GUILTY - Wayne Millard Murder Trial - Dellen Millard Charged With Murder - #5

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Arnie M said:
Maybe no murders had occurred yet but planning appears to be there and I am sure some of his buddies know some of it .

Things like the stolen wood chipper ..... stolen and repainted long before the "known" murders ..... what was the intended purpose of the chipper? ..... chopping up bodies ? ...... probably decided it would be too messy so they went the crematorium route.

Thefts ...... for example the newer bobcat construction equipment police traced to the Millard hangar ...... it had built in GPS which slatman subsequently removed but he did not realize the GPS had already mapped out the trip to the hangar. No charges laid back then , Millard probably denied knowing where it came from , and got away with it .... probably because the hangar was still under construction and all kinds of other contractor equipment around

The big backhoe at the farm ..... Millard blew the engine while digging a big hole in a remote swampy area of the farm ..... what purpose the hole? ..... would be a great place to bury something 20 feet deep where nobody would think to look ..... disturbed soil would not even be noticed because it would be submerged under muck and swamp water. A remote hole like that would have nothing to do with the new houses or garage he planned to build on the farm

These are some of the curiosities I have and I am sure that there are a few people who know more details ...... and hopefully they come forward now that loyalty to Dellen is no longer relevant.
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Millard did a lot of strange stuff, but there's no reason to believe that anyone apart from Smich and possibly Noudga knew about his plans to murder people.
 
ABro said:
I'm the reporter that broke that story. Unfortunately, the family of the GF could not speak to me until after the deadlines for my book.

Millard was in Toronto when she died. They had spoken on the phone before she jumped.
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Were you able/did you bother to speak to the family of the GF after your book deadline, even though it couldn't be used in your book? If so, will we read more about that in your book's update? (I think I read there will be an update to the book as opposed to a second book?)
 
deugirtni said:
Were you able/did you bother to speak to the family of the GF after your book deadline, even though it couldn't be used in your book? If so, will we read more about that in your book's update? (I think I read there will be an update to the book as opposed to a second book?)
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I spoke to both her parents in their lawyer's office when they came to Toronto on a visit. They provided some interesting insights about Millard and his psychopathic tendencies but nothing that fundamentally changes the story. I hope to write about it at some point but it won't be in the book.
 
ABro said:
The airport incident was strange. Unfortunately I couldn't get more info about it but I believe the cops spoke to at least one of the people who should know more about it.
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Hi Ann ..... Couple of years ago I read the workplace safety report (the agency was called something else back then) ..... my impression was it truly was an accident .... an (elderly) semi-retired aviation technician , along with several helpers (including Dellen) was removing an aileron from the wing of a DC3 type aircraft .

The tech was up on a scaffold , all the bolts had been removed but the part would not release so he took a step sideways to see what was binding and inadvertently stepped off the edge of the scaffold and fell to the concrete .

(From memory) it was a serious head injury , unconscious but alive , and died later at the hospital. Point being that he did not die "in the presence of Dellen" , and most certainly Dellen was not responsible.

Wayne took full responsibility at the hearing (he was not present when the accident happened) , the death impacted Wayne deeply , I think he paid a small fine (typical in cases like that) ...... and he updated all his scaffolding and lifts to include safety rails.

I have the report somewhere but its on an old computer. Thanks.
 
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Arnie M said:
.
Hi Ann ..... Couple of years ago I read the workplace safety report (the agency was called something else back then) ..... my impression was it truly an accident .... an (elderly) semi-retired aviation technician , along with several helpers (including Dellen) was removing an aileron from the wing of a DC3 type aircraft .

The tech was up on a scaffold , all the bolts had been removed but the part would not release so he took a step sideways to see what was binding and inadvertently stepped off the edge of the scaffold and fell to the concrete .

(From memory) it was a serious head injury , unconscious but alive , and died later at the hospital. Point being that he did not die "in the presence of Dellen" , and most certainly Dellen was not responsible.

Wayne took full responsibility at the hearing (he was not present when the accident happened) , the death impacted Wayne deeply , I think he paid a small fine (typical in cases like that) ...... and he updated all his scaffolding and lifts to include safety rails.

I have the report somewhere but its on an old computer. Thanks.
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Arnie, just like with the New York death, I'm the one that first brought the airport accident to public attention. I also spoke to the family of the man that died, who reported the accident to police after Millard was arrested in connection to the Bosma murder.

I wish I could convince people there aren't a whole bunch of promising leads out there that reporters are too lazy to follow up on.

At this point, about the only new information we're going to get is if people who really, truly know what went on in the Millard and Smich households choose to speak up. Personally, I don't think that's likely to happen.
 
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What are the rules surrounding publishing of police interviews related to this case? Is there a law that prevents the police interviews being made public when the person has not been charged? I was hoping to see the police interview of Ms. Burns the night she came over to Wayne’s home and called 9-1-1. Even the 9-1-1 call was not heard. Also, Ms. Noudga must have been interviewed as well and that was never shown.
 
Forest_Wood said:
What are the rules surrounding publishing of police interviews related to this case? Is there a law that prevents the police interviews being made public when the person has not been charged? I was hoping to see the police interview of Ms. Burns the night she came over to Wayne’s home and called 9-1-1. Even the 9-1-1 call was not heard. Also, Ms. Noudga must have been interviewed as well and that was never shown.
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Yes, there are very strong laws about protection of personal privacy in Canada, they're getting stronger all the time, including in criminal cases. For example, victims names aren't released by police unless there is a legal reason to do so. The names usually come from the family. This is the opposite to states like Florida, with sunshine laws that release everything.
 
jash said:
@ABro, do you have further information on the below? I'm wondering if knowledge of the incidents is solely based on digital evidence found on DM's devices.

• Four incidents in 2010. They took place about two years before Ms. Babcock’s disappearance. One incident involved Millard and Smich throwing a pumpkin from a moving car on a highway during Halloween. The other three incidents involved Millard and various friends other than Smich. In the first incident, Millard appears to drive his vehicle at night on top of another vehicle at a car dealership. The second incident involved Millard and a friend apparently committing arson by lighting two cars on fire at night. The third incident appears to involve a very brief robbery of a convenience store by three men. There are difficulties identifying the three men but Millard is alleged to be one of them;

CanLII - 2017 ONSC 5275 (CanLII)
​
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I can add to Abro's response (in post #1412). I was in court for the pre-trial hearing when the Crown was arguing for the inclusion of examples of what they considered to be evidence of escalating, thrill-seeking behaviour by Millard and Smich as a pair; these incidents were considered examples of that behaviour, and relationship.

One thing that stuck with me was a comment by one of the Crowns that while Smich was satisfied to launch the pumpkin from the on-ramp, Millard insisted on throwing it from the faster moving, live lanes of highway traffic, where the potential for injury and damage would be greater.

There was no consistent presence of MSM during the pre-trial hearings, while this content was still under publication ban (which it no longer is). The courtroom recordings available to media (only, per my understanding) will have captured these comments by the Crown.

There is a great deal of additional information captured in those pre-trial hearings. Most of what has been published under "what the jury didn't hear" is the Voir Dire content of the trial itself, when MSM was heavily represented, and doesn't touch on dialogue that was outside of Justice Code's published rulings for pre-trial matters.
 
What would the consequence be, if they had done such a thing, and it had resulted in one or more fatalities? Would they have laughed about the carnage, or..... felt horribly guilty for having caused such a thing?
Would love to hear what else you heard/learned during the pre-trial hearings gremlingrrl.
 
deugirtni said:
What would the consequence be, if they had done such a thing, and it had resulted in one or more fatalities? Would they have laughed about the carnage, or..... felt horribly guilty for having caused such a thing?
Would love to hear what else you heard/learned during the pre-trial hearings gremlingrrl.
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I think one must be capable of empathy in order to feel guilt, so in the case of DM, there's no way. MS maybe would feel guilty if it was someone he cared about but for perfect strangers (like Tim Bosma), doubtful. I can never get the image out of my head of him smiling demonically while posing in front of the Eliminator with the ash rake in hand.
 
deugirtni said:
What would the consequence be, if they had done such a thing, and it had resulted in one or more fatalities? Would they have laughed about the carnage, or..... felt horribly guilty for having caused such a thing?
Would love to hear what else you heard/learned during the pre-trial hearings gremlingrrl.
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I don't think they ever really thought about consequences, beyond whatever immediate result they were seeking.

It was stated by at least one of DM's friends that they felt immune and protected from negative repercussions with DM around.

As for the impact on others, esp. those whose belongings or safety and life were at risk, the theme through all of the trials was a blatant disregard of all of that, IMO.
 
I wonder if they would feel any guilt if they ever viewed a home video of TB, to get a feel of the true person they took. My own comment made me reflect and come up with my own answer to that> likely not, as DM did ask before hand "the nice guy or the ***hole?" I suppose I just hope age brings them to reflect on their own and have regret and sorrow. So sad
 
mimimic said:
I wonder if they would feel any guilt if they ever viewed a home video of TB, to get a feel of the true person they took. My own comment made me reflect and come up with my own answer to that> likely not, as DM did ask before hand "the nice guy or the ***hole?" I suppose I just hope age brings them to reflect on their own and have regret and sorrow. So sad
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There's no regret or sorrow for the lives they destroyed, or for the pain they've caused their victims' families, or at least for DM there isn't.

MS kept his face forward or down, with few exceptions, during the times I attended court. DM, on the other hand, made a point to smirk and grin at LB's mother and her friends on an ongoing basis.

And let's not forget what he put LB's father through in the stand. I was in court for that also. The tweets and reporting captured the mood fairly accurately, but witnessing it first-hand was revolting.

ETA: I don't question for a minute the evil inherent in MS, and what it took for him to carry out what he did over the years. But here, more nearly 7 years after all of this began, MS' courtroom demeanor was notably more sombre, whereas DM was still adamant to carry on with the DM Circus Show, starring the brilliant, untouchable DM.

E2xTA: I should probably preface all of the above with, "IMO, and based on (my) observations of courtroom behaviour (only)."
 
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gremlingrrl said:
There's no regret or sorrow for the lives they destroyed, or for the pain they've caused their victims' families, or at least for DM there isn't.

MS kept his face forward or down, with few exceptions, during the times I attended court. DM, on the other hand, made a point to smirk and grin at LB's mother and her friends on an ongoing basis.

And let's not forget what he put LB's father through in the stand. I was in court for that also. The tweets and reporting captured the mood fairly accurately, but witnessing it first-hand was revolting.

ETA: I don't question for a minute the evil inherent in MS, and what it took for him to carry out what he did over the years. But here, more nearly 7 years after all of this began, MS' courtroom demeanor was notably more sombre, whereas DM was still adamant to carry on with the DM Circus Show, starring the brilliant, untouchable DM.

E2xTA: I should probably preface all of the above with, "IMO, and based on (my) observations of courtroom behaviour (only)."
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Thanks for sharing your courtroom observations. They always add a lot, and are appreciated.

Re RBBM: Smich’s demeanor and emotions were always more recognizable I thought. They were more ‘normal’, even in the context of his heinous actions. He knew when to be nervous, knew when a little caution was called for. In court, he seemed to understand the gravity of the situation and the stakes. He knew how to behave to have half a chance.

DM was and is just such a classic psychopath. Nothing he did emotionally or behaviourally in court was ever ‘right’. He hung himself over and over, and so clearly coudn’t see that. His need for stimulation and risk was just so extreme. He remains one of the most shocking and unnerving people I’ve come across in true crime.
 
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