Identified! NY - Mount Vernon, WhtFem 51UFNY, 18-25, Left Near Junkyard, Feb'88 - Veronica Wiederhold

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jessr927 said:
Confirming that the Westchester ME is in Valhalla. Westchester is the county itself, Mt. Vernon is a city within the county. Most of the county's official places (courthouses, jail, ME) are in White Plains or Valhalla. I spoke with the ME's office a few years ago (2016?) and tried to get the location of her body. They told me to submit a written request. I submitted one from myself and one on behalf of Det. DiMase, with his permission. Did not get a response.
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I submitted one so we'll see
 
Al Ka said:
Not sure what OCME stands for but I find it really, really strange they won't give answers to main detective of her case.

It is very likely they do not know or have no records but it seems they all are worried of consequences of some mess from 30 years ago rather then simply saying to detective they do not know. But again, why so worried about that now? I wonder if there is different reason they all not cooperating together or unable to release information between each other. Some restriction on her case? Or some other strange reason?

We all assume she was burried, we have no confirmation of that yet... And if she was it could have been month or even quite some time after her demise.

Now, we know that original detective of her case passed away and case went through many detectives. But what about original coroner/medical examiner? Is it possible to trace who it was and arrange some kind of small interview?

I would suggest also to call or email local coroner/ME about what were their usual practices at that time. How long usually they kept the body and where they usually send them for burial. If it was send to different places or certain specific area. If length of keeping the body was different in case of unknown deceased. I would probably not ask them specifically about MVJD case, but just these information in general. This might not give us all answers but it might send us at some direction of search.
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Jess already did that. It was one of 3 places if I remember correctly . She posted it in the thread

Al Ka said:
Ok, I found out what OCME stands for - Office of Chief Medical Examiner
Link for NY Office of Chief Medical Examiner

Lots of information in that link which might be relevant to MVJD case.

1. Why is a body brought to the Office of Chief Medical Examiner?
Bodies of deceased persons are brought to this office because the law requires that the Chief Medical Examiner investigate deaths of persons dying from criminal violence, by accident, by suicide, suddenly when in apparent health, when unattended by a physician, in a correctional facility, or in any suspicious or unusual manner. The medical examiner is responsible for determining the cause and manner of death.

A body also may be brought to the Office of Chief Medical Examiner if the identity of the deceased or of the next of kin is unknown. The body is retained by this office for a reasonable period of time before interment at City Cemetery or until the next of kin can be located by the Police Department and identification established and funeral arrangements made.

City Burial
OCME's responsibility as the City mortuary includes caring for all remains in our custody with dignity and respect. There may be times in this work when remains are unidentified and/or unclaimed.

Unidentified and/or unclaimed remains are interred in City Cemetery on Hart Island within a reasonable period of time. If remains are subsequently identified, or if a family later wishes to claim their loved one, the remains can be disinterred for private burial.
===
Her autopsy was done by OCME (apparently), so did she at the end end up at Hart Island? :(

Anyway, still worth to make those calls to coroners or even to OCME and ask general questions.
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I think shes buried at Hart island because I'd read that too a few years ago but I believe all their records are online. Jess volunteers there, she hasn't see her listed
 
jessr927 said:
Confirming that the Westchester ME is in Valhalla. Westchester is the county itself, Mt. Vernon is a city within the county. Most of the county's official places (courthouses, jail, ME) are in White Plains or Valhalla. I spoke with the ME's office a few years ago (2016?) and tried to get the location of her body. They told me to submit a written request. I submitted one from myself and one on behalf of Det. DiMase, with his permission. Did not get a response.
Click to expand...

I also tried calling, if you remember. They were quite rude to me, which I guess I understand (I was nervous, and not calling on behalf of Det. DiMase, and they are very busy people)
 
I hate to ask a silly question-but could someone please explain to me on MVJD's Facebook page, the two photos that look like police mugshots? Where are they from? Are they her? I'm very confused.
 
*Bump*

Any updates on where Mount Vernon Jane Doe is buried? Any thoughts about where she could possibly be?
 
I called the city registrar who told me that neither a citizen nor the police can request the death certificate which would have the burial info. She said that even the detective in charge of the case would have to petition the Supreme Court for a copy of the death cert, and the court would have to find just cause to issue it. So that looks like a cold trail.

As to any guesses as where she is buried, I've got no way to narrow it down. The county ME's office said that any UIDs in Westchester County are buried in multiple cemeteries throughout Westchester and even some are buried in New Jersey (I have no idea why and neither did they). Westchester alone has a lot of large cemeteries - Valhalla is full of them, then there's Oakland in Yonkers and a couple in New Rochelle - not to mention the ones in smaller cities and towns.

Mrs. Badcrumble said:
*Bump*

Any updates on where Mount Vernon Jane Doe is buried? Any thoughts about where she could possibly be?
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I also just found a new link on the city of Mount Vernon page which allows you to contact the police commissioner. I sent the following message:

Commissioner Harris: I am writing in regards to the Mount Vernon Jane Doe case from Feb. 1988 which I understand is the city's only unidentified homicide victim. For over four years I have been active in trying to bring justice to this unidentified girl who was brutally murdered and dumped on our streets like trash. Detective DiMase has worked so hard on every possible lead. It has been 30 years since this murder and justice has yet to be served. I respectfully request that the MVPD petition the court to obtain the death certificate, to find out where Jane Doe is buried. Once that information is obtained it would be possible to order an exhumation, in order to test Jane Doe's isotopes which would help narrow down where she lived prior to her murder. Isotope testing has recently solved many cases including the well known cold case of "Buckskin Girl" who was recently ID'd as Marcia L. King, and "Lyle Stevik," whose identity was not released to the public. It would be a real coup for justice if this poor unidentified girl was given back her name. I am sure she had parents who are still wondering why their daughter never came home. Uncovering her identity could also bring MVPD closer to finding her killer. Who knows if the person responsible could still be in our city? 30 years is too long to go without justice. Please let me know if this is possible. Respectfully yours, ------
 
jessr927 said:
Isotope testing has recently solved many cases including the well known cold case of "Buckskin Girl" who was recently ID'd as Marcia L. King, and "Lyle Stevik," whose identity was not released to the public.
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respectfully snipped

It wasn't isotopes that identified Marcia King and Lyle Stevik. It was DNA Doe Project & GEDMatch, i.e. genetic genealogy. If there is a sample of MVJD's DNA available (at the M.E.'s office?) and if it was found to be viable, there would be no need for exhumation.
 
Wow Jess, THANK YOU very much for writing that letter!

On another note, I recommend all to read this article about what was often happening with NYC unidentified up until recent days.

For 22 Unclaimed Bodies in New York, a Grim Path From Death to Burial

As Westchester ME seems to avoid questions about MVJD body for around 30 years even to the police of her case, I do wonder if in past ME paperwork and doings were also not that up to scratch. I would not rule out that MVJD body ended as cadaver at medical school as many other NY unidentified as per above article. (Which would be shocking as she was murder victim).

I would also suggest in near future to contact Nina Bernstein (investigative journalist) of NY Times to help us trace MVJD body. She is the one who wrote above article and I think it was her and her collegues who did find out all that information about UIDs, morgues and ME practices.
 
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CCJD said:
respectfully snipped

It wasn't isotopes that identified Marcia King and Lyle Stevik. It was DNA Doe Project & GEDMatch, i.e. genetic genealogy. If there is a sample of MVJD's DNA available (at the M.E.'s office?) and if it was found to be viable, there would be no need for exhumation.
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That was what I was going to put in my email to the Commissioner, that they wouldn't necessarily have to exhume her if they kept some of her remains, like hair, nails, blood, etc.
 
jessr927 said:
I called the city registrar who told me that neither a citizen nor the police can request the death certificate which would have the burial info. She said that even the detective in charge of the case would have to petition the Supreme Court for a copy of the death cert, and the court would have to find just cause to issue it. So that looks like a cold trail.

As to any guesses as where she is buried, I've got no way to narrow it down. The county ME's office said that any UIDs in Westchester County are buried in multiple cemeteries throughout Westchester and even some are buried in New Jersey (I have no idea why and neither did they). Westchester alone has a lot of large cemeteries - Valhalla is full of them, then there's Oakland in Yonkers and a couple in New Rochelle - not to mention the ones in smaller cities and towns.
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I want to elaborate. I tried to get the records via FOIA and was told to try locally which I gave Jess the contact info so she could call.

Now I wonder if I can FOIA local records to really get an official no but have not had time to look into it because technically a phone call is not going thru legal channels but now we know where the records are not.
 
Something that strikes me as relevant to identifying this young woman is the fact that her teeth were completely natural and had no cavities. This could point to a couple of possibilities. One is that she grew up in a place with fluoridated water or at least regular dental care with access to fluoride tablets. This would point to her being from a reasonably comfortable socioeconomic background, or at least having an upbringing with access to health and dental care. The other possibility this information could point to is that--as most discussions of this case have noted--that she was on the younger end of the age range mooted for her i.e. late teens to early twenties. I'm hopeful that the rigmarole of getting isotope and more intensive DNA work performed and finding her resting place will be resolved soon and that someone, somewhere will be able to give her her name back.
 
Tatsachen said:
Something that strikes me as relevant to identifying this young woman is the fact that her teeth were completely natural and had no cavities. This could point to a couple of possibilities. One is that she grew up in a place with fluoridated water or at least regular dental care with access to fluoride tablets. This would point to her being from a reasonably comfortable socioeconomic background, or at least having an upbringing with access to health and dental care. The other possibility this information could point to is that--as most discussions of this case have noted--that she was on the younger end of the age range mooted for her i.e. late teens to early twenties. I'm hopeful that the rigmarole of getting isotope and more intensive DNA work performed and finding her resting place will be resolved soon and that someone, somewhere will be able to give her her name back.
Click to expand...

A third possibility is that she grew up in an area with naturally high fluoride levels.
 
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