Allabouttrial
Until you've walked a mile in someone else's shoes
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Oh yes of course, hadn't thought about drugs.
Uk - Amelia Brooke Harris, 4, Murdered, South Wales, 8 June 2018 *arrest*
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CoverMeCagney
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I’m sure there are other things that don’t show up in preliminary tests, hopefully someone more knowledgeable will be along soon!
NSS
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Suffocation is also hard to show. The article mentions that the wooden table was in the garden, the fact that the mother keeps repeating 'I'm sorry' suggests that she knows what happened. Rules regarding interviewing suspects is fairly strict in the UK (not rigid due to terrorism, but in general). The person should be fairly stable with regard to alcohol, drugs, and mental illness. Social media page (of the suspect) suggest that there may be an alcohol/mental health issue at play here. I don't expect a full confessional interview since lawyers have been able to form a strategy whilst her mental health has been addressed and they will likely suggest she say nothing until all the evidence is in.
Caution prior to questioning.
“You do not have to say anything. But, it may harm your defence if you do not mention when questioned something which you later rely on in court. Anything you do say may be given in evidence.”
Being arrested: your rights
Caution prior to questioning.
“You do not have to say anything. But, it may harm your defence if you do not mention when questioned something which you later rely on in court. Anything you do say may be given in evidence.”
Being arrested: your rights
Allabouttrial
Until you've walked a mile in someone else's shoes
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chimpface
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I'm not sure if anyone has seen this article or it's been posted but it's mentioned she may have drowned in the bath,
Mother quizzed over girl’s death after three-year-old found dead at South Wales home
Mother quizzed over girl’s death after three-year-old found dead at South Wales home
There was a warning from LE to basically ignore local rumours as there were so many flying around? That could easily be one of the incorrect rumours and the Express just 'had' to post it.
mrazda71
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I just wanted to make a point regarding the lack of any fb posts/pics of her children etc on Carlys profile and some making judgments on that.
You are only viewing the posts which are set to public, you are not seeing any posts shared with friends so please keep that in mind.
I've been on fb for 10 years, if you (as a stranger) looked at my profile, you would only see 5% if what I actually post/share and definitely not be able to see my kids pics ir anything personal.
You are only viewing the posts which are set to public, you are not seeing any posts shared with friends so please keep that in mind.
I've been on fb for 10 years, if you (as a stranger) looked at my profile, you would only see 5% if what I actually post/share and definitely not be able to see my kids pics ir anything personal.
Both have Facebook accounts, the eldest is around 17 and the youngest I think is 11 or 12.
KarenUK
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KarenUK
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Little girl 'was drowned then put onto a coffee table and set on fire'
Prosecutor Michael Jones QC will now open the case.
He is introducing himself and Kate Brunner QC.
“The case that you are about to hear concerns events that took place on June 8 in Tonypandy.
“On that day this defendant placed her four-year-old daughter into a bath full of water and deliberately drowned her.”
The court is told she then took the little girl’s body outside.
Harris is crying in the dock. The judge has stopped to make sure she has some water.
Judge: “Plainly emotions are likely to be varied and strong. I would appreciate it if you could keep them under control.”
The defendant took Amelia’s dead body out of the bath, placed her body on a coffee table outside, and set fire to the body.
Mr Jones said the jury will hear evidence about the injuries, about the cause of death, and the mental health issues that affect the defendant.
“As you hear the evidence, although this is obviously a harrowing and tragic case - it is important you put any emotions aside as you listen to this case.”
Live updates as mum accused of drowning daughter then burning body
Prosecutor Michael Jones QC will now open the case.
He is introducing himself and Kate Brunner QC.
“The case that you are about to hear concerns events that took place on June 8 in Tonypandy.
“On that day this defendant placed her four-year-old daughter into a bath full of water and deliberately drowned her.”
The court is told she then took the little girl’s body outside.
Harris is crying in the dock. The judge has stopped to make sure she has some water.
Judge: “Plainly emotions are likely to be varied and strong. I would appreciate it if you could keep them under control.”
The defendant took Amelia’s dead body out of the bath, placed her body on a coffee table outside, and set fire to the body.
Mr Jones said the jury will hear evidence about the injuries, about the cause of death, and the mental health issues that affect the defendant.
“As you hear the evidence, although this is obviously a harrowing and tragic case - it is important you put any emotions aside as you listen to this case.”
Live updates as mum accused of drowning daughter then burning body
KarenUK
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Defendant said: 'Amelia has gone to heaven'
The court heard at 10pm Harris appeared and said: “Amelia has gone to heaven. Don’t go out the back, she’s gone to heaven.”
A witness saw a coffee table and saw a “charred black leg”.
Mr Jones said a neighbour heard at 9.15pm what sounded like a little girl screaming “mammy, mammy, mammy”.
11:39
Defendant 'happiest in a long time' on the day in question
The court heard a housing officer attended the address on the afternoon and discussed complaints from neighbours regarding her dog fouling.
Mr Jones said Harris was watching television with her daughter.
Harris asked her friend to take her to buy a gas token.
She dropped them home at around 6pm and noted the defendant was “the happiest she had seen her in a long time”.
The court heard the defendant’s friend asked if she wanted to go to the play centre.
Harris said she would not have Amelia the next day.
11:36
Defendant 'believed she was being stalked'
Mr Jones said Amelia was four when she was killed.
They were living at Brithweunydd Road in Tonypandy.
The court heard Harris had been suffering with anxiety.
The prosecutor says Harris believed people were stalking her and she had been see a doctor.
Mr Jones added the defendant had “profound mental health issues”.
The court heard at 10pm Harris appeared and said: “Amelia has gone to heaven. Don’t go out the back, she’s gone to heaven.”
A witness saw a coffee table and saw a “charred black leg”.
Mr Jones said a neighbour heard at 9.15pm what sounded like a little girl screaming “mammy, mammy, mammy”.
11:39
Defendant 'happiest in a long time' on the day in question
The court heard a housing officer attended the address on the afternoon and discussed complaints from neighbours regarding her dog fouling.
Mr Jones said Harris was watching television with her daughter.
Harris asked her friend to take her to buy a gas token.
She dropped them home at around 6pm and noted the defendant was “the happiest she had seen her in a long time”.
The court heard the defendant’s friend asked if she wanted to go to the play centre.
Harris said she would not have Amelia the next day.
11:36
Defendant 'believed she was being stalked'
Mr Jones said Amelia was four when she was killed.
They were living at Brithweunydd Road in Tonypandy.
The court heard Harris had been suffering with anxiety.
The prosecutor says Harris believed people were stalking her and she had been see a doctor.
Mr Jones added the defendant had “profound mental health issues”.
KarenUK
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'Special verdict' can be applied
Mr Jones described the case as “exceptional”.
He said the experts agree the defendant did not know what she was doing was wrong.
The prosecutor added: “As horrific and unimaginable as this was her mental health condition was so profound it attracts a special verdict in law.”
The “special verdict” is not guilty of murder by reason of insanity.
The alternative is guilty to manslaughter on grounds of diminished responsibility.
That is the end of the prosecution opening.
The remaining “spare” juror has been released.
Live updates as mum accused of drowning daughter then burning body
Mr Jones described the case as “exceptional”.
He said the experts agree the defendant did not know what she was doing was wrong.
The prosecutor added: “As horrific and unimaginable as this was her mental health condition was so profound it attracts a special verdict in law.”
The “special verdict” is not guilty of murder by reason of insanity.
The alternative is guilty to manslaughter on grounds of diminished responsibility.
That is the end of the prosecution opening.
The remaining “spare” juror has been released.
Live updates as mum accused of drowning daughter then burning body
KarenUK
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Harris' eyes were 'wide open' following Amelia's death
Mr Jones is now reading a statement from a witness who cannot be named for legal reasons.
He described Harris with her eyes “wide open” following Amelia’s death.
He said Harris told him: “Amelia has gone to heaven. She’s coming back on Sunday.”
The witness added: “She tried to grip me and I just pushed her off.
“I saw all the police, ambulances and fire engines coming down the street.”
He said Harris had not been well for about six weeks.
The hearing will now break for lunch until 2pm.
12:53
Harris became 'paranoid' after landslide
The next statement is by a friend of Harris, who had known her for about a year.
She said: “I would describe Carly as a happy, bubbly person.”
She added Harris would moan about “run-of-the-mill things” like the house not being tidy.
The witness said Harris changed and became “paranoid” following the landslide outside her house.
She posted about the Bermuda Triangle on Facebook and thought she was being watched by people in the cemetery opposite her house.
12:50
Harris old friend Amelia would be 'in heaven' the next day
Mr Jones is now reading a statement from Harris’ friend Nikki Morgan.
She said Harris called her at around 4.30pm asking her to take her to sort the gas and electric.
Ms Morgan said Harris seemed “fine”. She added Amelia was “always singing”.
The witness said she dropped Harris back home at around 6pm.
She added: “Carly was the happiest I had seen her in a long time.”
Ms Morgan said she asked Harris if she and Amelia wanted to go to a play centre.
The court heard Harris said: “I can’t come tomorrow, I haven’t got Amelia.”
Asked what she meant, she said Amelia would be “in heaven”.
The witness said she became concerned about her friend after she started posting on Facebook.
She said following the landslide outside her home Harris thought people were plotting to dig up the foundations of her home.
Ms Morgan said Harris talked about God and the devil.
Live updates as mum accused of drowning daughter then burning body
Mr Jones is now reading a statement from a witness who cannot be named for legal reasons.
He described Harris with her eyes “wide open” following Amelia’s death.
He said Harris told him: “Amelia has gone to heaven. She’s coming back on Sunday.”
The witness added: “She tried to grip me and I just pushed her off.
“I saw all the police, ambulances and fire engines coming down the street.”
He said Harris had not been well for about six weeks.
The hearing will now break for lunch until 2pm.
12:53
Harris became 'paranoid' after landslide
The next statement is by a friend of Harris, who had known her for about a year.
She said: “I would describe Carly as a happy, bubbly person.”
She added Harris would moan about “run-of-the-mill things” like the house not being tidy.
The witness said Harris changed and became “paranoid” following the landslide outside her house.
She posted about the Bermuda Triangle on Facebook and thought she was being watched by people in the cemetery opposite her house.
12:50
Harris old friend Amelia would be 'in heaven' the next day
Mr Jones is now reading a statement from Harris’ friend Nikki Morgan.
She said Harris called her at around 4.30pm asking her to take her to sort the gas and electric.
Ms Morgan said Harris seemed “fine”. She added Amelia was “always singing”.
The witness said she dropped Harris back home at around 6pm.
She added: “Carly was the happiest I had seen her in a long time.”
Ms Morgan said she asked Harris if she and Amelia wanted to go to a play centre.
The court heard Harris said: “I can’t come tomorrow, I haven’t got Amelia.”
Asked what she meant, she said Amelia would be “in heaven”.
The witness said she became concerned about her friend after she started posting on Facebook.
She said following the landslide outside her home Harris thought people were plotting to dig up the foundations of her home.
Ms Morgan said Harris talked about God and the devil.
Live updates as mum accused of drowning daughter then burning body
Tortoise
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The court then heard Harris's 17-year-old son came home on Friday, June 8, to find his 11-year-old brother crying on the settee saying: 'Don't go out the back'.
'Neighbours heard the older child shouting: "How could you? She's my little sister".
'He was seen running around shouting: "You've killed her, you've killed her".
'The younger brother was heard saying: "Don't call the police, mammy will go to jail".
Mother, 38, 'deliberately drowned her four-year-old daughter in bath' | Daily Mail Online
I hadn't realised there were siblings old enough to understand, as if it wasn't bad enough, those poor boys Reading the live updates was a tough read, I certainly can't disagree with the assessment of mental health problems, that much is pretty clear from what we've heard so far. What a tragic case, I hope poor Amelia didn't know much about it for long (thank goodness it seems clear that the cause of death was drowning and not burning...).
Reading the live updates was a tough read, I certainly can't disagree with the assessment of mental health problems, that much is pretty clear from what we've heard so far. What a tragic case, I hope poor Amelia didn't know much about it for long (thank goodness it seems clear that the cause of death was drowning and not burning...).DNASolves
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