Australia Australia - Tegan Lane, 2 days old, Sydney, 14 Sept 1996 *K. Lane guilty*

[sunnybree]

I am getting the feeling from ExposedABC, that the journalists are inclined to believe her, all the clues and investigations they are doing right now are pointed in that direction. To get that retrial for her, to clear her name.

Many of the members are not very helpful to that end.... Including one with a very popular post - (their own opinion) with the extent of deception there can't be any persons that she might go to those lengths to protect, and a conclusion that there is no other possibility left but foul play.

If she does get retrial then this time there is no doubt they’ll seek to not have Keli’s history of lying in the adoption documents for the other children brought in. I honestly can’t believe the defence didn’t accept the judge’s prompting to have the false swearing charges severed. I think that balanced the scales in the prosecution’s favour.

 

[sunnybree]

I

Can someone also confirm if it was the pregnancy with Tegan where she tried to have a late term termination but was refused? Or was that one of the other pregnancies?

I think it was baby #3. She was refused the termination because there was a 20 week gestation limit; Keli stated she was under the limit but the clinic determined she was further along through examination.

 

[Bohemian]

I

I think it was baby #3. She was refused the termination because there was a 20 week gestation limit; Keli stated she was under the limit but the clinic determined she was further along through examination.

Yeah, it was:

‘February 1999: Lane is 25 weeks pregnant when she attends an abortion clinic in Queensland. They refuse to terminate the pregnancy.

Mid 1999: Lane gives birth a third time, [...]’

Baby killer Keli Lane hid TWO pregnancies murdering Tegan supporters insist she's INNOCENT | Daily Mail Online

 

[The Observer]

I'm sure it's been posted previously but just in case it hasn't, there's a lot of information here - R v Keli LANE [2011] NSWSC 289 (15 April 2011)
R v LANE 2013 https://www.legal-tools.org/doc/df34ca/pdf/

 

[JLZ]

Can someone also confirm if it was the pregnancy with Tegan where she tried to have a late term termination but was refused? Or was that one of the other pregnancies?

No evidence she tried to abort Tegan but she made three attempts to have the birth induced early, lying that she was overdue.

As the pregnancy progressed, Lane seemed anxious to give birth, arriving at Ryde Hospital, in Sydney's northwest, in early September 1996 complaining of pain, claiming her baby was due the following day and that she needed to have it induced. Hospital staff sent her away.

Three days later she tried the same trick and they sent her away again.

Then the following day she unsuccessfully tried it again.

Nocookies


10 September, 1996 - Keli back at Ryde hospital, complaining of back rib pain. Says she's 42 weeks pregnant. Examined and discharged.
We’re for Sydney | Daily Telegraph

 

[Bohemian]

Does anyone know if the adoption of Keli’s first live-born child was reported as particularly problematic or did it go smoothly? If it was problematic, or indeed emotionally traumatic, maybe that could go some way to explaining why Keli didn’t seek out adoption for Tegan. Then, without another ‘solution’ to ‘the problem’, I think it’s entirely possible that Keli either physically murdered Tegan and secreted her remains, or abandoned her resulting in her death, enroute to the house her then-boyfriend Duncan Gillies shares with his brother and another housemate at Venus Street, Gladesville. As Keli reportedly said words to the effect of, she couldn’t have anyone with her when she arrived there as she couldn’t be sure the house would be empty:


Ref: ExposedABC FB post Caro Meldrum-Hanna

 

[JLZ]

Does anyone know if the adoption of Keli’s first live-born child was reported as particularly problematic or did it go smoothly? If it was problematic, or indeed emotionally traumatic, maybe that could go some way to explaining why Keli didn’t seek out adoption for Tegan. Then, without another ‘solution’ to ‘the problem’, I think it’s entirely possible that Keli either physically murdered Tegan and secreted her remains, or abandoned her resulting in her death, enroute to the house she shared with her then-boyfriend Duncan Gillies, his brother and another housemate at Venus Street, Gladesville. As Keli reportedly said words to the effect of, she couldn’t have anyone with her when she arrived there as she couldn’t be sure the house would be empty:

View attachment 151586
Ref: ExposedABC FB post Caro Meldrum-Hanna

That would be TR born March 1995. Keli told a lot of lies and the social worker was persistent in trying to get permission for the adoption from Duncan Gillies, whom Keli claimed was the father (he wasn't). The lies, rather than the regular adoption process, involved Keli in a lot of inconvenience and led to her swearing false affidavits.

https://www.legal-tools.org/doc/df34ca/pdf/
Appeal judgement, paragraphs 179-186

 

[The Observer]

Does anyone know if the adoption of Keli’s first live-born child was reported as particularly problematic or did it go smoothly?

Quick reply as I'm rushing out will edit with sources later.

The first adoption wasn't smooth, it was dragged out and complicated due to her false affidavits. Keli even stated it was 'traumatic'.

 

[JLZ]

Does anyone know if the adoption of Keli’s first live-born child was reported as particularly problematic or did it go smoothly? If it was problematic, or indeed emotionally traumatic, maybe that could go some way to explaining why Keli didn’t seek out adoption for Tegan. Then, without another ‘solution’ to ‘the problem’, I think it’s entirely possible that Keli either physically murdered Tegan and secreted her remains, or abandoned her resulting in her death, enroute to the house her then-boyfriend Duncan Gillies shares with his brother and another housemate at Venus Street, Gladesville. As Keli reportedly said words to the effect of, she couldn’t have anyone with her when she arrived there as she couldn’t be sure the house would be empty:

View attachment 151586
Ref: ExposedABC FB post Caro Meldrum-Hanna

I have some sympathy for her here, not for resorting to murdering Tegan, but for her resentment over the intrusiveness of the process. Why did anyone need to know who the biological fathers were, why did the fathers have a right to refuse adoption when they didn't even know Keli was pregnant? In my opinion, a man isn't a father until he has a relationship with a child--born or unborn.

 

[Bohemian]

I have some sympathy for her here, not for resorting to murdering Tegan, but for her resentment over the intrusiveness of the process. Why did anyone need to know who the biological fathers were, why did the fathers have a right to refuse adoption when they didn't even know Keli was pregnant? In my opinion, a man isn't a father until he has a relationship with a child--born or unborn.

True but after all of the problems surrounding the adoption of Keli’s first live-born child and naming her father, she persists in naming fathers for her second and third. There was an option for her to ‘lie by omission’ and simply say that she didn’t know who their fathers were.

 

[The Observer]

Quick reply as I'm rushing out will edit with sources later.

The first adoption wasn't smooth, it was dragged out and complicated due to her false affidavits. Keli even stated it was 'traumatic'.

Couldn't edit my above post as I ran out of allowable time.

JLZ quoted the same source I was using. I too also posted that link earlier.

Here are a couple of other sources about the first adoption:

Keli was questioned at length and made to submit several affidavits due to the lies she told in the one(s) prior about her situation and the father. Keli was made to have foster care visits with the baby before the adoption would proceed and be finalised.

'Lane's Tears Over First Adoption' We’re for Sydney | Daily Telegraph

'Adopt A Kinder Attitude To Keli Lane' We’re for Sydney | Daily Telegraph

There's also an audio snippet that aired on the Exposed episode.

CM-H: What was that like Keli those final moments with Tegan just mother and daughter alone?

KL: It was awful… because I'd been there before and I knew how much it hurt. It was just so difficult to just make this decision again and basically to write myself out of it.

Audio can be found here: The Keli Lane tapes: From prison, a murderer breaks her silence

 

[The Observer]

I have some sympathy for her here, not for resorting to murdering Tegan, but for her resentment over the intrusiveness of the process. Why did anyone need to know who the biological fathers were, why did the fathers have a right to refuse adoption when they didn't even know Keli was pregnant? In my opinion, a man isn't a father until he has a relationship with a child--born or unborn.

Argument by some could be made that he can't have a relationship with a child if he wasn't given an opportunity too. Legally a father has the right to refuse an adoption if he plans on taking custody of the child. Had she of put 'father unknown' and said the pregnancy was (for example) a result of a drunken one night then there is no father to notify.

 

[The Observer]

True but after all of the problems surrounding the adoption of Keli’s first live-born child and naming her father, she persists in naming fathers for her second and third. There was an option for her to ‘lie by omission’ and simply say that she didn’t know who their fathers were.

Yes. This is what perplexes me too.

 

[Bohemian]

Yes. This is what perplexes me too.

A great deal about Keli perplexes me. Such as, was she trying to avoid the trauma of previous experiences when she made the decisions she did? Was she simply clueless or pathologically denying her pregnancies until she got some sort of ‘reality slap’? Or is she just a stone-cold murderer/abandoning mother? I don’t know. Dr Michael Diamond’s opinion is telling, albeit unusually sought according to Justice Whealy:

R v Keli LANE [2011] NSWSC 289 (15 April 2011)
(paras 21-29)

 

[Via Marple]

Couldn't edit my above post as I ran out of allowable time.

JLZ quoted the same source I was using. I too also posted that link earlier.

Here are a couple of other sources about the first adoption:

Keli was questioned at length and made to submit several affidavits due to the lies she told in the one(s) prior about her situation and the father. Keli was made to have foster care visits with the baby before the adoption would proceed and be finalised.

'Lane's Tears Over First Adoption' We’re for Sydney | Daily Telegraph

'Adopt A Kinder Attitude To Keli Lane' We’re for Sydney | Daily Telegraph

*snipped and respectfully bbm

That sounds different from what I read elsewhere, at ExposedABC, that implies she had a bond with the first baby and therefore she had several visits.

 

[sosocurious]

Argument by some could be made that he can't have a relationship with a child if he wasn't given an opportunity too. Legally a father has the right to refuse an adoption if he plans on taking custody of the child. Had she of put 'father unknown' and said the pregnancy was (for example) a result of a drunken one night then there is no father to notify.

Yeah, who could have disputed father unknown? Three less lies.

A few weeks after Tegan was born, Ms Lane began coaching water polo at Ravenswood School for Girls.
The fact she signed up for the job before the birth ''shows only too vividly that she had no intention of ever taking Tegan home'', Mr Tedeschi said.

No time for five babies: Keli Lane accused

 

[Via Marple]

Yeah, it was:

‘February 1999: Lane is 25 weeks pregnant when she attends an abortion clinic in Queensland. They refuse to terminate the pregnancy.

Mid 1999: Lane gives birth a third time, [...]’

Baby killer Keli Lane hid TWO pregnancies murdering Tegan supporters insist she's INNOCENT | Daily Mail Online

I think this is an important detail.

So all her pregnancies were handled differently. It is often generalised to say that the first and third live borns were adopted out the same way, why should she kill the second?

No she actually was keen to terminate the third one. Went to Queensland too. She couldn't go through with it because she was refused.

I don't dispute that all the pregnancies were traumatic for her. I think that's why she kept trying different "disposal methods", as she was smart enough to figure out something else.

 

[Via Marple]

True but after all of the problems surrounding the adoption of Keli’s first live-born child and naming her father, she persists in naming fathers for her second and third. There was an option for her to ‘lie by omission’ and simply say that she didn’t know who their fathers were.

MOO?

I think she loved to make up a fairytale life for herself.

Loving partners, overseas trips, caring parents, she was not another abandoned young single mother. Even if all the lying would get her into trouble again. She would just find a better way to tell it.

And the tale of Andrew fits right into this format, until she changes the ending to say that it was just a taxi driver who took her home

 

[sosocurious]

The secret reecording with Keli and her Mum.
Commencing about 7:58
at 10:54 Mum - "You could have put the child up for adoption, and I don't know if you should mention that other thing, either. I think we can only cope with only one thing a time. Well nothing has cropped up about that has it? Where did that happen and when?"

What was that other thing?

 

[Bohemian]

I think this is an important detail.

So all her pregnancies were handled differently. It is often generalised to say that the first and third live borns were adopted out the same way, why should she kill the second?

No she actually was keen to terminate the third one. Went to Queensland too. She couldn't go through with it because she was refused.

I don't dispute that all the pregnancies were traumatic for her. I think that's why she kept trying different "disposal methods", as she was smart enough to figure out something else.

I suppose it all comes down to intent. The jury believed that Keli intended to murder Tegan and carried out the act.