Rav4

[entrustEd]

A simple opinion question to all:

Is the amount of SA's blood found in the RAV4 consistent with the theoretical amount that could be drawn out of a vial without the vial later appearing emptied?

 

[missy1974]

A simple opinion question to all:

Is the amount of SA's blood found in the RAV4 consistent with the theoretical amount that could be drawn out of a vial without the vial later appearing emptied?

I had to go back and find some old posts I had made about this issue. The amount of blood in the vial has always bothered me, and still does, regardless of the RH theory that KZ presented.

The vial was a 10ml vial. The FBI noted that there was 5.5ml's of blood in the vial when they received it. There is paperwork from LabCorp that stated they consumed 1ml of blood. If we look at Nick Stahlke's (State blood expert)testimony, he said the amount of blood in the RAV4 would total 1-2ml's. Which was odd because he also said that a "natural blood drop" was .05ml.

 

[ACJL]

It does seem out of ordinary, yes. If you get BASIC info from a neighboring sheriff's office lead investigator, why would you need to verify, it's been all over the news as well, why would AC doubt plate #and model?

It's all explained in his testimony.

He or others in sheriff's office very likely found out between Oct 31- Nov 3rd that her last known stop was at SA's place. If they we already looking for an opportunity to cut SA down, that would have fell right in their lap. Then all they needed to do was find TH if dead, and see what, if anything could be done. If AC found her car, with her body in the back, it's suddenly a very good opportunity.
It would be good to see AC's phone records, did he call Lenk or someone else right after the call to dispatch? Where did his mobile phone ping off?

There is no evidence that the cops found out anything between Oct 31 and Nov 3rd. This is purely speculation from your part. The rest of this paragraph also contains nothing but speculation.

I don't doubt AC's phone records would show he was somewhere on the middle of a road.

 

[ACJL]

A simple opinion question to all:

Is the amount of SA's blood found in the RAV4 consistent with the theoretical amount that could be drawn out of a vial without the vial later appearing emptied?

More like consistent with an actively bleeding person.

 

[entrustEd]

More like consistent with an actively bleeding person.

By answering the question this way, you reveal you choose not acknowledge a reasonable observation, that the tiny amount of SA's blood in the RAV4 could be consistent with a logical amount withdrawn from the vial without making it look empty. That vial was stored in a cardboard box case file in the clerk's office, not in an evidence locker.

I choose to acknowledge that the tiny amount of blood could also be from an actively bleeding person, because it could be the truth, and that's what I want to know, yes I can handle SA being guilty. I feel it's more probable that there would be more blood from a bleeding person than the amount that was discovered.

 

[ACJL]

By answering the question this way, you reveal you choose not acknowledge a reasonable observation, that the tiny amount of SA's blood in the RAV4 could be consistent with a logical amount withdrawn from the vial without making it look empty. That vial was stored in a cardboard box case file in the clerk's office, not in an evidence locker.

I choose to acknowledge that the tiny amount of blood could also be from an actively bleeding person, because it could be the truth, and that's what I want to know, yes I can handle SA being guilty. I feel it's more probable that there would be more blood from a bleeding person than the amount that was discovered.

Actually, addressing another scenario says nothing about reasonable observation about the one you present. Do you know how much blood Marlene Kraintz put in the vial btw?

None of the comments you have left so far on the forum show any signs of you even remotely considering the fact Avery could be guilty.

 

[missy1974]

I don't think anyone knows how much blood was put in the vial when Marlene Kraintz took SA's blood. She was on the list of witnesses to testify, but I do believe it was more about the hole in the top of the vial. I would love to have known how much blood was in the tube originally, but I don't think it's documented anywhere.

 

[proudfootz]

I don't think anyone knows how much blood was put in the vial when Marlene Kraintz took SA's blood. She was on the list of witnesses to testify, but I do believe it was more about the hole in the top of the vial. I would love to have known how much blood was in the tube originally, but I don't think it's documented anywhere.

It's very likely assumed that there will be no hanky panky with such samples, and no particular attention is paid to documenting these details. But I would think that there is probably a habitual standard for how much blood is typically taken as a sample to ensure there is enough for X many tests.

 

[missy1974]

@proudfootz I looked everywhere for the answer of how much is typically drawn into the vial. Even looked on the manufacturers website, couldn't find the answer. I did find that they are vacuum sealed, and that is what draws the blood out, but no average volume. Common sense tells me that it's probably more than 6-7ml's though, but no way to be sure how much was drawn because the person taking the blood could also stop it at any point.

 

[proudfootz]

I suppose it would depend on the vacuum in the tube, which might be variable from tube to tube (and conceivably blood pressure?).

On the other hand there must be some standard amount of blood they want for tests common to sites where the tubes are used.

This site gives what sound like specifics:

How much blood is normally taken?

This depends on the sort of tests you are having done. Many tests can be done on the same sample of blood so you do not need to have a single bottle for each one: The bottles do not necessarily have to be completely filled either.

• Purple bottle - 3 ml - used for a full blood count (FBC) and ESR. An FBC needs 1 ml; a full 2.5 ml is needed if an ESR is also performed.
• Yellow bottle - 2.5 ml - this is used for a lot of different chemical tests, so it is usually completely filled.
• Other less common tests come in bottles up to 6 ml in volume and blood culture bottles are the largest size at 10 ml.

If you need a lot of tests therefore, you could end up having about 30 ml of blood (about six medicine teaspoons) taken out of your arm.

Blood Tests | Patient

##################

 

[proudfootz]

One more caveat regarding the information above - this was a discussion about taking blood samples for specific medical tests. It might not be applicable to blood samples taken by law enforcement.

 

[missy1974]

One more caveat regarding the information above - this was a discussion about taking blood samples for specific medical tests. It might not be applicable to blood samples taken by law enforcement.

Right, and unfortunately, I still can't seem to find what the volume should be in a 10ml vial. And the first one's to use the vial would have been LabCorp, and they didn't note the volume when they got it either.