AMBER ALERT WI - Jayme Closs, 13, Barron, missing after parents found shot, 15 Oct 2018 *endangered* #21

[SharonNeedles]

I view anything as more likely than trafficking lol.

But as far as a note goes...what if there WAS a note and it was longer, more detailed, i.e as though Jayme had written it in advance of the havoc at the time of the crime...leading to LE’s ambiguous (imo) phrasing about not using the wors “abducted”. Far fetched I know...

I don’t know that the possibility of a note is really all that far-fetched... no, probably not a note from Jayme saying the dog only eats chicken. But I wouldn’t completely rule out that the assailants could have left a note that we know nothing about.

 

[bizzle2]

This made no sense to me. At all. First of all the start time of the initial incoming 911 call was 7 minutes before the first officer arrived. And is he totally disregarding the gunshots heard by the neighbors now? This was one of the confusing parts of the interview for me. I dont understand

LE has never said anything about the neighbor hearing the shots.

There is no reason to take what the neighbors say about the timeline into account.

 

[human]

LE has never said anything about the neighbor hearing the shots.

There is no reason to take what the neighbors say about the timeline into account.

It does seem the Sheriff is saying more info would be left if the perp(s) were there for 25 mins which is the time amount if we go by the neighbor’s shot account.

He seems to deny that amount of time.

But how could he possibly know it is a few minutes?

 

[msmamanana]

I stand corrected. He did state" we have to realize they were probably only in that residence for FOUR minutes" @ -23:58

Who is this missing couple people keep asking the Sheriff about?

 

[Ellie1]

It's happened before: 38 years later, Simants murder case still raises tough questions

This case and Elizabeth Smart both had a perp who had done odd jobs around the house prior. We knew of a roofing company, right? But it was extended family? Are there any other people who might have done odd jobs?

I agree, a few things stood out to me and perhaps the aunt was giving "word clues" to let Jayme know (in case she was listening) that they were on to her running away with a perp.

Although I personally don't think this is what happened, what IF someone did put a plan in motion with Jayme to just run away together, and she didn't know that her parents would be murdered. I hope my assumption is wrong, but young kids sometimes just don't realize the evil that can lurk before their very eyes. Jayme struck me as a girl that wanted to see the good in everyone.. God bless her, and hopefully she is safe and just confused about everything.

I think it's possible there was a plan to do something with someone. I think it's possible and likely Jayme didn't even know it involved running away, and I'm certain she didn't know it involved hurting her parents in any way. I don't know if she even knew who the person was (if they pretended to be her a boy her age or a girl her age, but turned out to be an adult.) I think if she "ran away" it was news to her and essentially forced. I think the perp would have had an entire fantasy in their mind. I also think the perp could be preventing her from seeing any news coverage, telling her lies that everyone blames her for her parents deaths, that if she ever returns she'll be arrested, that they are the only one she can trust. Brainwashing her to believe that she can't ever return. Enough weeks being abused, brainwashed, and manipulated and a thirteen year old will believe it. Their brains are still forming. It would explain the police acting as though it's her choice to come home.

Or maybe it was a random drug related home invasion. I really don't know. I just hope she's safe. Relatively speaking.

All of this is JMO!

 

[Bluebythec]

If the bullet entered the bottom of the chair, maybe the chair was being held up as a shield.

I turn my chairs upside down and put them on the table when I wash the floor. If I'm not going to be in the kitchen again during the night I would just leave them there till morning.

edited for typo

 

[bizzle2]

It does seem the Sheriff is saying more info would be left if the perp(s) were there for 25 mins which is the time amount if we go by the neighbor’s shot account.

He seems to deny that amount of time.

But how could he possibly know it is a few minutes?

Going by what he says the answer is:

"If I'm in your house for 25 minutes I'm bound to touch something, leave a fingerprint, DNA, shoeprint, whatever. If I'm only in your house one minute today, ya know, I'm probably not going to leave much evidence."

Sometimes a lack of evidence IS evidence. It doesn't mean you can prove something, but it gives you an indication of how the crime happened.

In this case, there are two people murdered, so we know a crime occurred. And because there wasn't much evidence left behind, we know it happened quickly.

He's saying only a few minutes because the evidence available to them indicates that the crime started shortly before the 911 call. And the perp was gone before the officers arrived on scene. Hence, it happened quickly.

 

[Al Ka]

From the DrydenWire interview - Sheriff says =- "I don't know anything about the rope".

The. Interesting word. That is definitive to me. If there was no rope, he might have said "a rope".

"The rope"- let that sink in.

Actual question was - Was chair with THE ROPE taken for evidence? He answered yes. Few seconds later he added - I don't know anything about the rope.

He was simply answering the question. Nothing more to it.

 

[Al Ka]

Took some notes on the DrydenWire interview with the Sheriff. He answered a ton of questions. Here are my notes:

- Sheriff leans toward this being targeted, has not ruled out a random attack
- Everyone has cooperated -- local residents, current and former Jennie-O employees, friends, family, etc.
- Don't know if it was multiple perps or a lone perp
- Don't have a lot of evidence. Have released most of what they have
- Sheriff believes she is alive, but says that's just his gut, has no evidence to support this
- Person who stole Jayme's underwear from the house was cleared because he had an alibi and didn't own a vehicle. He is currently in jail
- Will not comment on DNA recovered from the scene
- 911 call was from a phone that seemed to be a good distance away from some commotion in the house. (Compared it to how the interview he was doing would sound if he were out in the hallway)
- Organized crime? Kind of laughed and said "can't be ruled out"
- Really not concentrating on the Challenger vehicle.
- Manufacturers were asked to identify vehicles from video that was obtained. Not releasing video to public because it is very poor quality
- Said Jayme hasn't necessarily been cleared as a suspect, but there is absolutely nothing to indicate that she is involved. Don't know 100% so won't take that off the table.
- Says abducted vs missing/endangered are basically the same thing. Just can't use the word abducted because LE doesn't know that for fact
- Why hasn't this case been solved? "They were probably only in that residence for 4 minutes." "If I'm in your house for 25 minutes I'm bound to touch something...leave a fingerprint...DNA, shoeprint, whatever. If I'm only in your house one minute today, you know, I'm probably not going to leave as much evidence. And so, that might be part of it."
- All sex offenders in the county have been checked, alibis verified.
- Don't know the answer to whether Dad was at casino night of murders
- Chair was taken into evidence. Says he doesn't know anything about ropes tied to it
- Sex trafficking? We don't know
- Recognizes low probability that Jayme would be kept alive by abductor. Referenced Cleveland case where women were held alive for years
- Have reports on who missed work/school since she went missing. Nothing suspicious
- Wants hunters to look for anything out of place when deer season starts
- Can't comment on rumors of 19 year old boyfriend
- Don't believe the perp was there for a long time
- All family has been interviewed and cooperated. Wouldn't say they were cleared
- Nothing about the family party, when they left it, or where they went after will help solve the case.

Thank You for all the narrative. Even though I have listened to interview it does help.

Just to add to certain points above - Will not comment on DNA recovered from the scene - It was stated that some people were being tested for DNA, which is interesting to note. Also that DNA from crime scene/evidence is still being tested and results are not back yet. So he pretty much answered the question even though at the end he stated no comment.

Another points to add - some phone calls are being monitored...
- social media are being monitored but not 24/7

I am actually quite glad that they are not zooming yet on one theory only without supporting evidence and that everything is still on the table. They are also checking on all theories no matter how far fetched they might sound to some. Once some evidence will surface they will take correct direction.

Edit: Adding video of interview -

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=2153175108344242

 

[Al Ka]

If the call went out at the beginning of the crime, then I imagine Jayme woke to hearing her father killed, ran to mom and sought protection - and I don't want to imagine how it unfolded there. He wouldn't comment on whether a sexual assault took place during the attack which was interesting when he implied today the perp was in an out within a few minutes. Doesn't seem like a sexual assault could have taken place in the time frame of 4 minutes - does it? So what might have made the mattress removed from the house significant?

Absolutely nothing. Mattress was collected only few days later so probably it was nothing obviously visible on it. It was stated by LE they do want to look at all scenarios and rule them out or in. Good on them.

If all the evidence from crime scene is still being tested (and he said it still is) he would not have answers back yet on any of the items yet.

 

[Mountain_Kat]

It is looking that way to me tonight. IMO.

Exactly. The Sheriff was simply having difficulty trying to articulate his thoughts, imo. From what evidence we DO know, it would have been impossible for this crime to have occurred in 4 minutes. Fitzgerald is commenting on the 4 minutes between the 911 call and the arrival of LE, and mucking up his thoughts as he tries to communicate them.

JMO, but c'mon...a little logic and common sense ought to tell everyone that a 4 minute time frame for the entire crime to have occurred is just silly.

 

[JohnTate90210]

So: what's the rules here...since LE has not ruled out a 19 year old boyfriend is there any anecdotal evidence out there that he exists that we can share here?

A “19 year old boyfriend” has been brought up many times in discussions elsewhere. The age is always stated as 19 which seems specific. I recall somebody early on claiming he had been cleared, even. Now, the sheriff isn’t denying his existance which pretty much confirms he’s real.

I know from my daughter, 13 year olds have “boyfriends” they really have very little to do with. They may chat online but never actually date at all. All of my daughter’s friends seemed to have such supposed-boyfriends. It seems to be a social requirement but doesn’t necessarily mean much. Now, in other cases classmates were heavily involved and having sex so it’s hard to tell just how serious Jayme’s possible relationship could have been.

It does lead me to believe she likely was talking to guys online and we all know that such people may not always be what they claim.

 

[human]

A “19 year old boyfriend” has been brought up many times in discussions elsewhere. The age is always stated as 19 which seems specific. I recall somebody early on claiming he had been cleared, even. Now, the sheriff isn’t denying his existance which pretty much confirms he’s real.

I know from my daughter, 13 year olds have “boyfriends” they really have very little to do with. They may chat online but never actually date at all. All of my daughter’s friends seemed to have such supposed-boyfriends. It seems to be a social requirement but doesn’t necessarily mean much. Now, in other cases classmates were heavily involved and having sex so it’s hard to tell just how serious Jayme’s possible relationship could have been.

It does lead me to believe she likely was talking to guys online and we all know that such people may not always be what they claim.

Wouldn’t online stuff be easy to discover?

 

[MassGuy]

Wouldn’t online stuff be easy to discover?

Generally, yes. That’s one of the reasons I’m no longer big on the online angle.

That was high on my list initially.

 

[HavenWood]

What about Snapchat? Don't the messages on there delete straight after being read?
I've never used it myself, but I know it is one of the more popular apps used by teenagers.

 

[JohnTate90210]

Generally, yes. That’s one of the reasons I’m no longer big on the online angle.

That was high on my list initially.

Teenage girls pretty much stick to their phones rather than computers. If her phone was locked they may not have managed access yet. Trackng through provider records isn’t necessarily easy.

 

[Al Ka]

I wonder how they proceed with everything now. It sounds like they have nothing to go on.

All evidence from crime scene is still being tested. Toxicology tests are also still in progress. DNA of some people are also being tested. They still reviewing different video and cctv footage. There are 57 FBI agents (if I heard correctly) still helping with other things with addition to LE own staff. And no words on phone data analysis back yet either. Social media are being scrutinized and people do talk... Lots and lots to still go on.

Once finally all this results are back it might lead them somewhere. And of course public tips. It is not over yet by any means.

Only thing I miss in this case compared to others, is public appeals by family (appart of one strange one). LE, one week into this case did state in media that they did not forbid for family to speak out. Next day family stated in media they will communicate only through LE. All that is fair and I understand they might be in fear due to what happened but it has been 4 weeks now... Jayme's case needs family touch and family push in my humble opinion. Quietness is too deafening for my ears.

 

[MsBetsy]

Delete

 

[Grammar]

Exactly. The Sheriff was simply having difficulty trying to articulate his thoughts, imo. From what evidence we DO know, it would have been impossible for this crime to have occurred in 4 minutes. Fitzgerald is commenting on the 4 minutes between the 911 call and the arrival of LE, and mucking up his thoughts as he tries to communicate them.

JMO, but c'mon...a little logic and common sense ought to tell everyone that a 4 minute time frame for the entire crime to have occurred is just silly.

It wouldn’t take long to bust down the door, shoot two adults, grab a young girl, and leave with her.

 

[mtnlites]

Teenage girls pretty much stick to their phones rather than computers. If her phone was locked they may not have managed access yet. Trackng through provider records isn’t necessarily easy.

It really depends on the girl. The teen girls I know spend an equal amount of time between tablets, laptops, and phones.