AMBER ALERT WI - Jayme Closs, 13, Barron, missing after parents found shot, 15 Oct 2018 *endangered* #18

[Rosiebones]

Perhaps a young man, obsessed by Jayme, and driving the red Charger, came to the house and confronted JC at the front door and shot him to gain admittance and then shot DC. Perhaps a family member/friend, driving the black SUV followed him and hoping to intervene and stop him came into the house and saw what happened. In the next twenty minutes before the 911 call, tried to reason with and talk down the killer. Realizing that the call had been placed and police were on the way, took Jayme (alive or not) and left rapidly one after the other. Now, both people are equally involved and cannot go to the LE independent of the other. They have to cover for each other whether they want to or not.

 

[Kid Dropsy]

Perhaps a young man, obsessed by Jayme, and driving the red Charger, came to the house and confronted JC at the front door and shot him to gain admittance and then shot DC. Perhaps a family member/friend, driving the black SUV followed him and hoping to intervene and stop him came into the house and saw what happened. In the next twenty minutes before the 911 call, tried to reason with and talk down the killer. Realizing that the call had been placed and police were on the way, took Jayme (alive or not) and left rapidly one after the other. Now, both people are equally involved and cannot go to the LE independent of the other. They have to cover for each other whether they want to or not.

Lots of moving parts there.

 

[KLM6]

I'm still stunned by hearing the sheriff say "killers"...
I don't know what to make of that.
Was there more than one gun used?
Why would 2 perps drive separate vehicles?
Did the cars drive off in the same direction?
Which one of them took Jayme?
Why?

Stunned me too. IF there were multiple killers in multiple cars, it almost makes me feel more like the Closs's knew the people, and that they were possibly in the house before anything bad ever happened. Kind of like @BIC s theory. This possibility sure gave me a different perspective.

 

[Minordetails]

The question for me is... we’re the killer(s) executing a planned operation or were they (he) in a situation that escalated to fear?? anger?? Impulse??

What kind of planned operation storms a house at 1:00 am, shoots the home owners, and yet fails to prevent someone in the home from making a 911 call?

If the only motive for the killer(s) was to take the girl, surly one could come up with a better plan.

 

[GoneGoldfishin']

Very good. I dug through the thread and didn't see that information. Thanks.

Thread 9, page 13

 

[pinkfly]

I think we have heard the Sheriff try to make his answers somewhat less specific and more vague to protect the integrity of the investigation. And then, since we have so little to go on, we dissect everything at face value (Man answering door). So I can't put too much stock in the plural of the perp(s). But I can see a scenario where a conversation starts with....If you help me do 'this', you can have 'that' as your payment.

 

[Gardener1850]

Were there 2 difft weapons used? Wonder what would make them think 2 killers? If that indeed is what they are thinking

I don't know, but that's what more than one killer implies to me.
A different gun/gunman killed each parent?
Mind boggling, though.

 

[WiseOwl]

How are the persons involved normally listed on a police dispatch?
In this case, if you start from the bottom up it starts with James who was the first one found, Denise (found second), Denise's brother, Jayme, the two girls who were driving by and then the aunt who took the dog.
Just curious why Denise's brother is listed before Jayme and why Jayme is not listed as a victim?

I am curious about this too. I have gone back to the very beginning of the Jayme Closs Missing thread and on CRIME DETAILS: 911 CALL DOCUMENTS BARRON COUNTY SHERIFF'S DEPARTMENT DISPATCH ENTRY
on page 1 it states PERSONS INVOLVED: <modsnip - name redacted>
Underneath that it then states the make of a car, then underneath that it says
R, J L (Female.17).
Scroll down to page 4 and it states (02.08.50): Advised <modsnip - names redacted> were asked to leave as they were driving by multiple times.
Do we know who these people are, and what were they doing in the vicinity at that time of night?

 

[Mountain_Kat]

One of the things I think some of you seem to be forgetting is that Fitzgerald said that he believed Jayme was at home at the time of the attack based on the 911 call and additional evidence. Now, that additional evidence may simply be that you would expect a 13 year old girl to be at home with her family at that hour of the morning, or it could be something more. But it wasn't simply the 911 call that indicated that Jayme was at home during the attack. In my view, that is essential information , and I am confused as to why so many posters haven't focused on that.

JMO

 

[BB71]

All very sad. Watching the trial gives good info on LE's use of SM. I believe each day is almost 2 hours long and if I recall correctly there are 7 days.

SM=Social Media?

 

[PommyMommy]

Has anyone researched missing teens from Wisconsin in the past years. I know the circumstances all vary but it could it could still provide information, pattern, etc. By adjusting search dates (from/too) each year could be looked at separately. I'm just starting from Jan 2 2017 to Oct 14, 2018. If anyone knows of a case from anytime or wants to search and add, well feel free to reply to this post with your info. It may be a complete waste of time but at least it's something productive. You just have to make sure the person is from Wisconsin, either hasn't been found or if found it involved an abduction or kidnapping crime.
1. Armoni Chambers>missing from Milwaukee WI June 18,2018>lured by online sex trafficker and taken to Chicago> found in July 2018 via a tip someone found on FB.
Wisconsin girl, 16, returns home after being sex trafficked into Chicago, mother says

National Center for Missing & Exploited Children

 

[BlinkOfAnI]

SM=Social Media?

Yes, FB

 

[pinkfly]

One of the things I think some of you seem to be forgetting is that Fitzgerald said that he believed Jayme was at home at the time of the attack based on the 911 call and additional evidence. Now, that additional evidence may simply be that you would expect a 13 year old girl to be at home with her family at that hour of the morning, or it could be something more. But it wasn't simply the 911 call that indicated that Jayme was at home during the attack. In my view, that is essential information , and I am confused as to why so many posters haven't focused on that.

JMO

Right. When he first said they believed she was at home I interpreted it as they believed the perp(s) took her, therefore she was there at the time. I am thinking that the part about the 911 call and more info came later in reply to a reporter.

P.S. I deleted earlier reply to something else....sorry, didn't mean to be part of the problem.

 

[Gardener1850]

I am curious about this too. I have gone back to the very beginning of the Jayme Closs Missing thread and on CRIME DETAILS: 911 CALL DOCUMENTS BARRON COUNTY SHERIFF'S DEPARTMENT DISPATCH ENTRY
on page 1 it states PERSONS INVOLVED: <modsnip - names>
Underneath that it then states the make of a car, then underneath that it says
<modsnip - names>.
Scroll down to page 4 and it states (02.08.50): Advised <modsnip - names> were asked to leave as they were driving by multiple times.
Do we know who these people are, and what were they doing in the vicinity at that time of night?

*Names changed to initials by me

Those are just the people police had contact with that night. <modsnip - family>. LE probably contacted family first to check if Jayme was actually supposed to be home that night or if she could have been staying elsewhere, and also to inform them that James and Denise had been found deceased.
<modsnip - names> are bystanders who kept driving by the scene-- probably someone with a family member in LE/firefighter/EMT who was at the house or someone who had a police scanner at home and was bored/curious about what was going on. They are like the people who drive by car accidents and gawk and slow down traffic even more by going extra slow. It's a small town and things like this don't happen very often. JMO.

 

[WiseOwl]

*Names changed to initials by me

Those are just the people police had contact with that night. <modsnip - family>. LE probably contacted family first to check if Jayme was actually supposed to be home that night or if she could have been staying elsewhere, and also to inform them that James and Denise had been found deceased.
<modsnip - names> are bystanders who kept driving by the scene-- probably someone with a family member in LE/firefighter/EMT who was at the house or someone who had a police scanner at home and was bored/curious about what was going on. They are like the people who drive by car accidents and gawk and slow down traffic even more by going extra slow. It's a small town and things like this don't happen very often. JMO.

Thanks for this Gardener1850 - i did wonder who they were!

 

[cluciano63]

Maybe Jayme’s phone records show she used her phone or was online not long before everything happened, placing her at home. Or it pinged from home area (if they can tell after the fact) during that time but not after, showing she was likely there. (As far as other reasons they believe she was there.)

 

[Gardener1850]

One of the things I think some of you seem to be forgetting is that Fitzgerald said that he believed Jayme was at home at the time of the attack based on the 911 call and additional evidence. Now, that additional evidence may simply be that you would expect a 13 year old girl to be at home with her family at that hour of the morning, or it could be something more. But it wasn't simply the 911 call that indicated that Jayme was at home during the attack. In my view, that is essential information , and I am confused as to why so many posters haven't focused on that.

JMO

Yes, I believe he specifically said evidence from the scene indicated she was there. I think we have not discussed it much because it could be anything-- from her DNA to her footprints/handprints/fingerprints in her parents blood somewhere to something of hers found under one of the bodies/with the bodies that would show her parents died trying to protect her. For example, her mom could have died with a torn piece of Jayme's clothing in her hands or one of Jayme's slippers under her body. Jayme could have been clutching at one of her parents and had blood on her hands as she was ripped away and then Jayme could have grabbed the door frame with her bloody hands trying to stop the killer(s) from carrying her out the door. Or if they found Jayme's fingerprints on her mom's phone, they may have been fingerprints made with bits of her mom's blood. There are so many possibilities for how they knew she was there that it seems hard to discuss. We probably will not learn how they knew she was there unless a perp is arrested and this goes to trial. JMO.

 

[JnRyan]

I still have a problem with the theory that Jayme was targeted. If that is the case, why not take her when she is some place alone? Bus stop? Store? When she is home alone? I don't know whether this is just really poor planning or an act of desperation. If it were the later - i.e., the killer(s) thought either the parents or Jayme knew something they shouldn't - maybe the killer(s) believed they didn't have the luxury of time to conduct surveillance on Jayme or the parents. Maybe they believed the house was so far from other neighbors they could pull it off like they did. Were it not for the 911 call no one might have known a thing till the next morning or afternoon.

Still you're going to go into a house not knowing if the owner has a gun nearby? I know my dad had a loaded .38 in his bedside cabinet and he was a light sleeper. Someone kicking a door open in that situation would likely have a very bad day.

 

[BlinkOfAnI]

.

National Center for Missing & Exploited Children

Thank you. I decided to hold off.

 

[JnRyan]

Yes, I believe he specifically said evidence from the scene indicated she was there. I think we have not discussed it much because it could be anything-- from her DNA to her footprints/handprints/fingerprints in her parents blood somewhere to something of hers found under one of the bodies/with the bodies that would show her parents died trying to protect her. For example, her mom could have died with a torn piece of Jayme's clothing in her hands or one of Jayme's slippers under her body. Jayme could have been clutching at one of her parents and had blood on her hands as she was ripped away and then Jayme could have grabbed the door frame with her bloody hands trying to stop the killer(s) from carrying her out the door. Or if they found Jayme's fingerprints on her mom's phone, they may have been fingerprints made with bits of her mom's blood. There are so many possibilities for how they knew she was there that it seems hard to discuss. We probably will not learn how they knew she was there unless a perp is arrested and this goes to trial. JMO.

The evidence can be anything. A phone call or text she made just prior to the incident. Her bed is a mess with blankets, sheets and/or pillows scattered about as someone was taken very quickly. Maybe eyeglasses or contacts were left behind next to bed or in the bathroom and she would usually have one or the other with her.