CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *Arrest* #14

[PommyMommy]

The Thayer’s talk about it in their interview. They were asked by the police to take Dieter, as per SW’s parents request. It seemed to happen right away.

My question is about Deeter (Dieter?) howling and the neighbor (Hallowell) calling the police for a well check on the dog. I am not asking about the Thayer's keeping him until her parents took possession. Here is the article again: Neighbor says Chris Watts “cared more about the dog” than pregnant wife and 2 toddlers he allegedly killed

 

[Ronso]

I think there was more than one WSer that predicted he might play for both teams. I just can't remember who they originally were.

 

[Sleutherfly]

That’s up for debate still as initially we believed he went for the first week and she stayed 5 more but then the random stranger who talked to her at a park and took photos of them confirms he was in NC with them for the last of the 6 weeks

I thought it was the last week that he joined them. I wonder if SW had mentioned things were rocky in her marriage and maybe her family encouraged them to try counseling at their church (since we know her family is religious). In the video before she left, she never mentioned that CW would be joining her for part of the trip. Or am I wrong about that? I think him joining her may have been a last ditch attempt to save their marriage, at least for her, I think he was already checked out.

 

[ZsaZsa]

I'm not pointing or arguing about the termination of pregnancy charge. Plain as plain the charges cite unlawful termination of pregnancy as the CAUSE of SW's death. No way that charge can be construed to say her death resulted in pregnancy termination. If the latter were the case, there's presumably nothing to prevent the charge document from saying so.

This charge has been explained by lawyers on this site several times . Here is what Alethea had to say in response to statements like yours. " It is a separate charge to account for the death of the unborn child at the hands of the defendant, NOT a description of the cause of death. Her pregnancy was terminated when her life was terminated.The same act (likely strangulation, based on LE reports) led to both the termination of her life and the termination of the pregnancy".
The prosecutor explained that Colorado has no fetal homicide law, so this charge as stated is the way they have to phrase it, to cover the death of the child.

 

[borndem]

Another thing that strikes me in these cases is how quickly the perpetrators want to get on with their plans, causing them to say and do odd things. While everyone else is in the midst of shock and concern, they've already "moved on", they know what has happened since they planned it, and they did it, and they are ready to move onto the next stage of their plan.

When NU called CW about the welfare check, he starts rambling to her about separation. NU is bewildered, at this stage she's just concerned SW has had a medical episode and she wants to check on her. She even said something along the lines of "why are you talking about this now?". She realizes CW isn't going to help, her anxiety rises, and thankfully she had it in her to not rationalize her gut feeling away and calls the police. She knows "something" is wrong here.

In CW's mind, the separation theory is his plan and he just wants to get on with it, he can't wait, and doesn't realise how strange he sounds.

Likewise when he's at the Thayers and starts talking about putting the house on the market. That's the next stage of his plan that he'd just like to get on with. Psychologically he's way ahead of everyone, since they don't even know she's dead at this point. He's come to terms with it already and is looking beyond. He also shows no interest in any of the Thayers ideas of where they could look for her. It's pointless to him, he knows where she is.

It reminds me of Gerard Baden-Clay, when his wife's body was found about eleven days after she went missing, he filed paperwork for her life insurance the same day. Who does that? Someone who has planned this all along and is just moving onto the next step of his plan. He knew she was dead all along, why wait any longer.

Scott Petersons wife goes missing and he adds the *advertiser censored* channel to his cable package.

They're over the loss of their families already, and find it frustrating that everyone else is so behind and making such a big deal about it. A few searches, a few memorial services, and they can just get on with their lives as they planned. Hurry up everyone..

Yep -- sociopaths like to compartmentalize things -- put that (getting fired, flunking a test, girlfriend breaks up with you, losing a race, killing your family, whatever) in a box, close it, and move on. They don't (or are unable to) look back at failure or negative events -- thus never having insight to analyze what went wrong, or to learn from their mistakes. But this man should not be pitied. There are a number of sociopaths that lead fairly normal lives, i. e., they aren't "bad people," and they don't cold-bloodedly murder their families

 

[Layla123]

My question is about Deeter (Dieter?) howling and the neighbor (Hallowell) calling the police for a well check on the dog. I am not asking about the Thayer's keeping him until her parents took possession. Did you read the article? I will link it again: Neighbor says Chris Watts “cared more about the dog” than pregnant wife and 2 toddlers he allegedly killed

It says the police did a check, and Dieter was okay in the article. I don’t think I’m understanding you. I’m sorry.

<modsnip: snipped social media that is not allowed>

 

[Whiteorchids]

My question is about Deeter (Dieter?) howling and the neighbor (Hallowell) calling the police for a well check on the dog. I am not asking about the Thayer's keeping him until her parents took possession. Here is the article again: Neighbor says Chris Watts “cared more about the dog” than pregnant wife and 2 toddlers he allegedly killed

I have a little Dachshund Weiner Dog like Deeter. They are mighty little dogs and very protective of family.

 

[Layla123]

This charge has been explained by lawyers on this site several times . Here is what Alethea had to say in response to statements like yours. " It is a separate charge to account for the death of the unborn child at the hands of the defendant, NOT a description of the cause of death. Her pregnancy was terminated when her life was terminated.The same act (likely strangulation, based on LE reports) led to both the termination of her life and the termination of the pregnancy".
The prosecutor explained that Colorado has no fetal homicide law, so this charge as stated is the way they have to phrase it, to cover the death of the child.

Do we know if this charge will stick? Has it been tried before?

 

[tlneedham]

“I don’t know if at the time of the murders, if the dog was in the house,” Hallowell said, suggesting that the killer “may have put him outside at the time or something.”

That’s the question — when exactly was this howling and the wellness check? Sunday afternoon after the birthday party? Middle of Sunday night? Seems like that could be a big clue that something was happening inside.

 

[chi123]

It says the police did a check, and Dieter was okay in the article. I don’t think I’m understanding you. I’m sorry.
<modsnip: snipped social media is not allowed>

She's wondering what time the welfare check for the dog was. Before the murders? Sunday night? We don't have that information but im curious too. Could be very telling.

 

[SheepMan]

Ok, this may be a bit far fetched but here goes as I try and work this out in my head.
What if CW played this rouse all along with SW about him being in marital strife with her and unhappy.
CW had SW thinking he was unhappy and outwardly withdrawing and being un- affectionate to her on purpose and having an affair.
Whether he started withdrawing when she went to NC or more likely while she was in NC .
CW says at some point he wants a separation (not a divorce as CW specifically said "separation" as did SW).
What if CW knew SW would tell a friend or family about the hypothetical separation and marital woes.
CW still could have been having an affair or affairs.
But what if CW planted marital issues in SW's mind and yet he had no intention of leaving SW but rather he planned on murdering them.
CW could have planned on murdering them and disposing of them and setting the stage that SW and CW were unhappy in the marriage and that separation was imminent and she ran off with the kids.
CW would be the victim.
CW could keep his secret life secret.
CW would be free and financially unencumbered.
CW would have admitted to the co worker affair and be the reason for SW running away with the girls.
I don't know but maybe he was playing SW with this separation/affair story line for an alibi.
Not saying he was smart and it definitely would have been a bungled plan but just maybe some truth in it??
.

Good thoughts, however as he made a pretty awful attempt at covering his tracks I doubt he has the intelligence to plant seeds weeks / months beforehand like this JMO

 

[ZsaZsa]

I thought it was the last week that he joined them. I wonder if SW had mentioned things were rocky in her marriage and maybe her family encouraged them to try counseling at their church (since we know her family is religious). In the video before she left, she never mentioned that CW would be joining her for part of the trip. Or am I wrong about that? I think him joining her may have been a last ditch attempt to save their marriage, at least for her, I think he was already checked out.

The photo at Myrtle beach was taken on August 2nd.

 

[gregjrichards]

My question is about Deeter (Dieter?) howling and the neighbor (Hallowell) calling the police for a well check on the dog. I am not asking about the Thayer's keeping him until her parents took possession. Here is the article again: Neighbor says Chris Watts “cared more about the dog” than pregnant wife and 2 toddlers he allegedly killed

I feel sorry for Deeter he has lost his family and likely loved Shannan, Cece and Bella. I hope the rest of his life is happy.

 

[Jennifer17]

She's wondering what time the welfare check for the dog was. Before the murders? Sunday night? We don't have that information but im curious too. Could be very telling.

I think that it was after he left for work (or whatever) on the Monday morning, but I have to think that the neighbours who did must have some inkling that things were not right.
It would not occur to me to call the police if a dog had been howling for a couple of hours unless the owner was elderly and lived alone.

 

[RickshawFan]

Hello,
Unaware of where you live but these Western drilling/well sites are remote and numerous which would make it be impractical for drone or camera monitoring.

I can’t imagine there’s no camera monitoring. It doesn’t cost much, and in the post 9\11 world, protection of infrastructure, fuel stocks, and data are critical.

 

[Sleutherfly]

The photo at Myrtle beach was taken on August 2nd.

When did she go to NC?

 

[RickshawFan]

This charge has been explained by lawyers on this site several times . Here is what Alethea had to say in response to statements like yours. " It is a separate charge to account for the death of the unborn child at the hands of the defendant, NOT a description of the cause of death. Her pregnancy was terminated when her life was terminated.The same act (likely strangulation, based on LE reports) led to both the termination of her life and the termination of the pregnancy".
The prosecutor explained that Colorado has no fetal homicide law, so this charge as stated is the way they have to phrase it, to cover the death of the child.

Could you maybe provide some links? ‘Cos that’s not what the charging document says.

 

[katydid23]

Another thing that strikes me in these cases is how quickly the perpetrators want to get on with their plans, causing them to say and do odd things. While everyone else is in the midst of shock and concern, they've already "moved on", they know what has happened since they planned it, and they did it, and they are ready to move onto the next stage of their plan.

When NU called CW about the welfare check, he starts rambling to her about separation. NU is bewildered, at this stage she's just concerned SW has had a medical episode and she wants to check on her. She even said something along the lines of "why are you talking about this now?". She realizes CW isn't going to help, her anxiety rises, and thankfully she had it in her to not rationalize her gut feeling away and calls the police. She knows "something" is wrong here.

In CW's mind, the separation theory is his plan and he just wants to get on with it, he can't wait, and doesn't realise how strange he sounds.

Likewise when he's at the Thayers and starts talking about putting the house on the market. That's the next stage of his plan that he'd just like to get on with. Psychologically he's way ahead of everyone, since they don't even know she's dead at this point. He's come to terms with it already and is looking beyond. He also shows no interest in any of the Thayers ideas of where they could look for her. It's pointless to him, he knows where she is.

It reminds me of Gerard Baden-Clay, when his wife's body was found about eleven days after she went missing, he filed paperwork for her life insurance the same day. Who does that? Someone who has planned this all along and is just moving onto the next step of his plan. He knew she was dead all along, why wait any longer.

Scott Petersons wife goes missing and he adds the *advertiser censored* channel to his cable package.

They're over the loss of their families already, and find it frustrating that everyone else is so behind and making such a big deal about it. A few searches, a few memorial services, and they can just get on with their lives as they planned. Hurry up everyone..

APPLAUSE was needed here:

 

[SheepMan]

Another thing that strikes me in these cases is how quickly the perpetrators want to get on with their plans, causing them to say and do odd things. While everyone else is in the midst of shock and concern, they've already "moved on", they know what has happened since they planned it, and they did it, and they are ready to move onto the next stage of their plan.

When NU called CW about the welfare check, he starts rambling to her about separation. NU is bewildered, at this stage she's just concerned SW has had a medical episode and she wants to check on her. She even said something along the lines of "why are you talking about this now?". She realizes CW isn't going to help, her anxiety rises, and thankfully she had it in her to not rationalize her gut feeling away and calls the police. She knows "something" is wrong here.

In CW's mind, the separation theory is his plan and he just wants to get on with it, he can't wait, and doesn't realise how strange he sounds.

Likewise when he's at the Thayers and starts talking about putting the house on the market. That's the next stage of his plan that he'd just like to get on with. Psychologically he's way ahead of everyone, since they don't even know she's dead at this point. He's come to terms with it already and is looking beyond. He also shows no interest in any of the Thayers ideas of where they could look for her. It's pointless to him, he knows where she is.

It reminds me of Gerard Baden-Clay, when his wife's body was found about eleven days after she went missing, he filed paperwork for her life insurance the same day. Who does that? Someone who has planned this all along and is just moving onto the next step of his plan. He knew she was dead all along, why wait any longer.

Scott Petersons wife goes missing and he adds the *advertiser censored* channel to his cable package.

They're over the loss of their families already, and find it frustrating that everyone else is so behind and making such a big deal about it. A few searches, a few memorial services, and they can just get on with their lives as they planned. Hurry up everyone..

Where is it said that he was talking of he separation when NU called him?

 

[PhoneJockey]

Do we know what these oil tanks look like? Can we figure out his route?


Edited: I see from here what those tanks look like: Shanann Watts’ girls may have been dead when she got home, husband’s charges show

****

Also, in that same article, the charges against CW are listed, and it's quite clear that: "the woman died as a result of the unlawful termination of pregnancy".

To me, this does NOT mean she died and thereby her pregnancy was terminated. It quite clearly says the reverse.

This sounds to me like the method was not strangling or suffocation (at least at the mouth).

CW could have sat on SW's belly? Crushed her lungs? Hit her?

When the prosecutor (?) made his statement about the arrest and charges, he clearly stated that this particular charge was due to CW murdering Shanann, thereby terminating the fetus. It is the only way to charge a person for the unlawful death of an unborn child in Colorado at this time.