Found Deceased CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *Arrest* #30

[Best of What's Around]

The thing that is IMO to be fundamental about our judicial system is you are innocent until proven guilty. There can be theories on everything until we get more physical evidence. This case is unique bc we have a victim which is also a Suspect. As of now we have heard nothing about physical evidence that implicated either CW or SW to killing the girls. A juror is supposed to be impartial to what defense may offer. I am interested in all those theories bc this crime does not add up. He had moved on absolutely nothing to gain by killing her and kids. He can be portrayed as verbally abused and she has admitted the need for mood support on her Sm. She had everything to lose imo . The motive puts her subject to be the killer imo

There was almost zero physical evidence in the Scott Peterson case. It was almost all circumstantial. You could make the same case there that Lacy had everything to lose. Did you think the jury made a mistake in convicting Scott Peterson?

 

[gitana1]

<modsnip: quoted post has been removed>.

Respectfully, I think you might be jumping to conclusions. I think all that was being said was that from that one picture, you can’t make a determination if there was or was not abuse. It’s not enough information. I don’t agree that any of the posts on social media represent clear abusive behavior but I also hope everyone here can understand that you can’t make a determination about abuse based on these posts! SM is curated. It’s not a full picture. But just because someone says you can’t definitely say there was no abuse, it doesn’t mean that a) she abused her children, or b) that was why she was killed.

Of course. However, there have been days of statements that Shanann is abusive and now "emotionally unavailable" based on her SM posts, one which features her kid crying in the background.

So people are pointing out the overwhelming number of photos and videos showing her to be a nurturing and engaged mother.

The fact is, there have been zero abuse allegations that we know of prior to some posters believing a few cherry picked videos out of thousands show evidence of that.

Ok the contrary, other than one anonymous insider who believes CW's story, everyone who knew her and has spoken publicly stated she was a devoted and wonderful mother.

They say both parents were good parents to the girls.

Now that CW has proposed his illogical story about Shanann murdering her kids, we have been subject to incredible speculation about her character, mental health status and parenting.

The default has apparently become, with some, that she is a liar, abusive, and mentally ill unless we can prove otherwise.

It's astonishing.

 

[Marli61]

Sorry I don't know how to clip, but I have to say, I can't watch the videos it's just too soon. But, I read most of this hearing her sweet voice, and yes, this is how Shanann talked all the time! Not saying she didn't have her bad days or months, she certainly did. But even then, the ultimate cheerleader for all her friends, near and far.

I just wanted to take time & thank you for being here BabyButterfly. So very very sorry for your loss. I didn't get a chance to respond to your post yesterday when you said you were wearing your Shan'ann shirt. Also every time I see your user name the thought of a "Baby Butterfly" makes my heart smile. <3

 

[MKZoo]

The thing that is IMO to be fundamental about our judicial system is you are innocent until proven guilty. There can be theories on everything until we get more physical evidence. This case is unique bc we have a victim which is also a Suspect. As of now we have heard nothing about physical evidence that implicated either CW or SW to killing the girls. A juror is supposed to be impartial to what defense may offer. I am interested in all those theories bc this crime does not add up. He had moved on absolutely nothing to gain by killing her and kids. He can be portrayed as verbally abused and she has admitted the need for mood support on her Sm. She had everything to lose imo . The motive puts her subject to be the killer imo

But she is not a suspect in any official capacity. Law enforcement doesn’t consider her a suspect. The state of Colorado doesn’t consider her a suspect. Only her killer claims she is a suspect. I am confident that the prosecution will make that distinction clear to the jury.

 

[kkdj]

We have a VI who hasn't defended SW's behavior and actions prior to the murders, but nobody has come forward with any negative thoughts towards CW's character prior to this. This alone makes me question everyone and everything. People don't typically just snap and kill their whole family without any warning signs. There has to be way more to this than CW wanting out to have a fresh start with his AP party. jmo

I think he was probably an odd duck but not that the outside world recognized. Who knows what evil lurks in the minds of others? Obviously something was going on inside of CW but it wasn't for the outside world to see. I know people who are so wonderful seeming to the outside world but in the crevices of their minds something is just off. I suspect this is how CW is.

 

[Clement86]

The thing that is IMO to be fundamental about our judicial system is you are innocent until proven guilty. There can be theories on everything until we get more physical evidence. This case is unique bc we have a victim which is also a Suspect. As of now we have heard nothing about physical evidence that implicated either CW or SW to killing the girls. A juror is supposed to be impartial to what defense may offer. I am interested in all those theories bc this crime does not add up. He had moved on absolutely nothing to gain by killing her and kids. He can be portrayed as verbally abused and she has admitted the need for mood support on her Sm. She had everything to lose imo . The motive puts her subject to be the killer imo

What evidence supports the claim that he was verbally abused? The social media videos? That seems to be an entirely subjective assumption

Your statement ‘she had everything to lose. The motive put her subject to be the killer’. What do you mean she had everything to lose?
She could have spinned the le-vel story into a hardworking single-mom, strong woman and gotten even more attention. She had her tons of close friends and family. She had two daughers that she adored. HE had everything to lose: shared custody, child support, a dead-end job, a cheater reputation. Sounds like a motive to me

I get some people like to be the devil’s advocate but lets try to have smart conversations!

 

[Best of What's Around]

But she is not a suspect in any official capacity. Law enforcement doesn’t consider her a suspect. The state of Colorado doesn’t consider her a suspect. Only her killer claims she is a suspect. I am confident that the prosecution will make that distinction clear to the jury.

A verified, very public liar and admitted murderer (who admittedly tampered with evidence that would have "made" his claims, if true), I might add.

 

[gitana1]

If CW gets a non public defender attorney, who is going to pay for that? I get the impression CW wouldn’t have anywhere near the money needed for his defense. Would dad be willing to give up monies in his accounts, retirement, second+ mortgage, etc.? And for what expectation in the end?

I absolutely believe his family would and is likely working hard to gather as much funds as they can for their precious boy.

 

[Best of What's Around]

Respectully, Just because my perception of CW doesn't align with yours doesn't mean I haven't read the links, don't comprehend and haven't followed other cases. I find it offensive to say otherwise.
jmo

I do not, IMO, believe pommymommy said anything offensive. I asked you what evidence leads you to believe CW does not fit a family annihilator and/or someone like Scott Peterson, to which I hope you will still answer.

 

[Tigerlily75]

The thing that is IMO to be fundamental about our judicial system is you are innocent until proven guilty. There can be theories on everything until we get more physical evidence. This case is unique bc we have a victim which is also a Suspect. As of now we have heard nothing about physical evidence that implicated either CW or SW to killing the girls. A juror is supposed to be impartial to what defense may offer. I am interested in all those theories bc this crime does not add up. He had moved on absolutely nothing to gain by killing her and kids. He can be portrayed as verbally abused and she has admitted the need for mood support on her Sm. She had everything to lose imo . The motive puts her subject to be the killer imo

quick clarification:

SW is not a suspect. LE charged CW with the murders and do not consider SW to be a suspect.

Innocent until proven guilty is fundamental, but using your logic, that should also apply to SW.

 

[PommyMommy]

The thing that is IMO to be fundamental about our judicial system is you are innocent until proven guilty. There can be theories on everything until we get more physical evidence. This case is unique bc we have a victim which is also a Suspect. As of now we have heard nothing about physical evidence that implicated either CW or SW to killing the girls. A juror is supposed to be impartial to what defense may offer. I am interested in all those theories bc this crime does not add up. He had moved on absolutely nothing to gain by killing her and kids. He can be portrayed as verbally abused and she has admitted the need for mood support on her Sm. She had everything to lose imo . The motive puts her subject to be the killer imo

Yes, there can be theories on everything, but they're not plausible unless they're based on facts and evidence.

Shanann is not a suspect per law enforcement, but only because a proven liar and confessed murderer decided to blame her to save himself, and when she is no longer here to defend herself. We are allowed to discuss this aspect of the case because it is part of his defense and I was one of the first people to state publicly that I understand and agree with that.

IMO, he had plenty to gain. He was having an adulterous affair with a co-worker which is one of the prime motivators of family annihilators.

“Family Annihilators”: Understanding What Drives Fathers to Kill | TIME.com

MOO

 

[Thepoet]

CW was born May 16, 1985, so he's 33 years old. We know ,some, about the time he and SW have been together. What about the other 27 years? He was born in Oklahoma, lived in North Carolina, and, I believe, got a chemical engineering degree from the University of Miami. That's four years in Florida. What else do we know? He wanted to be a NASCAR mechanic? I'm looking, but there doesn't seem to be much there.

 

[Marli61]

What evidence supports the claim that he was verbally abused? The social media videos? That seems to be an entirely subjective assumption

Your statement ‘she had everything to lose. The motive put her subject to be the killer’. What do you mean she had everything to lose?
She could have spinned the le-vel story into a hardworking single-mom, strong woman and gotten even more attention. She had her tons of close friends and family. She had two daughers that she adored. HE had everything to lose: shared custody, child support, a dead-end job, a cheater reputation. Sounds like a motive to me

I get some people like to be the devil’s advocate but lets try to have smart conversations!

Yes Clement86. Thank you. A million times over. This.

 

[Tippy Lynn]

I do not, IMO, believe pommymommy said anything offensive. I asked you what evidence leads you to believe CW does not fit a family annihilator and/or someone like Scott Peterson, to which I hope you will still answer.

That's your opinion, not mine. It was offensive to me. It doesn't fit my perception and I'm leaving it at that. jmo

 

[Marli61]

CW was born May 16, 1985, so he's 33 years old. We know ,some, about the time he and SW have been together. What about the other 27 years? He was born in Oklahoma, lived in North Carolina, and, I believe, got a chemical engineering degree from the University of Miami. That's four years in Florida. What else do we know? He wanted to be a NASCAR mechanic? I'm looking, but there doesn't seem to be much there.

BBM... I believe it was determined the chemical engineering degree was not correct

 

[NuttMegg]

CW was born May 16, 1985, so he's 33 years old. We know ,some, about the time he and SW have been together. What about the other 27 years? He was born in Oklahoma, lived in North Carolina, and, I believe, got a chemical engineering degree from the University of Miami. That's four years in Florida. What else do we know? He wanted to be a NASCAR mechanic? I'm looking, but there doesn't seem to be much there.

The chemical engineering degree is apparently for a different person of a similar name. We were talking about that a few days ago. One of the VIs said he went to some kind of Nascar technical institute, sorry I have forgotten the name of it. IMO

 

[MollyDDD]

Of course. However, there have been days of statements that Shanann is abusive and now "emotionally unavailable" based on her SM posts, one which features her kid crying in the background.

So people are pointing out the overwhelming number of photos and videos showing her to be a nurturing and engaged mother.

The fact is, there have been zero abuse allegations that we know of prior to some posters believing a few cherry picked videos out of thousands show evidence of that.

Ok the contrary, other than one anonymous insider who believes CW's story, everyone who knew her and has spoken publicly stated she was a devoted and wonderful mother.

They say both parents were good parents to the girls.

Now that CW has proposed his illogical story about Shanann murdering her kids, we have been subject to incredible speculation about her character, mental health status and parenting.

The default has apparently become, with some, that she is a liar, abusive, and mentally ill unless we can prove otherwise.

It's astonishing.

That “picture is worth a thousand words”.

 

[PommyMommy]

There was almost zero physical evidence in the Scott Peterson case. It was almost all circumstantial. You could make the same case there that Lacy had everything to lose. Did you think the jury made a mistake in convicting Scott Peterson?

Just jumping off your post, but relative to this case, the Weld County District Attorney who is prosecuting CW won a conviction in the John Sandoval case (the longest in Weld County history) despite not having one piece of physical evidence.
Michael Rourke talks about experience in Weld County as he aspires to be the next DA

MOO

 

[whisperOFwings]

Babybutterfly, could I ask you something about having Lupus? I thought that besides stress, the other big trigger for a flareup was being out in the sun (UV exposure). In her videos of Thrive trips, SW was in her bathing suit by a pool or beach. I thought that was pretty much forbidden if you have Lupus.

I'm not @BabyButterfly, but I found this...
Lupus Keeping You Indoors This Summer?
Snippet:
Studies have shown that about 40% of lupus patients are sun sensitive, but, of course, some are more sun sensitive than others.
and:
If sun exposure has not caused a flare-up in the past, people with lupus usually need not worry. Some rheumatologists advise strict adherence to sun avoidance, whereas others are more lax, but most lupus flare-ups are not associated with sun exposure. Lupus patients shouldn’t become hermits, afraid to venture outside.

 

[PrimeSuspect]

The thing that is IMO to be fundamental about our judicial system is you are innocent until proven guilty. There can be theories on everything until we get more physical evidence. This case is unique bc we have a victim which is also a Suspect. As of now we have heard nothing about physical evidence that implicated either CW or SW to killing the girls. A juror is supposed to be impartial to what defense may offer. I am interested in all those theories bc this crime does not add up. He had moved on absolutely nothing to gain by killing her and kids. He can be portrayed as verbally abused and she has admitted the need for mood support on her Sm. She had everything to lose imo . The motive puts her subject to be the killer imo

CW has confessed to killing SW and their unborn baby, he isn't innocent of that charge. So there's that.
CW had everything to gain by killing his family, total freedom and a big house to enjoy it in.

I understand some want physical proof on the bodies of Bella and CeCe that CW killed them. If it's found, will it make sense, of course, it won't. These family annihilations never make sense.
CW is being childish, such a quaint word for someone accused of despicable crimes but that's what's behind all this, he's scared, he's been caught out, he HAS to blame SW, it's too late to pin it on a random stranger, CW can't face the truth! Imo, the evidence will prove he's the killer of all 4 and SW's name will continue to shine.