AMBER ALERT WI - Jayme Closs, 13, Barron, missing after parents found shot, 15 Oct 2018 *endangered* #11

[ludakristen]

Alright, I just shared the basic facts of this case with my husband, trying to be as objective as possible in doing so. His immediate response was, "Mom was the target." I asked why, and his reasoning is:

- Dad was killed immediately, almost for practicality's sake. Just got him out of the way.
- 20+ minutes transpired between that murder and the 911 call. That's a long time if the purpose is just to snag Jayme and go.
- He thinks if Jayme was the target, it'd be easier to nab her another way. I agree with that.
- He thinks a crazed, obsessed man, just 1, is most likely. Someone who either had some sort of previous relationship with Denise, or became infatuated with her, stalked her, and wanted her. This perpetrator wouldn't be threatened by Jayme like he would be the husband, so she was an afterthought. He probably killed James and went straight for Denise, to .. I don't know, beg her to be with him, proclaim his undying love, sexually assault her, whatever. Jayme at this time was probably not even on his radar. But she was a witness, so when it was all said and done, he took her with him because she could ID him. And now, she's most likely been killed and her body is elsewhere.

I don't know what I believe now, but this was a pretty compelling argument for me to hear.

(IMO, JMO, etc etc etc etc)

 

[Weeobanite]

Takes less time to shoot a person in the head than it does to wrestle them into a car and drive away.

Not if you run out of bullets though.

 

[Lorelei1]

I thought I saw a photo somewhere of the front door with a narrow rectangular window in the middle of the upper half. I think the door was being carried in the photo. Maybe I’m mistaken.

Oops, there it is in #426 posted by Kas!

 

[AgeofAquaruis]

Was really hoping today would be the day this case got cracked.

 

[Falcon500]

Phones can be an important protective tool for a 13 yr old. My 13 yr olds had a lot of extracurricular activities after school. Their cells were of vital importance for me to know what was going on each day with rides, etc.

Yet before the invention of the cell phones children did just fine at school or after school.,If they needed to to contact their parents there was always a pay phone available. Sometimes I think that mothers make up reasons to call or text their children just to maintain control.

 

[SharonNeedles]

Alright, I just shared the basic facts of this case with my husband, trying to be as objective as possible in doing so. His immediate response was, "Mom was the target." I asked why, and his reasoning is:

- Dad was killed immediately, almost for practicality's sake. Just got him out of the way.
- 20+ minutes transpired between that murder and the 911 call. That's a long time if the purpose is just to snag Jayme and go.
- He thinks if Jayme was the target, it'd be easier to nab her another way. I agree with that.
- He thinks a crazed, obsessed man, just 1, is most likely. Someone who either had some sort of previous relationship with Denise, or became infatuated with her, stalked her, and wanted her. This perpetrator wouldn't be threatened by Jayme like he would be the husband, so she was an afterthought. He probably killed James and went straight for Denise, to .. I don't know, beg her to be with him, proclaim his undying love, sexually assault her, whatever. Jayme at this time was probably not even on his radar. But she was a witness, so when it was all said and done, he took her with him because she could ID him. And now, she's most likely been killed and her body is elsewhere.

I don't know what I believe now, but this was a pretty compelling argument for me to hear.

(IMO, JMO, etc etc etc etc)

A common theme in theories like this is that the assailant(s) would leave when they got what they came for or were interrupted. I’ve got to agree that makes sense, but if the first shots were fired at 12:31 and door was breached / dad was killed at that time, what could they have possibly been after that they still didn’t have 25 minutes later? If that line of thinking is correct, the objective had to center on Denise. But that makes no sense either.

 

[SuziQ]

It used to make me mad, but then I just took stock of why I do what I do here.

Heavens no. She repeated it like they were her own thoughts. Made me mad initially, but then, it also forced me to take a long hard look at why I do what I do here. If I'm here to gain any kind of personal credit or pats on the back, then I'm here for the wrong reasons. It should ALWAYS be about the victims.

Same has happened to me. It was a reminder to myself to always be responsible and extra careful in what I post. There is always the chance that the public or the media will latch on to something and run with it.

 

[BeckyF]

Spelling

 

[BlinkOfAnI]

I have guns strategically placed throught my home , especially at all entrances and exits, and in my out buildings.

I have motion sensors all over my property. They all have different tones so I know where there might be a problem before anything happens.

Also I have special doors that cannot be shot through, even with a shotgun. It's a 2 edged sword as I can't shoot through on the inside either. Also I would never open my door without a gun, especially at that hour, even if it was a neighbor.

My town has a population of 800. Maybe we are more paranoid out here than a bigger town.

All I know is I am as prepared as I can be.

Feeling safe is so important and based on important personal experience, personal judgement and locality specifics. Happy you have the security you need!

 

[otto]

Would an overprotective mother would lock herself in the bathroom when an intruder was in the house. I think she would go directly to her daughter and try to lead her to safety.

 

[ludakristen]

A common theme in theories like this is that the assailant(s) would leave when they got what they came for or were interrupted. I’ve got to agree that makes sense, but if the first shots were fired at 12:31 and door was breached / dad was killed at that time, what could they have possibly been after that they still didn’t have 25 minutes later? If that line of thinking is correct, the objective had to center on Denise. But that makes no sense either.

The more I think about this and talk about it with my husband, the more I think the purpose was to attack/assault Denise. So 25 minutes is not that long if you view it in that context. Perhaps raping/beating Denise, subduing Jayme? And maybe it would've gone on longer if one of them hadn't gotten a hold of a phone and dialed 911.

 

[EJB123456]

Yet before the invention of the call phones children did just fine at school or after school.,If they needed to to contact their parents there was always a pay phone available. Sometimes I think that mothers make up reasons to call or text their children just to maintain control.

Times have changed. Cell phones are an absolute must in my family. My kids are about 100 times busier than I ever was as a kid (or anyone else I knew). Opportunities exist that just did not exist when I was a child. And we had access to landlines at our friends’ houses as children. They do not. No pay phones anymore either. Two full time working parents and multiple children all going in different directions. Not to mention they’d have zero social Life because how would anyone get ahold of them - we don’t have a home phone.

ETA: My children are all right around this age btw and I tend to be more annoyed with the parents who DONT let their kids have a phone because they call me to make play dates For their pre-teens and teenagers! If the kids can’t make their own plans yet then I consider THOSE parents to be the helicopter parents.

 

[MesquiteO21]

Same. It was about taking her and she was not easy to grab elsewhere as it has been said she was seldom alone. (In so many words...i.e mom went with her on outings, alleged “caretaker”...) so not easy to take her another way.

completely agreed. where else take her from - school? a dance rehearsal or whatever? that would have to be during daylight hours with a whole boatload of potential witnesses. yes that has happened before, but it's risky. i'm also keeping open the possibility that mom and dad weren't intended on being killed. perp(s) could've wanted to just break in and abduct jayme, or lure her out, but then James maybe looked out the front door and saw them and all hell broke loose.

 

[JaneEyre]

It does seem that the pics on her FB were taken by someone else (I'm guessing her mother or friends). Speaks to the fact that she probably doesn't have a cell phone or her parents monitored her activity.

Or she's shy like me and so simply cannot "do" selfies without feeling extremely awkward.

 

[Inthedetails]

I wasn't happy with the quality of the other map I made, so I made a new one with clearer labels and layers you can add or remove. That way I can leave all points of interest on there without it getting too cluttered.

I could draw a shape on the map of the search area but I am not sure of the location.

Let me know if there are places I should add or rearrange the categories, ideas, etc.

Jayme Closs Case - Google My Maps

Great map. I like the feature of filtering the labels on the map. Cool.

Thank you!

 

[cluciano63]

Kids are online. They find ways. If they do not have a phone, or one with wifi, their friends do. If they are watched at home, they use it elsewhere. Parents cannot prevent it. And jmo all kids are interested in seeing what’s out there, what they hear from others., etc.. it can never be ruled out that any specific kid is safe from online dangers.
Jmo

 

[RoiPD86]

Wonderfully paraphrased. I didn’t see the interview but will comment on your excellent post. There may have been a reason for the suspect to believe Denise and Jayme were home alone. Regardless of this the suspect quickly encountered James and the plans were thrown off. The target may have been Denise and the perpetrator was someone James recognized. He was killed to clear the path to Denise. I would agree that in crimes of intense passion or anger “overkill” can occur. Depending on the nature of Denise’s wounds we may see this.

I agree that in 2018 with the current technology, so many vehicles and owners have already been eliminated. I think the search will slow here unfortunately.

It may be that a possible motive has slightly formed for the investigators and they surmise Jamey is no longer alive but of course can’t say for sure so they keep hope alive

Okay I know some of you may not care for Mark Furhman at times including myself but the thread was closed at the time he was being interviewed on Fox.

Since he spoke I can't get out of my mind what he said because it ALL made so much common sense and none of it I had ever even considered.

Anyway for those who may be interested I will try to post it in my own words for you.

He said he believes the evidence shows that Denise was the intended target. Here is the clear reason he gave. If James had been the intended target the mission would have been over right at the front door with no need to enter the home. They would have shot James and quickly left probably before Denise could have even seen who it was.

But he said they purposefully went inside to murder Denise. He also said the crime scene can reveal who may be the intended target. Such as if one victim suffered more gunshot wounds than another victim. Or if one victim had other type of injuries done by the killer beyond the gunshots themselves.

He said he does believe that Jayme has been killed and thinks the police know that too and know they are in recovery mode now.

He also said this which makes sense to me. He said the experts on the ground have the ability in less than a day's time to know if there are any vehicles in this county of 45000 that matches the 2 vehicles in question.

So he thinks the police already know the vehicles aren't from the county this happened in. He said they will go county by county searching the DMV data base looking for possible matches and interviewing anyone who may own the same type of vehicles crossing them off one by one.

So what do all of you think about this? I found all of it so facisinating. Jmo though

 

[amomandherblog]

Re: the Radar Online link

I just found that this story was told pretty much verbatim in a Facebook group that wouldn’t be considered legit. While that verifies that Radar Online accurately reported the sources story, the story itself should be considered unverified.

I’m pretty sure I read this account a couple of days ago on a FB group...although I think part of the original story (from FB) is missing. I’m not sure how much credence to put into this story.

 

[Msl1966]

I thought I saw a photo somewhere of the front door with a narrow rectangular window in the middle of the upper half. I think the door was being carried in the photo. Maybe I’m mistaken.

There’s a photo of Jayme on their front step that shows the door, with a small window in the middle, clearly behind her.

 

[otto]

A common theme in theories like this is that the assailant(s) would leave when they got what they came for or were interrupted. I’ve got to agree that makes sense, but if the first shots were fired at 12:31 and door was breached / dad was killed at that time, what could they have possibly been after that they still didn’t have 25 minutes later? If that line of thinking is correct, the objective had to center on Denise. But that makes no sense either.

Maybe the plan was to stay in the house until morning, but the 911 call changed plans. The first question to come up is : how did he get out of there in 4 minutes with Jayme if the plan was to commit the crime in the house and leave.