Found Deceased CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *Arrest* #28

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DexterMorgan said:
In real life. She gave that man a 5 week vacation from her and the kids while pregnant. 1 week later. Her and the kids are dead.
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And didn't CW tell the Thayer's that when they were away the house was lonely? I recall that but cannot find the exact statement.
 
DexterMorgan said:
In real life. She gave that man a 5 week vacation from her and the kids while pregnant. 1 week later. Her and the kids are dead.
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No what I was getting at is if she feels comfortable enough to ignore her clearly distressed children on a video which is supposedly representing a wonderful happy family, then how did she react, or not react, when the cameras were off.
 
Shekkiec said:
He IMO didn’t have a plan .
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I would say he thought the oil tanks out way too fast. The cops believe kids were killed on 12th or 13th. SW definitely on the 13th. I think the daughter he killed first might have been out of anger after the party if she threw a fit and he got enraged but I definitely think SW was premed.
 
This just hit me and stopped me in my thoughts cold.

Their entire lives were recorded and posted online. Every cold, every trip, every day several posts of daily life events. How ironic that nothing that night was recorded, somewhere, somehow. Or was it? If only she had walked into the house with phone camera in hand, recording "just in case." Then again, a deletion may not be recoverable... I'm not sure. A live video would be too late to retract or delete, even if just being played to family! But my point is just that it's horrible and ironic that we "know" so much about their lives because of the incessant filming and photos and then that night, all went quiet.
 
MassGuy said:
They did request his DNA in one of the motions. Palm prints may not have been standard procedure in booking. The foot prints they definitely would not have taken during booking, so they certainly need to request those.
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I just closed the link about 2 hours ago and cannot find it, but perhaps the reason is the DNA testing when they do it by law for felons to put in CODIS has different markers.

I read on the link, I hope I can add it later, but when they collect it for law enforcement under that law it only does 13 markers. It does not do genetic testing. Perhaps they want to be more specific on the testing with this and want to do more complete testing.

Okay I just found the link that talks about this that with the law they only do 13 markers, it may be true or may not but this is what I have found

Katie's Law - Wikipedia

My thoughts are they want to get greater sensitivity for the testing to show it is really him to give no doubt. Verses only having 13 markers.?
 
Whiteorchids said:
Time Required For Premeditation
Time alone doesn’t determine whether a defendant premeditated and deliberated. All premeditation and deliberation require is the time it takes to form the intent, ponder the crime, and then act. Defendants can premeditate and deliberate in a matter of minutes, as long as the thought process occurs before the act.

There is no specific formula for determining whether a defendant premeditated and deliberated before acting. Courts and juries will consider the circumstances of each case.

EXAMPLE: A defendant convicted of first degree murder for strangling a victim with a lamp cord premeditated the murder. The evidence showed that the defendant repositioned the cord around the victim’s neck numerous times, each time giving him the opportunity to reflect on his actions. The defendant had also had time to consider his actions during a struggle with the victim prior to the strangulation, further proving premeditation. (Berube v. State, 5 So.3d 734 (Fla. 2nd DCA 2009).)

What is premeditated and deliberate conduct?
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Has someone said they don't understand the definition of premeditation?
 
flourish said:
I was thinking more of not helping CeCe when she was distressed on the sink, her tiny toes gripping the toilet paper holder.

And the Santa video where the girls weren't allowed to feel safe and their repeated "no's" were ignored and Bella was called a Grinch.

The photo opportunities for Easter and Christmas where the girls are screaming and reaching for their mother.

Those things were rather disturbing to me. They may or may not be telling.
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Reasonable minds agree or disagree with you, although one of our VI attorneys (the master G) has said there was no indication of verbal or emotional abuse (in the legal sense) on them. What we do know, however, is that a man claiming to be witnessing at least one child's active strangulation failed to call 911 to try and save her. At all. Period. He just bundles the dead children up and dumps them in separate tanks of crude oil within the hour, according to his own confession. What does that say about his view of his children?
 
flourish said:
I was thinking more of not helping CeCe when she was distressed on the sink, her tiny toes gripping the toilet paper holder.

And the Santa video where the girls weren't allowed to feel safe and their repeated "no's" were ignored and Bella was called a Grinch.

The photo opportunities for Easter and Christmas where the girls are screaming and reaching for their mother.

Those things were rather disturbing to me. They may or may not be telling.
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Exactly. Every young, Chicago gangbanger probably had a bad upbringing before killing someone.

But we simply vote guilty for the murder and not consider the fact that they had a bad Christmas and Easter Holidays in the past.

So CW is guilty as heck.
 
PommyMommy said:
The motion does not say trash bags. It says "a bag." It doesn't say there may be prints, it says "made bare foot impressions." This is how rumors get started and grow legs, just like the dog barking at 5:15 that went on for pages and pages here earlier today. Here is the motion:
https://www.courts.state.co.us/userfiles/file/Court_Probation/19th_Judicial_District/caseofinterest/2018CR2003/People's O.PDF

I am not trying to nit-pick, just simply trying to avoid pages and pages of "where did it say trash bags?"
3
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I do apologize to all about going on and on about the dogs. But I find that when cases go stale and there is years between the arrest and the court, that stuff gets brought up and it is not true, or doesn't have substantiation behind it and it is a rumor that gets legs so I try to jump on it.

Many people on here actually leave the threads when somebody is arrested until the case because of that... Because stuff keeps brought up and they have to keep saying that was not correct, and having to research to give the background on it. But I understand as it gets confusing as time goes by as to what was verified and what was not, we have all done it!

One of the things to note is, some of us don't go on Facebook pages to Cloud our memory, or actually to give us more information that is allowed here, so that may be a reason also why some people know stuff that we cannot link here and therefore people here say it did not happen?

Who knows, somebody here may know the next door neighbor and actually knows that the dog was barking at 4:15 or 5, but we just can't like it here because of terms of service.

MOO
 
Imo I think SW knew about the separation . She had told family and friends in NC this as well. According to VI she knew and according to hairdresser (a family friend) they knew . She had dropped hints to Thayer but still didn’t believe he would leave bc he had no game . I believe that statement shows her feeling superior and in control. I believe the SM posts of herself stating he was the calm one she was the nice one were true . I am discerned by the multiple videos of her being excessively insultful , not ribbing to him when he was around . She would post fake nice perfect post for media but could not control her true feelings. When she went to NC she felt she had the upper hand with pregnancy and kids. She maybe purposely reacted overly accusing her MIL Of peanuts to gain sympathy from him. She had never posted anything of that nature before . I believe she was thinking he would not go through with it . She left NC (no intention of wanting to stay there ) and possibly he told her or she found about affair . She had been through a bad divorce and lost everything before . She knew with financial problems she could lose house , possible her car if she couldn’t pay for lease and insurance . You see He was recruited by her . If he left her and the company how would that effect her pay scale . Would those under his name still benefit her? The idea of being pregnant alone is terrifying for anyone . She may have threatened to take kids and he told her she couldn’t do that . You see in Colorado the affair does not matter in divorce . Her works was falling apart . She wanted to hurt him by taking what he said she couldn’t do . So she could have strangled the girls JMO
 
Allabouttrial said:
Has someone said they don't understand the definition of premeditation?
Whiteorchids said: ↑
Time Required For Premeditation
Time alone doesn’t determine whether a defendant premeditated and deliberated. All premeditation and deliberation require is the time it takes to form the intent, ponder the crime, and then act. Defendants can premeditate and deliberate in a matter of minutes, as long as the thought process occurs before the act.

There is no specific formula for determining whether a defendant premeditated and deliberated before acting. Courts and juries will consider the circumstances of each case.

EXAMPLE: A defendant convicted of first degree murder for strangling a victim with a lamp cord premeditated the murder. The evidence showed that the defendant repositioned the cord around the victim’s neck numerous times, each time giving him the opportunity to reflect on his actions. The defendant had also had time to consider his actions during a struggle with the victim prior to the strangulation, further proving premeditation. (Berube v. State, 5 So.3d 734 (Fla. 2nd DCA 2009).)

What is premeditated and deliberate conduct?
/QUOTE]
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I didn't fully understand the legal definition of premeditation, so Whiteorchid's link and explanation is really informative.
 
I’ll repost.

Time Required For Premeditation
Time alone doesn’t determine whether a defendant premeditated and deliberated. All premeditation and deliberation require is the time it takes to form the intent, ponder the crime, and then act. Defendants can premeditate and deliberate in a matter of minutes, as long as the thought process occurs before the act.

There is no specific formula for determining whether a defendant premeditated and deliberated before acting. Courts and juries will consider the circumstances of each case.

EXAMPLE: A defendant convicted of first degree murder for strangling a victim with a lamp cord premeditated the murder. The evidence showed that the defendant repositioned the cord around the victim’s neck numerous times, each time giving him the opportunity to reflect on his actions. The defendant had also had time to consider his actions during a struggle with the victim prior to the strangulation, further proving premeditation. (Berube v. State, 5 So.3d 734 (Fla. 2nd DCA 2009).)

What is premeditated and deliberate conduct?
Allabouttrial said:
I'm confused why do we keep repeating the definition of premeditation. Does anyone by now not know the meaning?
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someone asked earlier up thread. I’m behind catching up.
 
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