's believed they continue south on Route 101 until they reach State Route 1 in Leggett, California.

March 24, 2018 - 8:00 PM The Harts travel south on State Route 1 until they reach the Fort Bragg area in Mendocino.

March 25, 2018 - 9:00 PM: The family leaves Fort Bragg.

March 26, 2018: The Washington State Department of Social and Health Services again unsuccessfully attempts to make contact with the Hart family. They call 911 and ask the Sheriff's Department to do a welfare check on the family.

March 26, 2018 - 1:15 PM: Cheryl Hart calls 911 and asked the Sheriff's Department to do a welfare check on Sarah Hart. "Nobody has been able to get ahold of her, talk to her or seen her since," she told the dispatcher.

March 26, 2018: A passer-by along Highway 1 in Westport, California, calls 911 after looking down a 100-foot embankment and seeing an SUV upside down on the rocky shoreline. Five people are found dead: three children outside the SUV and two women inside.

March 27, 2018: The Washington State Department of Social and Health Services makes a third unsuccessful attempt to contact the Hart family.

March 28, 2018: The women are identified by the Mendocino County's Sheriff's Office as Jennifer and Sarah Hart and their children as Markis, Jeremiah and Abigail. Three of their other children: Devonte, Hannah and Sierra, remain missing. Sheriff Tom Allman said a search is ongoing for the remaining three children.

March 29, 2018: Police continue to search for the three missing children, including Devonte, and to investigate why the SUV plunged off the California cliff. Authorities don't know if the kids were also in the car, but are basing their search on the assumption that they were thrown from the car into the cliffs or the surf.

March 31, 2018: Officials reveal the speedometer on the Harts' wrecked SUV was "pinned" at 90 mph.

April 2, 2018: Officials say the crash may have been intentional, saying data taken from the family's SUV shows the vehicle came to a complete stop at the Route 1 pullout before speeding off the cliff. The search for the missing children becomes a "recovery effort."

April 2, 2018: "I'm to the point where I'm no longer calling this an accident, I'm calling it a crime," Mendocino County Sheriff Tom Allman tells HLN's Ashleigh Banfield.

April 7, 2018: An unidentified body, believed to be that of a black female, is found in the ocean near the site of the crash. Officials said an identification could take weeks.

Can we add the foster girl in the timeline? I think it's important.

 

[human]

I wonder if there will be any computer searches showing why they picked their route.

I wonder if there are people off the grid who have not heard of this. Solar does not give that much power to run everything unless you have a lot. There may be some who go get the news once in awhile.

The town Naselle is small enough so if there is anything to know, it may be found out.

It is possible that Jen stopped at the overlook, checked to see if there was a guardrail, saw there wasn’t, and went for it.

 

[bluesneakers]

I think the dogs could have been let out at the last site. People do this for animals. Then the next morning they let them back in again.

I thought about this too. If they didn't have chips and were found in some random town/park along the way who would know where to look for their owners?

 

[Whiteorchids]

I think the dogs could have been let out at the last site. People do this for animals. Then the next morning they let them back in again.

I don’t know only that LE said they were missing and neighbors would have seen them running around. Also I don’t think Devonte would have left them behind. Unless something happened to him before they left.

 

[erik28]

Maybe there really was a judicious judgement made there and it got the kids removed. We don't really know.

In my experience as an emergency foster-parent, there is zero room for "judicious judgement" on court orders, even if it is a family placement. The courts are dealing with bioparents whose judgment and actions couldn't be trusted and/or proved actually harmful. The court is done taking risks when kids get into placement. If things go well when orders are followed, there are timelines for relaxation, and even/ultimately reintegration with bioparents when it has been proven to courts and caseworkers that such activities are safe.

As emergency foster-parents (in Washington State), we were literally given a one-sheet on when and where we were allowed to use judgment, legally called "prudent parenting," and parental visits were not on that list. The state needs parents to follow the court-orders to have some modicum of accountability and recourse.

 

[human]

http://www.oregonlive.com/pacific-n...f/2018/04/devonte_harts_biological_mom_t.html

In the article that was posted above the mom said she was in and out of prison until she got clean.

I did not see that she was in and out of prison?

 

[Whiteorchids]

In he video press conference it was stated that the third child's results were not yet complete, and that they may or may not have diphenhydramine in their system as well, it was yet to be determined.

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk

Her body must have been in bad condition.

 

[Lilibet]

I'd like to know how the guidelines about commenting on bio family relates to the current MSM interviews with the aunt and mother.

edited to not sound snarky. I didn't intend for it to.

Tricia referred to not “judging” the family, that our words have power and are like a knife slicing through their hearts. So IMO, she’s asking us to show compassion and perhaps to bite our tongues if we don’t feel it. We don’t need to kick them when they’ve just heard terrible news. That’s my take on the guidelines, but it might be best to pm her and ask.

 

[Talulah]

In my experience as an emergency foster-parent, there is zero room for "judicious judgement" on court orders, even if it is a family placement. The courts are dealing with bioparents whose judgment and actions couldn't be trusted and/or proved actually harmful. The court is done taking risks when kids get into placement. If things go well when orders are followed, there are timelines for relaxation, and even/ultimately reintegration with bioparents when it has been proven to courts and caseworkers that such activities are safe.

As emergency foster-parents (in Washington State), we were literally given a one-sheet on when and where we were allowed to use judgment, legally called "prudent parenting," and parental visits were not on that list. The state needs parents to follow the court-orders to have some modicum of accountability and recourse.

I completely agree with you. I personally wouldn't have chosen to do it, no matter what I thought about the current state of the mother. *Mostly* because I am fully aware of what the outcome might be (removal). However, I am leaving room for the experiences, beliefs, and attitudes of people different from myself.

 

[PoirotryInMotion]

Nasalle's land area is only 2.3 square miles...not too big to search. Current population about 2000.