Deceased/Not Found Ca - Hannah,16 (fnd dec), Devonte,15, (dec nf) Ciera Hart,12 (fnd dec),mendocino Cty,26 Mar 2018 #7

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My first time posting here. What a gut wrenching saga of these beautiful children. I sincerely hope washington state or California state authorities will posthumously charge these two women with murder. I also hope somehow the adoption will be annulled so that Devonte's parents will be allowed to bury all the kids found so far. If there is a fund to donate for their burial separate from the Hart's, I would be honored to donate to it. One of the two women who ran this so called agency is from North Dakota. Her name is Maryjane Westra. Wonder if she knows Jennifer Hart from before. Wonder if Jennifer Hart and Sara Hart got the idea to adopt kids from TX from her because the founder knows they get paid to raise adopted children. https://www.fergusfallsjournal.com/2008/04/adoption-agency-has-placed-200-children-in-fergus-area/

Those are some sensitive suggestions. I hope that will happen.

In case anyone missed it, my daughter fell backwards off a swing at school, kneed herself in the face and promptly knocked both teeth out. Thankfully at school, or according to here I would be all types of suspect. I'm sure if they tried hard enough to find the dentist in question they could...it may take a few calls. Hence I shall refrain judgement on this particular issue, as I experienced it myself last week and I have only yelled at my child once when she knocked off the parking brake and my car started rolling with her in it.

Yeah, no. According to here you'd be a suspect in your child's tooth loss if you:

1. Had a child abuse investigation in 2008 involving physical abuse, and;.
2. Had another child abuse investigation in 2010 involving physical abuse and neglect that led to criminal charges and a plea by your wife, and;
3. Had a third and very detailed child abuse investigation in 2013, and;.
4. Had six kids all undersized, five of whom were not even on the growth charts for their age, matching with continuous allegations by the victims and by witnessed of cruel and pervasive food withholding, and;
5. Had witnesses describe extremely cruel sensory deprivation, physical and emotional abuse and neglect and general, punitive control and evasive punishment of your kids by you and your spouse, and;
6. Had witnesses and facts evidence that you're a delusional liar, and;
7. Had yet another child abuse investigation in 2018 due to serious allegations of abuse and gelect, and;
8. Ended up dead along with your dead wife and four of your dead kids after you drove off a cliff.

Yeah. Kids have accidents and harm themselves. Sometimes they knock a tooth or two out. But when their parent is an actual documented sadistic abuser it is logical to assume it didn't happen they way they claimed and was likely just more abuse.
 
I can't imagine social workers having or making the time to examine things like social media or much beyond the information they gather from in person investigation. Unfortunately, I think they they may have been tricked by whatever was presented to them face to face.


IMO

I just asked my friend/neighbor, who is a long time Foster parent. She said the social workers that she works with , DO look at the social media of their clients.

She knows this for a few reasons. She said she was questioned once about something she posted on her family page. She had a few pictures of a neighborhood 4th of July BBQ in her backyard. She didn't notice that her 15 yr old foster son, who she has since adopted, was filling up a glass from the Beer keg....:doh:....yikes....

She was not sure if the social worker had seen it herself or someone called it in...but a quick investigation showed that he had been filling up guests glasses because he thought the keg was cool. But he had not had any thing to drink himself. And they seriously questioned a couple of neighbors who were seen in the picture, who told them he had filled their glasses but didn't drink any of it.

It was bad judgment on her part, but I will admit that I let my son be the bartender when he was an older teen, just because he really loved the idea of learning to mix and serve drinks. He already had a job at a local restaurant, as a server, working himself up from busboy. And he wanted to be a bartender some day. So it may have been bad judgment on my part too...I was not always super strict...:blush:

She also said that she knows of an instance where the social worker told her about something seen on social media, showing that the bio-father was seemingly back in the home, against court orders. And they asked my friend if she knew anything about that or if the kids had said anything about him being there on their last reunification visit home.

So I do see that in some cases, social workers will check a clients social media. I think in some ways it is a pretty quick way of checking up on certain things. JMO
 
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Originally Posted by katydid23
We have been asking ourselves WHY did CPS believe the women, and doubt there was enough evidence of abuse to take the children out of the home. Cases kept getting ruled as 'unfounded.'

I have to wonder if the social workers looked at their social media, and saw the 'adorably joyful' family photos, and were tricked into believing the phony smiles and togetherness.



Respectfully, you guys need to READ the entire CPS report. Nobody was fooled. The language is very clear. The social worker(s) KNEW that the Hart women were manipulative and untrustworthy. They did tons of primary source research. Calls were made to MN, and materials were shared. They faithfully transcribed and reported all interviews with all players. Was the CPS investigation perfect? No, but it's better than I ever would have imagined.

Somebody was fooled because the cases were often ruled unfounded, case closed. Somebody bought what the 2 Moms were trying to sell. JMO
 
Agree. It was all a cover story. And its so obvious when you realize everything she posts is staged and has a specific purpose. So you ask yourself what was the purpose of all that? It was a CYA.

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Fellow members did an excellent job analysing what could have been her psychiatric problems and/ or type of personality. For her social media image, she made many posts exclusively for friends/friends of friends\closed groups. imo She would have never been able to face the backlash if exposed by people outside these circles.She cut off many people who criticized her choices and deeds; 'some' festival goers, old friends, neighbours (the Minnesota lady from the WP story) and online friends. She might have been looking for acceptance and recognition by specific groups on her terms. SH was a part of this scheme too. At least three photos of the children specially in their underwears or bathing suits in 2013 were very alarming and indicating a level of malnutrition, yet no one that we are aware of 'noticed' and acted upon this. This set of friends (with some exceptions) was a perfect match for her. With such stories, published sparsely to avoid questionable details from daily life that could eventually be debunked by experienced eyes here and there, she could have fooled many of them and taken advantages (free accommodation/ tickets/ clothes for the poor tiny kids I rescued from poverty, violence, ... etc). Notice that the children mostly wore over sized clothes, theatrical-themed ones or way too casual and outdated fashion outfits. She would exaggerate (like: we were targeted for being vegetarian lesbians with black children,..etc ; there were multi-layers of potential discrimination she claimed ...and the couple's friends would be some how 'obligated' to offer assistance for the 'kind' couple who saved six children but the evil world doesn't leave them alone. After all, they thought that they all belong to the same social/ and cultural or political/ group, they would empathizes with the story and the story plot would activate their imagination and evoke similar memories and prevent any reasonable or skeptical perception/ no fact check/ of what they were told). There is a scientific term for this trick/ this defensive one. Not sure if it is transportation attitude or something like that. She knew what she was doing manipulating others, especially those who were ready to believe a person they associate themselves with. I don't defend who observed any kind of abuse but trying to understand why some overlooked it or were not concerned enough by some alarming signs. Regular users of social media over the last decade can readily detect these tricks and would expose it in short(and sometimes harsh) comments. But not her alleged 'online friends. Sorry for being talkative:) jmo omo
 
I checked MN Secretary of State inactive businesses for business name "Permanent Family" to see what came up:
Non-profit Corp (Domestic)
Registered Address was in Fergus Falls, MN
Original filing 4/12/2000
4/12/2000 Business Name Filed: Permanent Family Resource Center
9/20/2005 Involuntary Dissolution Filed
1/09/2008 Annual Reinstatement Filed

5/17/2011 Intent to Dissolve Filed
1/27/2012 Dissolution Filed
A few other details can be found there but you have to put in the business name and search "inactive":
https://mblsportal.sos.state.mn.us/Business/Search

Per MN Statute:
(a) A corporation that has failed to file a renewal pursuant to subdivision 1 must be dissolved by the secretary of state as described in paragraph (b).
https://www.revisor.mn.gov/statutes/?id=317A.823


Red flag? If they used that particular agency it would appear the first adoption in 2006 took place after the involuntary dissolution by the SoS and before the reinstatement was filed. So during the period it was not registered as a business with the MN SoS.
September 2006: Jennifer and Sarah Hart adopt siblings Markis, Abigail and Hannah.
February 2009: Jennifer and Sarah adopt Devonte and two of his siblings [Jeremiah, Sierra]— bringing their number of children to six.
http://www.oregonlive.com/pacific-n...f/2018/03/hart_family_deadly_crash_a_tim.html

Note: The above business name matches up to the old website that Mira_Eg found earlier:
http://web.archive.org/web/20071215215326/http://www.permanentfamily.org:80/history.html

Also I scanned the OR DHS report again to verify adoption dates and noticed something seems off here. Report states JH/SH became certified in MN to be "placement resource" for a friend's child in 2010. (The teen that didn't last long due to using wire hangers. See pg 19 OR DHS link below.) This was not "Lee", she arrived summer 2004 and was dumped at her therapist's appointment Spring 2005. Per the Oregon Live article linked above, the Hart's weren't even licensed as foster parents till April 2005.

My head is spinning, bear with me! So if the above info is correct, the first adoption, if through that particular agency, was done when it wasn't lawfully registered as a business with MN SoS. The first foster child Lee was taken in before they were even licensed for foster care. And if the DHS report is correct regarding the 2010 certification as placement resource, then the Harts wanted to foster again the year after adopting the 2nd set of 3 siblings?
Again, if the above is all correct AFA dates, and they used that particular agency in 2006, then these women were at times skirting around the system it would seem, or the system was letting them skirt around it. Possibly illegally? And on top of that temporarily taking in another kid for a total of 7.

Page 19, source of 2010 "placement resource" note :
https://www.scribd.com/embeds/37719...J3P2I7dtOJqmmeeiRQO&show_recommendations=true
Article on foster teen "Lee": http://www.news.com.au/world/north-...h/news-story/1b33da3f5a1922a7da75d4967ad32a62

*^^^^
Hmm that is very interesting... doesn't all appear to be on the up and up[/QUOTE]


Nice work! I found this on a thread I follow in Twitter land, let me know if it's allowed. https://twitter.com/PermanentFamily. On May 19th, 2011 the twitter account posted about an interview- scroll down to 5/19 to find here http://brendamccreight.blogspot.com/2011/05/ -The author, Claudia Fletcher, is easy to find and is an adoption advocate who speaks publicly and candidly about her adoptive kids. She also must be whoever was running "Permanent Family" when they "reopened" in 2011. I'd be interested in knowing if they would be responsible today for these past illegal adoptions.
 
One accident knocking out one or two teeth I'd believe, two accidents knocking out a tooth each time seems unlikely.

The teeth should have been put straight back in the sockets. Rarely is there bone damage sufficient to prevent such. If the tooth is kept moist, the window for successful implantation is quite wide-under three hours the rates of success are pretty high. (Although the teeth will need root canal treatment, splinting etc) Surely they were within three hours of emergency dental care?

We will never really know how the teeth were lost, and why they were not replanted perhaps, but I'm sure not replacing them was at least neglect. These teeth are so important for speech, eating and aesthetics, imagine being a teenager without them? Apart from cost, I can't think of any other reason to not replace them. (And it wouldn't have been prohibitively expensive) I have never come across anyone, in my 25 yrs in dentistry, who opted not to replace missing front teeth in an otherwise healthy mouth, in a well young person. I consider that torturing Hannah.
 
My first time posting here. What a gut wrenching saga of these beautiful children. I sincerely hope washington state or California state authorities will posthumously charge these two women with murder. I also hope somehow the adoption will be annulled so that Devonte's parents will be allowed to bury all the kids found so far. If there is a fund to donate for their burial separate from the Hart's, I would be honored to donate to it. One of the two women who ran this so called agency is from North Dakota. Her name is Maryjane Westra. Wonder if she knows Jennifer Hart from before. Wonder if Jennifer Hart and Sara Hart got the idea to adopt kids from TX from her because the founder knows they get paid to raise adopted children. https://www.fergusfallsjournal.com/2008/04/adoption-agency-has-placed-200-children-in-fergus-area/

- My first time posting here. Welcome to WebSleuths :)
- I'm following three names, founders and ex-workers in this agency. Some still work in a relatively close field that involves children care.
- "....got the idea to adopt kids from TX from her because the founder knows they get paid to raise adopted children.": The NGO site mentioned the 'financial side' of adoption and through the entire process. I don't know if adopting that large number of children by the couple was basically for money and was promoted by the owner of this organization. I would say not the sole purpose, but just a factor amongst others. jmo omo
 
I also think JH was the one who hit the girl with her fist.

And: the mothers seemed to have a fixation on everything to do with eating: Mouths, teeth, food, etc. What a strange thing to do -post photos of your daughter's bloody tooth on the internet.

And: Every single child seemed to be required to be smiling in every single photo. (Really, of hundreds and hundreds of photos of children, virtually none of them show disinterest, grumpiness, anything other than absolute joy?)

And: Seemingly hundreds of incidents of food strangeness/withholding: "Eating out of garbage bins, off the floor". "Hannah was morbidly obese". Markis "I'll see if anything is left when everyone is finished". Etc., etc., etc.

A 12 year-old who has no front teeth, and there are no plans to fix it. (There weren't any. She'd been without teeth, bridge or anything else for years.)

Shoving food in children's mouths.

It's the "shoving the banana and some nuts" in Hannah's mouth that make me think it highly likely that the missing front teeth have something to do with punishment, and most likely food-related punishment.

A few posts back someone said they thought that JH had body/image/food issues that she projected onto the children. I'm 100% certain, at this point, that that is so.

Friday, brilliant post.

Bbm: My dad returned from ROTC Korea/Japan with a Nikon camera in the late 50's. There must be upwards of a thousand slides of me and my sisters over the years. Documenting everything from the sublime to the ridiculous. Even the staged portraits are natural, we had to calm the baby sister with cookies. So there she is eating her cookie! My dad captured real life. One of my favorites is of me and my sibs lined up on the side of a barn ALL expressing a Clint Eastwood in a Dirty Harry movie, face, before that movie was even made! We were so not lining up for a say cheese photo, at 7, 5, & 3. And my dad captured the moment.

Guess how many are the say cheese photographs?

Devonte especially, with his naturally glowing smile was showcased. And there is Hannah at the opposite end of the spectrum in later photographs.

And yes, the food thing. Athletes need fuel. These babies have no muscle, no evidence of pushing their their physical bodies. Damn, one of the things that inspired me in high school was the discovery I was good at soccer. I had no idea. None of these discoveries were provided for these kids. It's not just books,,, where is the rest?

So yes, there is something not right in the wake of a couple of overweight vegans starving their children. I don't have food issues like this. So I am not the one to know of the underlying issues, but I do believe it is as powerful as any addiction.
 
In regards to the teeth, I feel like it's just normal human nature on the part of many to want to rationalize this as an accident because we've had kids in our own lives and we ourselves have had some kind of freak accident in which the same end result happened (tooth getting knocked out). So we believe JH's FB post explanation, even when so much else of what she has posted on FB has been debunked as a lie for the camera.

On the other hand, we have documented CPS evidence that JH and SH did things like: hit children with a belt, held a child over a bathtub and beat her, starved children, and shoved a banana and nuts into a child's mouth.

Imo, there was no running allowed in that house to begin with to even set the stage for an accident. What's more likely to have happened given what we know about the behavior of JH are things like:

- H tried to escape from a punishment and did run as she broke free and fell hard. Being malnourished, her tooth broke off the way it did.
- JH shoving hard food like nuts into her mouth was something that happened more than once. On two occasions, the shoving of food was forceful enough (I imagining her shoving almonds forcefully at her teeth.) H being malnourished - weak gums - and out comes the tooth.
- JH outright punched H in the face for whatever perceived infraction.

To me, the cause is Occam's Razor. The posting of the tooth of FB is the CYA of all CYAs in the event H ever told someone about her teeth. "See, she's lying!" It's so clear imo. I just am feeling like too many times people rationalize ways to make this situation less dark.

There is that one photo of H wearing that hideous mask at the Goonies festival -- which you have to know was an "ironic" momster choice to make her wear that. The way her face is turned towards the camera, you can only see one little eye. And you can see that it's a sad little eye. In a sea of fake smiles.

MOO
 
Why are we still talking about the teeth and how they came out, there actually was a ton of discussion on the prior threads, and many posters had chimed in saying they knew of something similar happening by accident. Then others chimed in how if took to dentist right away the teeth could have been saved.

Hannah may very well have fallen acvidently and knocked her teeth out but I don't find it likely given all of the rest of the information of abuse allegations, eye witness accounts of behavior we now have and the strange food obsession the Hart "mothers" had.

Because Jenn hart said Hannah didn't want her front teeth replaced. Because every photo of Hannah goes from shining star to wth?

Because there was never an explanation that made sense?

High schoolers lose teeth in accidents, cracks, chips, breaks, and injuries above the gum line. But two teeth, one a perfect pulled tooth? As shown in JH SM?

Why am I thinking about this? Because I think this is a clue.
 
Yeah I think jen just punched her in the mouth. For being "disrespectful."

Definitely. Jenn's post with the tooth pic had an admonishing tone & referenced "the rules" & "consequences".

There was no genuine sympathy or concern for the fear & pain that little girl was going through. The whole thing had a tone of "I warned her, & now they all know - this is what happens to children who don't obey me"
 
The post showcasing the bloody tooth is bizarre enough even with the made-up explanation that I would have considered Jen a bizarre person for it alone. It's just weird. It would have raised my eyebrow.
 
Once Facebook got popular, that's one of the first things we did in our office. we almost always looked up the families' social media pages. However, none of that was admissable in a report, nor were we able to officially let anything we saw on their pages sway our decisions. The keyword being "officially." You can bet, however, that social workers most definitely look up SM pages, especially those of people who dinged our hinky meters.

Got it. So we have no way of knowing whether they indeed looked or not due to documentation and reporting procedures but it is a common practice for social workers to do so as an off the record aid. I'm wondering about something else... but I'm going to review the reports first. [emoji1476]


IMO
 
Got it. So we have no way of knowing whether they indeed looked or not due to documentation and reporting procedures but it is a common practice for social workers to do so as an off the record aid. I'm wondering about something else... but I'm going to review the reports first. [emoji1476]


IMO

Yep, that pretty much sums it up!
 
You're right. Something went awry but it definitely was NOT because the social worker didn't do her due diligence. She covered every possible angle, even, as you said, doing research in other states. I've written hundreds of these reports; this worker knew there was abuse in the home and did a very good job of documenting what she found along the way. Many of the details that she includes are not things that were necessary-she included them because she was concerned and wanted them documented.

So why wasn't the case opened? I don't know, but it wasn't the worker's fault. She didn't have final say.

Thanks for your perspective on this! It seems much of the problem is with the process itself, and the rules/laws the govern it.
 
I don't think Jen would have published that, ie, her bloody tooth. Imo. It dosen't stack up with the perfect savior thing.

Wondering if there was any follow up on social media after the publishing of the bloody tooth?

Jen posted photos of her emaciated children. She was hiding in plain sight.

And I think she would have posted a photo of a tooth she had punched out. The post was paragraphs of “I TOLD YOU SO” and triumphant gloating that Hannah got her comeuppance.
 
My first time posting here. What a gut wrenching saga of these beautiful children. I sincerely hope washington state or California state authorities will posthumously charge these two women with murder. I also hope somehow the adoption will be annulled so that Devonte's parents will be allowed to bury all the kids found so far. If there is a fund to donate for their burial separate from the Hart's, I would be honored to donate to it. One of the two women who ran this so called agency is from North Dakota. Her name is Maryjane Westra. Wonder if she knows Jennifer Hart from before. Wonder if Jennifer Hart and Sara Hart got the idea to adopt kids from TX from her because the founder knows they get paid to raise adopted children. https://www.fergusfallsjournal.com/2008/04/adoption-agency-has-placed-200-children-in-fergus-area/


Good find! I’m wondering how this agency was funded. Westra and Ringuette have to pay their bills somehow. Do clients pay them? Do they receive grants or government money? I know someone IRL who has a non-profit that helps people adopt; they are funded by private donations, but now I’ll have to ask. I know there’s a board of directors...

Does anyone know this?
 
I would like to be a fly on the wall in the 2 homes that JH and SH grew up in. No doubt in my mind that some unspoken

atocities were committed against or in front of these two monsters. Monsters like them grew up w. abuse and trauma

which may lie dormant for a time but will eventually come out as atrocities against others. Unless the

abused/traumatised one makes a conscious decision to thoroughly understand and a very conscious decision

not to perpetuate this kind of abuse on others. In other words, to become a better person than the family member(s)

that committed the atrocities on them. Abuse often begets more abuse- unless the abused is committed to halting it.

IME, MOO.
 
Thanks for your perspective on this! It seems much of the problem is with the process itself, and the rules/laws the govern it.

And that process is kind of a tricky thing, too. It both works and doesn't work at the same time. On the one hand, you have people like this who slip through the cracks and don't have cases opened on them when there should have been. On the other hand, we would all be in trouble if they just took people's words for what we were (or were not) doing to our kids. In this situation we have "friends" saying that "Jen did this" or "Jen did that", but there's no way to verify that. Unless the kids spoke up (and they usually don't), it somehow wound up on video or in photos, or there's physical evidence to support the claims, there's really no solid way to back many of those things up. When she said that Jen made the kids lay down for several hours with the sleeping masks on, for instance. That sounds terrible but how do you PROVE it? We should definitely believe the children, but if the kids aren't talking or if they're denying it? It kind of puts the worker in a tough position. There were many times in which we knew that something was going on, we could feel it and sense it, but we couldn't find any kind of physical evidence to support it-there were no environmental safety concerns, the kids denied everything the relative (in one case it was a cousin reporting on a cousin) was saying, there were no marks or history of suspicious medical incidents, etc. Still, we knew those kids were being abused. Because there was virtually nothing to support that, however, we couldn't open the case.

In the Hart's case, it was a different of course. There were some physical issues with the weight (and possibly medical neglect with Hannah's teeth but all we have is our own speculation about that) and that should have been pursued. If they'd followed up in six months, or sooner, then they may have caught something. Or they may not have. The women, knowing they were being investigated, might have changed their ways while the worker was in the home for the duration. Unfortunately we'll never know what might have happened if the case had been open.

What my office probably would have done is sent the case to Family Preservation. There were enough red flags in the report that, even without a lot of "hard" evidence, it would have warranted further attention. Family Preservation sometimes works with CPS in that they take on cases in which the families aren't in immediate danger (the house isn't hoarded, nobody's in jail, no signs of physical abuse, etc.) but they still need to make some changes in the home for safety purposes. A caseworker wold have spent 5-10 hours per week with the Harts (a minimum of 5, max of 10) for 4-6 weeks. They would've come up with a safety plan and set "goals" for the family to work on. During that time, the FP Officer would have been able to observe a LOT of what went on in the home. It's easy enough to hide your life during a one-hour meeting but a lot harder when the caseworker practically moves in with you. :)

I can feel the worker's frustration while reading the report. She went through all of that research because they truly believed that something was going on.
 
One accident knocking out one or two teeth I'd believe, two accidents knocking out a tooth each time seems unlikely.

The teeth should have been put straight back in the sockets. Rarely is there bone damage sufficient to prevent such. If the tooth is kept moist, the window for successful implantation is quite wide-under three hours the rates of success are pretty high. (Although the teeth will need root canal treatment, splinting etc) Surely they were within three hours of emergency dental care?

We will never really know how the teeth were lost, and why they were not replanted perhaps, but I'm sure not replacing them was at least neglect. These teeth are so important for speech, eating and aesthetics, imagine being a teenager without them? Apart from cost, I can't think of any other reason to not replace them. (And it wouldn't have been prohibitively expensive) I have never come across anyone, in my 25 yrs in dentistry, who opted not to replace missing front teeth in an otherwise healthy mouth, in a well young person. I consider that torturing Hannah.

Minusfour, you put this so eloquently and effectively!

The psychological impact of having no front teeth is tremendous, and even if the mothers didn't quite understand it as well as they should have, any professional would urge them to have it taken care of as soon as possible. Your face, first and foremost, is how you relate to the world -the most important part of your "being" in that sense. And that's just the "self-esteem"/psychological aspect of this. Then there's simple nutrition, speech, etc. (Yes, your front teeth affect speech tremendously.)

In case anyone here does not understand the self-esteem impact of having no front teeth, let me relay this: I had a serious case of cyst-forming rosacea on my face in my 30's which left huge purple scarring on much of my face. I'm not a person who is overly concerned with my looks. However, it shook me to the core to realize the depth of the impact on my concept of self and my relationships with others. I could see it register immediately on other's faces, and feel their pity. Some people, strangers, would even comment.

Guess what? My dermatologist, as early as possible, set up an appointment with a plastic surgeon for me, to give me hope. I think he knew that, eventually, those scars would fade and leave me much less disfigured, but as a professional, he understood the devastation to a person with a disfigured face. I never did have the surgery (and sure enough, the scars are much less prominent today) but that appointment with the surgeon, who told me he could certainly get my face looking better -not perfect, but better- gave me incredible hope while I was healing.

People like Hannah are exactly the people who first-world medical/dental professionals provide charity care for in developing countries. It's unacceptable and appalling that anyone who saw her in the relative affluent culture we live in, for anything other than a short time (friends?!) wouldn't have said something to the parents. It tells me, as well, that they either never took her to a dentist, or didn't follow up.

To let that go on for years is abusive.
 
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