Insomnia Momma
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Bumping for sweet Joe Clyde. Where are you buddy?
Deceased/Not Found TN - Joseph 'Joe Clyde' Daniels, 5, autistic, Dickson, 3 April 2018 *Arrests*
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wannabeasupersleuth
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I haven't been following this case, but all I see pop up in the Tapatalk main thread for this discussion is a pic of a very angry and miserable woman in a hospital bed holding a newborn.
It kind of tells me everything I need to know...
It kind of tells me everything I need to know...
MsGazette
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I haven't been following this case, but all I see pop up in the Tapatalk main thread for this discussion is a pic of a very angry and miserable woman in a hospital bed holding a newborn.
It kind of tells me everything I need to know...
I have been trying to catch up but I am lost. I have gathered that the father confessed and does not remember where he left the precious boys body. The mother knew about it so shes convicted for one reason or another. There are other children and they were removed from the home. No one knows where the missing child is. The fathers confession is questionable? Maybe? Just trying to gather and follow.
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Jax49
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This article has the basics. I don't question the confession but I've heard some people suggest he might be covering for his wife. moo
http://www.newsweek.com/joe-clyde-daniels-autism-missing-895997
December
Verified insider - Kathy Jones case
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There are special state benefits for special needs children. And there are benefits for children.
Eta
https://www.tn.gov/health/health-program-areas/fhw/mch-cyshcn/mch-cyshcn-css.html
https://www.tn.gov/tenncare/tenncare-kids.html
And families...
https://www.tn.gov/humanservices/for-families/families-first-tanf.html
I have no children and I know about this; so I am thinking they probably knew about it.
Yes, there are but it is dependent upon not just your disability but also your income. If your in a situation where you work and your insurance does not cover enough or anything at all you still would not be able to fill those gaps with Tenncare because they say you make to much money to qualify. There are services available through the school but it's not enough. I still have to get most of my child services outside of his school. Were fortunate to have tricare through the military and it covers everything. Unfortunately civilian health care in the state of Tennessee still falls short for children with autism. It's a spectrum disorder. Insurance companies often deem the severity to low to qualify therapy and thus do not pay for coverage even though any doctor worth his salt, any educator and parent knows THEY NEED THOSE SERVICES! It is Autism awareness month Ya'll. Maybe one way we can honor Joe's memory is to bring more attention to these very real challenges of insufficient support gaps that families raising children with autism deal with daily....
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AmyPond
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Unless you are very low income and qualify for medicaid...it's hard to get much help for services. My husband's insurance through work only covers very limited amounts of OT/Speech/PT a year. And ABA is completely excluded. So my son doesn't get the amount of services he needs because who has $150,000 extra a year laying around for ABA? Not us, that's for sure! I don't know this family's situations but the person who implied it's easy to get help? Ha! If only.
Do I think financial burdens led to Joe's murder? My opinion...no. I don't think that was it at all. I'd honestly be surprised if these people even attempted to get him therapy at all. I've sadly seen it a lot. In addition to money, therapy takes time. It takes effort for the parents. And some people just aren't willing to do it. It's pathetic.
Yes, I agree part of the problem is that people on the outside looking in assume that care and coverage is just readily available. One half thinks the problem is solved while the half says its not my problem. To those people I ask what happens one day when circumstances change and suddenly IT IS YOUR PROBLEM? The statistical FACT is that as of today 1 in 68 live births in the United States are on the ASD spectrum. Go ahead, keep on looking the other way. One day it's going to be your child, your grandchild, niece or nephew, your little cousin, someone you care about and then you are going to learn first hand just how hard it really is to get those services.
As to motive I have wonder if this could not have been a factor. There is no history abuse. There is no history of neglect. Joe by all accounts appeared to be a happy healthy little boy. I cant wrap my mind around that a parent would go from non abusive to abusive to the point of murder? There has to be motive....
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December
Verified insider - Kathy Jones case
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My post about benefits only applies to the people this thread is about. It sounds like no one in that family had a job, so that is their situation.
I am not implying everyone who may need help can easily get it. I don't know everyone's situation. How could I?
Eta...
And it was in response to the idea someone put forward that this murder happened because services for autistic children are expensive. While I am sure the services are expensive, I do not believe that is why this murder took place. I feel if that was the only problem, they would have tried something else.
Something else happened in this case. I don't think it had anything to do with any of that. This is my opinion.
I am not implying everyone who may need help can easily get it. I don't know everyone's situation. How could I?
Eta...
And it was in response to the idea someone put forward that this murder happened because services for autistic children are expensive. While I am sure the services are expensive, I do not believe that is why this murder took place. I feel if that was the only problem, they would have tried something else.
Something else happened in this case. I don't think it had anything to do with any of that. This is my opinion.
December
Verified insider - Kathy Jones case
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I am sorry you are having difficulty.
I was not talking about you or your child. I don't know you and did not know you had a child. I am sorry if you are facing challenges.
But, please understand that I was responding to your post about Joe Rsy Daniels possibly losing his insurance with his job. So, this is the specific situation I was addressing.
December
Verified insider - Kathy Jones case
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I did not mean to imply it is easy to get help for everyone. I was responding to a post about Joe Ray Daniels having no job and thus no insurance. That would seem to be very low income and very much needing help for the children.
And I do not believe that is the motive for the murder.
I know it is not easy to get help. I have a chronic health condition. I get NO help and hardly ever even see a doctor. Even insurance doesn't help.
December
Verified insider - Kathy Jones case
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I was only talking about a very specific situation, the one this thread is about.
We really do not know what was going on in their house. There are cases of abuse and neglect that are not detected until something horrible happens. That might be the case here.
Thank you. I appreciate that.
Joe is still missing. We all want to find him. I have gone over all the theories and suggestions provided in this forum as well as past and present media coverage. The one area that IMO has yet to be thoroughly debated is in that of the motive. Figuring out why this happened could help find Joe.
I'm trying to imagine myself in their shoes. That window of perspective that allows me to imagine this is linked in Autism. I have three boys two of which are on the spectrum (my oldest and middle child). My oldest is graduating this year and going away for college. My middle child is only a year younger than Joe and my youngest is just two years younger than he. I know very well how stressful it is to care for a young child who is not yet verbal but very mobile and a toddler at the same time. I have support, I have insurance, I have family nearby. The process I had to go through to get my son son diagnosed even with a previous history of Autism in his immediate family was so tedious you just cant imagine unless you've been through the process your self. The diagnosis is just the beginning. Then then you've got to go through the referral process. You have to find a place that accepts your insurance and has a slot available to even offer services. We had to wait a significant amount of time until an opening came available for just speech and ot. ABA approval took a year of fighting back and forth A YEAR... If Tricare called me today and said they were no longer covering his services I would be just beside myself, just absolutely devastated. Even imagining myself in that position I cant imagine that I would ever hurt my baby. However, there is another factor here to consider. Try to imagine yourself in that place of defeat and hopelessness and then imagine your a parent who is a paranoid schizophrenic with bipolar disorder off your meds like Krystal Daniels. Was it enough to snap???
Is it plausible to theorize that Krystal may have been the primary aggressor? She may have intended to kill not just Joe but herself as well. Joseph Ray maybe was to late to stop Krystal from hurting Joe especially if she used a weapon but he could have still saved Krystal. It could explain why he won't give up the body?
This is just a theory as to motive. Any other theories I encourage and welcome....
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A schizophrenic off their meds doesn't even need a motive to snap, they can have hallucinations that make the world around them seem different (from my understanding). They don't all commit murder, and with medication I believe they can live normal lives and they don't project 'crazy'. But I believe being off meds can be risky for the person.
There's a lot we don't know about the family. We don't know exactly the conditions under which DCF were involved in the past. We don't know if all past issues that caused DCF involvement are in the past and haven't returned to some extent.
We don't know why JRD gave up his job, and I don't think that was very long ago, in the past year maybe?
We don't know the med status of Krystal.
We don't know for sure that the confession from JRD is accurate and it was a beating by him, and by 'beating' I mean something with intent to kill little Joe. We don't know if those knives that were taken for forensics might be relevant, and if they are I think that might bring Krystal into the murder of little Joe and maybe put JRD into a covering up role, giving him a reason to not want the body seen and examined.
We don't know the details of that alleged sighting. The driver, according to at least one news article didn't think too much of it at the time as they thought it was someone older and probably connected to the house they were outside of. There is someone older in that household who has short blonde hair. But if it was K and she was having a schizophrenic episode I'd be surprised she wasn't shouting or causing a commotion that neighbors could hear. If it was little Joe, was his 'escape' the straw that broke the camel's back for JRD? Again, though, why didn't neighbors hear JRD calling for little Joe to get him back home? People might sleep through it, but 1 am voices are going to resonate more in the night are without all the traffic and people sounds, someone might be late to bed or have insomnia.
There's a lot we don't know about the family. We don't know exactly the conditions under which DCF were involved in the past. We don't know if all past issues that caused DCF involvement are in the past and haven't returned to some extent.
We don't know why JRD gave up his job, and I don't think that was very long ago, in the past year maybe?
We don't know the med status of Krystal.
We don't know for sure that the confession from JRD is accurate and it was a beating by him, and by 'beating' I mean something with intent to kill little Joe. We don't know if those knives that were taken for forensics might be relevant, and if they are I think that might bring Krystal into the murder of little Joe and maybe put JRD into a covering up role, giving him a reason to not want the body seen and examined.
We don't know the details of that alleged sighting. The driver, according to at least one news article didn't think too much of it at the time as they thought it was someone older and probably connected to the house they were outside of. There is someone older in that household who has short blonde hair. But if it was K and she was having a schizophrenic episode I'd be surprised she wasn't shouting or causing a commotion that neighbors could hear. If it was little Joe, was his 'escape' the straw that broke the camel's back for JRD? Again, though, why didn't neighbors hear JRD calling for little Joe to get him back home? People might sleep through it, but 1 am voices are going to resonate more in the night are without all the traffic and people sounds, someone might be late to bed or have insomnia.
December
Verified insider - Kathy Jones case
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Why are we thinking she is off her meds? I am asking if there are reports of that?
If she really has such serious mental health conditions, then maybe there is the possibility she receives benefits herself. I know everyone who needs benefits don't always get them, but some people do. If she does, then she might have medicine. Of course, that doesn't mean she took it faithfully. I just don't know.
The search warrant listed six knives. So, it is definitely worth considering these knives may have been used in the crime. But, they could have been used a number of ways: to threaten, in the commission of the crime, after the fact.
But, if we play out the scenario you described and Joe wished to protect Krystal, why would he describe a different method of committing murder than the one used? Especially if he saw it?
This is why I am wondering if the murder occurred on a different day. I have couple of other things I am wondering, but they are pretty horrible.
I don't think we will find the body by looking at the motive for the murder. Which is good since we have little information about that. We have to look at what this individual would be willing to do to make sure the body was not found. Because, as we have seen, that is of paramount importance to him. He has admitted to a heinous crime. What is so heinous he doesn't want to admit it?
Which that kind of proves his confession (and her confession) wasn't coerced. Because they're holding fast on the point of where is the body and you know they're being asked. Also, they're still talking to Krystal without Joe now. So, if he was trying to protect her (which I personally don't believe that is what is going on, but that's jmoo) he won't be able to do it completely any more.
To elaborate on your point of DCF I know that there is no history of DCS involvement in the past 3 years. There was someone else on this same thread that implied they knew that DCS only kept records as far back as 3 years. There was some information from Krystals facebook page in regards to getting her oldest son back. I don't know if there is someone who can verify if that was within a 3 year window or not. If it's in the 3 year window, probably was just a custody battle between parents. If its further back then 3 years then yes, it could be DCS. Now DCS was involved with Krystal Daniel's family when she was a child but that is the only involvement I can confirm.
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December
Verified insider - Kathy Jones case
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Amonet, the part you said about the commotion and noise is why I wonder if something happened on 4/1 (or even earlier) instead of 4/3. Of course, if Joe went to school 4/2 then it could not have.
Another thing I am wondering is if there is an ATV back in the woods Joe Ray knew about. That way he would have something other than his car. Maybe the owner doesn't realized it was even used.
Another thing I am wondering is if there is an ATV back in the woods Joe Ray knew about. That way he would have something other than his car. Maybe the owner doesn't realized it was even used.
I used DCF but I don't know if it's DCS in that state or another acronym.
I believe the date on Krystal's page where she mentioned regaining custody of one of her son's was before 3 years ago. I don't believe it was an issue between Krystal and Joseph Ray, but I don't know what the actual details of it were. I figure that if one of the children (or more) wasn't in Krystal's care for a while that DCF/DCS would be involved in that and that they would have a say in when the child(ren) could go back to Krystal?
http://fox17.com/news/local/joe-cly...-killing-autistic-boy-search-for-body-ongoing
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Listen to the 911 call. I think I can hear him tell the dispatcher about the severity of his autism.
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